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Is there anything that has made you think?

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    #32
    tlev
    Closed Accounts Posts: 320 ✭✭tlev


    ei.sdraob wrote: »
    a global currency enforced via embeded microchips in your arm :D

    Sounds like someone is in the wrong forum....:D:D


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    #33
    fictionaire
    Closed Accounts Posts: 75 ✭✭fictionaire


    The fact that we are being asked to vote a second time has made me think.

    If the treaty was passed the last time, would we be asked to vote again?
    Are there implications for democracy here?

    Does anybody know the record of the amount of times a populace has been asked to vote on the same issue more than once in Europe?


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    #34
    FutureTaoiseach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭FutureTaoiseach


    fictionaire wrote: »
    The fact that we are being asked to vote a second time has made me think.

    If the treaty was passed the last time, would we be asked to vote again?
    Are there implications for democracy here?

    Does anybody know the record of the amount of times a populace has been asked to vote on the same issue more than once in Europe?
    With respect to EU Treaties, it only happened 3 times, Maastricht (Denmark), and then us with Nice and now Lisbon. There has never been a third referenda on an EU treaty in an EU member state, however, and I don't believe there would be should we vote no. For a start, a Tory govt in the UK won't insist on trying to flog this dead horse a third time. They despise the Treaty.


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    #35
    View
    Registered Users Posts: 3,872 ✭✭✭View


    FutureTaoiseach wrote: »
    With respect to EU Treaties, it only happened 3 times, Maastricht (Denmark), and then us with Nice and now Lisbon. There has never been a third referenda on an EU treaty in an EU member state, however, and I don't believe there would be should we vote no. For a start, a Tory govt in the UK won't insist on trying to flog this dead horse a third time. They despise the Treaty.

    There is always a first time. After all, were the government to decide to opt-in to the full provisions of Schengen after the defeat of Lisbon II, it would totally change the context of Lisbon III. Suddenly, those provisions in Lisbon on streamlining the operation of Schengen would be very important...


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    #36
    FutureTaoiseach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭FutureTaoiseach


    View wrote: »
    There is always a first time. After all, were the government to decide to opt-in to the full provisions of Schengen after the defeat of Lisbon II, it would totally change the context of Lisbon III. Suddenly, those provisions in Lisbon on streamlining the operation of Schengen would be very important...
    Which would play into the hands of those voters concerned with the "race to the bottom". I'm relying on a no vote to constitute, besides a rejection of Lisbon itself, a warning to the political-parties, and especially FF, to heed the concerns of those voters concerned with this issue.


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    #37
    tolosenc
    Registered Users Posts: 6,889 ✭✭✭tolosenc


    There have been a few which have made me think, but this was mostly before I'd done my own research. Basically, they were, like 99% of the resons for voting no, baseless lies.


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    #38
    View
    Registered Users Posts: 3,872 ✭✭✭View


    FutureTaoiseach wrote: »
    Which would play into the hands of those voters concerned with the "race to the bottom".

    Well, in my opinion, the number of such voters would be outweighed by the number of voters who suddenly wanted the improvements in Lisbon to the Schengen/JHA provisions to come into place (rather than face Schengen without the improved provisions). But that is just a guess on my part, of course...
    FutureTaoiseach wrote: »
    im I'm relying on a no vote to constitute, besides a rejection of Lisbon itself, a warning to the political-parties, and especially FF, to heed the concerns of those voters concerned with this issue.

    Even if a No vote in Lisbon II killed the treaty, such a scenario would in my opinion, probably trigger changes you'd like even less as I'd guess it would result in a constitutional referendum to deal with the Crotty judgment. I suspect that the average voter isn't actually all that thrilled at the quality of "debate" that accompanies the EU treaties referenda...


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