English Premier League Superthread 2009/10

Headshot

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

United do not have any top class midfielders. They have midfielders that are better than 80% of the opposition have but they do not have anyone that comes near Lampard, Essien, Alonso, Mascherano, Fabregas, Gerrard, Ireland, Xavi, Iniesta, Kaka, Pirlo, Di Rossi and go knows who else.

Hargreaves would probably get into that list but he has only played a total of 1650 minutes in the PL in the past two years and by all accounts, will be out to December. He has also only started a total of 60 league games in the last 5 seasons.

pirlo your joking right,a few yrs back id agree but not the pirlo of today
ireland has only one good season,lets see can he repeat it
id agree with the others

jesus_thats_gre

flahavaj wrote: »

Likewise, having a world class midfield is no guarantee of success. Having a better midfield on paper (which Chelsea definitely do) is a moot point and as the last few years have shown, is no guarantee of Premiership or CL success.

No one could disagree with your point.

Chelsea under Jose showed what a world class midfield combined with a complete squad can get you.

Barcelona last season showed what a world class midifield combined with an experienced complete squad can achieve.

Liverpool showed what a world class midfield and a squad with an ok squad can get you.

United showed what a good midfield and a complete squad can get you.



Ultimately, a complete squad is what is needed to win the league.

A world class midfield with an ok squad can beat anyone on their day but ultimately stumble in thier quest for the league and end up being derided as being just a cup team.

jesus_thats_gre

Headshot wrote: »

pirlo your joking right,a few yrs back id agree but not the pirlo of today
ireland has only one good season,lets see can he repeat it
id agree with the others

You get my point though..

Pro. F

lol at United supporters saying that our midfield is anything other than weak. Our central midfield is easily the weakest in the top four. But our defence is one of the best in the world, our front two are quality, we have lots of depth in the squad and, most importantly, Ferguson is the master of putting together league campaigns. United will be there or thereabouts next May.

I think Arsenal are the dark horse this year. Lots of people are writing them off but I think with a better defence this season they're going to be formidable.

Don't know about Ancelotti at Chelsea. He's a top manager and they have a great team and squad. But having won only one Scudetto makes me wonder how good he is at insuring that the bread and butter of the league gets sorted week in, week out. I'm not saying that he will fail - I don't think that will happen - i just don't know if he'll get to grips with the league.

At Liverpool it's all about Alonso for me. If he stays they have a good chance imo. If he goes i think Rafa will struggle a lot to replace him.

herbieflowers

Pro. F wrote: »

I think Arsenal are the dark horse this year. Lots of people are writing them off but I think with a better defence this season they're going to be formidable.

Don't know about Ancelotti at Chelsea. He's a top manager and they have a great team and squad. But having won only one Scudetto makes me wonder how good he is at insuring that the bread and butter of the league gets sorted week in, week out. I'm not saying that he will fail - I don't think that will happen - i just don't know if he'll get to grips with the league.

Yeah, I think Arsenal were fairly ravaged by injuries last season. I think they'll do better this term if they can keep their first eleven fit for most of the season but ultimately the squad is a little weak.

Re: Ancelotti. It can go either way. On the one hand you have someone like Scolari, repsected international maanger who ultimately wasn't able to get the best out of the side and then someone like Hiddink or even Grant who had no prior experience managing in the PL and doing great jobs.

Morzadec

5starpool wrote: »

Their bad run of form coincided I think with Essiens absence, and the importance and brilliance of him cannot be underestimated. More than Lampard, Drogba, Anelka or Terry, to my mind he is the single most important player in the Chelsea team.

Was looking at the odds for PFA player of the year, and it looks like the bookies agree with your assessment of Essien. Was quite surprised to see him as joint favourite with Gerrard although I do rate him very highly.

PFA Player of the Year Odds (Paddypower):

Gerrard 6/1
Essien 6/1
Torres 9/1
Lampard 10/1
Rooney 10/1
Fabregas 14/1
Arshavin 14/1
Drogba 20/1
Robinho 20/1
Terry 20/1
Van Persie 22/1

Obviously this is a hard award to predict (given Giggs's win last year and the fact it should have arguably gone to Vidic who would've possibly been around the 50/1 mark at the start of the season), but any predictions for this one?

Gerrard I'm sure should make the nominations as he has done most years so it's understandable that he's favourite. Rooney could take it if he starts playing regularly up front and United win the League. LAmps will be up there I'm sure. I think Arshavin could have a good chance, he looks a reallly special player. If Torres stays fit he'll be up there as well I'm sure.

Interesting to see that Terry is shorter odds than Vidic...

Really hard to predict as I say.

5starpool

I'm surprised that neither Ferdinand or Vidic make it into that lineup really.

Morzadec

5starpool wrote: »

I'm surprised that neither Ferdinand or Vidic make it into that lineup really.

Yeah I stopped at Van P, Vidic is right after at 25/1. Which to be honest might not be a bad shout. It was between him, Gerrard and Lampard last season for me.

jesus_thats_gre

Man City could end up being responsible for Arsenal not only retaining their position in the top 4 but making a genuine push for the the league title.

A month ago, it looked like Arsenal were **** broke and unable to afford anyone to plug that hole in the centre of midfield. Now they have 40 million and probably the best squad of attacking players in the league.

While they are leaking goals all over the shop, they are always at risk of dropping out of the top 4. If they sign a top class holding midfielder, Arsenal will be genuine contenders for the league.

Just look at the squad:

Right back: Sagna and Eboue
Centre back: Gallas, Vermaelen, Djourou and Silvestre
Left back: Clichy, Traore and Gibbs

Defensive midfielder: xxxxxxxxx, Denilson, Song and Diaby
Attacking midfielder: Fabregas, Arshavin, Nasri, Rosicky and Walcott

Strikers: Ven Persie, Bendtner, Eduardo and Vela

That squad is very close to being complete.

JPA

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Man City could end up being responsible for Arsenal not only retaining their position in the top 4 but making a genuine push for the the league title.

A month ago, it looked like Arsenal were **** broke and unable to afford anyone to plug that hole in the centre of midfield. Now they have 40 million and probably the best squad of attacking players in the league.

While they are leaking goals all over the shop, they are always at risk of dropping out of the top 4. If they sign a top class holding midfielder, Arsenal will be genuine contenders for the league.

Just look at the squad:

Right back: Sagna and Eboue
Centre back: Gallas, Vermaelen, Djourou and Silvestre
Left back: Clichy, Traore and Gibbs

Defensive midfielder: xxxxxxxxx, Denilson, Song and Diaby
Attacking midfielder: Fabregas, Arshavin, Nasri, Rosicky and Walcott

Strikers: Ven Persie, Bendtner, Eduardo and Vela

That squad is very close to being complete.

Centre back is surely a problem position, Silvestre obviously not good enough, Gallas has struggled for form all his Arsenal career, Vermaelen unknown in the league and is Djourou good enough?

Morzadec

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Man City could end up being responsible for Arsenal not only retaining their position in the top 4 but making a genuine push for the the league title.

A month ago, it looked like Arsenal were **** broke and unable to afford anyone to plug that hole in the centre of midfield. Now they have 40 million and probably the best squad of attacking players in the league.

While they are leaking goals all over the shop, they are always at risk of dropping out of the top 4. If they sign a top class holding midfielder, Arsenal will be genuine contenders for the league.

Just look at the squad:

Right back: Sagna and Eboue
Centre back: Gallas, Vermaelen, Djourou and Silvestre
Left back: Clichy, Traore and Gibbs

Defensive midfielder: xxxxxxxxx, Denilson, Song and Diaby
Attacking midfielder: Fabregas, Arshavin, Nasri, Rosicky and Walcott

Strikers: Ven Persie, Bendtner, Eduardo and Vela

That squad is very close to being complete.

Yeah I certainly wouldn't write them off. People are quick to forget that they were genuinely challenging for the League in 07/08, and were certainly the best side for the first 6 months or so. They also had some rotten luck with injuries last year. People have pointed to United, Liverpool and Chelsea having 'new' players (i.e. players still at the club but who were peripheral last year due to injuries).

But it is arguably Arsenal who have strengthened most without adding to the squad.

Fabregas only played 22 League games last year and he is a huge player for them -their biggest.

Rosicky didn't play at all (question marks over his current ability after 18 months out to be fair)

Eduardo pretty much missed the whole season and he's a top striker, he will be an important player this season.

Arshavin only played 12 games. He could be massive for them this year, he looks like a real top class player.

Add to this the fact that players like Walcott, Bendtner, Song, Djorou and a couple of others, will be a year older and wiser and there is certainly an argument that could be made that they could well add 10-15 points onto last years tally.

Would absolutely agree with your point about the DM though. Flamini was a huge loss for them. A new signing, or someone like Song to really step up is a must if they are to challenge.

Pro. F

Morzadec wrote: »

Rooney could take it if he starts playing regularly up front and United win the League.

You do know that Rooney played regularly up front last season? He only played out wide a handful of times in all competitions. ..not that i'm saying he should have won the award btw

Headshot

out of the top 4

what players are going to the African nations ?

edit

theres none from utd anyway

leninbenjamin

JPA wrote: »

Centre back is surely a problem position, Silvestre obviously not good enough, Gallas has struggled for form all his Arsenal career, Vermaelen unknown in the league and is Djourou good enough?

I'm beginning to think otherwise. It's not the worlds best but it could well suffice if we can strengthen the midfield. With the exception of set pieces, most of the problems stemmed from the midfield. Gilberto in his day was a master at dropping into defence to take up covering positions, and Flamini after his good run at left back seemed to learn how to do it in his own more energetic way.

I think it's why Sagna and Clichy looked much more error prone last season, they simply didn't have cover and were nervous because of it, and Gallas and Toure were over stretched because of it.

jesus_thats_gre

JPA wrote: »

Centre back is surely a problem position, Silvestre obviously not good enough, Gallas has struggled for form all his Arsenal career, Vermaelen unknown in the league and is Djourou good enough?

I do agree that they could do with improving but I think a quality defensive midfielder would take an awful lot of pressure off the defense.

jesus_thats_gre

leninbenjamin wrote: »

I'm beginning to think otherwise. It's not the worlds best but it could well suffice if we can strengthen the midfield. With the exception of set pieces, most of the problems stemmed from the midfield. Gilberto in his day was a master at dropping into defence to take up covering positions, and Flamini after his good run at left back seemed to learn how to do it in his own more energetic way.

I think it's why Sagna and Clichy looked much more error prone last season, they simply didn't have cover and were nervous because of it, and Gallas and Toure were over stretched because of it.

I would agree with this post 100%

JPA

Headshot wrote: »

out of the top 4

what players are going to the African nations ?

edit

theres none from utd anyway

Essien, Drogba, Mikel, Eboue, Song, el Zhar



forgot Kalou.

Fuzzy_Dunlop

Headshot wrote: »

out of the top 4

what players are going to the African nations ?

edit

theres none from utd anyway

Essien, Mikel, Kalou, Drogba, Song, Eboue(if he stays)

That's all I can think of for now

JPA

leninbenjamin wrote: »

I'm beginning to think otherwise. It's not the worlds best but it could well suffice if we can strengthen the midfield. With the exception of set pieces, most of the problems stemmed from the midfield. Gilberto in his day was a master at dropping into defence to take up covering positions, and Flamini after his good run at left back seemed to learn how to do it in his own more energetic way.

I think it's why Sagna and Clichy looked much more error prone last season, they simply didn't have cover and were nervous because of it, and Gallas and Toure were over stretched because of it.

Well I agree but is the central defence good enough, no matter what midfield there is, to win the league ? Is that still the aim?

jesus_thats_gre

JPA wrote: »

Essien, Drogba, Mikel, Eboue, Song, el Zhar



forgot Kalou.

Chelsea hit pretty hard. Could cause them major problems.

JPA wrote: »

Well I agree but is the central defence good enough, no matter what midfield there is, to win the league ? Is that still the aim?

It isn't as good as the others but Arsenal will never be as dependent on clean sheets as Liverpool, Chelsea or United.

Morzadec

Pro. F wrote: »

You do know that Rooney played regularly up front last season? He only played out wide a handful of times in all competitions. ..not that i'm saying he should have won the award btw

true true it was him and Berba most of the time. I guess what I mean is that with Ronaldo gone, Rooney will possibly be the focal point of the attack. Rooney sometimes had to sacrifice himself to accomadate Ronny's backtracking. (I'll admit this is something that happened more in the CL, and I probably saw more of United in the CL last year so maybe this is what I'm basing it on).

leninbenjamin

JPA wrote: »

Well I agree but is the central defence good enough, no matter what midfield there is, to win the league ? Is that still the aim?

of course winning the league is the aim.

the point is, if there is enough balance throughout the squad, you don't need brilliance in any one particular area.

Man United have brilliant defenders who compensate for weakness in midfield to control the game. Liverpool have an excellent midfield who compensate for weaknesses in their defence (most notable Masch, who makes up for their complete lack of a decent fullback). The same of Chelsea where Essien's closing down compensates for Terry's lack of pace meaning there's less balls going over the top for him to chase.

If Denilson and Song could step up their game to exert more influence a bit more our defenders wouldn't be caught out as often, and their weaknesses wouldn't exposed as frequently.

JPA

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

It isn't as good as the others but Arsenal will never be as dependent on clean sheets as Liverpool, Chelsea or United.

IF they won the league it would be because they are capable of keeping clean sheets. A team simply has to have a top notch defence to win the league.

Pro. F

leninbenjamin wrote: »

The same of Chelsea where Essien's closing down compensates for Terry's lack of pace meaning there's less balls going over the top for him to chase.

Do you think Vidic or Caragher have that much more pace than Terry? It's the combination of the centre back pair that matters. If any pair of centre backs can't deal with balls going over the top then they won't get anywhere near winning the league.

leninbenjamin

Pro. F wrote: »

Do you think Vidic or Caragher have that much more pace than Terry?

yes. Well, Vidic maybe not, but Carragher definitely. Terry's lost a lot of his pace due to Mourinho and co. making him play through injuries to the extent it's much more a liability now than it was two years ago in my opinion.

Pro. F wrote: »

It's the combination of the centre back pair that matters. If any pair of centre backs can't deal with balls going over the top then they won't get anywhere near winning the league.

I'm not disagreeing with that at all, Vidic's lack of pace is completely covered by Ferdinand's fantastic sweeping ability (in the same way Ferdinand compensates for the midfield as i mentioned above).

But none of Chelsea's CBs would have the pace of Ferdinand or Toure and seem much easier to expose in the last season than in their heyday.

As for Arsenal, the CB partnership is completely unknown. It all depends on how good Vermaelen is.

And liverpool play a narrower game than the others so pace in the CBs isn't as much a necessity, but their ability to do so successfully hinges on the fantastic midfield.

Pro. F

leninbenjamin wrote: »

But none of Chelsea's CBs would have the pace of Ferdinand or Toure and seem much easier to expose in the last season than in their heyday.

Could be true that they are getting to be past it but i wouldn't judge them on last season. Chelsea had a horrible season just gone with Scolari floundering, Carvahlo out injured and Cech continuing to fall apart.

leninbenjamin wrote: »

As for Arsenal, the CB partnership is completely unknown. It all depends on how good Vermaelen is.

Yeah agree with you there. I think Gallas gets a lot of undeserved stick tbh. He was a sh!t captain but i think he's a good centre back. It all just depends on how good Vermaelan is and if they work together. I wonder if some more cover is needed there though, now that Toure is gone. it's a hard call to say where the money should be spent imo.

leninbenjamin wrote: »

And liverpool play a narrower game than the others so pace in the CBs isn't as much a necessity, but their ability to do so successfully hinges on the fantastic midfield.

Nah man - you're over complicating it. If Liverpool's centre backs couldn't deal with the ball being played over the top they wouldn't have done so well in the league and CL last season, no matter what their midfield was doing. I'm not saying that the midfield doesn't need to protect the defence, they do, but weak centre back pairings don't get to challenge for the league.

leninbenjamin

Pro. F wrote: »

Could be true that they are getting to be past it but i wouldn't judge them on last season. Chelsea had a horrible season just gone with Scolari floundering, Carvahlo out injured and Cech continuing to fall apart.

Well, i think Carvalho, while still a top notch player, can't be relied at at this level any more. Just too many injuries over the past two seasons. As for Terry, I've been saying that since before Mourinho left. He's not the same player who won the Prem. I also remember it being said somewhere when he was coming back from the last big injury he had that his jump isn't as good as it used to be (from the back injury i think), that he's lost a few inches and he doesn't have the 'spring' he had to throw himself about as much.

Pro. F wrote: »

Yeah agree with you there. I think Gallas gets a lot of undeserved stick tbh. He was a sh!t captain but i think he's a good centre back. It all just depends on how good Vermaelan is and if they work together. I wonder if some more cover is needed there though, now that Toure is gone. it's a hard call to say where the money should be spent imo.

It's a head wrecker tbh. Listening to the descriptions, Vermaelen is another sweeper type who relies on his reading of the game more than his physicality or pace. Which isn't what they need tbh, they've missed having a stopper in the back since Campbell left. Big questions remain.

Pro. F wrote: »

Nah man - you're over complicating it. If Liverpool's centre backs couldn't deal with the ball being played over the top they wouldn't have done so well in the league and CL last season, no matter what their midfield was doing. I'm not saying that the midfield doesn't need to protect the defence, they do, but weak centre back pairings don't get to challenge for the league.

maybe, but any time i watch them, Masch seems to bail Carra and Srkrtl/Agger out a few times in a game with his covering and work rate. I'm not saying they are weak though, I'm just saying they have their vulnerabilities.

Defences as good as United's at the moment are quite rare, they really do bail United out a hell of a lot. You only have to watch the CL final to see how vulnerable United can be if they aren't on form (i know some one will counter with the can't judge them on one game thing, but i think it's a perfect example) . Tbh, i'd hazard the only equivalent paring of this decade were Nesta/Cannavaro.

Smegball

I think Arsenal will surprise alot of people next season and be challenging right to the end, the potential is there, Rosicky and Eduardo are basically new signings, Wilshere looks fantastic, Ramsey is a very gifted young player and I think Song will have a great season.

If they get some consistency going they will definitely be in with a shout of the league imo.

mink_man

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Chelsea hit pretty hard. Could cause them major problems.



It isn't as good as the others but Arsenal will never be as dependent on clean sheets as Liverpool, Chelsea or United.

thats stupid, the reason the're not challenging for the league is because they concede too many goals!!!

mink_man

Smegball wrote: »

I think Arsenal will surprise alot of people next season and be challenging right to the end, the potential is there, Rosicky and Eduardo are basically new signings, Wilshere looks fantastic, Ramsey is a very gifted young player and I think Song will have a great season.

If they get some consistency going they will definitely be in with a shout of the league imo.

yep, united fan here and i think arsenal will surprise alot of people, they could finish above liverpool i think!

jesus_thats_gre

mink_man wrote: »

thats stupid, the reason the're not challenging for the league is because they concede too many goals!!!

Yes, hence me saying that if they sign a decent defensive midfielder that will inevitably lead to them to them conceeding less, that they will very likley be in with a genuine shout.

I also think I mentioned something about their place in the top 4 being under risk if they keep leaking goals like they are.

Not quite sure what part of that is stupid. Maybe you can shed some light on that?

PHB

In terms of the league, I think, at this very moment, the top 4 clubs have fairly similar first 11s, with Arsenal prob in 4th place.

I think Liverpool might lose Alonso which will be a significant loss. I think Arsenal could still strengthen.
Chelsea and United might still strengthen but it seems unlikely.

If I had to call the league right now, I'd say United. As I still think Chelsea's system doesn't suit the PL, the squad of Liverpool is weak, particuarly on the wings, and Arsenal just don't have the mettle to maintain a challenge. That said, United have lots of potential problems too.

It really could go any way, although I would think that personally, Chelsea and United are favorites, Arsenal 3rd and Liverpool are the team I fear the least from the top 4, but still wouldn't be hugely shocked to see any win it.

PHB

In terms of the league, I think, at this very moment, the top 4 clubs have fairly similar first 11s, with Arsenal prob in 4th place.

I think Liverpool might lose Alonso which will be a significant loss. I think Arsenal could still strengthen.
Chelsea and United might still strengthen but it seems unlikely.

If I had to call the league right now, I'd say United. As I still think Chelsea's system doesn't suit the PL, the squad of Liverpool is weak, particuarly on the wings, and Arsenal just don't have the mettle to maintain a challenge. That said, United have lots of potential problems too.

It really could go any way, although I would think that personally, Chelsea and United are favorites, Arsenal 3rd and Liverpool are the team I fear the least from the top 4, but still wouldn't be hugely shocked to see any win it.

Mr Alan

Kuyt
Yossi
Riera
Babel
El Zhar

with possibly one new winger coming in also....

versus....

Valencia
Park
Giggs
Obertan
Nani

pretty similar imo-as you yourself said on numerous occassions, Ronaldos brilliance papered over cracks in Utds squad.

Headshot

Mr Alan wrote: »

Kuyt
Yossi
Riera
Babel
El Zhar

with possibly one new winger coming in also....

versus....

Valencia
Park
Giggs
Obertan
Nani

pretty similar imo-as you yourself said on numerous occassions, Ronaldos brilliance papered over cracks in Utds squad.

mr alan if your going to name out our wingers,please at least get it right

giggs doesn't play on the wing any-more

and you forgot the talented Tosic

oh and btw our wingers win

Eire-Dearg

The talented Tosic has yet to do anything at Man Utd, so how he can be regarded is beyond me, same for Obertan. Let's see when they actually get some game time.

Valencia was a good buy, but he'll never offer what Ronaldo offered.
Nani hasn't turned his potential yet, and Park is an honest hard worker.

For me Yossi is better than Park or Nani, he's reliant and worthy of regular goals. As for Kuyt, for me one of the best right midfielders in the League. Who'd have thunk it two years ago? Who needs winger pace when you can provide like him.

El Zhar is good back-up, while Babel? You could say he's our own version of Nani.

flahavaj

Liverpool's are better there on paper to be perfectly honest. Not that that proves a whole lot in the long run.

Headshot

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

The talented Tosic has yet to do anything at Man Utd, so how he can be regarded is beyond me, same for Obertan. Let's see when they actually get some game time.

Valencia was a good buy, but he'll never offer what Ronaldo offered.
Nani hasn't turned his potential yet, and Park is an honest hard worker.

For me Yossi is better than Park or Nani, he's reliant and worthy of regular goals. As for Kuyt, for me one of the best right midfielders in the League. Who'd have thunk it two years ago? Who needs winger pace when you can provide like him.

El Zhar is good back-up, while Babel? You could say he's our own version of Nani.

well I called him talented because iv seen him for the U21 tournaments
ah ya valencia isnt bought to the next Ronaldo,there a tad different ya know

I find yossi doesnt perform that well on the wings compared when he is in Gerrard position

orourkeda

Mr Alan wrote: »

so where's the "pure class" in Utds midfield?

criticisms leveled at Ballack are also equally (if not more applicable) to Giggs & Scholes in the Utd midfield.

Plus i think If Alonso leaves, i think he'll be replaced by a very good player.

Now I'm not a Manchester United supporter.

Premier League Champions
League Cup Winners
World Club Champions
Champions League Runners Up
FA Cup Semi Finalists.

Thats where the pure class in Manchester Uniteds midfield is.

Eire-Dearg

Headshot wrote: »

well I called him talented because iv seen him for the U21 tournaments
ah ya valencia isnt bought to the next Ronaldo,there a tad different ya know

Didn't say he was bought to be the next Ronaldo, but he's the only starting XI player you've bought in his position.

I find yossi doesnt perform that well on the wings compared when he is in Gerrard position

Yossi could start on the wing, and still perform better centrally as he has a tendancy to wander in. Top, top reliant player in a range of positions.

Headshot

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Didn't say he was bought to be the next Ronaldo, but he's the only starting XI player you've bought in his position.



Yossi could start on the wing, and still perform better centrally as he has a tendancy to wander in. Top, top reliant player in a range of positions.

why would we need to buy 2 RW's

valencia is first choice and Nani is probably back up

as a winger park is better than yossi,yossi is great in Gerrard position that's what i think or should i say my wallet says so

Liam O

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Didn't say he was bought to be the next Ronaldo, but he's the only starting XI player you've bought in his position.



Yossi could start on the wing, and still perform better centrally as he has a tendancy to wander in. Top, top reliant player in a range of positions.

Benayoun is nearly even with Park imo. If Park could finish from all the great positions he gets himself into he'd be twice the player. Benayoun is better at finishing, Park is better at tackling. Benayoun is the better player imo, but Park fits better at United than I think Benayoun would.

Mr Alan

orourkeda wrote: »

Now I'm not a Manchester United supporter.

Premier League Champions
League Cup Winners
World Club Champions
Champions League Runners Up
FA Cup Semi Finalists.

Thats where the pure class in Manchester Uniteds midfield is.

this thread is about next season, not last.

Utd have sold their best winger, their best player. so last years performances are a little irrelevant.

Liam O

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Didn't say he was bought to be the next Ronaldo, but he's the only starting XI player you've bought in his position.



Yossi could start on the wing, and still perform better centrally as he has a tendancy to wander in. Top, top reliant player in a range of positions.

what was Ronaldo's position as a matter of interest? it certainly wasn't where Valencia will be playing.

Eire-Dearg

Liam O wrote: »

what was Ronaldo's position as a matter of interest? it certainly wasn't where Valencia will be playing.

Ronaldo had an unclassified position, if you want go that route then Valencia will be filling in a fifth of what Ronaldo did and that's being a wide player now and then.

PHB

Well ya see, I was talking about squad. Rooney is going to play there quite a bit I'd say, especially if nobody steps up. That'll make us fairly decent out there.

Since the comparison would be Kuyt, I know you'll throw some stat my way, but imo Rooney is a far superior player.

Beyond that,

Park is fairly similar to Yossi, although Yossi is more central
Nani is fairly similar, but imo better than Babel
Valencia and Riera are fairly similar I'd accept

The difference between United and Liverpool on the wings? Full-backs. Ours offer so much more going forward in general play.

Nonetheless, wings are the area where United are without a doubt most weak. However, our squad can cover for it imo for a league challenge. I wouldn't think that Liverpools squad can.

Liverpool will fall down for the same reason they have in the past, a lack of natural width that breaks down poorer teams on a more consistant basis. Ultimately, Liverpool play a striker who provides very little width, and Yossi, who is more of a central attacking midfielder.
Uniteds wingers are more natural wingers, bar Rooney of course, and likely to provide proper width.

Rafa is still sticking to his guns and playing the narrow game, and I think it'll be the downfall.

Liam O

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Ronaldo had an unclassified position, if you want go that route then Valencia will be filling in a fifth of what Ronaldo did and that's being a wide player now and then.

No, Valencia will be playing on the right midfield, sticking to the byline. You say that's a fifth of what Ronaldo did? Well while Ronaldo is a great player he can hardly be in five places at once can he?

Eire-Dearg

Liam O wrote: »

No, Valencia will be playing on the right midfield, sticking to the byline. You say that's a fifth of what Ronaldo did? Well while Ronaldo is a great player he can hardly be in five places at once can he?

Yes, that's what I meant :rolleyes:

Goals, provide, play out wide, etc.

aodea

Mr Alan wrote: »

this thread is about next season, not last.

Utd have sold their best winger, their best player. so last years performances are a little irrelevant.

ill tell you why this matters. man utd players have been there and done that and won the lot. man utd have sold big players before and strolled to titles, Ince and kanchelskis, beckham, Ruud van Nistilroy. When push comes to shove to pick up points the experince utds players have is huge.
They grind results there Midfield is top notch and while it may not have a lampard or essien its world class because it does not fall apart when one player is injured or suspended. Liverpool lose the masch they are in trouble, Lampard gets injured there up the creek, utd lose carrick there team wont suffer like that.

The reason utd do well is they beat the other teams in the premership more often. I think the challenge will be good this year as really think Aresnal may push on and chelsea may have one last big year left in some of there older boys. i worry for liverpool if they lose alonso as stevie g drops back and i really felt him being closer to torres was why they were such a threat last year.

orourkeda

Mr Alan wrote: »

this thread is about next season, not last.

Utd have sold their best winger, their best player. so last years performances are a little irrelevant.

They got by far the best of the Ronaldo deal. They still have a midfield capable of being the best in the league. Their nearest rivals have not made the necessary additions to make a sufficient but we'll just have to wait and see how the season plays out