Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread [mod warning #11145, #32140 (see OP)]

Glico Man

kippy wrote: »

1.
Liverpools top five transfer fees paid have ALL been in the Rafa era.
Torres, Keane,Mascherano, Johnson, Aqualani.

All of these players were signed using money gained from player sales... Torres' fee was also partly funded from prize money from the CL

kippy wrote: »

4.
Yes, the donations were generous. Why publicize them?

From the people that he donated to, he didn't want his donations to be made public, but they chose to disclose them as to show the generosity of the man
to donate money he didn't have to give away

Kess73

kippy wrote: »

1.

4.
Yes, the donations were generous. Why publicize them?.

He didn't. At all.

Margaret at the Hillsborough support group came out about his donation there.

Looking through the thread, I am the big mouth that mentioned Alder Hey yesterday as the brother's girlfriend works there.

Pretty sure you will see similar stories for his other donations. It was ordinary joe soaps that have highlighted the donations. If Rafa wanted the PR I am sure he could have made it known in advance he was going to these places and someone from the Echo or Post would have been there with a camera.

kippy

Lads,
Seriously.
He didn't publicise the fact that he made a donation...........
Anonymous donations are a thing of fiction obviously.

mike65

Kippy go away

Melion

And we're back on to Rafa's transfers, theres a shock

Hoki

Melion wrote: »

And we're back on to Rafa's transfers, theres a shock

He should never have sold Robbie Keane

SARCASM

Glico Man

To move the discussion away from this... who would you lot like to make the step up from the reserve level for this season coming?

I would like to see the following get more game time.

Pacheco - he's a very talented little player. Similar to Yossi the way the ball sticks to his feet and he's excellent from dead ball situations. Should be on the bench and play in the cups

Kelly - Did very well last season when he played (Lyon game) was his best performance. Would like to see him play at CB rather than RB. Should get on the bench and get game time during cup runs

Eccleston - Had one sub appearance last season against Fulham. Has bags of pace and can put the ball in the net. Should get game time during cup runs

Mavinga - A shining light in the reserves. Excellent at either LB of CB, can have good future at the club should he progress well in the next 2 seasons. Should be a squad player during cup runs.

I would also like to see LDV move up the the reserves full time as he was scoring for fun in both reserves and U18 last season

Not sure if Spearing or Darby will make it at Anfield, both seem average at best.

stumpypeeps

Should anyone question Benitez they will be met with the following response.

stumpypeeps

aaronh007 wrote: »

To move the discussion away from this... who would you lot like to make the step up from the reserve level for this season coming?

I would like to see the following get more game time.

Pacheco - he's a very talented little player. Similar to Yossi the way the ball sticks to his feet and he's excellent from dead ball situations. Should be on the bench and play in the cups

Kelly - Did very well last season when he played (Lyon game) was his best performance. Would like to see him play at CB rather than RB. Should get on the bench and get game time during cup runs

Eccleston - Had one sub appearance last season against Fulham. Has bags of pace and can put the ball in the net. Should get game time during cup runs

Mavinga - A shining light in the reserves. Excellent at either LB of CB, can have good future at the club should he progress well in the next 2 seasons. Should be a squad player during cup runs.

I would also like to see LDV move up the the reserves full time as he was scoring for fun in both reserves and U18 last season

Not sure if Spearing or Darby will make it at Anfield, both seem average at best.

Pacheco and Kelly I expect to make the step up. Eccleston I'm not so sure about. Mavinga may make progress but I don't see him breaking into the first team squad regularly. Jack Robinson may well be one to keep an eye on. Still very young though.

Someone shoot El Zhar. Or hopefully Rafa makes him Inters first big money signing!

101001

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Someone shoot El Zhar. Or hopefully Rafa makes him Inters first big money signing!

You couldn't just not give a rafa dig?

I'd love to see pacheco given the nod. Out of that list I reckon he is the only one there that could make the step up and someone I'd like to give more of a shot. Please ignore this next statement... The only silver lining i could see for MON going to liverpool would be pacheco... I reckon he wouldve given him a punt.

Funnily enough I'm looking forward to the Carling cup this year. Love seeing these lads getting a run out in a big game. For that reason I really enjoyed last years arsenal liverpool game in the cup

Kess73

aaronh007 wrote: »

To move the discussion away from this... who would you lot like to make the step up from the reserve level for this season coming?

I would like to see the following get more game time.

Pacheco - he's a very talented little player. Similar to Yossi the way the ball sticks to his feet and he's excellent from dead ball situations. Should be on the bench and play in the cups

Kelly - Did very well last season when he played (Lyon game) was his best performance. Would like to see him play at CB rather than RB. Should get on the bench and get game time during cup runs

Eccleston - Had one sub appearance last season against Fulham. Has bags of pace and can put the ball in the net. Should get game time during cup runs

Mavinga - A shining light in the reserves. Excellent at either LB of CB, can have good future at the club should he progress well in the next 2 seasons. Should be a squad player during cup runs.

I would also like to see LDV move up the the reserves full time as he was scoring for fun in both reserves and U18 last season

Not sure if Spearing or Darby will make it at Anfield, both seem average at best.

Spearing and Darby are championship level players at best imho.

Mavinga I don't have high hopes for, I would rate Jack Robinson as a better future prospect for the lb slot.

Eccleston I would like to see get some game time as he has shown signs that there could be a good player in him. Great pace and a very calm head in front of goals.

Pacheo I am actually unsure of. No doubt he has technical ability but I wonder about his durability, even at ressie level there have been times when he gets brushed off the ball or when the game seems to be going too fast for him.


Kelly I would like to see become cover for Johnson for a few years, and maybe acting as a third choice CB for the right sided CB slot at the same time. He reminds me of another young defender we had that was touted for big things; Gregory Vignal. Obvs Vignal was a left sided FB but there are similarities in their playing styles. Should defo become one of the subs this year though.



My own picks to watch from the ressies and youth teams would be Palsson, Bruna, Robinson, Eccleston, and maybe Amoo.

stumpypeeps

101001 wrote: »

You couldn't just not give a rafa dig?

I'd love to see pacheco given the nod. Out of that list I reckon he is the only one there that could make the step up and someone I'd like to give more of a shot. Please ignore this next statement... The only silver lining i could see for MON going to liverpool would be pacheco... I reckon he wouldve given him a punt.

Funnily enough I'm looking forward to the Carling cup this year. Love seeing these lads getting a run out in a big game. For that reason I really enjoyed last years arsenal liverpool game in the cup

Oh come on I was only poking fun at Rafa's persistance in bringing El Zhar on despite him never having made much of an impact. One carling cup goal aside.

I believe Kelly will make the grade at Liverpool. I see him as a long term replacement for Carragher. More pace and better in the air though. Very impressive. Don't forget Daniel Ayala too, looks a powerful centre half.

101001

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I see him as a long term replacement for Carragher.

I reckon I agree with you on this count

stumpypeeps

101001 wrote: »

I reckon I agree with you on this count

It won't be long before your subscribing to all of my beliefs.

jesus_thats_gre

Pighead wrote: »

Well for me the core of Rafa's team has always been very good. Great goalkeeper, good defence, great central midfielders, great striker. They never really had impressive wingers which is down to Rafa really. 6 years in charge and about 6 failed wingers.

All perfectly reasonable statements. Based on that though, a manager doesn't deserve to be sacked.

stumpypeeps wrote: »

His tactics didn't change, personal was largely the same, so what changed?

In my opinion, players lost faith. Which after 6 years and no League championship, invariably happens.

His tactics changed significantly about half way through. He switched from a 4-4-2 to a 4-2-3-1.

stumpypeeps

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

All perfectly reasonable statements. Based on that though, a manager doesn't deserve to be sacked.



His tactics changed significantly about half way through. He switched from a 4-4-2 to a 4-2-3-1.

In the 4-4-2 are you considering Gerrard as the secon striker?

In a 4-2-3-1 with Gerrard in an attacking midfield role, is their much difference. Its two wingers, two defensive midfielders and Gerrard behind Torres.

jesus_thats_gre

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Should anyone question Benitez they will be met with the following response.

None of you seem to get. The people here defending Rafa are doing so due to over the top criticism that is demeaning to what he done for the club.

101001

Does anyone find the statements from Paul Dalglish telling of Kenny's desire for the Liverpool job a little weird. It kinda looks like there is a big push for KK to get the job. Before this I kind of took the info with a grain of salt. He's now looking a little more likely than Roy atm

stumpypeeps

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

None of you seem to get. The people here defending Rafa are doing so due to over the top criticism that is demeaning to what he done for the club.

History will judge Rafa to have had relative success at Liverpool. He brought a European Cup, an FA Cup and a runners up finish in the Premiership in 6 years.

All the other details will be lost.

In the general history of Liverpool managers will he be looked upon favourably? Yes, though he failed to deliver a League title and may ultimately be judged a failure.

stumpypeeps

101001 wrote: »

Does anyone find the statements from Paul Dalglish telling of Kenny's desire for the Liverpool job a little weird. It kinda looks like there is a big push for KK to get the job. Before this I kind of took the info with a grain of salt. He's now looking a little more likely than Roy atm

I'd say the biggest stumbling block G&H would have about appointing Dalglish would be the power he would wield. They would be afraid to touch a hair on his head!

jesus_thats_gre

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

None of you seem to get. The people here defending Rafa are doing so due to over the top criticism that is demeaning to what he done for the club.

Exactly.

Some of the criticisms are ridiculous especially the charity one

First time I've ever heard someone criticising another for donating to charity! :pac:

Some people are extremely bitter and need to remove the massive chips on their shoulders tbh.

101001

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I'd say the biggest stumbling block G&H would have about appointing Dalglish would be the power he would wield. They would be afraid to touch a hair on his head!

They would have no reason to touch him. He wouldn't have any hold over the purse strings, wouldn't be in control of transfers. Though if he did start mouthing off (i doubt he would) there could be a lot of blow back on the owners alright. They are just looking for someone to run the team and stay out of their hair

stumpypeeps

101001 wrote: »

They would have no reason to touch him. He wouldn't have any hold over the purse strings, wouldn't be in control of transfers. Though if he did start mouthing off (i doubt he would) there could be a lot of blow back on the owners alright. They are just looking for someone to run the team and stay out of their hair

Que Roy Hodgson.

jesus_thats_gre

stumpypeeps wrote: »

In the 4-4-2 are you considering Gerrard as the secon striker?

In a 4-2-3-1 with Gerrard in an attacking midfield role, is their much difference. Its two wingers, two defensive midfielders and Gerrard behind Torres.

Gerrard didn't play as the second striker in the 4-4-2 for the vast majority of the first two or three seasons. Those were the years when he was he was regularly being shifted out to the right and so on. He was also used as part of a two man midfield of course.

stumpypeeps

stumpypeeps wrote: »

though he failed to deliver a League title and may ultimately be judged a failure.

Utter rubbish.

Some fans believe Liverpool have a god given right to win league titles just because we did so in the 70s and 80s.

Should Harry Rednapp be sacked next season if Spurs dont win the league?

stumpypeeps

rarnes1 wrote: »

Utter rubbish.

Some fans believe Liverpool have a god given right to win league titles just because we did so in the 70s and 80s.

Should Harry Rednapp be sacked next season if Spurs dont win the league?

Spurs haven't won 18 League Titles.
Benitez was hired to win us a League, thats why he got the job. His achievements at Valencia led Parry to believe he could win us a League.

Ultimately he didn't. Is that success?

jesus_thats_gre

stumpypeeps wrote: »

History will judge Rafa to have had relative success at Liverpool. He brought a European Cup, an FA Cup and a runners up finish in the Premiership in 6 years.

All the other details will be lost.

In the general history of Liverpool managers will he be looked upon favourably? Yes, though he failed to deliver a League title and may ultimately be judged a failure.

It depends on your own expectations I guess.

Not a single person on this thread has said that he was prefect, that he didn't make mistakes or that he was great in the transfer market. The criticism being laid at his feet by the anti rafa heads is extremely disrespectful.

If you guys want to continue shouting about how he was ****e in the transfer market or that wining the CL in a season only means that it was a good season, you are going get droves of people replying with equally extreme and inaccurate comments in his defence.

There is so many things going on at the club, so much disinformation put out by both sides and god knows what else going on that we all really need to moderate our opinions on the subject.

Argue that you think his failures in the transfer market brought about his demise or that one or two players seem to have lost faith in him but please also acknowledge the contrainys that existed, the rumoured failures of the higher ups or that he can't possibly have lost the dressing room if two of the first 11 are rumoured to be following him and the keeper has publically lamented the fact that he has left.

Just try being balanced in your opinion and you might be surprised by the replies. At the moment, you argument is as one sided and biased as those that you are slagging.

stumpypeeps

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Spurs haven't won 18 League Titles.
Benitez was hired to win us a League, thats why he got the job. His achievements at Valencia led Parry to believe he could win us a League.

Ultimately he didn't. Is that success?

Just because we've 18 titles doesnt mean we should be expected to win one every season. Get realistic.

Any fan who thinks we can compete with united and chelsea is deluded.

You'll be grateful for Benitez when you look back in 5/6 years time

stumpypeeps

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

It depends on your own expectations I guess.

Not a single person on this thread has said that he was prefect, that he didn't make mistakes or that he was great in the transfer market. The criticism being laid at his feet by the anti rafa heads is extremely disrespectful.

If you guys want to continue shouting about how he was ****e in the transfer market or that wining the CL in a season only means that it was a good season, you are going get droves of people replying with equally extreme and inaccurate comments in his defence.

There is so many things going on at the club, so much disinformation put out by both sides and god knows what else going on that we all really need to moderate our opinions on the subject.

Argue that you think his failures in the transfer market brought about his demise or that one or two players seem to have lost faith in him but please also acknowledge the contrainys that existed, the rumoured failures of the higher ups or that he can't possibly have lost the dressing room if two of the first 11 are rumoured to be following him and the keeper has publically lamented the fact that he has left.

Just try being balanced in your opinion and you might be surprised by the replies. At the moment, you argument is as one sided and biased as those that you are slagging.

I don't believe I've been that critical of Benitez at all. In fact I was much more supportive of him than the majority of people I know. If you can point out to me anywhere I have been overly critical of him please do.

All I've been saying is that I believe a deterioration between senior players and him ultimately cost him his job because the results he achieved during his time here weren't poor enough to merit him being sacked this season. I don't think thats anti-rafa?

jesus_thats_gre

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Spurs haven't won 18 League Titles.
Benitez was hired to win us a League, thats why he got the job. His achievements at Valencia led Parry to believe he could win us a League.

Ultimately he didn't. Is that success?

One again, you are ignoring that they enticed him to the club by promising that new investment was on it's way to the club and that he would have the financial backing he needed to win the league.

Now, we all have opinionson whether he was given enough money or not but during his time there, he struck me as a person who was deeply dissatisfied with how much he was given. He could be completely deluded or his expectations may actually be based on commitments made to him . It's just t thought now.

We know that he was promised x amount a year in order to sign a new contract last summer and we know that the rug was literally pulled from under him when RBS demanded 60 million in order for the loans to be refinanced.

Then there is comments from Torres and Gerrard just a few weeks ago whet they pretty much mirrored each others views, i.e. more than happy to stay at the club once the club matches their ambition and sign the players needed in order to be competitive in the league, champions league or europa league.

Now, all of a sudden, both are rumoured to be leaving. It was initially spun that it was because Rafa had lost the dressing room but it still seems just as likely that they could leave despite Rafa having now left..

I wonder why that is.

spockety

Thread's dead baby, thread's dead.

stumpypeeps

rarnes1 wrote: »

Just because we've 18 titles doesnt mean we should be expected to win one every season. Get realistic.

Any fan who thinks we can compete with united and chelsea is deluded.

I agree for the most part with that. But ultimately when judging Benitez, the criteria is different to other clubs. Because of our history.

Now it'd be great if everyone forgot about our history and accepted his achievements on their own merits. But that is unlikely to happen.

And ultimately he was hired to win the League. Thats a fact.

stumpypeeps

stumpypeeps wrote: »

To be honest I thought they were wrong to get rid of him.

You seem confused.

I'm calling shenanigans on you.

The Muppet

rarnes1 wrote: »

Utter rubbish.

Some fans believe Liverpool have a god given right to win league titles just because we did so in the 70s and 80s.

Should Harry Rednapp be sacked next season if Spurs dont win the league?

I'd say all liverpool fans have an expectation to win the league, He shouldn't have promised 4th if he wasn't up to delivering it. When he got the job Liverpool had a five year plan to land the title. He didn't deliver in fact the team went backwards last season and him saying he needed another £80 million to be able to launch a challenge next season showed he had lost the plot..

jesus_thats_gre

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I don't believe I've been that critical of Benitez at all. In fact I was much more supportive of him than the majority of people I know. If you can point out to me anywhere I have been overly critical of him please do.

All I've been saying is that I believe a deterioration between senior players and him ultimately cost him his job because the results he achieved during his time here weren't poor enough to merit him being sacked this season. I don't think thats anti-rafa?

I am not necessarily talking about just your posts. I am talking about the posts that prompted a mass defines of Rafa that then resulted in you posting that picture.

It may have been the final nail in the coffin. It wouldn't surprise me if Gerrard had run out of patience with him. I have own personal opinion of Gerrard and his personality that renders his stance or opinion somewhat irrelevant. A big personality at the club is Pepe Reina. He has come out and publicly lamented Rafa leaving the club. Riera has also come out and slated Rafa since. It is also rumoured that Kuyt and Mascherano are following him to Inter.

That is about all that we can go on for now really. For me, it is inconclusive for now. Jamie Redknapp won't be the one swaying my stance either.

The Muppet

The Muppet wrote: »

I'd say all liverpool fans have an expectation to win the league,

Yeah, deluded ones :cool:

stumpypeeps

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

One again, you are ignoring that they enticed him to the club by promising that new investment was on it's way to the club and that he would have the financial backing he needed to win the league.

Now, we all have opinionson whether he was given enough money or not but during his time there, he struck me as a person who was deeply dissatisfied with how much he was given. He could be completely deluded or his expectations may actually be based on commitments made to him . It's just t thought now.

We know that he was promised x amount a year in order to sign a new contract last summer and we know that the rug was literally pulled from under him when RBS demanded 60 million in order for the loans to be refinanced.

Then there is comments from Torres and Gerrard just a few weeks ago whet they pretty much mirrored each others views, i.e. more than happy to stay at the club once the club matches their ambition and sign the players needed in order to be competitive in the league, champions league or europa league.

Now, all of a sudden, both are rumoured to be leaving. It was initially spun that it was because Rafa had lost the dressing room but it still seems just as likely that they could leave despite Rafa having now left..

I wonder why that is.

Ok. I like Benitez. I think he did wonderful things for the club over the last 6 years. To me he was a success at Liverpool.

He made us a European powerhouse again. His tactical acumen is unequalled.

Are we closer to winning the league than when Houllier was here? Not really. Thats a failure on his part.

His failure meant that untimately he lost some of the senior players.

Does that mean they are willing to stay now he's gone. No, they may still want to leave. The two are not connected rigidly.

I still think you are much too much a fan of Benitez to judge him objectively.

jesus_thats_gre

The Muppet wrote: »

I'd say all liverpool fans have an expectation to win the league, He shouldn't have promised 4th if he wasn't up to delivering it. When he got the job Liverpool had a five year plan to land the title. He didn't deliver in fact the team went backwards last season and him saying he needed another £80 million to be able to launch a challenge next season showed he had lost the plot..

You are so simple minded that it is beyond belief sometimes.

You point out the five year plan while completely ignoring the upheaval that has gone on at the club.

I look forward to posting on the United thread in a few seasons time and laughing at you defending AF when deluded supporters are calling for his head after not winning the league again for a few years despite the fact that he was hamstrung by the finacial mismanagement of the club by the owners.

Put that in your sig if you want too because it's nailed on to happen.

jesus_thats_gre

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Ok. I like Benitez. I think he did wonderful things for the club over the last 6 years. To me he was a success at Liverpool.

He made us a European powerhouse again. His tactical acumen is unequalled.

Are we closer to winning the league than when Houllier was here? Not really. Thats a failure on his part.

His failure meant that untimately he lost some of the senior players.

Does that mean they are willing to stay now he's gone. No, they may still want to leave. The two are not connected rigidly.

I still think you are much too much a fan of Benitez to judge him objectively.

I very possibly am but I am doing my very best to be objective and impartial.

It's obviously an emotive topic given we are talking about the club we all love and a manager that I still had faith in.

Your post is fair enough however. You could be right but I don't know. I suspect that the players lost faith in the club and the manager was lost as to how motivate them.

Boggles

stumpypeeps

rarnes1 wrote: »

You seem confused.

I'm calling shenanigans on you.

Where did I post that and in what context?

I thought they were wrong to sack him up until I began to believe that some senior players had lost faith in him. Theirs only one outcome when that happens.

Anyone who has such a strong personal feeling for a manager as you seem to have can never look objectively at him. Your more fanatical than fan.

stumpypeeps

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

I very possibly am but I am doing my very best to be objective and impartial.

It's obviously an emotive topic given we are talking about the club we all love and a manager that I still had faith in.

Your post is fair enough however. You could be right but I don't know. I suspect that the players lost faith in the club and the manager was lost as to how motivate them.

Well that may well be the case. The lack of quality additions would obviously worry Torres and Gerrard terribly. And if the manager is unable to motivate the players, the result is inevitable.

The Muppet

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

You are so simple minded that it is beyond belief sometimes.

You point out the five year plan while completely ignoring the upheaval that has gone on at the club.

I look forward to posting on the United thread in a few seasons time and laughing at you defending AF when deluded supporters are calling for his head after not winning the league again for a few years despite the fact that he was hamstrung by the finacial mismanagement of the club by the owners.

Put that in your sig if you want too because it's nailed on to happen.

The upheavel in the club really only started when the yanks realised that rafa was wasting their money on **** players

I've already been there with Fergie remember sack Fergie sell Giggs? I had plenty of ammunition to defend Fergie then and I'd have even more now, I certainly wasn't relying on a champions league with his predecessors team and an Fa cup.

jesus_thats_gre

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Well that may well be the case. The lack of quality additions would obviously worry Torres and Gerrard terribly. And if the manager is unable to motivate the players, the result is inevitable.

That is why I don't see the point in changing the manager when the club is in the situation that it is.

The 10m being spent to get rid of Rafa and get Roy is possibly being wasted. I feel that you might has well left Rafa in place and spent the 10m on a left back or midfielder.

I just don't see it as a sensible footballing decision and really do think that it is personal and the owners just wanted an excuse to sack him.

stumpypeeps

The Muppet wrote: »

The upheavel in the club really only started when the yanks realised that rafa was wasting their money on **** players

I've already been there with Fergie remember sack Fergie sell Giggs? I had plenty of ammunition to defend Fergie then and I'd have even more now, I certainly wasn't relying on a champions league with his predecessors team and an Fa cup.

When will the upheavel start at United when the glazers realise Ferguson has been wasting their money on **** players?

daithijjj

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I agree for the most part with that. But ultimately when judging Benitez, the criteria is different to other clubs. Because of our history.

Now it'd be great if everyone forgot about our history and accepted his achievements on their own merits. But that is unlikely to happen.

And ultimately he was hired to win the League. Thats a fact.

I dont think rafa was hired to win the league per se. Thats a bit unfair and also a bit unrealistic. It would have been a mammouth achievement.

Personally, i would never see that as a reason to part company with him if it was not achieved. What id be interested in is the week to week display (i have no interest in euro comps to be honest). Where rafa failed ultimately for me, was his inability to adapt mid game. Last season there was a terrible fear in this team, take the away game at stoke for example. We were never threatened even though we were not great for 70 mins. Found ourselves 1 up and despite stoke having done nothing, we sat back and invited a team onto us. It has happened many many times. There was a point in that game where we never had 1 player within 70 yards of the opposition goal. Now i wasnt expecting expansive football but the amount of times we invite trouble onto ourselves or inversely were not seemingly given the instructions to go for the jugular and finish the opposition off was just getting too much for me. There was no belief and this is where the manager has a responsibility. Rafa had the whole of last season to instill some belief but it never showed up for me.

I was ok with him getting one more season though but now that i think more about it, him leaving now was the best for everyone including rafa and i think rafa knew this. The new owners will have a fresh canvas to splash paint on. Rafa was looking for assurances that nobody could give him and i believe this is when he decided to call it a day. He has left on excellent terms regarding the fans, even the ones who were non believers in his ethos.

stumpypeeps

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

That is why I don't see the point in changing the manager when the club is in the situation that it is.

The 10m being spent to get rid of Rafa and get Roy is possibly being wasted. I feel that you might has well left Rafa in place and spent the 10m on a left back or midfielder.

I just don't see it as a sensible footballing decision and really do think that it is personal and the owners just wanted an excuse to sack him.

Well they are risking fans outrage and further instability by sacking him. As well as the financial loss. So why did they do it? I think they're too frugal to have done it out of spite. Therefore I believe senior players may well have hung him out to dry. And perhaps Kenny Dalglish gave him a vote of no confidence. Being as close to Purslow as he is apparentlly.

He did himself no favours courting Juventus either.

stumpypeeps

daithijjj wrote: »

I dont think rafa was hired to win the league per se. Thats a bit unfair and also a bit unrealistic. It would have been a mammouth achievement.

Personally, i would never see that as a reason to part company with him if it was not achieved. What id be interested in is the week to week display (i have no interest in euro comps to be honest). Where rafa failed ultimately for me, was his inability to adapt mid game. Last season there was a terrible fear in this team, take the away game at stoke for example. We were never threatened even though we were not great for 70 mins. Found ourselves 1 up and despite stoke having done nothing, we sat back and invited a team onto us. It has happened many many times. There was a point in that game where we never had 1 player within 70 yards of the opposition goal. Now i wasnt expecting expansive football but the amount of times we invite trouble onto ourselves or inversely were not seemingly given the instructions to go for the jugular and finish the opposition off was just getting too much for me. There was no belief and this is where the manager has a responsibility. Rafa had the whole of last season to instill some belief but it never showed up for me.

I was ok with him getting one more season though but now that i think more about it, him leaving now was the best for everyone including rafa and i think rafa knew this. The new owners will have a fresh canvas to splash paint on. Rafa was looking for assurances that nobody could give him and i believe this is when he decided to call it a day. He has left on excellent terms regarding the fans, even the ones who were non believers in his ethos.

I always had huge problems with the way we played football in the Premier league. He was too tactically minded. Tactics in the premier league are not as important as Europe. I mean look at the teams you play against. The best way to stop stoke bombarding you with long throws is to play the game in their half and try and score more goals.

I'd love any new manager who comes in to open the shackles and get after teams. If it means losing a few more games so be it. We might win a lot more too. It was the drawn games that killed us.

stumpypeeps

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Anyone who has such a strong personal feeling for a manager as you seem to have can never look objectively at him. Your more fanatical than fan.

you're wrong there.

I've been critical of Benitez over the years but I'm able to recognise all that he has done for the club in spite of the chaos that's gone on around him.

stumpypeeps

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Tactics in the premier league are not as important as Europe. I mean look at the teams you play against. The best way to stop stoke bombarding you with long throws is to play the game in their half and try and score more goals.

Tactics not important in the PL ?

Very naive. What age are you?