Looking for a good starting point

evil-monkey

Hey all,

I'm looking to do the Irish Leaving Cert Irish exam next year. I'm going into my final year of BSc degree, but am considering pursuing a primary teaching post grad come the conclusion of my studies.

I did Ordinary Level Irish for my leaving cert (6 years ago now). Haven't a word of Irish now, and need to get a C in Honours next summer.

I am going to do a night course in it, but I'm looking to get started straight away. Can anyone suggest a good way to get started?? Any good books for beginners or for the basics of the language??

Any tips much appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Poll Dubh

evil-monkey wrote: »

Haven't a word of Irish now

Another great educator for the Irish state in the making - hope to god you don't end up teaching my kids.

dlofnep

Ah Poll... Don't nitpick. The internet is hardly a bastion for grammar

Evil Monkey, I can only offer advice to you for what helped me. I bought the buntus cainte books (3 of them) which helped me build up my vocab and phrases. I regularly watch TG4, and I listen to RnaG, and Splanc on Newstalk on Fridays at 10pm. In addition to that, I started up a conversational group locally which has helped me loads. There was none in the city, so I had to get one going myself.

I did a course with Gaelchultúr last year also, and it helped me a good bit too - Although it was quite expensive.

Just stick at it, don't get disheartened. In 6 months from now, look back at how much you've learned. I don't see my progress in gaeilge until I look back. 2-3 years ago, I couldn't string together a basic sentence.. Now I'm fully able to maintain a conversation.

Adh mór ort!

Oh one more thing - Buy a small little notebook (that you can fit in your pocket) - Bring it everywhere with you and note down any new phrases you hear. I find that phrases don't stick with you until you hear them a few times, by me just writing them down I've learned loads.

pog it

Have you decided which night course you're going to do?

In the meantime exposure to Irish will be massive help to ya when you go to actually start the classes- just watch lots of tg4 programmes and listen to radio. Yeah you won't understand what they're saying but you will absorb the sounds and pronunciation with no effort! Good way to start imo.

Then up the ante. Get yourself basic books say at the standard of 1st year secondary school Irish and so on. If that is too heavy even for the first couple of months, then go with Buntus Cainte as suggested by Dlofnep! I definitely think you should be getting grinds too on top of the night school. It's the way to go- one on one. Every week, or every second week- it'll be worth every penny.

Have faith, a year of consistent and hard study and you'll have a good enough standard in Irish at least which you can then keep building on.

evil-monkey

Poll Dubh wrote: »

Another great educator for the Irish state in the making - hope to god you don't end up teaching my kids.

Well if they're anything like their parent I'll do my best to avoid them so don't worry. My Irish is poor due to lack of use, yes. But my maths are superb, my English good enough for publication, I've written software for the teaching of word recognition to dyslexic kids that was taken on board by the Department of Education, and I'm not an a**hole who makes snide remarks when someone asks me for help or advice. No wonder the Irish language is dead if this is the reception people get when looking to learn it.

For everyone else, thanks for the tips. Will take them on board.

Poll Dubh

evil-monkey wrote: »

Well if they're anything like their parent I'll do my best to avoid them so don't worry. My Irish is poor due to lack of use, yes. But my maths are superb, my English good enough for publication, I've written software for the teaching of word recognition to dyslexic kids that was taken on board by the Department of Education, and I'm not an a**hole who makes snide remarks when someone asks me for help or advice. No wonder the Irish language is dead if this is the reception people get when looking to learn it.

For everyone else, thanks for the tips. Will take them on board.

I'm happy to see you're interested in learning the language even though it's obviously not because of any interest in speaking it, but just to get a job. It's simply ridiculous that you should be thinking about teaching in the Irish school system until you have a reasonable grasp of Irish. With English and Maths you are only 2 out of the 3 core subjects. Thanks to the lack of government interest in protecting our native language the sad reality is you'd still probably be recruited. Get used to snide remarks when you're a teacher because your career won't last long if you resort to name calling.

evil-monkey

Poll Dubh wrote: »

With English and Maths you are only 2 out of the 3 core subjects.

Yes, the two that pupils will actually use in their future.

And I wasn't name calling, I was simply making the point that when people ask me for help, I don't make snide remarks. You unfortunately can't say the same.

Whatever my reasons for wanting to learn Irish, I would think all that matters is that I am learning Irish. With the numbers of those speaking the language in such a pitiful state, I don't think it's important why people want to learn it, but just that they do. In two years time I could have a fine standard of Irish. The reasons as to why I attained that standard is irrelevant. What really matters is that there's one more person speaking a language that needs every tongue it can get.

dlofnep

Poll, it's that sort of attitude that puts people off learning Irish. Whatever his reasons are, it's his reasons. He asked for help, not to be criticised.

Poll Dubh

dlofnep wrote: »

Poll, it's that sort of attitude that puts people off learning Irish. Whatever his reasons are, it's his reasons. He asked for help, not to be criticised.

It's teaching it I want to put the OP off, not learning. The number one reason that people give that they can't speak Irish is because of the education system. Yet at the the same time you have the OP who regards Irish as a dead language and can't speak a word looking to become a teacher. What standard of Irish is Evil-Monkey likely to achieve in night classes? Maybe enough to get by, just, but certainly not enough to teach the language to a good standard. With the lack of interest in the language obvious in the OP's posts what hope is there for the hundreds of children who would pass under Evil-Monkey's tutelage of ever acquiring an interest or competency in the language. Evil monkey should go to England to teach and leave teaching posts in Ireland open to people who care about our language and culture.

evil-monkey

Poll Dubh wrote: »

The number one reason that people give that they can't speak Irish is because of the education system.

That's not necessarily true. The majority of people that I know that didn't do it at higher level in school was because they knew they'd never have use of it. It's not required in a whole lot of professions these days...

Poll Dubh wrote: »

Yet at the the same time you have the OP who regards Irish as a dead language

Irish is a dying language, are you suggesting that it isn't?? That's just a simple matter of fact. I'm not disrespecting the language in anyway - I'm just stating the obvious.

Poll Dubh wrote: »

What standard of Irish is Evil-Monkey likely to achieve in night classes? Maybe enough to get by, just, but certainly not enough to teach the language to a good standard.

I didn't think that primary school children (in non Gaeltacht schools at least) were taught Irish to any great proficiency anyway. If the level that teachers are required to teach isn't high enough in your opinion, then your issue is with the Department of Education, not me.

Poll Dubh wrote: »

Evil monkey should go to England to teach and leave teaching posts in Ireland open to people who care about our language and culture.

Just because I don't place the same weight in the value of Irish as I do in English or Maths doesn't mean I don't care about our culture. There's far more to our culture than just the language. Claiming I don't care about our culture, when you haven't the faintest idea what I'm like, is just silly...

At the end of the day the DOE will decide whether or not my language reaches a high enough proficiency to teach it. Because I personally don't regard it as the most important thing in the world, especially with the state of Mathematics amongst children in the country, is of little consequence, as it does not mean I wouldn't teach it well. I would, like all teachers, follow a curriculum and teach what I'm told. Even if you're the greatest Gaeilgoir on the planet, there's only so much you're allowed teach to 8-year-old anyway. There are countless teachers at primary school level who only know the language to the debt at which they have to teach it. If that's a failing of our system, then take it up with Batt O'Keeffe, not me.

dlofnep

Poll, I think you have evil-monkeys intentions misplaced. We should encourage anybody who wishes to learn the language and promote it - even through education. evil-monkey acknowledges that his/her Irish isn't good enough yet, and wishes to put the time into learning it so that their Irish is alot better.

Alot of primary school teachers have sketchy Irish at first, but after 2 or 3 years of teaching develop much better Irish. Instead of bashing, we should do what we can to help.

Evil-Monkey - you're based in Cork right? Get yourself off to Múscraí, or if you are in East-cork, pop along to An Rinn (west-Waterford Gaeltacht). Spending time in a Gaeltacht is a really great way of absorbing the language, I would certainly recommend it. If you wish to become a primary school teacher, you'll need to go there anyway. Don't make a chore out of it - Go there and enjoy yourself. Have a few pints, talk to the locals. Your level of Irish will improve dramatically.

TirNaNog.

You could brush up with ' Turas teanga' at home
Its a CD pack and book
Teached by the Kinda hot Sharon ni Bheolain

dlofnep

Turas teanga is decent. I have it here.

evil-monkey

dlofnep wrote: »

Evil-Monkey - you're based in Cork right? Get yourself off to Múscraí, or if you are in East-cork, pop along to An Rinn (west-Waterford Gaeltacht). Spending time in a Gaeltacht is a really great way of absorbing the language, I would certainly recommend it. If you wish to become a primary school teacher, you'll need to go there anyway. Don't make a chore out of it - Go there and enjoy yourself. Have a few pints, talk to the locals. Your level of Irish will improve dramatically.

I've made plans with a friend to go to Rinn for two weeks at the end of September / start of October. Hopefully might get to spend a bit longer later in January but that depends on how things go with college, and how I'm fixed to be put up.

dlofnep

Ring is a lovely spot. I'm heading up there tomorrow myself.

herbrobert

hi. an excellent book is progress in irish. using the net is very good and trying to respond to the posts here. also the book dul siar is very good. spending time translating will relly help you i think, bealtrial is another good book. its very do able. your right to start now. youd be amaxed how quickly youll learn . i never took to irish in school and have started now and i engoy it. consider post graduate certs in education in england if you dont get into teaching here. do your base degree here and then a year there. youll have to do an irish exam when you return to ireland but you get five years teaching prior to this, youl have to show in a school though your making an effort to learn the language and that you can teach it the level required in those five years. worth persuing htis one though:)hope that helps

pog it

My father was telling me that when they left primary school in his day they had as much Irish as they have now leaving secondary school. Not to mention Latin! The teachers and principals in the schools back then were very pro-Irish anyway.

Is there a similar profile of primary school teacher about now? I'd reckon if you had great Irish or at least showed you had an above average level you'd have a far bigger chance to get a job. And these days primary school teaching jobs are really thin on the ground, you really need to stand out.

If evilmonkeys could illustrate a genuine interest in and also an above average (in terms of other primary school teachers) level in Irish I'd say it would be in their interest in terms of getting work, and not just the kids!

herbrobert

i dont disagree with that at all and definately believe its beneficial for all. however its up to the teacher involved to maintian thier language and if you spent 15 years teaching infants or resource were you don t use the irish id imagine its very difficult at times. Also ive a friend who works in teaching and she was telling me they really go on all your subject areas. makes sense i guess. The department of education did a survey and it showed teachers at primary level irish to be proficient in general a few years ago. i love irish and dont get me wrong but id hate our education system of such small children to be based on a huge emhasis on irish. art, music love of reading, maths science etc etc all deserve emhasis in their own right and to stand out at these would also be great!!:)anything the children enjoy and develop from.I am confident for the most that most schools in ireland recognise this...I hope!!!!:rolleyes: