Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2009-2011

STIG83

That behaviour wouldnt really happen at a soccer match!!, it's sad to see that kind of scumbag behaviour creeping into GAA matchs though, last thing you want to happen is be a target for trouble and hassle .

Cake Man

KevIRL wrote: »

Without a doubt I would have gone. Things can be done to cut down on the costs, packed food, car pooling etc. We dont play all that many championship games each season relatively speaking and the team need and deserve our support. A lot of people moaning about the cost were probably out Saturday night having a skinful and spent a good bit more than the match going cost*. It was a really really poor turn out from Waterford people on Sunday.

* I will qualify this by acknowledging this isnt everyone, and in the current climate some people are very stuck, and its tougher again for those with families.

Agreed. I don't know about other people but I plan my summers around these games! :pac:

Mountainlad

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

Mountainlad is calling for Lawlor to be put in fullback praising his performances against Cork and Clare last year but fails to mention that he had a nightmare in the all Ireland semi against Tipp. I think he'll start there the next day as hes an alternative to Hutchinson. not necessarily because hes a better option.

I don't blame you considering the amount of post on this thread in the past 24 hours, but I explicitly stated that Liam had a bad game that day, but to be fair, he was in good company. Sure Noel McGrath ate Brick that day, so will we drop Brick. I'm not saying he's Brick but he's proven he's solid in other tests and has more game time in championship than Hutchison. I also made the point that a full back line is always going to get caught when you have ball raining down on the backline which happened torrentially against Tipp and against Limerick yesterday. But Hutchison wasn't tested and when he was he failed miserably. I also said I've seen them both play at club level and like obviously there's a big difference but I see Liam Lawlor dominate but not Hutchison, ever. And I'm not talking about one game, I was at about three Ballygunner games last year and 6 or 7 the year before and plenty of Fourmilewater games.

deiseach

KevIRL wrote: »

Without a doubt I would have gone. Things can be done to cut down on the costs, hang sangwidges, car pooling etc. We dont play all that many championship games each season relatively speaking and the team need and deserve our support. A lot of people moaning about the cost were probably out Saturday night having a skinful and spent a good bit more than the match going cost*. It was a really really poor turn out from Waterford people on Sunday.

* I will qualify this by acknowledging this isnt everyone, and in the current climate some people are very stuck, and its tougher again for those with families.

Fixed that for you

johnfarmer

Adrian Power's lethal puckouts would have been a massive advantage yesterday in dirty weather like that. But in fairness Pauric won 3 or 4 lovely balls on a day where clean fielding was unbelievably difficult. Anybody else notice Davy moved Shane Walsh out to wing forward? Real sign of panic.

STIG83

johnfarmer wrote: »

Adrian Power's lethal puckouts would have been a massive advantage yesterday in dirty weather like that. But in fairness Pauric won 3 or 4 lovely balls on a day where clean fielding was unbelievably difficult. Anybody else notice Davy moved Shane Walsh out to wing forward? Real sign of panic.

Shane Walsh was fine where he was, Davy makes strange decisons at times

premierstone

johnfarmer wrote: »

Anybody else notice Davy moved Shane Walsh out to wing forward? Real sign of panic.

Tactical incompetence more than panic imo, and there are many examples of it, in fairness as iv said before he is a very very good physical coach but other than that saying he is limited would be a nice way of putting it

Mountainlad

premierstone wrote: »

Thats a very simplistic view tbh, of course shot stoping is an integral part of being a goalkeeper, its what seperates the greats from the also rans Fitzhenry, Cummins and that lunatic of a manager of yers they were/are all capable of making match winning saves, I can honestly say I have never seen Hennesy make any such save, its also one of the very reasons Galway have failed to deliver on all their talent, they havent had a decent keeper in donkeys years.

I miss learn how to manipulate videos because I've heard this a few times.

Decisive/quality saves Clinton has made;

2007-

League final v Kilkenny, flicked the ball off Shefflin's hurley.

Munster Final V Limerick, early save to deny Begley

All-Ireland quater final reply v Cork, many people have convieniently forgotten (ok in fairness if your from Tipp you'd hardly remember) the two early saves he made when our full back line was blitzed, imagine if Cork had scored two early goals? And both were one on ones.

All-ireland semi final v Limerick, on a day he couldn't to much and a year he did very well in and was unlucky to have a full back line that got torn to shreds at times, he made one good save from Seanie O Connor (believe that was his name)

2008-munster quarter final vs Clare, this save featured 20-30 in the recent top 50 saves of all time show on TG4, and although it wasn't decisive by any means it was quality.

2009-All ireland semi final v Kilkenny, a good save to deny Taggy Fogarty

These are only ones I can remember, I will compile a comprehensive list of any I see on the Waterford Chasing Glory dvd in a couple of weeks time. He isn't Brendan Cummins-granted. That's not why we haven't won an all-ireland and he's a damn side better than anything we had before him for a very long time. Power is possibly the best young shot stopper in Ireland (in fact he probably is) but until he is safer around the house or Clinton retires he doesn't merit starting.

I'd also just like to clarify how hard it is to save shots on the ground. I'm not a keeper, but I played in goal against Brian O'Halloran (against Clashmore, obviously). He scored three goals, but I remember making two saves, one in particular. He drilled it head height but straight at my head. They played me again there against Abbeyside. I was beaten by a ground shot, not hit particularly hard. I noticed it was incredibly hard to get down to it. People don't realise how hard it is to save ground shots or one on ones. Sure great keepers make great saves, but more often than not if a keeper saves a one on one, the forward has messed up.

So the first goal, he did as much as he could, and nearly managed to save it. Would have been a great save. Now, I will say I was disapointed with him for the third goal and undecided about the second. For the third, as someone mentioned already, he did a stupid dive. He needed to stand big and narrow the angle. I'd be suprised if he'd saved it but he gave himself no chance in that occasion, but it wouldn't have been his fault of we'd lost that game.

Mountainlad

premierstone wrote: »

Tactical incompetence more than panic imo, and there are many examples of it, in fairness as iv said before he is a very very good physical coach but other than that saying he is limited would be a nice way of putting it

While I'm as much an advocate of Shane playing full forward (was definetly saying it last year) he was getting no ball. The problem was that all clearances were landing on the half backline and were poor balls. Somebody needed to be getting on the ball somewhere between the halway line and our half back line and be driving the ball directly to Shane, other wise you could have him full back, it would be more use to you than what was happening yesterday.

Deise Tom

STIG83 wrote: »

Anyone out on the terrace yesterday? the reason i ask is i heard there was a bit of trouble there with Limerick fans throwing stuff at the Waterford fans, i heard one guy got hit on the back of the head.
I only seen it once before, that was 04 against Clare in Thurles, the group i was with had coins thrown in our direction.

Anyone remember the football game a few years back in Killarney, I think it was Kerry and Cork, and some fellow or fellows at the back of the terrace decided that they needed to spend a penny but did not want to miss any of the action on the field.

Deise Tom

Mountainlad wrote: »

I know for a fact that when Kilkenny one the Waterford game in 2009, a celebrated player who had a particularly good game that day was drinking. I should imagine he wasn't the only one, i.e. they were allowed. That whole issue is blown completely out of proportion, and they definetly drank more when Justin was around then they do now. With some of the talk since last night you'd swear some people want him reinstated :eek:

Who Justin. He remained a year or two too long.

Mountainlad

Jeddah wrote: »

If he is our No.2 full back why wasnt he brought on yesterday?? Davy musnt have much faith in him. I think our problem yesterday in the backs was not the players but that our manager couldnt figure out what Limericj were after doing.

Interviewed on WLR afterwards he was injured. Was he on the programme yesterday? Was Ringo on the programme? Did he warm up at any stage?

Mountainlad

Deise Tom wrote: »

Who Justin. He remained a year or two too long.

Agree with that, if he'd left a bit earlier maybe Fitzgerald wouldnt have gottne the job!

Deise Tom

premierstone wrote: »

Tactical incompetence more than panic imo, and there are many examples of it, in fairness as iv said before he is a very very good physical coach but other than that saying he is limited would be a nice way of putting it

And so say all of us.

Deise Tom

Mountainlad wrote: »

Agree with that, if he'd left a bit earlier maybe Fitzgerald wouldnt have gottne the job!

The biggest problem we might have is that we hold onto our coachs/managers a bit too long, even if they are successful. I think there is a risk that players get so used to the one voice the whole time that there is a chance they get a bit fed up in their play and need someone new every few years 3 or 4 or else there is need for a radical shake up, the way the likes of Ferguson or Wenger do things in soccer. Cody seems to be the exception to the rule. What ever he has he is able to keep hold of players the likes of Sheflin, Walsh etc and still keep them and everyone happy.

Cake Man

Mountainlad wrote: »

Interviewed on WLR afterwards he was injured. Was he on the programme yesterday? Was Ringo on the programme? Did he warm up at any stage?

Ringo was warming up anyway, fitness wise I'd say he's not 100% just yet. Anyone see Philip Mahony come out before the teams came out and did what looked like a late fitness test? He seemed to walk back into the dressing room a few mins later and looked like he was injured the way he was walking gingerly.

KevIRL

Deise Tom wrote: »

The biggest problem we might have is that we hold onto our coachs/managers a bit too long, even if they are successful. I think there is a risk that players get so used to the one voice the whole time that there is a chance they get a bit fed up in their play and need someone new every few years 3 or 4 or else there is need for a radical shake up, the way the likes of Ferguson or Wenger do things in soccer. Cody seems to be the exception to the rule. What ever he has he is able to keep hold of players the likes of Sheflin, Walsh etc and still keep them and everyone happy.

Hang on Tom. You want to ignore the example of the most successful side of the modern era and change managers within a 4 year period? Thats bonkers surely? No need to change managers just for the sake of it imo.

Also you give the example of Wenger and Ferguson who have been both around a lot longer than 4 years, Ferguson with a lot of success. Ferguson in particular has changed the team and is not a slave to player reputation.

Its a bit ironic also that the guy who manages at the moment whom you dislike so much has been bringing about a pretty radical shake up in playing staff.

No need for change just for change sake I say.

Daysha

I think we should be happy that we've managed to find coaches who are willing to put in the huge commitment required year after year. Sheedy, O'Grady and Allen are just some of a massive pool of managers who quit on a high because they knew what kind of stress the job can put on you. And they all managed their native counties as well, Davy does 5 hours round-trips from Clare 2-3 times a week.

premierstone

Mountainlad wrote: »

While I'm as much an advocate of Shane playing full forward (was definetly saying it last year) he was getting no ball. The problem was that all clearances were landing on the half backline and were poor balls. Somebody needed to be getting on the ball somewhere between the halway line and our half back line and be driving the ball directly to Shane, other wise you could have him full back, it would be more use to you than what was happening yesterday.

I agree with yoyu where the problem was just dont agree with the solution Davy came up with, surely removing Maurice Shanahan earlier was hte logical change to make.

Mountainlad

That's one thing you have to admit, love him hate him, like him but think he could improve, you'd have to concede that he is very committed and fair play to him. I do think he lacks a bit of know how, and maybe over physical training as well. Limerick seemed faster to me yesterday in general.

Well, taking Shane Walsh out wouldn't be my solution either. I don't think they really did have a solution. Sure Maurice came out for Prender, but at the end of the day all you were gaining was a better airly threat but someone who was equally immobile. They have to bypass the half backlines. We're not strong in the half forward line, or at least aerialy, so we need to get it deeper and play it longer.

tomkelly99

I fired up the Datsun and went to the game yesterday. I thought it was very good. There was some super players on show. It was a pity Dan Shanahan wasn't fit, I think he'd have put the fear of God into the Limerick backs. I was surprised Clem Smith wasn't playing yesterday. One of the lads was saying he thinks Clem got injured at the Beijing Olympics there a few years back doing the shot pott and he never recovered afterwards. Davy was fierce giddy yesterday. He was like a child on Christmas morning with Tourettes that got a present he didn't like. That happened me once. I asked for a Playstation and I got a laminator instead. Paraic Fanning was in front of me at one stage and the language he used would make a nun vomit.
We played very well, We deserved the win, although Limerick deserved to win too. I was delighted for John Mullane. He's a great young player and was a vital cog in the wheel of DLS winning the minor hurling this year. He's gone very bald for a minor.
I can't believe Davy didn't pick Colm Breathnach of Rinn Ó gCuanach. He's only 34 and has already won a national trophy this year. He's a roving fullback who was Donegals top scorer from sideline cuts in the Micky Rackard Michael Lowry Meagher Cup. He made a lovely speech in Croker the day they won, although Davy and Paraic must have helped him write the speech because the F bombs he was dropping would make Snoop Dogg look like Bishop William Lee.
Rumour has it there is going to be a massive party in the Church of the Holy Family down the Folly if we bate Tipperary in the Munster final.Music will be provided by Chris Doran and Mattie Weldon. It's €10 in for kids and adults are free.

STIG83

^^ Ah Tom you are back to us!! You must be related to Walter Mitty, good report of the match :pac:

Jeddah

Cake Man wrote: »

Ringo was warming up anyway, fitness wise I'd say he's not 100% just yet. Anyone see Philip Mahony come out before the teams came out and did what looked like a late fitness test? He seemed to walk back into the dressing room a few mins later and looked like he was injured the way he was walking gingerly.

That was Richie Foley

Daysha

Confirmed that a Tipp/Waterford final would be in Cork

Professey Chin

Ugh.I hate Pairc Ui Caoimh

Jeddah

I wonder if Tipp gave us € 80k would we play it in Thurles???

premierstone

Daysha wrote: »

Confirmed that a Tipp/Waterford final would be in Cork

The Chin wrote: »

Ugh.I hate Pairc Ui Caoimh

Jeddah wrote: »

I wonder if Tipp gave us € 80k would we play it in Thurles???

Jaysus lads hold yer horses there, the Clare boys will be loving reading all this, Sparrow will have no problem motivating the troops with all that is been said and printed in the media about a Tipp/Waterford final.

Jeddah

That was exactly the point!!!

deiseach

tomkelly99 wrote: »

I fired up the Datsun and went to the game yesterday. I thought it was very good. There was some super players on show. It was a pity Dan Shanahan wasn't fit, I think he'd have put the fear of God into the Limerick backs. I was surprised Clem Smith wasn't playing yesterday. One of the lads was saying he thinks Clem got injured at the Beijing Olympics there a few years back doing the shot pott and he never recovered afterwards. Davy was fierce giddy yesterday. He was like a child on Christmas morning with Tourettes that got a present he didn't like. That happened me once. I asked for a Playstation and I got a laminator instead. Paraic Fanning was in front of me at one stage and the language he used would make a nun vomit.
We played very well, We deserved the win, although Limerick deserved to win too. I was delighted for John Mullane. He's a great young player and was a vital cog in the wheel of DLS winning the minor hurling this year. He's gone very bald for a minor.
I can't believe Davy didn't pick Colm Breathnach of Rinn Ó gCuanach. He's only 34 and has already won a national trophy this year. He's a roving fullback who was Donegals top scorer from sideline cuts in the Micky Rackard Michael Lowry Meagher Cup. He made a lovely speech in Croker the day they won, although Davy and Paraic must have helped him write the speech because the F bombs he was dropping would make Snoop Dogg look like Bishop William Lee.
Rumour has it there is going to be a massive party in the Church of the Holy Family down the Folly if we bate Tipperary in the Munster final.Music will be provided by Chris Doran and Mattie Weldon. It's €10 in for kids and adults are free.

Best post ever

STIG83

Tipp are not in the final yet, anything could happen next weekend.

premierstone

STIG83 wrote: »

Tipp are not in the final yet, anything could happen next weekend.

We're well aware of that down here STIG, but I suppose its hard to blame yer boys getting all excited about playing their idols in a Munster Final

STIG83

premierstone wrote: »

We're well aware of that down here STIG, but I suppose its hard to blame yer boys getting all excited about playing their idols in a Munster Final

More than likely it will be Waterford and Tipperary MF though.

Jeddah

premierstone wrote: »

We're well aware of that down here STIG, but I suppose its hard to blame yer boys getting all excited about playing their idols in a Munster Final

The only way Tipp will be bet this year is if they have their head up their own holes and it looks like thats exactly where they have it!!

STIG83

Jeddah wrote: »

The only way Tipp will be bet this year is if they have their head up their own holes and it looks like thats exactly where they have it!!

What makes you think that?

calvin_zola

what changes does anyone anticipate for the Munster final? Will we bring Lawlor back in FB or stick with Hutchy

deiseach

Well everyone I've spoken to down Tipp way is certain they're going to be in the Munster final. Ya hear me Sparrow - EVERYONE and CERTAIN

Professey Chin

calvin_zola wrote: »

what changes does anyone anticipate for the Munster final? Will we bring Lawlor back in FB or stick with Hutchy

I genuinely wouldnt be surprised if Davy decided to start Brick in FB. I dont see Wayne starting there again. His confidence will be shot after that game. Personally id rather Lawlor back in there. Although I also see a repeat of the All Ireland SF "tactics" from last year unfortunately

premierstone

deiseach wrote: »

Well everyone I've spoken to down Tipp way is certain they're going to be in the Munster final. Ya hear me Sparrow - EVERYONE and CERTAIN

How many of the panel and officials have you been talking to then?? Seems you are desperate to create that impression, are you saying you would prefer to play Clare, is it you that sees them as a soft touch? Surely last Sunday has shown that anything can happen once the sliothar is thrown in, I can tell you now there is no-one invloved in the Tipp camp taking Clare lightly and they will be afforded the same respect as any other opponent.

deiseach

premierstone wrote: »

How many of the panel and officials have you been talking to then?? Seems you are desperate to create that impression, are you saying you would prefer to play Clare, is it you that sees them as a soft touch? Surely last Sunday has shown that anything can happen once the sliothar is thrown in, I can tell you now there is no-one invloved in the Tipp camp taking Clare lightly and they will be afforded the same respect as any other opponent.

premierstone

calvin_zola wrote: »

what changes does anyone anticipate for the Munster final? Will we bring Lawlor back in FB or stick with Hutchy

The order of preference should be Lawlor, Brick, play with 14, Hutchinson.

Lawlor deserves another crack he was not to blame against Tipp last year he was horribly exposed, and in hindsight he probably did aswell if not better than no less a man than Noel Hickey against that FF line.

Brick is sheer quality but to tie up a player of hes ability as a stop go measure would be criminal, he is IMO the best centre back in the country and if is ever to be moved from there it is in the other direction and not back.

johnfarmer

All the talk is of our 3rd Munster senior final appearance in row but let's not forget that our minor hurlers are heading for there 3rd appearance in a row too. What's the latest from the minor camp ahead of the semi-final against Limerick Friday week?

KevIRL

johnfarmer wrote: »

All the talk is of our 3rd Munster senior final appearance in row but let's not forget that our minor hurlers are heading for there 3rd appearance in a row too. What's the latest from the minor camp ahead of the semi-final against Limerick Friday week?

Is this game on in Walsh Park?

deiseach

KevIRL wrote: »

Is this game on in Walsh Park?

Yes, Saturday week

KevIRL

deiseach wrote: »

Yes, Saturday week

nice one. tyty

calvin_zola

johnfarmer wrote: »

All the talk is of our 3rd Munster senior final appearance in row but let's not forget that our minor hurlers are heading for there 3rd appearance in a row too. What's the latest from the minor camp ahead of the semi-final against Limerick Friday week?

I know can't wait for this, gonna be a massive crowd in Walsh park for it... It would be class if Waterford and Tipp made it to the finals at both grades, I know Tipp yet to play Clare but I can see them winning it,

The Chin wrote: »

I genuinely wouldnt be surprised if Davy decided to start Brick in FB. I dont see Wayne starting there again. His confidence will be shot after that game. Personally id rather Lawlor back in there. Although I also see a repeat of the All Ireland SF "tactics" from last year unfortunately

Yeah i know, I agree, I don't think Lawlor did a massive amount wrong last year, he did well against Clare and Cork.... Pity about Hutchy hes been banging on the door for a long time and could have made his debut under Mccarthy if Mccarthy had any respect for his panel players. Starting Brick in FB is a bit of a disadvantage, ya don't weaken a strong position to strenghten a weak one and all that craic......

premierstone

calvin_zola wrote: »

I know can't wait for this, gonna be a massive crowd in Walsh park for it... It would be class if Waterford and Tipp made it to the finals at both grades, I know Tipp yet to play Clare but I can see them winning

In the minor or senior? Cant see Tipp beating Clare in the minor, Clare look very strong and I fancy them to win the AI tbh, minors are of course notourisly unpredictable but everything I have seen this year would suggest Clare would have too much for us this year, Limerick and Waterford should be a cracker very evenly matched, Walsh Park perhaps to swing it in Waterfords favour.

PTH2009

Pairc Ui Chaoimh in running for decider

14 June 2011

Pairc Ui Chaoimh will host this year's Munster SHC final if Tipperary overcome Clare in Sunday's second semi-final at the Gaelic Grounds.

The All-Ireland champions are hot favourites to account for the Banner and set up a final showdown with Waterford on July 10. Pairc Ui Chaoimh was the venue for Waterford's famous Munster final victory over Tipperary in 2002, but when the sides last met in the decider two years ago, it was played in Thurles.

Páirc Uí Chaoimh last hosted a Munster senior hurling final in 2005, when Cork defeated Tipp by 1-21 to 1-16. Semple Stadium would be expected to host a Waterford-Clare final.

STIG83

What's people's problem with Pairc Ui Caoimh? it's alot better to get to Cork since Youghal bypass was built.

Daysha

Just updated the blog there with some thoughts on the game. Most of it is just a cross-post from what I said here on Sunday night but I've found some pretty interesting stats in the meantime.

Our Championship record under Davy against teams outside the 'big two' is currently at played 11, won 9, draw 2 and lost 0. Not only is that very encouraging the way they were won really says a lot about the team. Here's the list of wins and what the score was with 10 minutes to go.

2008 Offaly – up by 2
2008 Wexford – up by 2
2008 Tipperary – down by 2
2009 Limerick – up by 1
2009 Limerick (replay) – up by 2
2009 Galway – down by 3
2010 Clare – A/S
2010 Cork – down by 1
2010 Cork (replay) – A/S
2011 Limerick – A/S

We failed to lose a single one of those games, mostly because of one defining goal that turned the game on its head. The unfortunate thing is when we do lose, we lose heavily. That's why as long as we're not blown away in the 1st half of the final and we're still in with a shout as the game goes on, we'll be in with a great chance.

http://waterfordgaa.wordpress.com/

Mountainlad

I still think the team doesn't get the credit it deserves. There's nothing encouraging about beating offaly and wexford narrowly. I believe a better manager and we'd be further down the road we're headed. We could have worse though