New Restricted List sneak peek

fat-tony

bunny shooter wrote: »

We shall wait and see whats on the next list from the DOJ these will be centrefire so won't be on this list

Be weird if it's another "copy" & "paste" job though

Wha

bunny shooter

This latest DOJ list is unrestricted pistols ....................

.32 is a centrefire, and ALL centrefire are going to be restricted we were told.

With me now?

fat-tony

bunny shooter wrote: »

This latest DOJ list is unrestricted pistols ....................

.32 is a centrefire, and ALL centrefire are going to be restricted we were told.

With me now?

No. You said next list. I assumed you had some knowledge of another list. The list today was the DoJ / Garda view of unrestricted .22 "Olympic" pistols.
Tired now ... bedtime .....

rowa

ok so you can shoot issf instead of that evil ipsc shooting , but just a certain bit of issf :rolleyes:, this is a right dogs dinner .

rowa

fat-tony wrote: »

No. You said next list. I assumed you had some knowledge of another list. The list today was the DoJ / Garda view of unrestricted .22 "Olympic" pistols.
Tired now ... bedtime .....

night .

Sparks

bunny shooter wrote: »

Seems I wasn't too far off

Bunny, you weren't even close.

So I think we shall have to agree to differ on the defination of a "list"

Or I can just search your posts and quote what you posted before.

The first mention of the list you're talking about came from Double Alpha:

Double-Alpha wrote:

a certain group sometime ago sent in a list with specifications of particular handguns to the DOJ and said that they were the only type of handguns that they thought should be used for target shooting in Ireland.

And here's your description of it:

Bunny Shooter wrote:

a list of a certain type of pistol/s was handed to DOJ and/or the FCP by certain people involved in the FCP without the agreement and/or knowledge of other FCP participants

It's utterly impossible that that could be describing the list of equipment rules posted by rrpc or the sheet of photos posted by me; firstly because those had been with the DoJ since around 2004 (which you'll note is a fair while before the founding of the FCP); and secondly because those photos were stressed at the time as being nothing more than a sample of some of the pistols we used. The point that there were far more in use by others was made at the time. And the NTSA was bloody anxious to avoid being asked for a list from the DoJ because it'd be a pita to prepare and maintain.

But I think you don't really care about that, to be honest. Because back then, all this was explained to you, very clearly. Here and here. But you decided that it was more fun to insinuate there was something cloak-and-dagger going on. To troll the forum, basicly.

bunny shooter

Now I know how poor Scully must feel :P So much information & disinformation and then she sees something with her own eyes and she just doesn't know what/who to believe

Selective quotes from the thread don't give the whole picture

I have progressed from a liar to a troll

I have got rid of my pistols and Sparks one is safe so why are we bothered ?

The only people who will loose out are those who don't want to shoot ISSF, which according to the Minister is the only type of shooting that should be allowed

Anyone know where I can get quick-drying paint and a pellet gun ?

Rovi

bunny shooter wrote: »

We shall wait and see whats on the next list from the DOJ these will be centrefire so won't be on this list

I doubt there'll be any such list, as centrefire pistols are specifically prohibited, regardless if they're 'designed for' Olympic competition or not.

Which leads to an interesting conundrum: the ISSF administer a fair few shooting disciplines that don't currently feature in the Olympic programme, centrefire pistol, and centrefire rifle stuff particularly.
If I recollect correctly, the IOC have put a ceiling on the number of sports they're willing to include in both the Winter and Summer Games programmes; essentially, if a new sport is to be introduced, an existing one has to be dropped.
Shooting disciplines have been getting whittled away steadily over the last few decades, with the shotgun sports and the air and smallbore pistol and rifle sports the only ones remaining at this stage.
Look at the carry on over in the U.K. over the shooting events in the upcoming 2012 games, and it's not outside the bounds of possibility to consider that the IOC may decide that shooting (of the pistol and rifle varieties anyway) is more trouble than it's worth and that they'll get more kudos and television coverage to sell by dropping them in favour of something more 'sellable' to the worldwide television audience.

So, if an 'Olympic' stage no longer exists (as opposed to an 'ISSF' one) for these particular pistol sports, will they then loose their exemption as detailed in the Statutory Instrument?

Sparks

Yeah, you'll find ISSF loses out as well there bunny, as we don't have centrefire pistols. And our equipment list is now curtailed. And we're not seeing entry-level and crossover-entry-level pistols on that curtailed list. And the spectre of the personal import ban is still out there as well, just for fits and giggles.

Selective quotes from the thread don't give the whole picture

Yes, and I've cunningly hidden the rest of the thread from anyone who wants to see it...
...oh, wait, I haven't. How odd.


Feck's sake Bunny. How about you do something useful like get a copy of the Guidelines from Des and publish them here, eh?

bunny shooter

What's the point if Dermo or his successor/s decide we all have to take up golf there ain't much we can do

Sparks

And if my aunt had testes she'd be my uncle.
C'mon Bunny, do something useful!

bunny shooter

Sparks wrote: »

And if my aunt had testes she'd be my uncle.
C'mon Bunny, do something useful!

Even Mulder lost the will to go on, for a while :P

Sparks

Yeah, but he eventually did something useful...


...for a given value of useful, anyway...

Vegeta

bunny shooter wrote: »

So I think we shall have to agree to differ on the defination of a "list"

Well bunny you're either lying or wrong so which ever one suits you, you can choose that one.

I am not in any way affiliated with NTSA or ISSF style shooting but even I can see that what you said then was not what happened. You can see my first post in this thread to see how I feel about this list too.

Now there is a difference, you can choose to ignore it, but that makes you wrong or a liar. Its up to you to decide which one you want to be.

bunny shooter

Vegeta wrote: »

.............you can choose to ignore it, but that makes you wrong or a liar. Its up to you to decide which one you want to be.

Patience, Grasshopper

The time of revelation is coming

G17

bunny shooter wrote: »

The time of revelation is coming

I can't wait! Really. I'm logging on for information and seeing posts that, well, offer no information, I've found scores nay hundreds of them pointing at some secret cloak and dagger association between organisation A. and organisation X.

Or are these posts just a bit of messing/ribbing (which is fine too, I guess)?

Maybe we can create another thread for this sort of thing? So I'll know not to look for information there, just join in with the bit of craic?

Whatever the revelation is, I'm on the edge of my seat waiting for it, it'd better not end with someone walking out of a shower!

Vegeta

G17 wrote: »

I can't wait! Really. I'm logging on for information and seeing posts that, well, offer no information, I've found scores nay hundreds of them pointing at some secret cloak and dagger association between organisation A. and organisation X.

Or are these posts just a bit of messing/ribbing (which is fine too, I guess)?

Maybe we can create another thread for this sort of thing? So I'll know not to look for information there, just join in with the bit of craic?

Good post G17 and I think the last point may have merit

griffdude

You know lads I've been reading this stuff for a while now and it seems to me that the DOJ or the Gardai dont have to go anywhere else than here to get their ideas.

I wonder did they leak this list for a reason?

Anybody got a few loopholes that they can close out of the next list? Post them here and see what happens.

Vegeta

bunny shooter wrote: »

Patience, Grasshopper

The time of revelation is coming

Well its a bit like saying its going to rain. You'll be right at some stage :P

For all we know the DoJ might have seen your accusations and thought it was a good idea and forced the hand of everyone who wants to do some smallbore pistol shooting :P

dimebag249

Always thought that all the sh!t slinging and scare-mongering on boards.ie were kinda like a self-fulfilling prophecy alright. We know the authorities are reading all of this (wish i could get paid a civil servants salary to peruse the shooting forum), yet some people can't resist undermining disciplines or organisations that they don't like. Makes it very easy for the DoJ to pick out the easy targets.

Could we put this power to good? If we all slagged off boy racers and related undocumented anecdotes of their illegal and undesirable activities on this forum would Mr. Ahern have a Fuhrer Order Statutory Instrument banning modified cars ready by tomorrow?

bunny shooter

Vegeta wrote: »

Well its a bit like saying its going to rain. You'll be right at some stage :P

You'll have to be patient

Vegeta wrote: »

For all we know the DoJ might have seen your accusations and thought it was a good idea and forced the hand of everyone who wants to do some smallbore pistol shooting :P

Little old me, responsible for whispering in the DOJ's ear (like your style, make me the demon )Wish I could but some have a lot of say in this, more than they're letting on

rowa

is any shooting association or body in contact or lobbying with the dept of justice as to what pistols are going to be permitted ? or is this the usual "this is the list like it or lump it " ? i ask because i have a ruger mk3 competition target and this shower are saying its not suitable for target shooting and so is a restricted model .
surely instead of the hastle of compiling a list of permitted pistols , it would be better to give guidelines as for other guns , eg. minimum barrel length , maximum magazine capacity , overall length etc ?

bunny shooter

Are you a member of an authorised range, NARGC, CAI etc ?

All these have reps on the FCP

rowa

bunny shooter wrote: »

Are you a member of an authorised range, NARGC, CAI etc ?

All these have reps on the FCP

yes , but is there dialogue open or is this just another dictate from ahern and his cronies and the dept of justice .

Sparks

Not sure about who's talking to whom, but I was told the SI wasn't finalised, but was very close to being wrapped up, so if you're going to talk to someone, I'd do it fast.

bunny shooter

rowa wrote: »

yes , but is there dialogue open or is this just another dictate from ahern and his cronies and the dept of justice .

Some organisations seem to have more clout than others. The unrestricted list seems very ISSF friendly. The lads from NASPRC or MNSCI might be the ones to talk to as it's probably their members who are more likely to use the Ruger MK 3's and their equivalent, presuming you are a member of one of these groups. I'm sure they were under the impression ALL .22's were going to be unrestricted.

rowa

i thought that .22 pistols and revolvers would be exempt from the restricted list , i know of only 3 people in our club who have proper match target pistols , the rest shoot rugers , buckmarks , cz kadets , s & w 617 revolvers and i shoot an old webley , all of which will now be on this ridiculous list , all of these measures are to put prospective shooters off taking up pistol shooting .
how is one .22 more dangerous than another when they shoot exactly the same ammunition ?

bunny shooter

rowa wrote: »

i thought that .22 pistols and revolvers would be exempt from the restricted list , i know of only 3 people in our club who have proper match target pistols , the rest shoot rugers , buckmarks , cz kadets , s & w 617 revolvers and i shoot an old webley , all of which will now be on this ridiculous list , all of these measures are to put prospective shooters off taking up pistol shooting .
how is one .22 more dangerous than another when they shoot exactly the same ammunition ?

I agree with ya We were led to believe this is the was it was going to be. Seems something or someone scuppered it :mad:

Kryten

How the hell did the Walther SP22 end up on that list? It is completely unsuitable and not designed for Olympic shooting. Look at this

Yet the buckmark, mk3 ruger and hammerli xsse are not there.

bigred

Kryten wrote: »

How the hell did the Walther SP22 end up on that list? It is completely unsuitable and not designed for Olympic shooting. Look at this

Yet the buckmark, mk3 ruger and hammerli xsse are not there.

So Sparks, there's clearly some valuable feedback here for the DOJ to include the buckmark, luger, webley etc. Any chance you can pass on the suggestions?

Is it going beyond the realms of reality that they treat this classification in a way like they did with shotguns - i.e. up to 6 round capacity = unrestricted (includes the revolvers). Greater than 6 = restricted/banned. And God forbid, they might even allow .22 conversion kits for all those 'evil' glocks and sigs etc.

a .22 is a .22. I just don't get it..