Research A Soldier

R.Dub.Fusilier

Medal Index Card for AH Barnes

nkay1985

arnhem44 wrote: »

That came from the Soldiers Died in the Great War database which gives slightly different details from the CWGC.Now then from a quick search I have found a record for John Hearne from Trinity Without army number 6464 who enlisted on the 12th of August 1914 aged 20 which has survived which does list family and addresses,it's not too easy to read but I'll give it a go.His mother was Margaret Hearne,father Maurice and brothers Patrick and James living at an address at number 8 Slieve Keale Waterford.It's an interesting record as there is a lot on info in there with some correspondence from his mother to the army office.Sadly there doesn't appear to be a record surviving for the other John Hearne that I mentioned.Maybe a bit of family detective work might turn up some family names to help to narrow down the search.

Hi Arnhem.

I've just received the marriage cert of John Hearne and Mary Ryan, my nanny's parents. Rather than confirm which John Hearne it is, it's confused me even further.

They got married in Trinity Without. And his place of residence at the time of marriage was Slievekeale. This is all very promising and indicates the man with service number 6464.

However, his age in June 1913 was 24, rather than the 20 in 1914 as you indicated, and his father's name is very unclear but it's certainly not Maurice.

But the age of John Hearne living in Slievekeale in the 1901 and 1911 census tallies with my great grandfather's age and his mother is indeed Margaret, the brothers' names are correct and his father is dead.

So I suppose I'm wondering did it often happen that a soldier's age would be incorrect? And are you certain the father's name was Maurice?

arnhem44

Hello again,I've had another look and found his father's name mentioned on another page of the service record also and it is Maurice,John was born in 1896 according to this with his enlistment age been 20 in August 1914 which would be correct.Maybe he lied about his age,he would of had no reason to when joining the army at age 20 unless he thought it may benefit him at a later stage in life if he was still in the service but that's just speculative.

nkay1985

arnhem44 wrote: »

Hello again,I've had another look and found his father's name mentioned on another page of the service record also and it is Maurice,John was born in 1896 according to this with his enlistment age been 20 in August 1914 which would be correct.Maybe he lied about his age,he would of had no reason to when joining the army at age 20 unless he thought it may benefit him at a later stage in life if he was still in the service but that's just speculative.

Yeah that is really weird. I'm going to have to get my John Hearne's birth cert if possible and see if that can tell me anything.

arnhem44

I forgot to mention that John Hearne 6464 died from a gunshot wound to the abdomen,all his effects were sent back to his mother notifying the military in Cork that she had received them.These included a photo,letters,coins,his dog tag and a religious medal amongst other things.

nkay1985

arnhem44 wrote: »

I forgot to mention that John Hearne 6464 died from a gunshot wound to the abdomen,all his effects were sent back to his mother notifying the military in Cork that she had received them.These included a photo,letters,coins,his dog tag and a religious medal amongst other things.

Yeah in the letter that Enfield had posted up but is now removed, the Belgian priest said the same about the gunshot. It seems amazing that it couldn't be my John Hearne, seeing as he was living in Slievekeale in June 1913, but it also seems unlikely that he wouldn't mention his wife. That being said, they probably just ended up married because she got pregnant.

It's very possible that all those effects are still around because we have no idea about John's nephews and their descendants.

darirl

Hi Folks, I'd really appericate any information you might be able to give me regarding the two medal cards I have here. Even if you could help me with the abbreviations or numbers that are on the cards that would be great.

JamesSatellMedalCard.jpg

TimothyKirwanMedalCard.jpg

johnny_doyle

Cl Z on the James Satell index card indicates he was demobbed to the Class Z Reserve and liable for call up should war with Germany flare up again. Entered France on the 19th December 1915 (possibly with the 2nd Battalion, Worcestershire Regiment) and entitled to the 1915 Star as a result. British War Medal and Victory Medal were standard issue for all those who served abroad during WW1.

He appears to have served with the RDF and the Worcestershire Regiment and accordingly has different regimental numbers (standardised Army numbers didn't come into play until after WW1)


Info re the various reserves :
http://www.1914-1918.net/reserve.htm


The UK National Archives has page re the WW1 medals and medal index cards

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/medals.asp

Timothy Kirwan appears to have served as a Gunner in the Royal Field Artillery and the Royal Garrison Artillery. He was awarded the British War Medal and Victory Medal but appears to have returned these (forfeited) 23rd August 1922. Can't find any info re CRV 444/B, NW/9/3161 or AS/RFA/4549. Would have expected some sort of KR (Kings Regulations) code if a disciplinary issue; might be that he didn't serve abroad and wasn't entitled to them (but that is speculation). As a gunner in the RFA he would have probably been trained on either 18 pounder Quick Fire guns or 4.5inch howitzers. RGA gunners worked on the very big artillery pieces and the railway guns.

darirl

johnny_doyle wrote: »

Cl Z on the James Satell index card indicates he was demobbed to the Class Z Reserve and liable for call up should war with Germany flare up again. Entered France on the 19th December 1915 (possibly with the 2nd Battalion, Worcestershire Regiment) and entitled to the 1915 Star as a result. British War Medal and Victory Medal were standard issue for all those who served abroad during WW1.

He appears to have served with the RDF and the Worcestershire Regiment and accordingly has different regimental numbers (standardised Army numbers didn't come into play until after WW1)


Info re the various reserves :
http://www.1914-1918.net/reserve.htm


The UK National Archives has page re the WW1 medals and medal index cards

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/medals.asp

Timothy Kirwan appears to have served as a Gunner in the Royal Field Artillery and the Royal Garrison Artillery. He was awarded the British War Medal and Victory Medal but appears to have returned these (forfeited) 23rd August 1922. Can't find any info re CRV 444/B, NW/9/3161 or AS/RFA/4549. Would have expected some sort of KR (Kings Regulations) code if a disciplinary issue; might be that he didn't serve abroad and wasn't entitled to them (but that is speculation). As a gunner in the RFA he would have probably been trained on either 18 pounder Quick Fire guns or 4.5inch howitzers. RGA gunners worked on the very big artillery pieces and the railway guns.

Good stuff, I actually couldn't read the writing so that was a big help in itself. I did find this (http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=146705) about the "forfeited" reference, might be more along the lines if I believe what I was told by some family members.

johnny_doyle

sounds like you've something else to tell us there darirl

What ages were the 2 guys and where were they from?

jos28

Is there any hope of finding any information on a soldier if I only have and name and where he was from ? Apparently he only served for 4 months and did not see any active service. All I really want to do is confirm his dates of service. Thanks

arnhem44

Only if his Attestation record has survived which is a one in three chance of finding something for British records.If there is no record then you won't find anything else about his service I would imagine if he didn't serve overseas.If you want to post up some details then we can have a look for you.

johnny_doyle

I have come across a number of instances where a chap was enlisted for a very, very short time but has a pension record rather than a service record.

R.Dub.Fusilier

arnhem44 wrote: »

Only if his Attestation record has survived which is a one in three chance of finding something for British records.If there is no record then you won't find anything else about his service I would imagine if he didn't serve overseas.If you want to post up some details then we can have a look for you.

A44 if he was discharged because of sickness etc. he may be entitled to a silver war badge.

jos28

arnhem44 wrote: »

Only if his Attestation record has survived which is a one in three chance of finding something for British records.If there is no record then you won't find anything else about his service I would imagine if he didn't serve overseas.If you want to post up some details then we can have a look for you.

Thanks Arnhem,
He was William McLoughlin from Howth, that's all the info I have.

arnhem44

R.Dub.Fusilier wrote: »

A44 if he was discharged because of sickness etc. he may be entitled to a silver war badge.

But without a number the Silver War Badge Roll will reveal little,the ones I've seen don't have the names and addresses of soldiers only regimental details,the OP has said name and origin only as of yet so to match a soldier on the Roll without his number would be difficult.

arnhem44

jos28 wrote: »

Thanks Arnhem,
He was William McLoughlin from Howth, that's all the info I have.

I'll have a look there now and see if anything is there on him

arnhem44

Jos do you have an age for William,there is one William a Reservist in the Kings Shropshire Light Infantry showing up here for Dublin discharged after three months,he was in the Cheshire Regiment before the war at some stage.

jos28

arnhem44 wrote: »

Jos do you have an age for William,there is one William a Reservist in the Kings Shropshire Light Infantry showing up here for Dublin discharged after three months,he was in the Cheshire Regiment before the war at some stage.

Unfortunately not, I know that he was working in the Post Office as a telegraphist before he enlisted which might indicate that he was not as young as some recruits ???

arnhem44

Jos the William I found was aged 41 but occupation given at the time was a labourer.On the 1911 Irish census there is a William McLoughlin aged 17 living in Howth who is a postman,is this the same person?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Howth/Howth_Town/23970/

jos28

arnhem44 wrote: »

Jos the William I found was aged 41 but occupation given at the time was a labourer.On the 1911 Irish census there is a William McLoughlin aged 17 living in Howth who is a postman,is this the same person?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Howth/Howth_Town/23970/

I reckon thats him on the census alright. I was speaking to his daughter who was born in 1927 which would fit in with the time frame. She mentioned an uncle Joseph too.

arnhem44

Suziq1957 wrote: »

I don't know it you remember this post it was quite a while ago. I came across it looking for John Bowie. Mary Rodger was my grandmother. My mother was born at 37 Gordon Street, Buckie. John Bowie was her first husband with whom she had two sons. A lot of drifters where commandered during the first world war, I believe, to act as mine sweepers. In the Buckie Advertiser of July 1917 it was reported that George K Bowie, 5 James Street, Buckpool was reported to have been drowned off the HMD Morning Star. In another later edition the paper shows photographs of the four sons and two son in laws of George K Bowie, Buckpool. John, James, George and William also Peter Reid and Peter Cowie. I wonder, where they all drowned on that day? How sad.

Hi again Suzi,I found out what happened to the Bowie brothers.In a newspaper report on the 16th of June 1917 two days after their death it was reported in the Clonakilty notes of a local newspaper that two sailors had drowned.Sadly it doesn't mention their names but the dates of death are a perfect match giving the day as Thursday which was the 14th, the day that the two brothers drowned.It states that they were employed to salvage wreckage in the vicinity and were coming ashore in a small boat with others off Ring Point going to Ring village for provisions,when,owing to the rough sea the boat was upset and they were drowned and the others narrowly escaping.
I've attached the newspaper image and also a Google map of ring and as you can see it is very close to Clonakilty,the Google image is poor though.Ring point is situated south of Middle Ring and west of Councambeg.Ring Point is notoriously dangerous as boats have to navigate around a rock known as the bar rock and the sand bank to the right of Inchydoney Island Lodge & Spa which narrows a boats passage going into Ring especially at low tide.During low tide and in rough seas the waves breaking there are extremely hazardous and the stretch of water has claimed many lives over the years.

http://maps.google.ie/maps?hl=en&cp=1&gs_id=2&xhr=t&q=google&rlz=1R2TSEH_en&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&biw=1366&bih=612&wrapid=tljp132878662444000&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wl

arnhem44

OK lads I need help on this one as I can't find a thing anywhere on this person.I know many of you have a good knowledge of events surrounding the Easter Rising and hope someone can add a little to this query.I came across a newspaper report that a soldier by the name of Montagu Finslay of the South Irish Horse was on leave in Dublin at the time of the Easter Rising and reported himself for duty at Portobello Barracks and was involved in three days of fighting in Dublin,engaged in three days and three nights of fierce fighting it says.He worked in the National Bank in Clonakilty but I've checked the Census with no luck,the South Irish Horse website with no luck,medal index cards with no luck and ancestry without success however there is a Lieutenant Finslay on a passenger list but I'm unable to access it due to limitations on my Ancestry account.Also the London Gazette has yet again beaten me although only a limited search was made.Can anyone add something to this mystery man?

R.Dub.Fusilier

is this the one you wanted?

arnhem44

That's the document but I wonder is it him.The pencil stroke through the name obscures it a little,I'm not sure is it Findlay or Finslay from that.The change to the RAF would explain why I can't find a MIC for him though.

johnny_doyle

which paper was the report from and what date?

So far, my searches are drawing nothing.

arnhem44

johnny_doyle wrote: »

which paper was the report from and what date?

So far, my searches are drawing nothing.

johnny I'll post the dates and that up later when I have more time.

arnhem44

Johnny it came from the Southern Star dated 27th of May 1916.There is another mention of him elsewhere with another member of the bank volunteering both into the South Irish Horse and again the second name draws a blank like the first regarding the SIH.This mention was on or around the time they were leaving the bank dated November the 6th 1915.Hubert McConnell was the second volunteer,going on the name there is a possible match for him in the MGC.

Foghladh

I'm afraid I can't help you with your Montagu Finslay but it would appear he's not the RAF Lieutenant on the passenger manifest. You seem to have found a Scottish fighter ace instead! Maxwell Hutchinson Findlay. He was born at Grasslaw Farm near Stonehaven Aberdeen in 1898 which is the address given on the shipping list. http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/scotland/findlay3.php

Not what you're looking for but interesting nonetheless. Apparently he was stationed in Afghanistan around that time which would explain that trip from India

johnny_doyle

Hubert George McConnell seems to have a Silver War Badge that gives his enlistment as 8/11/1915 and discharge as 2/4/1919 as a result of wound.

He's listed as age 28year and 9months.

Transcription error on the 1911 census has him as Habert

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Cork/Cork_No__3_Urban/York_Street/387496/

but looks like he might be from Wexford

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Wexford/Gorey_Urban/Georges_Street/1794597/

Married in Nenagh in 1927. A family tree has him passing away 23rd Jan 1959.

I was hoping that if he was in digs then it might lead to Montagu but no luck there.

Came across a John Montague Mainwaring Finley but looks like he went to Canada approx 1911. Will have a few more attempts with variations but it's not looking good at the moment.