IFA

kakashka

IFA on RTE Rad 1 earlier complaining about new forms,seems that a lot of farmers complaining,was a poor effort to be honest,sorry but i dont know how to link to it

rrpc

kakashka wrote: »

IFA on RTE Rad 1 earlier complaining about new forms,seems that a lot of farmers complaining,was a poor effort to be honest,sorry but i dont know how to link to it

Kind of ironic that the IFA are complaining as they had a rep on the FCP who was semi-detached from proceedings by all accounts.

But of course if it's the IFA complaining the media sit up and listen :rolleyes:

marlin vs

I heard it, and it was the most miserable interview iv'e ever heard, the chap hadn't a clue what he was trying to say.

Rovi

It was on Drivetime earlier.
Here's a quick grab of the item:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4UllbvgSpQ

rrpc

I listened (through clenched and gritted teeth I have to admit). Listening to Philip Boucher-Hayes referring to inconsistencies in licensing numbers uncontested and calling John Deasy the catalyst for firearms legislation that was passed three years ago really took the biscuit.

If there's any justice, that gobsh*te should lose his seat in the next election*.




*Of course there is no justice and the gobsh*te will top the poll at the next election and be appointed Minister for Justice in the next government. Don't say I didn't warn you....

BornToKill

'Arising out of that there was a consultative panel established' - and the interviewee sat on that panel.

If there was 'an aspect which didn't receive much consideration' then why was that? Everyone knows that the form has problems but it's a bit odd for a panel member to be complaining about it.

PJ Hunter

muck is hitting the fan what farmers think about forms is well known. better having seperate form like one for restricted, rifle and shotguns

PJ Hunter

NEW FIREARMS LICENSING UNWORKABLE AND COUNTERPRODUCTIVE
IFA Countryside Chairman David Wilkinson today called on the Minister for Justice Dermot Ahern to rethink the newly introduced licensing system for firearms. Under the new legislation all gun owners are required to invest a huge amount of time satisfying complex and confusing red tape requirements.
Mr Wilkinson said, ‘this new system is a logistical nightmare which does not recognise the outstanding record of those who have legally held firearms in this country in the past. IFA Countryside has been inundated with complaints from worried members who are seriously considering abandoning the sport altogether.’
He concluded, ‘the licensing system should aim to keep firearms out of the hands of undesirables while making it user friendly for those who use them legally. IFA Countryside were at no point, during the firearms consultative panels meetings, informed that red tape of this degree was going to be introduced.”


ifa president padraig walsh to be at the game fair. many farmer think the extention was them renewed for the year, not just farmers up in arms, the fo asked whats on the restricted list and the 34 advice pages 9 page form and certs all about. dont ask me.

cavan shooter

IFA dont like forms full stop.

Sparks

You know, while it's nice to see public criticism, it would have been far nicer if the IFA rep had done his bloody job and spoken up in the FCP and solved the problem rather than go to the papers to get the IFA some press coverage before Lisbon. This isn't about the IFA membership's interests, it's political drum-beating before the IFA starts their Lisbon support campaign in earnest.

pedroeibar

The IFA comments are nonsense on farmer’s paperwork and fees. Admittedly, most nowadays would almost need a secretary with the amount of records they must keep and produce, from tests, tags, REPS, etc., so I have some sympathy for another long form. However, most only have a shotgun, stashed near the range or behind the kitchen door. The fee increase for that is only a fiver, spread over 3 years.
What I don’t understand is why there is little/no noise about the increase in fees from the shooting community?
Last year I paid a total of euro 75, or 225 for three years. (Rifle38, first shotgun 25, 2 subsequent @6=12)
This year I will pay euro80x4 or 320, an increase of 42%.
Browsing this board I cannot find any comment by CA or NARGC on the increase in fees. What was their input on this? Can you imagine the outcry if golf clubs or hurleys were similarly taxed?
Rs
P.

PJ Hunter

IFA Countryside has been inundated with complaints from worried members who are seriously considering abandoning the sport altogether.’
He concluded, ‘the licensing system should aim to keep firearms out of the hands of undesirables while making it user friendly for those who use them legally.

the ifa members can be busting clays one day, vermins the next. plenty of shotguns around. fair enough to be complaining if they want.

Sparks

IFA members to the IFA rep for not doing his job right, yeah, but that's not what this is PJ...

Grizzly 45

they had a rep on the FCP who was semi-detached from proceedings by all accounts.

Maybe it was abit above the guys head? As it didnt involve REPS pyments,EU grants,or Suckler scheme payments,or the price of Heifers in Ballydung mart???:rolleyes:

marlin vs

pedroeibar wrote: »

The IFA comments are nonsense on farmer’s paperwork and fees. Admittedly, most nowadays would almost need a secretary with the amount of records they must keep and produce, from tests, tags, REPS, etc., so I have some sympathy for another long form. However, most only have a shotgun, stashed near the range or behind the kitchen door. The fee increase for that is only a fiver, spread over 3 years.
What I don’t understand is why there is little/no noise about the increase in fees from the shooting community?
Last year I paid a total of euro 75, or 225 for three years. (Rifle38, first shotgun 25, 2 subsequent @6=12)
This year I will pay euro80x4 or 320, an increase of 42%.
Browsing this board I cannot find any comment by CA or NARGC on the increase in fees. What was their input on this? Can you imagine the outcry if golf clubs or hurleys were similarly taxed?
Rs
P.

Fair play to you pedroeibar, thank god someone is living in the real world,we're being ripped off, one time we used to get something back from the government in the line of a few pound for poults, but now it's all TAKE and more TAKE.

maglite

pedroeibar wrote: »

have a shotgun, stashed near the range or behind the kitchen door. The fee increase for that is only a fiver, spread over 3 years.

I can see a limted justification for this, I have known a farmer that needed access to his gun quickly as both the local fox and dog population hit his sheep hard, He kept a semi .22 with a fold able stock in the tractor cab.

Also
6*3= 18
80-18=62
62≠5.

PJ Hunter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Maybe it was abit above the guys head? As it didnt involve REPS pyments,EU grants,or Suckler scheme payments,or the price of Heifers in Ballydung mart???:rolleyes:

or knee deep in it. forms or get the sucklers castrated. is he farming full time

Sparks

maglite wrote: »

Also
6*3= 18

6 was for the subsequent shotguns.

And frankly, I'm happy the price has gone up for those.
I'm rather sick of paying out more for my air pistol than someone pays for a 12-gauge, and having to have more secure storage. We all have firearms; so we all should pay the same.

marlin vs

Sparks wrote: »

6 was for the subsequent shotguns.

And frankly, I'm happy the price has gone up for those.
I'm rather sick of paying out more for my air pistol than someone pays for a 12-gauge, and having to have more secure storage. We all have firearms; so we all should pay the same.

First time iv'e ever heard of someone being happy with a price hike,people with 12gauge's are on you'r side.

tonysopprano

So if he was paying €6 for the shotgun, it means that he had at least 1 other.

So pre-August 09
€25+6= €31 per year

Post Aug 09 means,
€26.66+€26.66 per year

€31 to €53.22 means raise of €22.22 per year = 71.68%

Now would this increase in shotgun fees (and the attempt to reduce shotgun( and firearms) numbers) have anything to do with the fact that shotguns are the most stolen firearms in Ireland, and also the firearm with the lowest security (stashed near the range or behind the kitchen door or in the cab) requirements.

I personally do not see any problem with this, as I take MY firearm security seriously and do not see why someone who is lax or lacking should cause me to pay more or take more precautions or suffer because of them.

On another note, are members of IFA and NARGC only now taking note as to who they got to represent them at FCP (when the were awake), and as to why other shooting organisations were questioning them?

rrpc

As a matter of interest, the licence fee intake from the new system over the next year will come to small change under twenty million quid.

That's enough to pay every district Superintendent, every dividional Chief Superintendent, the Commissioner and the Minister for a year.

There'd still be enough left over to build a very nice range

Sparks

marlin vs wrote: »

First time iv'e ever heard of someone being happy with a price hike,people with 12gauge's are on you'r side.

Sure they are - when they lobby for all firearms licences to be reduced in price. And if they do that, I'll happily help.

I get the feeling, however, based on the umpteen years that subsequent shotguns cost less than airguns, that that's not what will be lobbied for...

tonysopprano

My yearly fee pre-August 2009 was €104

My yearly fee post-August 2009 is €80

BUT my firearms were amonst the most HATED in society (if the tabloids are right).

So a bit of equalisation suits me, when I had to pay for safes, alarms, and in-car security just to own an equally lethal firearm. The days of begorra, he's only a farmer/redkneck/countryfolk and can't afford it are far behind us. If those aforementioned people had taken security seriously, as most of us do now, then we wouldn't be in this situation.

BornToKill

rrpc wrote: »

the licence fee intake from the new system over the next year will come to small change under twenty million quid.

In fairness, that's the intake for three years in effect.

tonysopprano

But it is still €20million in their bank now, with an election coming, and they can spend it now and leave whomever comes in less €20million.

Meyer

He concluded, ‘the licensing system should aim to keep firearms out of the hands of undesirables while making it user friendly for those who use them legally. IFA Countryside were at no point, during the firearms consultative panels meetings, informed that red tape of this degree was going to be introduced.”

I have to laugh at that bit from the IFA Statement. It seems everybody is waking up to late to the Ministers lie, that his handgun legislation would not affect the vast majority of Irish shooters.

rrpc

BornToKill wrote: »

In fairness, that's the intake for three years in effect.

It's also when all the work will be done.

So it's a fair analogy.

rrpc

Meyer wrote: »

I have to laugh at that bit from the IFA Statement. It seems everybody is waking up to late to the Ministers lie, that his handgun legislation would not affect the vast majority of Irish shooters.

Well what they're complaining about has nothing to do with what this Minister has introduced.

kakashka

Sparks wrote: »

This isn't about the IFA membership's interests, it's political drum-beating before the IFA starts their Lisbon support campaign in earnest.

More an effort(admittedly a sad sad effort) to appease the thousands of complaints recieved from members,most of whom knew nothing of this till it slipped through the letter box

kakashka

Sparks wrote: »

You know, while it's nice to see public criticism, it would have been far nicer if the IFA rep had done his bloody job and spoken up in the FCP and solved the problem

Absolutely...and if the IFA had bothered to consulted its members things MIGHT be a little different

ayapatrick

tonysopprano wrote: »

So if he was paying €6 for the shotgun, it means that he had at least 1 other.

afaik you could have had just one gun for €6. know a couple of guys that have! id say probably just for farmers though. and only 25 cartridge limit on it.