Advanced driving courses, any use?

ps3man

was just browsing through various driving schools and saw ads for advanced driving course, can anyone tell me if they are worthwhile doing, whats the criteria for doing them and the big question... How much are they... Cheers in advance

Nigel A

If you do the right one and have the right tuition then, no doubt at all, they are very beneficial in reducing vulnerability to accidents - more properly called crashes nowadays. In other words what is learned can significantly improve your safety profile.

Permabear

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Nigel A

Don't particularly want to get parochial but, don't forget that the RoSPA test is graded with Gold being the highest and that you are re-tested every three years if you get either the Silver or Gold. Plus you get a multipage test report. Professionals can go further and take the RoSPA Diploma Course which has national accreditation.

RoSPA Advanced Drivers and Riders URL is: http://www.roadar.org/

IAM (and I have been a Group Training Officer for both organisations) is a one hit job; take it at twenty and you can continue membership for the rest of your life without ever having your driving reviewed again.

The other thing to be aware of is the origins of the test you might be taking. Principally they come from two directions. Firstly, and the original, routes from police driving schools which resulted in the publication Roadcraft. The second type is more of a platitude to DSA licenced instructors (ADIs) and is more a kin to a tighter standard driving test. One of the key differences between the two is that of (lateral positioning), which is a learned skill area in itself; the other is in the approach to marking. Because of the need to appear scrupulously fair to some 59m people and across many different cultures the standard driving test is marked is a strict minor and major faults system; in other words there are really no grey areas - it is very black or white. Moving up from that basic level means that more judgements are made in grey areas and therefore a more subjective approach is needed in deciding whether primarily that action was safe or potentially vulnerable in those circumstances. DSA/ADI based advanced tests also do not, to the best of my knowledge, place any real emphasis on positioning and that is also a key reason why, for me, they are not in the frame. You can't have really good road driving without a sound understanding and application of positioning.

Permabear

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Nigel A

Yes, RoSPA tests are available in Eire. Your best action is to contact Melinda Rae at HO. Her e-mail is: MRae@rospa.com.

Let us know how you get on.

wicklow joe

Yep i've done the rospa driving test in Dublin

In the UK there are lots of training groups with qualified Rospa trainers, i didnt come across any in the republic so i ended up training with a guy in bristol. (thank god for ryanair). I would highly recomend it. If any one would be interested in setting up a Rospa group in or around dublin get in touch

Nigel A

Joe.

I am Groups Advisory Panel Representative for the South West. If I can be of any help please don't hesitate to contact me.

Regards

Nigel

biomech

i would highly recommend any of the race and rally driving schools around the country.... driving a car at the edge of grip while being shown how to remain in control is very good practice... albeit for only a few hours and a bit expensive..

Nigel A

This is, unfortunately, the danger; that of confusing road techniques cum mind-set with that needed for track driving. Track driving can give you a better idea of the performance envelope of the vehicle and (with the right instruction) a good understanding of slip-anges, understeer and oversteer but that's about as far as it goes, apart perhaps for an opportunity to have a good blast.

That apart the road lines, approaches to, through and exiting bends are completely different. Indeed track lines can lead to dangerous tendencies on the roads. The other is that track work will work at the limits of adhesion but, in good road work the speed should such be that you can stop in the distance you can see to be clear. The two are very different and, again, require completely different mind-sets. If you are over the latter in road road then you are significantly increasing the vulnerability to crashes.

Road work also involves a completely different mindset with willingness to exercise restraint which is a complete anathma to track driving.

And so it goes on. By all means do a track day (or even days) but understand them in their correct perspective and then they can be very useful.

ps3man

Defo worth while doing then, any idea lads where is the best, i know the airport drivingschool do them, anywhere else do them,

Old Gill

ps3man wrote: »

Defo worth while doing then, any idea lads where is the best, i know the airport drivingschool do them, anywhere else do them,

get clarification 1st on what it involves as for many it is simply taking a pupil out after they have passed their test to teach them about using the motorway etc

Nigel A

Looking at their website it looks as though they only prepare people for the IAM test. However, I suggest checking the instructor's qualifications.

The problem is that many people are taught to pass a test whereas they should be taught to improve their safety standard first and foremost and then that can be validated by taking a test. Superficially that may look similar but the roots are quite different. In the second a 'pupil' would be taught more about understanding the 'why' of what they are doing and how that relates to improving safety, whereas in the former you are merely taught what is neccessary to pass the test criteria and that does not autmatically mean you properly understand the why, which is in a way the most important part and the bit which helps you sustain your standard (and therefore your safetly level) after passing which ever test, you do.

fox65

Recently got my license,

first question, i am hoping to do the ignition driving course with hibernian, is it true that this is done by AIM instructors.

I was hoping to do a lesson before i do the ignition test, with a long term view of doing an advanced driving course

Has anyone here had any chance with the ignition course

And how big a difference is from regular driving is the respective courses and how long would it take to learn the system in both the AIM and the Ro one

tormented

Hi,my husbands school does the advance driving- teaching how to lower fuel consumption, reaction to hazards, reducing wear and tear etc, all part of advance driving skills. But if you are shopping around, I would stress that prices vary hugely and above all make sure wherever you go that your instructor is qualified as Nigel stated;)

Nigel A

fox65 wrote: »

Recently got my license,

first question, i am hoping to do the ignition driving course with hibernian, is it true that this is done by AIM instructors.

I was hoping to do a lesson before i do the ignition test, with a long term view of doing an advanced driving course

Has anyone here had any chance with the ignition course

And how big a difference is from regular driving is the respective courses and how long would it take to learn the system in both the AIM and the Ro one

Looks like a standard driving school focused on teaching learners. The other thing is that it is a big national setup and, as such, will likely do anything to promote its commercial creedence.

In the UK there are many ADIs (Government Approved Driving Instructors) who do pass their IAM and/or RoSPA tests but, I believe many do this mainly to get the letters after their names and, again, improve their professional profile. As a present and past (previous group) training officer for a RoADAR (RoSPA Advanced Drivers and Riders) group I have seen numerous ADIs come along to groups to learn and take their advanced tests. Unfortunately most are only interested in the minimum requirements to get their (advanced) tickets and don't have any real interest in depth of knowledge or understanding of the subject. More than that, most (but not all, I am glad to say) are so imprinted with the black and white mindset which is necessary for the DSA standard driving test that they are not able (or willing) to move to the more fluid approach needed for anything over and above the standard driving test.

However, to be fair, there are some ADIs who are very good. In my experience mostly those from a police driving back ground and, in isolation, some others who take a keen interst in the subject.

For the most part where you have highly commercialised driving schools I would stay well clear as far as true advanced work goes; they are far more intersted in commernce than anything else. Try to find one where the instructor (or instructors) are sincerely keen on the subject and have a much wider perspective than just that needed for the standard driving test. It might be more difficult in Eire but that is your best course if you are able to do it.

therewillbe

In a previous life I was with Dublin Bus and we all sat the advanced driving test. It was part of the British run I A M .The testers in our case were Gardai.They are based I think in Kilkenny.It cost appx e55 upwards depending if you want all the books etc.As for insurance companies,Some do give discounts if you have done the test and passed .

Permabear

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Nigel A

donegalfella wrote: »

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That seems quite a good idea cum scheme for young drivers.

Nigel A

therewillbe wrote: »

In a previous life I was with Dublin Bus and we all sat the advanced driving test. It was part of the British run I A M .The testers in our case were Gardai.

Yes. Those wonderful, indeed almost halcyon, days when professional drivers really were professional drivers; who took a pride in their driving as well as the example they set for other road users.

fox65

Ignition is run by hibernian school of motoring now, nothing to do with the IAM.

Can anyone recommend and places for the IAM. You can do it with the institute directly but only offer a large bulk course, i'm not looking for that just yet. I was hoping to get a lesson or two to sharpen some skills so i can hopefully go up a bracket in the ignition.