Contact with Supervisor

Leopardi

I am roughly seven weeks away from a submission deadline. I've had minimal contact with my supervisor (two emails with extremely brief, if encouraging comments). I have sent him three chapter drafts so far, the last of which he has not commented upon, even though he received it over three weeks ago.

Contact with him has been discouraged, so I am waiting in anguished silence and trying to maintain a respectful distance.

This is extremely frustrating. In spite of his encouraging words, I have received no advice so far. By the time that he offers it, my deadline will be, I imagine, significantly closer.

Given his vast wealth of supervisory experience, I am wondering if this is standard practice?

I am tempted to be idealistic and imagine that he has much faith in me, but I dread a situation where I receive a grade that falls short of my standards.

Given his eminence both inside and outside my institution, I feel totally powerless.

convert

Is there any particular reason you were advised to keep contact to a minimum?

Do you know if he is away at the moment? Or is he around campus?

Perhaps you could send him a polite email asking him if he had received your last chapter and ask would it be possible to arrange a meeting with him to discuss the overall state of your thesis with the deadline being so close.

Leopardi

convert wrote: »

Is there any particular reason you were advised to keep contact to a minimum?

Do you know if he is away at the moment? Or is he around campus?

Perhaps you could send him a polite email asking him if he had received your last chapter and ask would it be possible to arrange a meeting with him to discuss the overall state of your thesis with the deadline being so close.

Hi Convert,

Thanks for replying. I was told he is "a very busy man" - which I have no issue with, as I'm aware of the extent of his duties. He is definitely around campus. He told me about two months ago that we would meet as soon as he had material from me to discuss. He already has about 75% of my first draft and no meeting seems imminent. Given his worldwide standing, I'm aware of my privilege in having him as a supervisor, but I have received no concrete advice from him so far, just general approval and assurances of his enthusiasm for my ideas. If my final grade matches such feedback, I'll have no cause for complaint, but if not, I'll feel rather peeved. Having received high firsts in the rest of my coursework, I don't want to ruin my earlier efforts owing to a lack of interaction with him.

convert

Busy or not, he should still have and make time to meet you to discuss your thesis, even if it's just a brief one.

Try emailing him and if that doesn't work, call up to his office. Failing that, camp outside his office till you meet him

My OH couldn't contact their supervisor and resorted to the latter and met the supervisor, who was very apologetic and said he hadn't realised the submission date was so close!!

Best of luck!

Leopardi

convert wrote: »

Busy or not, he should still have and make time to meet you to discuss your thesis, even if it's just a brief one.

Try emailing him and if that doesn't work, call up to his office. Failing that, camp outside his office till you meet him

My OH couldn't contact their supervisor and resorted to the latter and met the supervisor, who was very apologetic and said he hadn't realised the submission date was so close!!

Best of luck!

Thanks again Convert. I'm an independent spirit in general, and I go to painstaking lengths to avoid imposing, but this situation is ridiculous.

Arda

generally, supervisors are expected to meet you at least once a month, no matter what degree you are doing. In the case of a PhD, most of them meet more frequently than that.
You can always if you deem the matter too delicate, contact your student ombudsman (I know from a friend that this was most helpful), which on the other hand might not be much to the likes of your supervisor...your choice.
In my opinion: no academic is so important as to neglect his students and the man wouldn't be very high in my esteem, be he the greatest in his field. especially with a PhD student (and all academics have gone through that) who, as he well knows, needs regular support, encouragement and feedback from him.
I don't want to discourage you and if that is the case then I am more impressed by your rather DIY PhD, as this demands discipline beyond the normal, but some great minds are not necessarily either great lecturers or supervisors.
As it stands, you seem to be fairly advanced, I would suggest you write him a very polite and eloquent email, asking for a meeting asap, where you discuss as much as possible with him. Should he try to defer it or give a reply along the likes 'I-am-very-busy', go to the ombudsman. And please don't listen to what other people tell you about him and what you should do. One of my supervisors has also an extremely important position in the college, yet she has agreed to supervise me and if I have to, I'll tie her to that!
Hope that was a little helpful,
Arda

Leopardi

Arda wrote: »

generally, supervisors are expected to meet you at least once a month, no matter what degree you are doing. In the case of a PhD, most of them meet more frequently than that.
You can always if you deem the matter too delicate, contact your student ombudsman (I know from a friend that this was most helpful), which on the other hand might not be much to the likes of your supervisor...your choice.
In my opinion: no academic is so important as to neglect his students and the man wouldn't be very high in my esteem, be he the greatest in his field. especially with a PhD student (and all academics have gone through that) who, as he well knows, needs regular support, encouragement and feedback from him.
I don't want to discourage you and if that is the case then I am more impressed by your rather DIY PhD, as this demands discipline beyond the normal, but some great minds are not necessarily either great lecturers or supervisors.
As it stands, you seem to be fairly advanced, I would suggest you write him a very polite and eloquent email, asking for a meeting asap, where you discuss as much as possible with him. Should he try to defer it or give a reply along the likes 'I-am-very-busy', go to the ombudsman. And please don't listen to what other people tell you about him and what you should do. One of my supervisors has also an extremely important position in the college, yet she has agreed to supervise me and if I have to, I'll tie her to that!
Hope that was a little helpful,
Arda

I deeply appreciate your reply. It is quite sad that there is often such a gulf between an individual's academic standing and their personal attributes. My first request for a meeting received a vague reply about a future meeting, when more work had been submitted. My second request was totally ignored, then my last request received another evasive answer about a future meeting. I still have not received any concrete advice, despite asking specifically for it. I've received many assurances which involve recognising his very high standards - supposedly I should be flattered by his passivity. I am an extremely diligent student, but I am also an honest one. Soon I will be called upon to sing his praises in my acknowledgements section. It is ludicrous to think I am expected to commend someone who has done virtually nothing for me and who has acted in such an ignorant way. I dread the thought of causing any trouble for him, especially when he is held in high regard by my department, but at the risk of sounding distinctly self-righteous, I think I'm being treated appallingly.

convert

To echo Arda's question: Is there a lecturer in your school/department who's postgrad officer (or some equivalent title)? If so, and from what you've said, it's definitely time to have a chat with them. Part of their role is to help with issues such as yours. And it shouldn't matter who your supervisor is or how well regarded they are, they are still your supervisor and subject to the same rules and guidelines as everyone else.

Leopardi

convert wrote: »

To echo Arda's question: Is there a lecturer in your school/department who's postgrad officer (or some equivalent title)? If so, and from what you've said, it's definitely time to have a chat with them. Part of their role is to help with issues such as yours. And it shouldn't matter who your supervisor is or how well regarded they are, they are still your supervisor and subject to the same rules and guidelines as everyone else.

Yes, there is at least one well-placed member with whom I could consult. I'm just over four weeks away from submission now. I fear the possibility of receiving an email from him advising substantial changes when I'll have even less time to incorporate them. If I take action now, I'm fearful that my grade will suffer because of that (paranoia perhaps). If I am not happy with my eventual grade, I'll definitely appeal, but that will then involve a disruption of my subsequent studies, owing to revision requirements etc.

Thanks for your latest response.

convert

Talk to that staff member as soon as possible, preferably today; tomorrow at the latest. And have the emails to and from your supervisor with you. The sooner you approach them, the sooner the situation is resolved.

Don't worry too much about changes yet... And it's amazing how much work you can get done in 3 weeks... Trust me on that!

Leopardi

convert wrote: »

Talk to that staff member as soon as possible, preferably today; tomorrow at the latest. And have the emails to and from your supervisor with you. The sooner you approach them, the sooner the situation is resolved.

Don't worry too much about changes yet... And it's amazing how much work you can get done in 3 weeks... Trust me on that!

Thanks again. I'm not so much worried about my ability to get any necessary changes done, but the frustrating part about that possibility is that he had most of my chapters for weeks. If major changes were needed, I would have preferred to have started on them before now. At present, I am at the "refine and polish" stage anyway.

I've retained all my email contact with him.

Arda

Maybe there is another lecturer working in the same field who is more approachable than your supervisor, again that friend of mine got a lot of her thesis corrected from the Head of her Department (which works well for major mistakes and changes) and then got into contact with the ombudsman for correction of the finer things. If not, maybe you could just try and find a lecturer you like that is close enough to your field and ask him for simple proof-reading, for punctuation, expressions etc. My first go would also be fellow students; they aren't experts but 'know what you are going through', are maybe at the same level or more advanced and can tell you how to avoid certain mistakes; Content-wise I'm afraid you will have to be patient if you want to be polite. But I have realised with my proposals that other people can often tell if something simply just reads well. I know it is not what you are looking for at the moment but it'll bring you another (even small) step closer to your goal and you don't feel like you are just waiting.
But I also have to agree with Convert, you should contact a member of staff as soon as possible.
Best of luck,
Arda

Leopardi

Arda wrote: »

Maybe there is another lecturer working in the same field who is more approachable than your supervisor, again that friend of mine got a lot of her thesis corrected from the Head of her Department (which works well for major mistakes and changes) and then got into contact with the ombudsman for correction of the finer things. If not, maybe you could just try and find a lecturer you like that is close enough to your field and ask him for simple proof-reading, for punctuation, expressions etc. My first go would also be fellow students; they aren't experts but 'know what you are going through', are maybe at the same level or more advanced and can tell you how to avoid certain mistakes; Content-wise I'm afraid you will have to be patient if you want to be polite. But I have realised with my proposals that other people can often tell if something simply just reads well. I know it is not what you are looking for at the moment but it'll bring you another (even small) step closer to your goal and you don't feel like you are just waiting.
But I also have to agree with Convert, you should contact a member of staff as soon as possible.
Best of luck,
Arda

I am very grateful for your contribution. Yes, I have considered contacting one senior academic who is not formally linked with my institution. His feedback would be helpful. Now that it's Friday, I will not hear from my supervisor for at least three days. My next contact from him will almost certainly involve a vague, one-line statement or a detailed list of advised changes. If I had been receiving proper advice up to now, I would not have had any problem with necessary adjustments, but at this point such changes will have accumulated.

Breaktown

I really hope this works out for you. I know exactly how you feel. I had a "supervisor" for my final year project that was mainly absent and competely ignored me for two months. I'm quite independant, but I did still need some guidance and wasn't given it. So then I didn't get a good grade. I tried to appeal and was told I couldn't. It was so frustrating.

Obviously a PhD is far more important though. If/when you do go to another staff member, try and make sure it's someone who would be neutral about the whole thing and who isn't great friends with your supervisor. That only makes things very awkward.

Leopardi

Breaktown wrote: »

I really hope this works out for you. I know exactly how you feel. I had a "supervisor" for my final year project that was mainly absent and competely ignored me for two months. I'm quite independant, but I did still need some guidance and wasn't given it. So then I didn't get a good grade. I tried to appeal and was told I couldn't. It was so frustrating.

Obviously a PhD is far more important though. If/when you do go to another staff member, try and make sure it's someone who would be neutral about the whole thing and who isn't great friends with your supervisor. That only makes things very awkward.

Thanks for contributing to this thread. My real concern is my potential grade. While it would have been ideal to have experienced fruitful interaction with my supervisor (given his standing and experience), I am less worried about that. Your lack of an appeal option must have been very irritating.

Yes, I am a little concerned about contacting someone else (for the reasons you mentioned). Even if they were to commend my work, I'm still left with a supervisor who has the task of grading me. I still can't believe I'm in this situation.

Leopardi

I tried to appeal and was told I couldn't. It was so frustrating.

Now I've been told by a well-placed source that regardless of my eventual grade, there can be no subsequent change to it through an appeal.

Leopardi

My supervisor eventually took an active stance on my work. In the meantime I got an academic from another institution to read it. I received very positive feedback from that individual. My supervisor has also told me that it is work of the highest quality, but would not speculate as to my eventual grade - he insists that I should be proud of it regardless.

While I cannot expect him to tell me what grade he has in mind (given the necessity for collaboration with an external examiner), I am worried about the possibility of falling short of my standards (my overall grade at present is a high first), especially given the total inadequacy of supervision I received for roughly 75% of my research time.

Now that I'm on the verge of submission (he told me that no further changes are required) I am likely to fret over the coming weeks.

I would be interested to hear the opinions of other members on this issue.