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ESB HALO

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2

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    #32
    Wyldwood
    Registered Users Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭Wyldwood


    I meant cheaper for ESB but.. you win :)


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    #33
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    AWESOME! :D


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    #34
    makeorbrake
    Registered Users Posts: 4,664 ✭✭✭makeorbrake


    My post was made according to much the same logic as Wyldwood's.

    I get the point about it being free, but someone still ends up paying for this sort of thing one way or another.

    If your right d'Oracle, re. people not knowing these basic things, then thats fair enough - and on that basis, I guess it can be justified.


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    #35
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    Nobody is being ripped off here folks.

    The ESB know what halo is, because they designed it.


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    #36
    Wyldwood
    Registered Users Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭Wyldwood


    d'Oracle I think you're misinterpreting the discussion. Nobody is suggesting that the ESB are ripping anyone off. The point I'm making is that the amount of money spent on the individual house inspections seems to be excessive given the fact that what's done is a walk around with a check list and marking off against the current requirements. My suggestion of a mailshot with a checklist of current recommendations i.e
    Insulated cylinder
    TRVs
    Double Glazing
    Modern condensing boiler
    Energy saving light bulbs
    12" attic insulation
    etc., etc.
    All these are visible to the homeowner who checks their current installations against the list and sees where they are lacking.
    Include a list of grants available and recommended installers and job done at a fraction of cost.
    There are two positives to the Halo scheme - it's free to the homeowner so why not get it done and it is creating much needed employment but I still question the economics of it.


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    #37
    makeorbrake
    Registered Users Posts: 4,664 ✭✭✭makeorbrake


    Again, Wyldwood's post above is exactly where I'm coming from too. Nobody is getting 'ripped off'. However, these times more than ever, value for money should be key - and I don't think this scheme represents value for money.


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    #38
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    How much is being spent, per house?

    I am literally amazed at some of the stuff I am reading here.


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    #39
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    Wyldwood wrote: »
    My suggestion of a mailshot with a checklist of current recommendations i.e
    Insulated cylinder Sure, but no grant, and very expensive
    TRVs OK, but a lot of people won't know, and more than likely wont understand the requirements of the grant. Also by themselves don't make a huge difference
    Double Glazing All Dbl Glaz is not created equal.
    Modern condensing boiler How do you explain by mailshot, how to tell if a boiler is condensing or not?
    Energy saving light bulbs Grand
    12" attic insulation there is actually more to this than just if there is 300mm of insulation. The quality and how it is lain must also be considered
    etc., etc.
    All these are visible to the homeowner who checks their current installations against the list and sees where they are lacking.
    Include a list of grants available and recommended installers and job done at a fraction of cost.

    Sure if all these things were as easy as you seem to think, you could extend it to say people should be doing BER assessments by mailshot.


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    #40
    muffler
    Registered Users Posts: 46,095 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    d'Oracle what exactly is the problem here?


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    #41
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    muffler wrote: »
    d'Oracle what exactly is the problem here?

    Sorry, its just a difference of opinion really, not a problem.

    Its just knowing enough about the survey, knowing people doing the surveys, knowing how much they are paid and knowing that it costs homeowners nothing to do, on top of how it is helping people to access services and a knowledge base that they probably don't have time to seek out themselves...

    I just can't see how anybody could criticise the programme.
    It confuses me greatly.

    Edit: On reflection my posts do look a bit harsh.
    I'm not trying to hammer people here, just put some perspective on this.


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    #42
    makeorbrake
    Registered Users Posts: 4,664 ✭✭✭makeorbrake


    d'Oracle wrote: »
    Its just knowing enough about the survey, knowing people doing the surveys, knowing how much they are paid and knowing that it costs homeowners nothing to do, on top of how it is helping people to access services and a knowledge base that they probably don't have time to seek out themselves...

    I just can't see how anybody could criticise the programme.
    It confuses me greatly.
    If it is really of benefit then thats fine. However, I wouldn't look on it as being 'free'. At the end of the day, all electricity customers have to foot the bill for this.


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    #43
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    Its got nothing to do with BER. I got a survey. They only tell you how to improve the house. They do not give you a ber indication.

    I actually had a BER asser do mine. Very interesting discussion was had on the direction of BER and taxation of a house.


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    #44
    makeorbrake
    Registered Users Posts: 4,664 ✭✭✭makeorbrake


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    I actually had a BER asser do mine. Very interesting discussion was had on the direction of BER and taxation of a house.
    ie. BER data being used for property taxation purposes?


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    #45
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    makeorbrake wrote: »
    ie. BER data being used for property taxation purposes?

    No. but close. The BER assesment is not really taken serious at the moment. As generally speaking when you put in the year the house was built a lot of automatic factors kick in. This would mean in theory all houses built the last few years would score roughly the same. So really the assement is worthless unless you are compareing an old and new house. If this were the case you would have an idea of work that needs doing anyway. Unless your clueless.

    Where the asser future lies is in govt taxation like bands on cars, If your an A Band B1 B2 B3 c1 c2 c3. However really unless the govt applies the tax on a yearly basis to encourage developemt. It will simply become part of the mortage and ultimatly another govt tax method.


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    #46
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    makeorbrake wrote: »
    If it is really of benefit then thats fine. However, I wouldn't look on it as being 'free'. At the end of the day, all electricity customers have to foot the bill for this.
    +1 it's like a tax, because we all pay for some of the dearest electricity in the EU.
    If people who don't really want it, and have no intention of acting on it, get the halo inspection just because its "free" then its a retrograde step. It's the opposite to the principle of the proposed water charges; ie people will abuse anything they get free.


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    #47
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    No. but close. The BER assesment is not really taken serious at the moment. As generally speaking when you put in the year the house was built a lot of automatic factors kick in. This would mean in theory all houses built the last few years would score roughly the same. So really the assement is worthless unless you are compareing an old and new house. If this were the case you would have an idea of work that needs doing anyway. Unless your clueless.

    Where the asser future lies is in govt taxation like bands on cars, If your an A Band B1 B2 B3 c1 c2 c3. However really unless the govt applies the tax on a yearly basis to encourage developemt. It will simply become part of the mortage and ultimatly another govt tax method.

    A) the part of a BER related to the age of the house, which is U-values, is only one part of the BER.

    B) If you are saying that any future property tax will be cheaper for a house with a good BER, then IMO that's a very fanciful idea.
    Maybe someone is getting confused with the carbon tax which will affect running costs ?


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    #48
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    No. but close. The BER assesment is not really taken serious at the moment. As generally speaking when you put in the year the house was built a lot of automatic factors kick in. This would mean in theory all houses built the last few years would score roughly the same. So really the assement is worthless unless you are compareing an old and new house. If this were the case you would have an idea of work that needs doing anyway. Unless your clueless.

    Where the asser future lies is in govt taxation like bands on cars, If your an A Band B1 B2 B3 c1 c2 c3. However really unless the govt applies the tax on a yearly basis to encourage developemt. It will simply become part of the mortage and ultimatly another govt tax method.

    Are you a trained assessor?


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    #49
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    d'Oracle wrote: »
    Are you a trained assessor?

    Cen faith????


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    #50
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    Cen faith????

    Cos you said an assessment is worthless. One would assume that you would have to have some understanding of the methodology, other than the rather limited explanation you say you have been given by an Assessor.

    I mean "Generally Speaking" would imply some level of actual knowledge of the survey procedure.
    If you aren't trained, you actually have no basis to draw that conclusion from.


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    #51
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    d'Oracle wrote: »
    Cos you said an assessment is worthless. One would assume that you would have to have some understanding of the methodology, other than the rather limited explanation you say you have been given by an Assessor.

    I mean "Generally Speaking" would imply some level of actual knowledge of the survey procedure.
    If you aren't trained, you actually have no basis to draw that conclusion from.

    I ment an assement is worthless in the sense that it will not matter to the buyer if the house is C1 rated or C3 rated unless the govt plan to tax based on this assement and only if this tax is tied into a future yearly property tax will it matter.

    Otherwise people will just asses the payment as part of the mortage.


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    #52
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    I ment an assement is worthless in the sense that it will not matter to the buyer if the house is C1 rated or C3 rated unless the govt plan to tax based on this assement and only if this tax is tied into a future yearly property tax will it matter.

    Otherwise people will just asses the payment as part of the mortage.

    Probably right there.

    But its a personal thing.
    I would pay attention to a rating when buying a house, cos I hate paying to waste energy, when I could just pay for less energy.

    This is getting a bit OT actually.


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    #53
    muffler
    Registered Users Posts: 46,095 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    d'Oracle wrote: »
    This is getting a bit OT actually.
    Yes indeed. Its been so long ago and so far back but something tells me we were supposed to be discussing the HALO scheme ;)


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    #54
    Horse1860
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭Horse1860


    I've read with interest the posts on this tread and would like to make the following observations:
    1. The ESB advertised for individuals and/or companies to conduct the Halo surveys. Applicants were interviewed. A panel of companies was chosen that demonstrated they had the ability to deliver the surveys. This included the technical ability to conduct surveys.
    2. The purpose of the survey is to assist householders in reducing their energy usage and therefore the CO2 output. With this in mind the 5 areas looked at include; Insulation in the Roof Spaces and Walls, Heating Systems and Heating Controls, Windows and the Bulbs used.
    3. The majority of householders know that they need or want to make improvements to their homes. However, in the vast majority of cases they don't know what options are open to them and which measures offer the best value for money when considering payback periods etc. The Halo Survey Report will give make the Householder more informed and point them in the right direction (as they are impartial the householder is getting independant advise).
    I hope this clarifies some of the points raised in this thread to date.


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    #55
    _Whimsical_
    Registered Users Posts: 7,953 ✭✭✭_Whimsical_


    We got a HALO assesment around 6 weeks ago but have received no report from it.

    Is this a normal wait period to get the results?The guy who did it said we'd have it in 10 days max.Is there anywhere to ring or email where I can follow up on it?


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    #56
    Blizzard
    Registered Users Posts: 222 ✭✭Blizzard


    chilly wrote: »
    We got a HALO assesment around 6 weeks ago but have received no report from it.

    Is this a normal wait period to get the results?The guy who did it said we'd have it in 10 days max.Is there anywhere to ring or email where I can follow up on it?

    Hi - not sure if this will help you, but we also had the survey done recently and did get the report emailled to us about 10 days later. I think there are a few companies sub-contracting this work from ESB so I'm not sure that the phone number for our surveyor would be any good to you, although if you want it, I could give it to you (pm if this is the case). On the last page of the report, it states:

    If you have any questions or feedback on the HALO Home Energy Efficiency Programme, please contact our customer care team on LoCall 1850 372 333 - we would love to hear from you.

    I'm not sure if that's ESB's number. Have your MPRN number ready as that's how they'll track it. Hope this helps you.


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    #57
    No6
    Registered Users Posts: 2,489 ✭✭✭No6


    I am having my "survey" done tomorrow, Should be interesting:D


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    #58
    No6
    Registered Users Posts: 2,489 ✭✭✭No6


    Ok I had my survey done on friday, a very nice young building surveyor from Belfast did it. He knew what he was talking about in regard to improvements within thescope of the Halo scheme and the SEI grant scheme. I did let him know that I am an Architectural Technologist and a registered BER assessor but he was grand with that. He siad a lot of people were very dissapointed with him when they realised that the halo survey would not give them a free BER cert. There is very little to it, have a look see what improvements can be made within the grant schemes and also possibly change windows and lightbulbs. If upgrading any insulation take measurements of the areas (or in my case give him the drawings!!) so estimated costs can be given using a ESB provided software calculator!!!

    I will update further when i get my report.


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    #59
    muffler
    Registered Users Posts: 46,095 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    No6 wrote: »
    a very nice young building surveyor from Belfast did it.
    Was his name Ian by any chance? Serious question now!


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    #60
    No6
    Registered Users Posts: 2,489 ✭✭✭No6


    No it wasnt it was Kevin!!!:D(seriously)


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    #61
    muffler
    Registered Users Posts: 46,095 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    No6 wrote: »
    No it wasnt it was Kevin!!!:D(seriously)
    Seriously ;) the reason I asked is that I had an inspection of the works carried out after getting the SEI grant last year and the guy was from Belfast also but his name was Ian.

    Thought it might have been the same guy.


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