Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread [mod warning #11145, #32140 (see OP)]

SlickRic

wow, Boggles really managed to wind you lot up.

well done lad.

purple_hatstand

Anderson may well turn out to be a better player than Carrick. It is unlikely, however, that either will ever be as good as Gerrard. Utd have not found any kind of adequate replacement for either Keane or Scholes despite spending huge money on several players and nowhere was this more evident than the CL Final against Barca. Hargreaves and Fletcher would have given Utd more bite if they had been available but even they are not even near to the first-choice CM combinations deployed by Liverpool and Chelsea last season.

It remains to be seen how greatly the loss of Alonso will affect us in this regard. I'm hoping Aquilani proves to be worth the investment and that Lucas can silence some of his critics.

Karmafaerie

SlickRic wrote: »

wow, Boggles really managed to wind you lot up.

well done lad.

When has Boggles ever managed to wind any of us up?!
We're all used to him, and just find it amusing.

It's only newer posters who react adversly, as the rest of us have been there, done it, and bought the t-shirt.

Bandit12

How is a wind up merchant like this boggles fella allowed post on the Liverpool thread anyway's? The last 4 pages are full of his nonsensical Gerrard v Carrick arguement that is pathetic. Anywho good news on the injury front as the terminator (Skrtel ) came through a practice game this morning with Oldham with no ill effects. God damit i'm getting excited about the new season
www.liverpoolway.co.uk/forum/news/82246-skrtel-comes-through-practice-game.html#post1849006

--amadeus--

purple_hatstand wrote: »

Anderson may well turn out to be a better player than Carrick. It is unlikely, however, that either will ever be as good as Gerrard. Utd have not found any kind of adequate replacement for either Keane or Scholes despite spending huge money on several players and nowhere was this more evident than the CL Final against Barca. Hargreaves and Fletcher would have given Utd more bite if they had been available but even they are not even near to the first-choice CM combinations deployed by Liverpool and Chelsea last season.

Interesting point actually.

Pundits always talk about the importance of teh "spine" to a team. With Reina / Carra (Agger / Skrtel) / Masch / Gerrard / Torres we have an outstanding spine, world class players in every position. With the exception of CB you could argue that each of those players is in fact the best in teh league at what they do.

Chelsea are slightly weaker, overall. Terry is a better CB but Lampard always struck me as a poor mans Gerrard. Ballack and Drogba are getting on and Anelka is temperamental. Cech on his day is better than Reina but it took him time to re-establish confidence and dominance after his injury.

But Utds spine looks quite weak. Van Der Sar is out and nowhere near the player he was. Foster looked a bag of nerves. The CBs are strong but teh CM is patchy. And upfront - which used to be thier strongest point - looks flaky. Berbatov? Very poor last season. Owen? Hmmmm, lets wait and see. Rooney? Great technical player but seems to be shunted out to no mans land and poor goals:game ratio.

whatawaster

Bandit12 wrote: »

How is a wind up merchant like this boggles fella allowed post on the Liverpool thread anyway's? The last 4 pages are full of his nonsensical Gerrard v Carrick arguement that is pathetic. Anywho good news on the injury front as the terminator (Skrtel ) came through a practice game this morning with Oldham with no ill effects. God damit i'm getting excited about the new season
www.liverpoolway.co.uk/forum/news/82246-skrtel-comes-through-practice-game.html#post1849006

Hopefully if Skrtel doesn’t make it on Sunday, he’ll continue his rehabilitation against Bohemians. Would be nice.

Fink Goddie

Karmafaerie wrote: »

English, please.

It was last time i looked.

Karmafaerie

Bandit12 wrote: »

How is a wind up merchant like this boggles fella allowed post on the Liverpool thread anyway's? The last 4 pages are full of his nonsensical Gerrard v Carrick arguement that is pathetic. Anywho good news on the injury front as the terminator (Skrtel ) came through a practice game this morning with Oldham with no ill effects. God damit i'm getting excited about the new season
www.liverpoolway.co.uk/forum/news/82246-skrtel-comes-through-practice-game.html#post1849006

Because it's an open forum and anyone can post here.
If you want to take it as a wind-up, that's your opinion.
I think of it as more of a fun discussion.

Helps the work day to go quicker.


Great news about Martin though.

Fink Goddie

Bandit12 wrote: »

How is a wind up merchant like this boggles fella allowed post on the Liverpool thread anyway's? The last 4 pages are full of his nonsensical Gerrard v Carrick arguement that is pathetic. Anywho good news on the injury front as the terminator (Skrtel ) came through a practice game this morning with Oldham with no ill effects. God damit i'm getting excited about the new season
www.liverpoolway.co.uk/forum/news/82246-skrtel-comes-through-practice-game.html#post1849006

Because everyone is allowed their opinion.

jesus_thats_gre

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Chelsea are slightly weaker, overall. Terry is a better CB but Lampard always struck me as a poor mans Gerrard. Ballack and Drogba are getting on and Anelka is temperamental. Cech on his day is better than Reina but it took him time to re-establish confidence and dominance after his injury..

I am sure you omitted Essien there by accident:

Cech - Terry - Essien - Lampard - Drogba
Reina - Carra - Masch - Gerrard - Torres

About even if you ask me..

Eire-Dearg

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

I am sure you omitted Essien there by accident:

Cech - Terry - Essien - Lampard - Drogba
Reina - Carra - Masch - Gerrard - Torres

About even if you ask me..

When you put it like that it's actually quite even all across the board.

slingerz

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

I am sure you omitted Essien there by accident:

Cech - Terry - Essien - Lampard - Drogba
Reina - Carra - Masch - Gerrard - Torres

About even if you ask me..

Well your omitting some players. Its not a 5 a side game

Cole - Boswinga - Carvalho - Zhirkov - Malouda - J.Cole - Anelka -Mikel
Aurelio - Johnson - Agger - Riera - Benyaoun - Kuyt - Voronin - Lucas

Eire-Dearg

I think he meant the spine of each side, slingerz - goalkeeper, centre half, centre midfielder, Gerrard/Lampard and up front.

jesus_thats_gre

slingerz wrote: »

Well your omitting some players. Its not a 5 a side game

Cole - Boswinga - Carvalho - Zhirkov - Malouda - J.Cole - Anelka -Mikel
Aurelio - Johnson - Agger - Riera - Benyaoun - Kuyt - Voronin - Lucas

I was talking about the spine of the team.

In case it isn't clear, I think that Chelsea are favs for the league and genuinely believe that they would have dominated the PL if they left Jose to it.

SlickRic

Karmafaerie wrote: »

When has Boggles ever managed to wind any of us up?!
We're all used to him, and just find it amusing.

It's only newer posters who react adversly, as the rest of us have been there, done it, and bought the t-shirt.

true, but he still managed to get a non-argument to stretch out over about 4 pages.

old posters and new both contributing.

entertaining to say the least.

Bandit12

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Because it's an open forum and anyone can post here.
If you want to take it as a wind-up, that's your opinion.
I think of it as more of a fun discussion.

Helps the work day to go quicker.


Great news about Martin though.

The day will go quicker if you work harder

Paul Tergat

I can't believe that you spent so long trying to justify/back Gerrard.

He's world class and imo the best all round midfielder in the world and I've been saying this for the last 3 years or so. Even though I really don't like him!

SlickRic

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Lampard always struck me as a poor mans Gerrard.

to be fair to Lampard, he's not a poor man's anyone. he's awesome at what he does.

he has different qualities to Gerrard, despite what many would argue. Lampard has a calming influence on a game a la Xabi (if i can boldly make that comparison) while strolling around the park and making sudden bursts into and around the box a la vintage Scholes.

Gerrard is all about taking a game by the scruff of the neck and making something happen, even if nobody else will.

Which is why Rafa has him playing where he has him.

(i understand they're very simplistic descriptions of each player, but i don't have time for a hugely detailed post, so hopefully you get where i'm coming from!)

Karmafaerie

Bandit12 wrote: »

The day will go quicker if you work harder

Perish the thought!:eek:

Karmafaerie

p_larkin99 wrote: »

I can't believe that you spent so long trying to justify/back Gerrard.

He's world class and imo the best all round midfielder in the world and I've been saying this for the last 3 years or so. Even though I really don't like him!

But he likes you.

bUILDERtHEbOB

Nice to see Skrtel back in flying form.:o

SlickRic

bUILDERtHEbOB wrote: »

ha!

it looks like he's doing that just because he can. your man is nowhere near the ball. Skrtel could just take it easily.

spockety

Aquilani explaning a few things about how football works to Rafa..

Fink Goddie

spockety wrote: »

Aquilani explaning a few things about how football works to Rafa..

He's telling him that Lucas is sh1t and to get rid

missingtime

Fink Goddie wrote: »

He's telling him that Lucas is sh1t and to get rid

lol

NabyLadistheman

Fink Goddie wrote: »

He's telling him that Lucas is sh1t and to get rid

He's way off with that one!

spockety

I think any Cattermole rumours can now be put to bed, Sky are reporting that he's on the verge of joining Sunderland (medical etc.)

Paul Tergat

Karmafaerie wrote: »

But he likes you.

What?

--amadeus--

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

I am sure you omitted Essien there by accident:

Cech - Terry - Essien - Lampard - Drogba
Reina - Carra - Masch - Gerrard - Torres

About even if you ask me..

Essian is a good player but I'd rather have Masch. Not much in it though - I left him out because I was trying to look at where there were differences between the teams.

As it stands I'd take our keeper, DM, AM and CF. It's only at CB they have a clear edge, with DM very close. I see teh point above about Lampard being a slightly different style to Gerrard but I'd still rather have Gerrard in teh team to Lampard. And Drogba / Anelka are both pretty patchy.

Same story with Utd. It used to be that you would look at Utd / Chelsea (and Arsenal) and wonder how many of our team would get into thiers. Now there are very few of thier players would get into ours.

From Chelsea only Ashley Cole and John Terry would be nailed on 1st teamers

From Utd probably Rio Ferdinand (maybe, I think he lacks concentration), Vidic, Rooney. I really can't think of anyone else that would be a guaranteed starter.

[edit and qualifyer - playing in our current formation, if you switch formations that changes things and you can always make room (eg play Lampard where Alonso used to). And I'm talking about first choice XI, not squad]

Paul Tergat

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Rio Ferdinand (maybe, I think he lacks concentration)

lol

you seem to be a few years behind on your views on him.

--amadeus--

Nope, I just don't buy into the hype around him. He's a brilliant defender, good positionally and an excellent distributor of the ball. Easily worth a slot in the Champions defence. But he has always struck me as someone who might make a silly mistake. Put another way the Utd defensive pairing do very well against the vast majority of teams. But when faced with intelligent attackers (eg Barca in the CL and Torres at OT against us) they struggle.

Which isn't to say I don't rate him - I'd put him in before Carra at this stage. But long term I'd be backing Agger & Skertel.

whatawaster

Lucas and Ayala scored in a 2-0 win over Oldham in a friendly behind closed doors.

~Rebel~

I actually cant get over the change in Lucas. 6 months ago he wouldn't have even been in the oppositions half, let along in their box taking shots - he's just totally changed his game! I dont think i've ever seen anyone change the way they play that quickly before...

Paul Tergat

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Nope, I just don't buy into the hype around him. He's a brilliant defender, good positionally and an excellent distributor of the ball. Easily worth a slot in the Champions defence. But he has always struck me as someone who might make a silly mistake. Put another way the Utd defensive pairing do very well against the vast majority of teams. But when faced with intelligent attackers (eg Barca in the CL and Torres at OT against us) they struggle.

Which isn't to say I don't rate him - I'd put him in before Carra at this stage. But long term I'd be backing Agger & Skertel.

The arguments you make are completely daft.

If you have evidence of these silly mistakes fair enough but you don't. Its an argument that was thrown at him in his early career and like any defender he did make the occassional mistake. But the Rio of at least the past 3 years is not mistake prone.

And you use 2 games in a season as a means of arguing over one of our defenders lack of concentration. If you wanna pick the Pool game then at least blame Vidic for that as he was the one who had a mare that game. As for the Barca game, it was our midfield that was dominated not our defence. I could then point to the season before and look at us playing the 'intelligent attacks'. We didn't concede vs Barca then and then against Pool we didnt concede over 2 games, keeping a clean sheet at Anfield against your intelligent attack.

Basically, the games you chose Rio played well enough. The only reason LT that your younger centre halves would be picked over him is that Rio will be too old then.

--amadeus--

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I actually cant get over the change in Lucas. 6 months ago he wouldn't have even been in the oppositions half, let along in their box taking shots - he's just totally changed his game! I dont think i've ever seen anyone change the way they play that quickly before...

Wasn't that one of the excuses for his poor form last year though? That he was signed as an attacking midfielder and was being played as a defensive one?

~Rebel~

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Wasn't that one of the excuses for his poor form last year though? That he was signed as an attacking midfielder and was being played as a defensive one?

to a point, but he was never an AMC, he was a box to box player. But tbh, i just never thought he looked comfortable and confident when he turned and tried playing towards goal until the last few months (end of last season and pre season). He seems to have grown a lot in confidence to be able to take the extra step foward

SlickRic

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I actually cant get over the change in Lucas. 6 months ago he wouldn't have even been in the oppositions half, let along in their box taking shots - he's just totally changed his game! I dont think i've ever seen anyone change the way they play that quickly before...

it's the position he played for Gremio.

it doesn't surprise me one iota that he's started to look impressive.

SlickRic

spockety wrote: »

I think any Cattermole rumours can now be put to bed, Sky are reporting that he's on the verge of joining Sunderland (medical etc.)

honestly, he's above them (all respect to Sunderland).

unless Sunderland become a top-8 force he'll be gone in a year or 2 imo.

spockety

Ok, this isn't back seat modding/sniping etc, but I would like to officially propose that a "Player/Squad Comparison" sticky is set up in the Soccer forum to take pages and pages of this kind of thing out of the club superthreads. I don't want to come in here to read about Rio Ferdinand and Michael Carrick, even in the context of how they stack up against Liverpool players. It's Liverpool FC Team Talk, not Liverpool and Man Utd team talk.

A squad/player comparison sticky might also rope in a number of other board posters who wouldn't normally stray in here, and widen the debate.

Anyone agree?

Edit: By sticky I mean superthread, sorry.

SlickRic

spockety wrote: »

Ok, this isn't back seat modding/sniping etc, but I would like to officially propose that a "Player/Squad Comparison" sticky is set up in the Soccer forum to take pages and pages of this kind of thing out of the club superthreads. I don't want to come in here to read about Rio Ferdinand and Michael Carrick, even in the context of how they stack up against Liverpool players. It's Liverpool FC Team Talk, not Liverpool and Man Utd team talk.

A squad/player comparison sticky might also rope in a number of other board posters who wouldn't normally stray in here, and widen the debate.

Anyone agree?

it would be carnage, and a nightmare to mod. like Liv v Utd bannings all year round!

but if possible, yes, it's a decent idea.

therecklessone

Hmmm, a general thread where people can compare teams, players, discuss league issues etc etc?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055637852

Bandit12

spockety wrote: »

Aquilani explaning a few things about how football works to Rafa..

But Rafa i'm injured and still would piss all over these guys.:pac:

5starpool

Bandit12 wrote: »

But Rafa i'm injured and still would piss all over these guys.:pac:

Nah, he is saying "how am I meant to get into the team ahead of this Lucas? He is too good".

:D

~Rebel~

SlickRic wrote: »

it's the position he played for Gremio.

it doesn't surprise me one iota that he's started to look impressive.

He didnt play AMC for Gremio, he played CM. I watched him a nice bit at the time.

Bandit12

5starpool wrote: »

Nah, he is saying "how am I meant to get into the team ahead of this Lucas? He is too good".

:D

He's be right. Watch this lad go this season;)

Mr Alan

Liverpool should beware of calling Rafael Benitez's bluff over transfer policy
By David Maddock


If there is a common theme throughout the managerial career of Rafael Benitez, then it is the fact that he is a man of principle.

At Real Madrid, a club he loves and that is in his blood, he was doing the youth team job of his dreams, but walked out rather than select the president of the club's son who he considered not good enough.

At Extramadura, despite winning a miraculous promotion to La Liga, he again quit after being crossed by the president of the club.

At Valencia, after winning two league titles against all odds, he walked out after promises were broken over transfer policy.

Why mention all this? Well, when the Liverpool manager was negotiating his current contract in April, a deal that will apparently keep him at Anfield for five more years, one of the main points of negotiation was over future transfer funds.

Benitez knows he has a squad that is close to being champions, and recognises that he requires perhaps just two more top class players to take the final step. He also recognises those players will cost massive money to improve on what he already has.

Hence his negotiations in April, when he secured promises from Liverpool's American owners that funds would be made available to build the squad of his desires to seriously challenge the Manchester United-Chelsea dominance at the top of the Premier League.

The details of those negotiations are unclear, but it was widely assumed that he would be given at least £20million to spend this summer on top of ANY money he raised himself through sales. Other reports suggested he would be given £40million plus sales.

With less than a week to go before the start of the new season, he has been given precisely NOTHING to spend, above and beyond the money he has raised.

To spell the maths out for Liverpool fans puzzled at this statement, the sales of Xabi Alonso, Sebastien Leto, Alvaro Arbeloa, Jack Hobbs and Paul Anderson have generated something in the region of £40million.

In response, he has paid out around £32million to bring in Glen Johnson and Italian midfielder Alberto Aquilani, leaving a PROFIT of around £8million, perhaps more.

Unless you sell Cristiano Ronaldo for £80million, it is hard to make a profit in the transfer market and retain a squad good enough to win the title - especially if you were just short of that mark the season before.

Benitez knows this, and as already suggested, he really is a man of principle. He will be seething inside that his best chance of winning the title at Anfield is apparently being scuppered by owners who have gone back on their word, and are trading long-term title prospects for short-term balance sheet concerns.

A word of warning to Tom Hicks and George Gillett, Benitez walked out of Valencia - a club that had won two titles and a UEFA Cup and were amongst the favourites to lift the Champions League - because he "asked for a table and they brought me a lampshade".

So far this summer, the owners haven't even turned that lamp on at Anfield.

said it the other day, i'll say it again, how he hasn't walked is beyond me.

Eire-Dearg

Very very interesting.

I wonder why he has stayed? With a history of walking over the suits up stairs he'd be gone long ago. Perhaps he knows he has a chance to finally bring the EPL back to Liverpool - a big appeal for any manager.

~Rebel~

Mr Alan wrote: »

said it the other day, i'll say it again, how he hasn't walked is beyond me.

I'm really praying he's just holding his cards close to his chest so he can pull off one more signing without getting fleeced. Would hate to think he was given so little backing so soon after negotiating a new contract and after running Utd so close last season.


As regards the above post, i do think he has more of a connection to liverpool then he has to any other job he's had. As he said himself, his daughters speak with a scouse accent (though some would say thats reason enough to walk and move on!)

Mr Alan

think he genuinely "gets" Liverpool FC & the city tbh.

Mr Alan

good to see Skrtel was taking it easy in the behind closed doors friendly!



Me reckons he'll be alright for sunday