What's with the anti-Republican attitudes?

Reillyman

Thought my 100th post should be a big one!:D

There's a reoccurring theme of threads(both on and off-topic), that deal with "the North", "SF/IRA" "Provo's" etc etc.

Most of theses threads take place in after-hours so I thought this would be the place to ask this.

Now first off, I would not consider myself a Republican, but I would have certain sympathies with those in the north that want to be part of Ireland.

Anyway, what I have noticed on Boards over the last year or so is this huge wave of fierce anti-Republicanism. It seems to me that to be anti-Republican is currently the "cool" thing to do, by showing you can think for yourself, are anti-conformist etc etc.

The anti-republican posts are not confined to the obviously understandable(and right imo) negative views of the IRA and SF, but I have seen posts which more or less denounce any achivements we have made breaking free from britain. For example, many people have expressed the view that Michael Collins, Padraig Pearse etc etc were "terrorists"...I mean, come on lads. Another popular thing is that "we'd be better off if we had stayed with Britain."

What I think is that alot of people posting these comments don't actually believe these things themselves, but rather are trying to show how "free-thinking" and "intelligent" they are...

Anyway, there's my query, tear me to shreads!:P

Rabies

Because some people can't let go of the past

phasers

to most people, republican = terrorist

ihadu

Reillyman wrote: »

Thought my 100th post should be a big one!:D

There's a reoccurring theme of threads(both on and off-topic), that deal with "the North", "SF/IRA" "Provo's" etc etc.

Most of theses threads take place in after-hours so I thought this would be the place to ask this.

Now first off, I would not consider myself a Republican, but I would have certain sympathies with those in the north that want to be part of Ireland.

Anyway, what I have noticed on Boards over the last year or so is this huge wave of fierce anti-Republicanism. It seems to me that to be anti-Republican is currently the "cool" thing to do, by showing you can think for yourself, are anti-conformist etc etc.

The anti-republican posts are not confined to the obviously understandable(and right imo) negative views of the IRA and SF, but I have seen posts which more or less denounce any achivements we have made breaking free from britain. For example, many people have expressed the view that Michael Collins, Padraig Pearse etc etc were "terrorists"...I mean, come on lads. Another popular thing is that "we'd be better off if we had stayed with Britain."

What I think is that alot of people posting these comments don't actually believe these things themselves, but rather are trying to show how "free-thinking" and "intelligent" they are...

Anyway, there's my query, tear me to shreads!:P

pick up a james joyce book and read it. you'll soon realise the difference between apathy and futility of caring.

Carsinian Thau

A lot of people tend to equate republican with stupidity.

And stupidity annoys people.

My name is URL

Because some people are democratic, and don't want to see a united Ireland that was only united by force, via killing innocents

Mossy Monk

phasers wrote: »

to most people, republican = terrorist

Most people are fools in that case.

wudangclan

ihadu wrote: »

pick up a james joyce book and read it. you'll soon realise the difference between apathy and futility of caring.

i'm too apathetic to read joyce

Shacklebolt

Because Irish people seem to have a bizarre reluctance to take pride in the people who fought to give them the freedoms and the democracy that they enjoy today. Americans don't regard George Washington as a terrorist, so why do we say such things about our nations heroes?

Svalbard

I doubt most people who disagree with republican dogma are doing it 'to be cool'. They, like me, have a problem with the ardent republican attitude which glorifies barbarism and relies on fuzzy facts and half-truths.
In fact its about time that people question what has been pretty much unquestionable in most of Irish society. Perhaps Collins, Pearse and co are not the noble heroes we are told they are. Perhaps we need to judge them by modern standards and not through the sepia-tinted lens with which we normally view republican history.

Does anyone else find their national pride tainted somewhat by the knowledge that our independence was gained by terrorism?

Eoin

You can be anti-SF and anti-IRA without being anti-Republican.

wudangclan

Svalbard wrote: »

Does anyone else find their national pride tainted somewhat by the knowledge that our independence was gained by terrorism?

the brits at that time got what they deserved imo.i would prefer the gandhi route personally but wouldn't condemn the choices of our forefathers.

drunkmonkey

Ferris made an almighty cock up this week, probably cost him his job and a a good bit of support for Sinn Fein, and to think I was going to give his daughter one...:pac:

Riddle101

I think the years of fighting in the North as well as the mentality that England and Ireland are friends now is what's causing a lot of the so called Anti-Republicanism. We don't live in the 1970's anymore, Ireland's relationship with Britain has gotten stronger over the years and the idea of this whole Irish Vs British thing is outdated. If people can forgive Germany for WWI and WWII then people in Ireland can forgive Britain. By the way I not saying this as an anti-republican either because I myself have symphaties too, but the fact is. It's been a long bitter rivalary between the two nations and people are sick of the fighting. But there are some Republicans that would threaten the peaceful co-existience between Ireland and Britain, and that's why I believe their are Anti-Republicans around.

Does anyone else find their national pride tainted somewhat by the knowledge that our independence was gained by terrorism?

No and i'll tell you why. No war if fought right. You do what you have to do in order to win and that's what Micheal Collins believed, sure it's arguable about whether or not we did win but by using that so called terrorism, Collins was able to put a fire under the British rule in Ireland. Hell if you want to talk about terrorism, why don't you look at a guy like Oliver Cromwell who's terrorism led to many deaths in Ireland, yet England hold a lot of pride for him. Whether or not Ireland got it's independence through terrorism, isn't what people look at, what the see is heroic figures who fought for freedom.

nothin i hate more than some eejit goin on about how great the ra are and how the brits are this and that. i think omagh was a big moment when everyone realised republicanism and terrorism isn't sound.

Senna

I'd say a lot on here are;
Anti-terrorism
Anti SF/IRA etc
Have sympathy from republicans in NI
Dont want NI part of ROI
Dont want ROI to be part of UK

dvpower

Reillyman wrote: »

For example, many people have expressed the view that Michael Collins, Padraig Pearse etc etc were "terrorists"...I mean, come on lads.

One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

Mossy Monk

Deleted User wrote: »

republicanism and terrorism isn't sound.

Republicanism does not equal terrorism.

El Siglo

Reillyman wrote: »

Anyway, there's my query, tear me to shreads!:P

Don't mind if I do!:D
A lot of this anti-republican attitude has to do with the IRA and what they've done along with the attitude of Sinn Fein to violence and their total ineptitude etc... Also, republicanism, wrongly, tends to connote ideas of car bombers, illegal diesel, racketeering etc... Furthermore, it's the fact that Northern Ireland is such a messed up place (along with the Republic, economically anyway) and that reunification would now be impossible and would almost destroy our public finances etc... You're right though, some people on boards think it's cool to spout anti-republicanism etc... Personally, I would like to see reunification but I doubt I'll ever see it in my life time, 2016my left one McGuinness!:rolleyes:

squod

Svalbard wrote: »

Does anyone else find their national pride tainted somewhat by the knowledge that our independence was gained by terrorism?

I dunno what to say, is that what you think....... really.

People fought for your freedom, that's what happened according to my old history teacher.
Similar conflits happened in states also over-run by crazy invaders looking to take what wasn't theirs.

You know, really, I dunno what to say to you.

gurramok

OP, there are many self proclaimed Unionist posters on the Politics forum as well as English posters thrown into the mix with Irish posters who have ignorant stereotype views.

Just watch how little knowledge these anti-nationalist/republican posters have of the north when they spout their views with no backup, its as almost they believe everything they read from The Sun.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Mossy Monk wrote: »

Republicanism does not equal terrorism.

Potentially it can. The OP should have really defined what he was referring to in his post.

ihadu

gurramok wrote: »

OP, there are many self proclaimed Unionist posters on the Politics forum as well as English posters thrown into the mix with Irish posters who have ignorant stereotype views.

Just watch how little knowledge these anti-nationalist/republican posters have of the north when they spout their views with no backup, its as almost they believe everything they read from The Sun.

well you won't like Kevin Myers from The Irish Independent either

fergusman

Personally while i would have republican sympathies, I really am starting to detest the sight of them, especially Ferris, MacDonald etc down south.

While i understand the mindset behind some of the violent actions in the past in the North given the circumstances at the time, the shooting in cold blood of the 2 gardai in Adare sickened me.
Ferris's actions have only managed to cement in my mind that I will never have any time for SF ever again.

I will never vote for a party that refuses to condemn the shooting of two officers of the law of this state.

SF's "alleged" links to organised crime and drugs dont help either but of course this is all "lies" .......yeah right

DoireNod

Svalbard wrote: »

Does anyone else find their national pride tainted somewhat by the knowledge that our independence was gained by terrorism?

Ah terrorism. The great buzz-word. We could go back through history and point out countless 'noble' achievements that would, in the event they happened now, be considered terrorism. Sure, depending on how you look at it, what the USA and UK are doing in the Middle East is terrorism. It's only 'terrorism' when it suits.

Originally Posted by dvpower
One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

Originally Posted by Mossy Monk
Republicanism does not equal terrorism.

Correct.

Republicans can accept criticism, but it's hard to swallow when it's accompanied by a largely ill-informed concept that all republicanism is, by default, wrong.

Reillyman

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Potentially it can. The OP should have really defined what he was referring to in his post.

What I am referring to is the recent wave of not only anti-republicanism, but also anti anything that Irish patriots have done, both achieved and failed...

These posts suggesting that certain Irish Heroes are terrorists etc. This is what I am referring to...

FlutterinBantam

Personally I'd say it has a lot to do with the one sided rhetoric spouted by the well known few on this subject.

These people cannot see another side to their point of view, and seem to think that posters here are stupid enough to believe that they have the definitive take on all things pertaining to NI.

I am as republican as the next man, but sure as hell won't be browbeaten by a line of rhetoric that went out of fashion in the last century.

There are two sides to every story and one mans hero is another man's villain.

A lot of the punters who post here don't seem to be able to grasp that concept and view things in a very bigoted and biased way.

Now that's bad enough but they then try to portray those who hold contrary views as somehow less than Irish.

I'll leave it up to discerning posters to decide why they don't gain much sympathy.

Svalbard

squod wrote: »

I dunno what to say, is that what you think....... really.

People fought for your freedom, that's what happened according to my old history teacher.
Similar conflits happened in states also over-run by crazy invaders looking to take what wasn't theirs.

You know, really, I dunno what to say to you.

The question stands and its a legitimate one.
As another poster pointed out Irish people do seem to have difficulty celebrating the architects of our independence freely as the Americans do. Why is that?

I'm not saying I'm not glad Ireland is independent or that we do not need to at least acknowledge those responsible, but I cannot feel uninhibited pride nor can I swallow much of the Wolf Tones/GAA/Oh-ah-up-the-RA crap that so many seem to think defines what it means to be Irish

gurramok

Reillyman wrote: »

What I am referring to is the recent wave of not only anti-republicanism, but also anti anything that Irish patriots have done, both achieved and failed...

These posts suggesting that certain Irish Heroes are terrorists etc. This is what I am referring to...

Because they believe that all was rosy here before 1922 and that there were no atrocities, persecutions, terror etc that happened before that.

Another bunch see their town/village been liberated as part of the ROI and don't give two hoots about their brethren who were thrown into a gerrymandered state post 1922 by the drawing of an imaginary line over the land.

Its mé-féinism.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Reillyman wrote: »

What I am referring to is the recent wave of not only anti-republicanism, but also anti anything that Irish patriots have done, both achieved and failed...

These posts suggesting that certain Irish Heroes are terrorists etc. This is what I am referring to...

Republicanism is a broad field. I even started a thread on it before. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055598850

My idealist preferred ruling for this Island would be a 32 county republic. My heart says yes but my head says no because I know unionists who were born on the Island and don't consider themselves Irish(cultural sense) yet have nothing against Irish culture. I never call myself a republican because I know it would lead people to the wrong conclusions about me.

There's always always been an anti-sinn fein IRA sentiment from many posters. Myself included.

The anti Irish patriots I think isn't that common, some fairly decent thread ideas comparing current dissidents to say 1916 rebels but the rest is people trying to be smart.

FlutterinBantam

Svalbard wrote: »

The question stands and its a legitimate one.
As another poster pointed out Irish people do seem to have difficulty celebrating the architects of our independence freely as the Americans do. Why is that?

I'm not saying I'm not glad Ireland is independent or that we do not need to at least acknowledge those responsible, but I cannot feel uninhibited pride nor can I swallow much of the Wolf Tones/GAA/Oh-ah-up-the-RA crap that so many seem to think defines what it means to be Irish

Excellent post, a lot of it about friend.