World Championships 2009 - Berlin

Mr Mister

OutsideLane wrote: »

Agree, completely inappropriate, but that is what we have come to expect from the clique that have taken over a large chunk of the organisation.

I wasn't aware that he was now after Eo'K also. Somebody needs to tell him bluntly that his job is to support the athletes (& in every way possible), not vice-versa.

As regards our performance in Berlin - we did incredibly well considering there has been next to nothing put into this by the powers-that-be. And credit to the athletes and those supporting them for that.

Agree with you in that I thought the blog was really inappropriate. Looked to be an exercise in self back-patting, although didnt really bathe himself in glory.

I dont know the man that well but my one experience with him was largely negative....I was representing Ireland in a track and field team competition (you can probably guess which one) and despite running a PB and placing well, the first thing he said to me afterwards was of a negative nature. Didnt think too much of it at the time but looking back on it, it was a completely off-the-wall thing to say to a young athlete who had just represented their country well in their first international. Dont want to get into it any more than that but suffice to say I think his people management skills leave something to be desired

Fish'n'Chips

Originally posted by Tingle
A blog like that should not be allowed, gives me the impression that the gig for him is more about the manager than the team.

Spot on Tingle. It has only ever been about Patsy McGonagle with Patsy McGonagle.

As time goes by more and more people are starting to see this.

What was he trying to achieve by having a blog other than trying to raise his own profile and gain praise?

It's completely two faced praising and taking credit for athletes who do well while at the same time kicking others when they are down.

Discussing athletes he is supposed to be managing like that in an open forum is dispicable and really shows how much honour the man has.

A lot of people and athletes within the sport have issues with this man and how he operates but yet he remains with a huge amount of control within Athletics Ireland. He is Vice President of AAI, Chair of the High Performance Committee and also Team Manager for Major Championships. This is an obvious conflict of interests which is allowed to happen. The fact he is staunch Fianna Fail probably explains a lot...

thirtyfoot

Irishathlete_1 wrote: »

Derval - Excellent performance. I've been very critical in the past of her, but she was nothing short of phenomenal out there.

My estimation of you has gone up;) Fair play, takes a man to admit you were wrong:cool:

Running Bing

Patsy to sign up to boards and defend himself in 5...4...3.......

thirtyfoot

FishnChips wrote: »

The fact he is staunch Fianna Fail probably explains a lot...

Ah jaysus, there is being political and being political but what does his party politics have to do with anything. Lets keep it civil (oops forgot not a mod anymore) but anyway, lets keep it civil and discuss whats at hand and not get personal.

Irishathlete_1

Tingle wrote: »

My estimation of you has gone up;) Fair play, takes a man to admit you were wrong:cool:

Ha ha. I always told you I would happily stand up and admit if I was wrong. I still think a lot of people were defending her on blind faith though. There is nobody out there who for saw what she was going to run.

Anyway, now she needs to bring it to the next level and win the Euro outdoors next summer with a fully loaded field.

Fish'n'Chips

Originally posted by Tingle
Ah jaysus, there is being political and being political but what does his party politics have to do with anything. Lets keep it civil (oops forgot not a mod anymore) but anyway, lets keep it civil and discuss whats at hand and not get personal.

Sorry Tingle I'll try not to make it too political on here but it does have to be said the same old boys club cronyism which our esteemed Team Manager appears to exercise seems to be a microcosm of how the political party with which he is strongly affiliated to has the country in the current mess it's in. He has been well schooled.:)

OutsideLane

Irishathlete_1 wrote: »

Ha ha. I always told you I would happily stand up and admit if I was wrong. I still think a lot of people were defending her on blind faith though. There is nobody out there who for saw what she was going to run.

Anyway, now she needs to bring it to the next level and win the Euro outdoors next summer with a fully loaded field.

Well done IA_1, keep injury free and improving. Glad you enjoyed it; now kinda sorry I gave it a miss travelling over this time.

I do hope Derval can get a good run at the Euros next year, but you must know how much of a knife-edge it is in track, especially at the top. Just keeping my fingers crossed that most of you will get a good, injury-free run-in to your next big event.

BTW, I know Gilly had posted the 5th fastest time so far thsi year in the lead-up to Berlin but both T&F news and tilastopaja had him ranked 11th. 6th was good, but he did look a bit jaded (relatively) in the final. I know it was his first time doing 3 rounds so close. Hopefully he can keep the upward curve going. He wasn't too far from 4th, but Quow is a proven championship performer (olympic finalist, former world Jun champ) and was probably the best bet for the only medal place realistically open in that race.

Enjoy your break or have you a few GPs lined up?

IrishTrackFan

FishnChips wrote: »

Spot on Tingle. It has only ever been about Patsy McGonagle with Patsy McGonagle.

As time goes by more and more people are starting to see this.

What was he trying to achieve by having a blog other than trying to raise his own profile and gain praise?

It's completely two faced praising and taking credit for athletes who do well while at the same time kicking others when they are down.

Discussing athletes he is supposed to be managing like that in an open forum is dispicable and really shows how much honour the man has.

A lot of people and athletes within the sport have issues with this man and how he operates but yet he remains with a huge amount of control within Athletics Ireland. He is Vice President of AAI, Chair of the High Performance Committee and also Team Manager for Major Championships. This is an obvious conflict of interests which is allowed to happen. The fact he is staunch Fianna Fail probably explains a lot...

This is not new by the way. Here is a quote from his Beijing Blog last year

'One interesting aspect of competition and the evaluation of same is that some athletes will internalise, be self critical, and be determined that they will use the experience to further improve. These are normally the more successful athletes. The other type of athlete is the one that pretty much looks round to see who or what they can blame the performance on should it be bad. Such is life and the challenge that comes with being a manager.'

Now that reads to me that if you are an elite athlete that voices a complaint with the system (what system?) then the Team Manager thinks you are a loser. Its sneaky, its underhand and the attempt to garner sympathy for the Team Manager/Chair of High Performance/Deputy President as if he might not bear some responsibility for such faults is low rent. He's the problem, not the solution!

Irishathlete_1

OutsideLane wrote: »

Well done IA_1, keep injury free and improving. Glad you enjoyed it; now kinda sorry I gave it a miss travelling over this time.

I do hope Derval can get a good run at the Euros next year, but you must know how much of a knife-edge it is in track, especially at the top. Just keeping my fingers crossed that most of you will get a good, injury-free run-in to your next big event.

BTW, I know Gilly had posted the 5th fastest time so far thsi year in the lead-up to Berlin but both T&F news and tilastopaja had him ranked 11th. 6th was good, but he did look a bit jaded (relatively) in the final. I know it was his first time doing 3 rounds so close. Hopefully he can keep the upward curve going. He wasn't too far from 4th, but Quow is a proven championship performer (olympic finalist, former world Jun champ) and was probably the best bet for the only medal place realistically open in that race.

Enjoy your break or have you a few GPs lined up?

Quow is also very beatable, the way he runs his races leaves him there for the taking.

Yes, am going to Zurich, Gateshead, Brussells. Possibly Rieti too.

thirtyfoot

IrishTrackFan wrote: »

'One interesting aspect of competition and the evaluation of same is that some athletes will internalise, be self critical, and be determined that they will use the experience to further improve. These are normally the more successful athletes. The other type of athlete is the one that pretty much looks round to see who or what they can blame the performance on should it be bad. Such is life and the challenge that comes with being a manager.'

I don't see too much wrong with that statement.

There probably is some truth in that for the majority of athletes. Those who don't take responsibility themselves and who look at others for why they are failing will probably never be honest with themselves and get to the root cause of their problem. That will apply to an athlete or runner of any level or ability. There are exceptions of course and those that may appear as moany may be just a bit bolshy by nature and perceived as 'difficult' will many times backup their outspokeness with results.

Then again, we all know athletes are delicate creatures. Eilte ones even more so. I would imagine that as a team manager you would need to be walking on egg shells and always be conscious of this at a major championships. As always it is all about the athletes after all.

Rineanna

As always it is all about the athletes after all.

And that's what we'd hope the officials have in mind at the big Championships, and at all times of the year, but it's things like this blog that give impressions to the contrary.

Tingle wrote: »

Ah jaysus, there is being political and being political but what does his party politics have to do with anything. Lets keep it civil (oops forgot not a mod anymore) but anyway, lets keep it civil and discuss whats at hand and not get personal.

+1. I'm not a fan of his blog talk, but let's refrain from getting personal as Tingle says.

Fish'n'Chips

Does anyone know what McGonagle's qualifications are to be advising elite level athletes?

From reading his blog it sounds like car boot psychology at best - something you'd expect to hear from a GAA manager.

His comments about Deirdre Ryan are a disgrace. To say something like that about her on public blog shows he has no respect for her (and more than likely most of the other athletes on the team).

Irishathlete_1

I entirely agree that writing an online blog is unacceptable and very foolish from any team official.

Can I just ask though, does anyone here know how Deirdre Ryan tends to behave after a poor performance? Maybe he is treating her from experience? Maybe she needs to vent frustrations before discussing what went wrong, what to change etc...?

Commenting on this was obviously crazy, but was his choice of action? Any of the athletes I know on Irish teams over the years have nothing but good things to say about Patsy and on or two other officials. The way they prepare the athletes and the lengths they go to for them, so I am just interested to know. I don't know anything about Deirdre Ryan, so I don't know how she is post comp.

thirtyfoot

Irishathlete_1 wrote: »

Can I just ask though, does anyone here know how Deirdre Ryan tends to behave after a poor performance? Maybe he is treating her from experience? Maybe she needs to vent frustrations before discussing what went wrong, what to change etc...?

.

Yes, thats a good point.

But how he deals with her and if she does have a strop shouldn't be the stuff off an online blog. Contrary to some people here who have issues with his management, my only issue is the posting of such stuff on a blog. If Deirdre does have a strop after an event, does that mean that Patsy should still be discussing it online? No way.

Irishathlete_1 wrote: »

Any of the athletes I know on Irish teams over the years have nothing but good things to say about Patsy and on or two other officials. The way they prepare the athletes and the lengths they go to for them, so I am just interested to know. I don't know anything about Deirdre Ryan, so I don't know how she is post comp.

As I said for me this is not about his management style, its the fact he is discussing it and publicly dissing her online.

We are all now here making assumptions as to whether Deirdre Ryan is a stroppy athlete post comp, is that fair? No bloody way. He should be protecting her if she is like that.

Fish'n'Chips

Irishathlete_1,

I don't think how Deirdre Ryan reacts after a good, bad or indifferent competition is the point here or should really be discussed.

The point is that Patsy McGonagle's blog shows a major breach in confidentiality between a Team Official and an athlete which brings an issue of trust, or more to the point, distrust (amongst other things), into the equation.

Funny that you should say that you know a lot of Irish athletes down the years who have nothing but good things to say about Patsy - I find my experience to be the opposite in most cases.

It's generally the older athletes who have been around the Irish scene a while who eventually cop on to the way he operates i.e. sneakily and underhand. He's best friends with an athlete when they do well - then distances himself and criticises them when they're injured or underperform (usually behind their backs of course).

All Irish athletes should be aware of this if his blog hasn't alerted them to it already.

Irishathlete_1

If you read my post, I completely agree that any team official should not be making anything public. At no point would I think this is a good idea.

The point of my post was where people were being critical of his management style towards Ryan. I was asking people who know Ryan well, is this the best way to handle her or not?

ChickenTikka

Irishathlete_1 wrote: »

The point of my post was where people were being critical of his management style towards Ryan. I was asking people who know Ryan well, is this the best way to handle her or not?

I don't think its fair to be discussing Deirdre Ryan's personality etc here. Fair enough to discuss performances but I think it should be left at that.

thirtyfoot

FishnChips wrote: »

From reading his blog it sounds like car boot psychology at best - something you'd expect to hear from a GAA manager.

There are a fair few GAA managers who I wouldn't mind having in athletics. Brian Cody for one. His principles of promoting respect, responsibility, togetherness and honesty of effort is admirable and the reason why his team are one of the most successfull sports teams this country has ever produced. But I digress...........

IrishTrackFan

Tingle wrote: »

I don't see too much wrong with that statement.

There probably is some truth in that for the majority of athletes. Those who don't take responsibility themselves and who look at others for why they are failing will probably never be honest with themselves and get to the root cause of their problem. That will apply to an athlete or runner of any level or ability. There are exceptions of course and those that may appear as moany may be just a bit bolshy by nature and perceived as 'difficult' will many times backup their outspokeness with results.

Then again, we all know athletes are delicate creatures. Eilte ones even more so. I would imagine that as a team manager you would need to be walking on egg shells and always be conscious of this at a major championships. As always it is all about the athletes after all.

I disagree. How do you improve things without having open and frank discussion/criticism? In Patsy's world the ones who internalise and self-critique are the ones who go on to success. In reality what they do is see that the support system is non-existent and they get on with creating their own, which then hopefully leads on to their success. The 'other athlete' is the one who is unable to create with their own system for whatever reason and is less successful because of that.
In my experience neither class of athlete is inclined to speak openly about the problems, and you have to wonder why that is.
Certainly, the strong implication in Patsy's blog, that athletes who do speak up are losers, can't be seen as any incentive to have them tell us how things should improve.

thirtyfoot

Irishathlete_1 wrote: »

The point of my post was where people were being critical of his management style towards Ryan. I was asking people who know Ryan well, is this the best way to handle her or not?

We shouldn't even be discussing this. Its not the point of it and the reason that people (well you only) are asking about it to maybe justify his actions on the blog could be seen as yet another example of the athletes not coming first. At the end of the day, its all about the athletes in my opinion.

Fish'n'Chips

Originally posted by Tingle
There are a fair few GAA managers who I wouldn't mind having in athletics. Brian Cody for one. His principles of promoting respect, responsibility, togetherness and honesty of effort is admirable and the reason why his team are one of the most successfull sports teams this country has ever produced. But I digress...........

I'd agree with you on Cody but I'm sure you'd agree he is the exception to the norm. The vast majority of GAA managers out there (Club and Inter-county) are unprofessional, unqualified and for the most part clueless in terms of maximising their players' performance.

That's what I was referring to.

thirtyfoot

IrishTrackFan wrote: »

I disagree. How do you improve things without having open and frank discussion/criticism? In Patsy's world the ones who internalise and self-critique are the ones who go on to success. In reality what they do is see that the support system is non-existent and they get on with creating their own, which then hopefully leads on to their success. The 'other athlete' is the one who is unable to create with their own system for whatever reason and is less successful because of that.
In my experience neither class of athlete is inclined to speak openly about the problems, and you have to wonder why that is.
Certainly, the strong implication in Patsy's blog, that athletes who do speak up are losers, can't be seen as any incentive to have them tell us how things should improve.

I suppose so, I see what you mean. It probably does depend on the athlete and you can't generalise like he has done. DOR could be perceived as 'difficult' or outspoken yet she takes ownership and gets the sh*t done at the same time. And I suppose if I had been one of the athletes who had done poorly and had had a bit of a rant (as would be understandable) then I wouldn't be happy with comments like that.

But then also, you say open and frank discussions are good, is that not what Patsy is doing on his blog, saying it as it is, shooting from the hip.

Rineanna

For the second time, let's leave personalities and anything to do with the person themselves out of this conversation. We're beginning to go around in circles, and this convo isn't leading anywhere but towards trouble. I think most people are in pretty much consensus that he was a bit out of line with the blog comments, and that's the main point.

thirtyfoot

FishnChips wrote: »

I'd agree with you on Cody but I'm sure you'd agree he is the exception to the norm. The vast majority of GAA managers out there (Club and Inter-county) are unprofessional, unqualified and for the most part clueless in terms of maximising their players' performance.

That's what I was referring to.

I know, are you thinking along the lines of the charachter from the D'unbelievables who was manager of the U10's with about 10 hurleys under his arm and a 2 litre bottle of water to splash on any young lad who got a belt?

Reaganomical

FishnChips wrote: »

The vast majority of GAA managers out there (Club and Inter-county) are unprofessional, unqualified and for the most part clueless in terms of maximising their players' performance.

Apologies for going off-topic but...

That's a sweeping generalisation isn't it? The vast majority of intercounty squads now have the full ambit of coaching personnel, it's not just one man. There are a large number of clubs who also have the resources to put in place complete coaching teams including nutritionists, psychologists, medical staff etc etc etc...all assisting the manager and ensuring that he does have a clue.

To call coaches unqualified is a bit OTT as well. The GAA runs excellent coaching courses at all levels.

And, to state the obvious, of course they're not professional...it's an amateur organisation (;)) but to suggest that the GAA coaches do not act in a professional manner is unfair.

IrishTrackFan

Tingle wrote: »

I suppose so, I see what you mean. It probably does depend on the athlete and you can't generalise like he has done. DOR could be perceived as 'difficult' or outspoken yet she takes ownership and gets the sh*t done at the same time. And I suppose if I had been one of the athletes who had done poorly and had had a bit of a rant (as would be understandable) then I wouldn't be happy with comments like that.

But then also, you say open and frank discussions are good, is that not what Patsy is doing on his blog, saying it as it is, shooting from the hip.

You're right Patsy is just saying it, but not as it is, more as he sees it. I disagree with his analysis and I think his viewpoint, along with the inappropriateness of his blogging about individuals, brings into question his suitability for the job.
Also wondering how he gets the job anyway? I see in the IT today that he will be Team Manager next year in Barcelona. Can't remember seeing that advertised on the AAI website.

Common Sense

Rineanna wrote: »

For the second time, let's leave personalities and anything to do with the person themselves out of this conversation. We're beginning to go around in circles, and this convo isn't leading anywhere but towards trouble. I think most people are in pretty much consensus that he was a bit out of line with the blog comments, and that's the main point.

Rineanna, with respect I think the consensus is he was totally out of line and that using his blog to criticise athletes he has just managed at a major championships is totally inappropriate.

Fish'n'Chips

Originally posted by Tingle
I know, are you thinking along the lines of the charachter from the D'unbelievables who was manager of the U10's with about 10 hurleys under his arm and a 2 litre bottle of water to splash on any young lad who got a belt?

Yes And there are more of those type of guys out there than you would think!

Sure if we have an unqualified guy managing an Irish team at an Olympic Games and World Championships (in one of the most competitive sports of all) saying what he was saying on an internet blog, imagine what is going on at the lower echelons of sport in Ireland!

Rineanna

IrishTrackFan wrote: »

You're right Patsy is just saying it, but not as it is, more as he sees it. I disagree with his analysis and I think his viewpoint, along with the inappropriateness of his blogging about individuals, brings into question his suitability for the job.
Also wondering how he gets the job anyway? I see in the IT today that he will be Team Manager next year in Barcelona. Can't remember seeing that advertised on the AAI website.

That's interesting, actually. We might have missed it, but I don't remember it being advertised either, and I would've thought these positions are, in the interest of fairness, re-advertised every year.

Common Sense wrote:

Rineanna, with respect I think the consensus is he was totally out of line and that using his blog to criticise athletes he has just managed at a major championships is totally inappropriate.

..and I don't disagree.

Rineanna wrote:

That's pretty eye opening. Can't imagine Deirdre Ryan would be any less pissed if she read that.

Spiderspeed

Two observations on last three days postings;

1. There is definitely a click on this board.
2. There is a great tendency to personlise that includes quotating from other sources) when the individual concerned have no right of reply.

Rineanna

The European Athletics Association posted the best results of European Athletes in each event, and nice to see DO'R and Gillick representing ourselves on the list. Obviously Olive wasn't a million miles away froom being on said list too :

http://www.european-athletics.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=7704&Itemid=2

MEN
100: Dwain CHAMBERS Finalist (6th)

200: Ramil GULIYEV Finalist (7th)

400: David GILLICK Finalist (6th)

800: Youriy BORZAKOVSKIY Finalist (4th)

1500: Mehdi BAALA Finalist (7th)

5000: Mo FARAH Finalist (7th)

10,000: Carles CASTILLEJO Finalist (15th)

110H: William SHARMAN Finalist (4th)

400H: Periklis IAKOVAKIS Finalist (5th)

3000m Steeplechase: Bob TAHRI Bronze

Marathon: J.M. MARTINEZ (8th)

High Jump: Yaroslav RYBAKOV Gold

Pole Vault: Roman MESNIL Silver

Long Jump: Greg RUTHERFORD Finalist (5th)

Triple Jump: Philippe IDOWU Gold

Shot Put: Tomasz MAJEWSKI Silver

Discus Throw: Robert HARTING Gold

Hammer Throw: Primoz KOZMUS Gold

Javelin Throw: Andreas THORKILDSEN Gold

20kmw: Valeriy BORCHIN Gold

50kmw: Sergey KIRDYAPKIN Gold

Decathlon: Alexander POGORELOV Bronze

4x100: GBR Bronze

4x400: GBR Silver

WOMEN

100m: Verena SAILER Semi-Finalist

200: Emily FREEMAN Semi-Finalist

400: Antonina KRIVOSHAPKA Bronze

800: Jenny MEADOWS Bronze

1500: Lisa DOBRISKEY Silver

5000: Silvia WEISSTEINER Finalist (7th)

10,000: Ines MONTEIRO Finalist (10th)

100H: Derval O´ROURKE, Finalist (4th)

400H: Natalya ANTYUKH Finalist (6th)

3000m Steeplechase: Marta DOMINGUEZ (Gold)

Marathon: Marisa BARROS (6th)

High Jump: Blanka VLASIC Gold

Pole Vault: Anna ROGOWSKA Gold

Long Jump: Tatyana LEBEDEVA Silver

Triple Jump: Anna PYATYKH, Bronze

Shot Put: Nadine KLEINERT Silver

Discus Throw: Nicoleta GRASU Bronze

Hammer Throw: Anita WLODARCZYK Gold (WR)

Javelin Throw: Steffi NERIUS Gold

Heptathlon: Jessica ENNIS Gold

20km Walk: Olga KANISKINA Gold

4x100: GER Bronze

4x400: RUS Bronze

myflipflops

If this comment can be taken literally then it's more than likely a pre-meditated thing by him. Maybe he was taking advice of Charles van Commenee!!

I would suggest that there's a chance that saying 'Deirdre Ryan's failure in the high jump' may possibly refer to the fact that you do 'fail' in that discipline. You literally fail a height as opposed to being eliminated in a heat or whatever. May be just a case of an unfortunate turn of phrase.

Rineanna wrote: »

That's pretty eye opening. Can't imagine Deirdre Ryan would be any less pissed if she read that.

myflipflops

It's an open forum so technically everyone does have a right to reply. The personalising aspect is coming about because there is more debate going on over the last few weeks. People are posting different opinions which is great but you find that when people differ online when posting anonomously, it almost naturally becomes a different type of debate.

What would be ideal would be to remove the anonymity and still maintain the number and nature of the best posters!!

Spiderspeed wrote: »

Two observations on last three days postings;

1. There is definitely a click on this board.
2. There is a great tendency to personlise that includes quotating from other sources) when the individual concerned have no right of reply.

Pherekydes

Spiderspeed wrote: »

1. There is definitely a click on this board.

Tools -> Options -> Boards -> Sounds -> Click -> Off


P.S. It's not a clique; it's a conspiracy.

Dodge

Rineanna wrote: »

The European Athletics Association posted the best results of European Athletes in each event, and nice to see DO'R and Gillick representing ourselves on the list. Obviously Olive wasn't a million miles away froom being on said list too :

Shame they've no chance of a medal at next year's euros though

Fish'n'Chips

Originally Posted by IrishTrackFan
You're right Patsy is just saying it, but not as it is, more as he sees it. I disagree with his analysis and I think his viewpoint, along with the inappropriateness of his blogging about individuals, brings into question his suitability for the job.
Also wondering how he gets the job anyway? I see in the IT today that he will be Team Manager next year in Barcelona. Can't remember seeing that advertised on the AAI website.

Originally Posted by Rineanna
That's interesting, actually. We might have missed it, but I don't remember it being advertised either, and I would've thought these positions are, in the interest of fairness, re-advertised every year.

Yes does anyone on here know the process by which Team Managers and Support Staff at Major Championships are selected?

As I mentioned in a previous post, Patsy McGonagle holds the position of Team Manager, Chair of High Performance and is also Vice-President of AAI.

This is the type of conflict of interest that has Athletics Ireland in the state it's in.

So here we have a Team Manager who seems to think it is ok to publicly denigrate an Irish athlete he is supposed to be protecting which would obviously cause potential embarrassment and humiliation to the girl. This displays complete inadequacy in his role as Team Manager.

In a normal working organisation that sort of behaviour would have repercussions......but not Athletics Ireland!

Who is supposed to review the Team Manager's performance (after all the athlete's performances are reviewed)?

Would it be the High Performance Committee with whom he is Chair of?

Or would it go to a higher level such as the President or Vice-President? Oh hold on a second he's Vice-President also...

Another interesting thing I noticed from his blog was that Stephen Maguire was "Head Coach" for the Irish Team.

I've also noticed in recent times nearly every team that McGonagle has managed has had Maguire as the Team Coach.

Nothing personal against Maguire but does anyone know what the process was by which he got selected as "Head Coach" despite never actually having coached an athlete at a World Championships or Olympics?

Would it have anything to do with the fact that Maguire and McGonagle are good friends?

So there we have it: Inadequacy, insenitivity, conflicts of interest, incompetence, lack of accountability, unprofessionalism, ego tripping, self crediting, sorting yourself and your mates out with trips abroad and other such perks....I guess it's all a day in the life of a 'volunteer' at Athletics Ireland who will swear blindly they're doing it for the good of the sport and the athletes.:rolleyes: It's just the tip of the iceberg.

Irishathlete_1

FishnChips wrote: »

[/I]


Yes does anyone on here know the process by which Team Managers and Support Staff at Major Championships are selected?

As I mentioned in a previous post, Patsy McGonagle holds the position of Team Manager, Chair of High Performance and is also Vice-President of AAI.

This is the type of conflict of interest that has Athletics Ireland in the state it's in.

Unless you know what the process is, how can you state that this is a conflict of interest?

FishnChips wrote: »

[/I]
Another interesting thing I noticed from his blog was that Stephen Maguire was "Head Coach" for the Irish Team.

I've also noticed in recent times nearly every team that McGonagle has managed has had Maguire as the Team Coach.

As far as I am aware, this is the first major Champs Maguire has been coach at since the Euro indoors in 2007. I don't think he was in Beijing last year or Osaka in 2007.

FishnChips wrote: »

[/I]

Nothing personal against Maguire but does anyone know what the process was by which he got selected as "Head Coach" despite never actually having coached an athlete at a World Championships or Olympics?

He was Director of Coaching and Director of Athletics prior to Max Jones's appointment. Aside from Jim Kilty, which Irish coaches have coached athletes to World/Olympic Level?

FishnChips wrote: »

[/I]

Would it have anything to do with the fact that Maguire and McGonagle are good friends?

So there we have it: Inadequacy, insenitivity, conflicts of interest, incompetence, lack of accountability, unprofessionalism, ego tripping, self crediting, sorting yourself and your mates out with trips abroad and other such perks....I guess it's all a day in the life of a 'volunteer' at Athletics Ireland who will swear blindly they're doing it for the good of the sport and the athletes.:rolleyes: It's just the tip of the iceberg.

These are the type of posts that make the mind boggle. Can you actually back up any of these accusations apart from insensitivity/unprofessionalism relating to his blog on Finn Valley's site?

I am not defending anyone here, I just find it interesting that you can post such stuff with no evidence to support your accusations and claims

thirtyfoot

Pherekydes wrote: »

Tools -> Options -> Boards -> Sounds -> Click -> Off


P.S. It's not a clique; it's a conspiracy.

Yes. I have a problem with a click too. Its my left elbow. Everytime I type a message on boards there is a click in my elbow joint. I'm not looking for medical advice but anyone know what it is. I've tried fish oils but to no avail.

Rineanna

Ok guys, this thread has LONG since run its course. The accusations are still flying despite warnings. I'll be shutting this thread down later today, so any last minute observations on the Worlds (the performances, not the management)? Any predictions for Daegu 2011 ?

Tingle wrote:

Yes. I have a problem with a click too. Its my left elbow. Everytime I type a message on boards there is a click in my elbow joint. I'm not looking for medical advice but anyone know what it is. I've tried fish oils but to no avail.

Be under no illusions, this is medical advice. Consider yourself permanently banned.

thirtyfoot

Rineanna wrote: »

Ok guys, this thread has LONG since run its course. The accusations are still flying despite warnings. I'll be shutting this thread down later today, so any last minute observations on the Worlds (the performances, not the management)? Any predictions for Daegu 2011 ?
.

My last word. Great champs overall, great results by 4 of our athletes. So so by the rest. Onwards and upwards and Euro '10 will be super.

Rineanna wrote: »

Be under no illusions, this is medical advice. Consider yourself permanently banned.

Such banter feeds the conspiracy theorists that it is all a clique around here. BTW, I'll call you later about dinner tonight. Both irish athlete_1 and Fish 'N' Chips are coming over too so we should have a bit of craic. Not sure if any of the other regulars can make it. We might get a chance tonight to discuss whats the next item the clique want to violently disagree on. Eat a big lunch, its Pherekydes risotto that he is cooking so we'll all be starving.

PS: Should we invite Spiderspeed, I think he feels left out?

Rineanna

Thanks for that, Tingle. Provocative much? :eek:

Let's move the athletics related talk over to the new Post Berlin thread:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055661932

Lots of Grand Prix coming up: Zurich, Brussels, Rieti, Roverto, Thessaloniki, Gateshead, etc.

Pherekydes

Tingle wrote: »

Yes. I have a problem with a click too. Its my left elbow.

I have a cure for that involving a large gauge hypodermic, four strong men, 3-in-1 oil, and lots of paper towels. Oh and a gag would come in handy, too. :eek:

Tingle wrote: »

Eat a big lunch, its Pherekydes risotto that he is cooking so we'll all be starving.

Damn, it was to be a surprise. No fairy cakes for afters now.

As to Berlin, I think the team did well, as a whole. Better results at the top end and less disasters at the rear. Chammers wasn't a mile away from the semis in both his events and the experience will stand to him in Barca and Daegu. That would be a powerful argument in favour of including 'B' athletes in the future.

Now, will RTE be covering Barca? I suppose not...;)

Very last words: This thread has been one of my highlights about Berlin. Thanks to all who contributed.

mrak

Super champs.. a couple of pics and vids..

possibly the worst video of Bolt's 200m - the camcorder died out there and was forced to record video on my ancient compact camera which only had 2x zoom Another excuse.. I wasn't actually looking at the camera but just holding it in my hand and vaguely pointing it in the track's direction - trying to soak it in with my eyes as any sane person would:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPdzrYCrD3g

Here's a pic of some Hession supporters in limited edition superhesh tshirts (Pauls gf + mates):



Met this italian lad on the tube who must be an autograph hunting legend - I can recognise two of the autographs - can anyone identify any others..?



Well done all on the coverage and the build-up in this thread.

p.s. Olive has a homecoming in Loughrea on Sunday at 1:00PM - cany Galway-direction it would be great to have a decent turnout - she did so well.

Cheers!

Mark.

Fish'n'Chips

Sorry folks if this appears to be hijacking the thread but I do feel that it's important athletics people out there are aware of some of the inner workings of AAI and how Irish athletes are treated and viewed by the very people who should be helping them out. Maybe there should be a separate thread set up for this..

Originally posted by Irishathlete_1
Unless you know what the process is, how can you state that this is a conflict of interest?

You seem close to the Irish scene IA_1 and/or are a friend of Patsy McGonagle so perhaps you could offer an explanation as to what the process was? If you don't see the conflicts of interest that I've outlined of someone holding those 3 positions then there's no point in us trying to have an intelligent debate about it. Perhaps you could explain how they are not conflicts on interest?

Originally posted by Irishathlete_1
These are the type of posts that make the mind boggle. Can you actually back up any of these accusations apart from insensitivity/unprofessionalism relating to his blog on Finn Valley's site?

I am not defending anyone here, I just find it interesting that you can post such stuff with no evidence to support your accusations and claims

The points I've made in my previous posts support those claims. Do you want me to go through them one by one again? Since you haven't been able to answer a number of the questions I've asked my suspicions will remain.

Rineanna

Fish'n'Chips - Sorry to cut your debate short, but I've said above that this thread is being locked today as it had gone way off topic. The accusations flying around were unacceptable and I really left it go on way too long.

If people want to set up a separate thread, like F'n'C suggested, to discuss this then fine. However, it'll be watched like a hawk, and any accusations against particular individuals will be followed by infractions/bans and a deleted thread.

And on that cheery note, thanks everyone for contributing to the thread. We'll set up a dedicated cross-country thread to cover Dublin 2009 and Bydgoscz 2010 when the elite XC season kicks off.

Link to Post Berlin Thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055661932