UPC do something nice, refuse to block Pirate's Bay

GerardKeating

According to the store on various news sities, including RTE.

Hogzy

Whats the point, its going legal anyways!

Barrypr

Ya it was purchased recently but in the article it also states:

"Similar High Court proceedings by the music firms against Eircom were settled earlier this year. Under the settlement, the record companies will supply Eircom with the internet protocol (IP) addresses of all persons who they detect illegally uploading or downloading copyright works. Eircom agreed that it would disconnect any broadband subscriber who failed to comply, following a warning they were acting illegally. The music firms wanted UPC to agree to similar measures."

How are record companies getting these ip address, is it a case of them going after sites like rapidshare, trying to get them to had over databases!

Kensington

Interesting how to see this pans out. UPC is not a small, debt ridden company like Eircom is and I'd imagine would have a lot more muscle in a legal case.

Barrypr wrote:

How are record companies getting these ip address, is it a case of them going after sites like rapidshare, trying to get them to had over databases!

They're only targetting Bit Torrent services at present. They basically have computers connecting to loads of popular torrent seeds. Any basic Bit Torrent program allows you to view the IPs of all computers connected to the torrent - all they do is capture all the IPs and the relevant date and time, trace the ISP who owns the IP block and then forward the letters to this ISP. If it's an Eircom IP, for example, and it was you with that IP at the time, you'll then get a letter!

NullZer0

If this is the case, the record companies would have to verify the integrity of the IP addresses that they provide.

I don't think this is going to be easy to do. In the PirateBay case AFAIK a screenshot didn't suffice and I certainly wouldn't settle for it.

Aswel as this, the record company would have to verify that it was said data, to do this they would have to download the data (which would mean they would seed it too).

I don't know about you but that sounds like more of a "sting" operation so I don't know how that holds up in court.

Barrypr

Little update on pirate bay's plans:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/19/ggf_plans_for_legal_pirate_bay/

Some_Person

Fair play UPC, I hope all other ISPs take UPC's stance.

Hogzy

Some_Person wrote: »

Fair play UPC, I hope all other ISPs take UPC's stance.

Everyone but Eircom so far... Predictable though, i hope Eircom loose alot of their subscribers for that move!!!

mehmeh12

So UPC are going to block pirate bay? And here i was about to switch over to them :eek:

Some_Person

No...Eircom is going to block access, UPC are NOT going to block access and they intend to defend their position.

donmeister

mehmeh12 wrote: »

So UPC are going to block pirate bay? And here i was about to switch over to them :eek:

Did you read this thread at all? Even the title?

Amalgam

UPC aren't doing it to defend the rose tinted semantics of your right to download, they're doing it because there's no basis in Irish law for them to do what the Irish Record companies are asking them to do.

Eircom are arseholes, or geniuses.. because if you have even the slightest idea how this whole online lark operates, it basically works its way around blocks like this, much like water seeping into wet soil.. where there's a will, there's a way.

Agreeing might give the company room to manoeuver (legally) if things progress (for the worst) at a later date.

Barrypr

This is the start of it, The great Firewall of Ireland!! :eek:

Solair

Well, if the record industry asked An Post to destroy packages that it the industry suspected contained illegal non-copyright material, there'd be shock/horror and uproar.

If they want to shut down pirate bay, go after pirate bay! It's really nothing to do with the Irish internet service providers, all they do is provide a pipe that connects you to the internet.

As pointed out too, UPC is on a whole different scale to eircom. It's a huge organisation and one of the largest broadband suppliers in the world.

They will be quite capable of defending their position.

mehmeh12

donmeister wrote: »

Did you read this thread at all? Even the title?

My bad..i was a bit tired when i wrote that last post :rolleyes:

In a slighlty different note i've been trying to get through to chorus ntl customer support...i get to the automated message that tells you your button options...i click 1 and the phone is always busy! Been doing this the past three days! Is customer service always like this?

Solair

mehmeh12 wrote: »

My bad..i was a bit tired when i wrote that last post :rolleyes:

In a slighlty different note i've been trying to get through to chorus ntl customer support...i get to the automated message that tells you your button options...i click 1 and the phone is always busy! Been doing this the past three days! Is customer service always like this?

Try them off peak if at all possible, i.e. not over lunch and not between 5 and 7pm. It's the same with Sky - I was on hold for 50 mins trying to get my HD box sorted with them! If you don't have time try : http://service.upc.ie/contact/form

sharms

it's not "NICE" as you put it is irresponsible. Why dont u take ur hand outta ur pocket and pay 4d music u r stealing

joolsveer

sharms wrote: »

it's not "NICE" as you put it is irresponsible. Why dont u take ur hand outta ur pocket and pay 4d music u r stealing

Where do I get music downloads for four pence per track?

Solair

sharms wrote: »

it's not "NICE" as you put it is irresponsible. Why dont u take ur hand outta ur pocket and pay 4d music u r stealing

It's not irresponsible. If the music industry wants to go after Pirate Bay, they should go after Pirate Bay directly, not ISP who do not really have any control over what's going through their network.

If we continue down this route, we'll have all sorts of organisations requesting that ISPs block content to protect their business interests and potentially serious problems with censorship.

An ISP is no different from the Post Office, they do not know what is in the envelopes, they just carry them.

Sleipnir

sharms wrote: »

it's not "NICE" as you put it is irresponsible. Why dont u take ur hand outta ur pocket and pay 4d music u r stealing

Only if you promise not to use textspeak when typing.

sharms

joolsveer wrote: »

Where do I get music downloads for four pence per track?

ur payin d illegal websites not the artists or record companies.. steal away i know what will eventually happen to u nd sure honestly i suppose ur doin every1 a favour because when they decide to issue proceedings against u they'll get der money back plus some

RangeR

Hogzy wrote: »

Whats the point, its going legal anyways!

That's irrelevant. Blocking one site, regardless of what it is, sets precedent. It will be known that UPC / eircom / whatever bow to a little pressure.

Cabaal

sharms wrote: »

ur payin d illegal websites not the artists or record companies.. steal away i know what will eventually happen to u nd sure honestly i suppose ur doin every1 a favour because when they decide to issue proceedings against u they'll get der money back plus some

less of the text speak please,
You have a full keyboard infront of you please use all of it

mehmeh12

Solair wrote: »

Try them off peak if at all possible, i.e. not over lunch and not between 5 and 7pm. It's the same with Sky - I was on hold for 50 mins trying to get my HD box sorted with them! If you don't have time try : http://service.upc.ie/contact/form

I will try to call them sometime later i guess..if they ever pick up..can't help but feel that there is only one person answering the phone.

And in that form to fill in on that link...my hotmail, gmail and ucd email will all not be accepted for some reason..says these emails are invalid..but they work for most other things...

the_syco

Amalgam wrote: »

Eircom are arseholes, or geniuses.. because if you have even the slightest idea how this whole online lark operates, it basically works its way around blocks like this, much like water seeping into wet soil.. where there's a will, there's a way.

The latter, as Eircom don't have to give anyb info to anyone, and since they have to give no info, does the no info include telling them they shut down anyones connection?

mehmeh12

In relation to Ireland specifically have Eircom actually prosecuted people for illegal downloading? can they they cut people off BB after three strikes?

sharms

mehmeh12 wrote: »

In relation to Ireland specifically have Eircom actually prosecuted people for illegal downloading? can they they cut people off BB after three strikes?

they have indeed prosecuted people for illegal downloading but as of yet they are not in a position to cut off anyones broadband

vibe666

mehmeh12 wrote: »

In relation to Ireland specifically have Eircom actually prosecuted people for illegal downloading? can they they cut people off BB after three strikes?

i don't think eircom will actually do anything about it.***

sure they might send a letter or two out, but at the end of the day, record companies have no access to anything other than IP addresses at specific times and dates, eircom is the only one with actual customer details and since 99% if eircom customers are on dynamic IP's, who's to say that the same IP downloading stuff 3 times is the same user except eircom?

they're under no obligation to provide user info to record companies so i reckon they'll just fob them off any time is comes up with the "dynamic IP, different user" defence so they don't need to disconnect anyone.

can you imagine how many people would jump ship if eircom actually started kicking customers off? not exactly what a company with as much debt as eircom has needs to help it stay afloat is it?

***this is just my opinion, i've no evidence for or against this POV, it's just what I think.

EDIT:

sharms wrote: »

they have indeed prosecuted people for illegal downloading but as of yet they are not in a position to cut off anyones broadband

do you have any proof of this?

mehmeh12

sharms wrote: »

they have indeed prosecuted people for illegal downloading but as of yet they are not in a position to cut off anyones broadband

I dont suppose you know of any high profile cases? How much can a prosecution cost you? Does this make you a criminal?

sharms

vibe666 wrote: »

i don't think eircom will actually do anything about it.***

sure they might send a letter or two out, but at the end of the day, record companies have no access to anything other than IP addresses at specific times and dates, eircom is the only one with actual customer details and since 99% if eircom customers are on dynamic IP's, who's to say that the same IP downloading stuff 3 times is the same user except eircom?

they're under no obligation to provide user info to record companies so i reckon they'll just fob them off any time is comes up with the "dynamic IP, different user" defence so they don't need to disconnect anyone.

can you imagine how many people would jump ship if eircom actually started kicking customers off? not exactly what a company with as much debt as eircom has needs to help it stay afloat is it?

***this is just my opinion, i've no evidence for or against this POV, it's just what I think.

EDIT:
do you have any proof of this?

ha yes but it certainly aint for boards

Hellrazer

vibe666 wrote: »

not exactly what a company with as much debt as eircom has needs to help it stay afloat is it?

Wouldnt look good to that Singapore telecoms company that put in an offer to buy them last week either.