4x4 sawn and planed

doubtfir3

Hi

I'm working on a project ( a raised bed) and have from drawings figured that I'm going to need approx 20m of 4x4 timber for the legs and supports.

I've attached a rough drawing of the type of bed I want to make (will need some additional supports across the base and legs to support but you get the idea.

I will make some form of "boxes" which will be used instead of a ladder to get up on to the bed, and will be building in a cabinet for TV and games and consoles etc in the remaining sloped area above the bed.

Any thoughts on a costing for timber for this? Are 4x4 boards too thick?

It is for a childs bed (9) but I want to go overkill in case it all collapses in the night and I end up with a crying boy with a bump on his head

I was going to use coach bolts which are pre-drilled and countersunk into the posts for fixings, would this be OK?

Thanks

SpitfireIV

Cant see any image on my end I'm afraid.

doubtfir3

Oops! my bad, forgot to attach it!

See attached now.

ennisa

man I love sketchup, and I hate what they do to houses with the stair wells. It's just butchery. I saw 4x4 posts ( i think they were scots pine/redwood/red deal ) in B&Q at the weekend. The problem is that I doubt if they were long enough. I would say they were only 5 or 6 foot lengths and they were about €10 each! I would imagine that 2x4 themselves would do the job or if you are sure you want 4x4 then 2x4 jointed together to make a square post would be just as good. You would probably get the 4x4 posts cheaper in a builders providers but you would more than likely get enough 2x4 in longer lengths that you can double up to 4x4 for less than the equivilant amount of 4x4. I don't see 4x4 used much in houses and building but I am not a builder. Maybe one of the other folks here with more experience in that side of things can tell you how easy they are to find.
If you are talking about coach bolts to hold the frame in your plans together and they have to go through a 4x4 post and then at least 2-3 inches into the other side then you are talking about a lot of 6-7 inch coach bolts and they are pricey too. That being said I am not sure what alternative to offer other than some kind of L bracket but that wont look so nice. Are you looking to be able to dissaseble them? Coach screw into endgrain won't have as much resistance to being pulled out as it does in side/face grain, in fact I have, on occasion, been unable to get a coach bolt to tighten up nicely going into end grain. The threads just chewed up wood and pulled itself out. I ended up having to cut joinery, motrice and tenon and glue to get it to hold the way I wanted.

Hope this helps.

doubtfir3

Thanks for coming back to me, would definitely prefer to use 4x2 if I can as it will be nice and tidy, but if the 4x4 is a better option then I will go for that.

I might compromise between the two and use 4x4 for the vertical posts and then use 4x2 for the side rails and the base supports etc.

My intention is to get some (probably) 3x1 or 3x2 and tie this into the inside of the 4x2s and use it for the mattress supports with a central rail running down the middle of the bed.

I'll do an updated sketchup and see what you think

Tks

ttm

doubtfir3 wrote: »

I might compromise between the two and use 4x4 for the vertical posts and then use 4x2 for the side rails and the base supports etc.

After looking at this post and wondering what you'd be growing in your raised bed and realising my mistake I'd agree with the above. Just from the sketchup pic I get the feel that 4x4 is the right size for the uprights.

Having made a few beds (for both people and veg) I think I would take a slightly different approach and make a "bed frame" of 4x2's with an inner 2x2 (cut down 4x2) to support 2x1 p4s slats to support the mattress then support the frame on the 4x4's. I'd then run a sheet of ply or mdf around the base to keep the mattress in place and if this also came below the bed frame would provide a way of securing the upright 4x4's to the bed frame. I'd also raw bolt the rear 4x4's to the wall.

doubtfir3

OK, have done a new Sketchup model to give a better idea of what i want to do.. the model is still a bit rough in spots but it will give you a general idea.

Essentially, project is to be laid out as follows:

2x "head" posts 4x4
2x "middle" posts 4x4
2x "foot" posts, top sections only

All of the above to be braced top and bottom, and along the slope from stairwell with 4x2.

"siding" for bed area to be made from recessed 4x1, and bed slats to be made from 2x1. I am going to put a centre support in this top/bottom made from 2x2.

Section under head will house a hanging wardrobe area, and the section under middle and foot areas will have 225mm x 225mm x 250mm deep shelves for jeans/tshirts/jumpers etc.

I will extend the framing on the sloped area to accommodate steps which will allow you to walk from head area on floor up to foot area at top. I will create steps on the plasterboard but will cap these with timber treads.

My intention is to countersink coach screws which will hold the 4x4 and 4x2 together and then to fill the holes, and then to use countersunk wood screws on the remaining areas - again to be filled after.

Any suggestions on wood to use? I was hoping to use Pine, but am open to suggestions on this, both in terms of material and likely costs!

There are a few sawmills near me so will most likely source from there.

Thanks

ttm

doubtfir3 wrote: »

OK, have done a new Sketchup model to give a better idea of what i want to do.. the model is still a bit rough in spots but it will give you a general idea.

Essentially, project is to be laid out as follows:

2x "head" posts 4x4
2x "middle" posts 4x4
2x "foot" posts, top sections only

All of the above to be braced top and bottom, and along the slope from stairwell with 4x2.

"siding" for bed area to be made from recessed 4x1, and bed slats to be made from 2x1. I am going to put a centre support in this top/bottom made from 2x2.

Section under head will house a hanging wardrobe area, and the section under middle and foot areas will have 225mm x 225mm x 250mm deep shelves for jeans/tshirts/jumpers etc.

I will extend the framing on the sloped area to accommodate steps which will allow you to walk from head area on floor up to foot area at top. I will create steps on the plasterboard but will cap these with timber treads.

My intention is to countersink coach screws which will hold the 4x4 and 4x2 together and then to fill the holes, and then to use countersunk wood screws on the remaining areas - again to be filled after.

Any suggestions on wood to use? I was hoping to use Pine, but am open to suggestions on this, both in terms of material and likely costs!

There are a few sawmills near me so will most likely source from there.

Thanks

I often use the timber sizes you are using and find that with pre drilled holes (but not in the end grain) No5 x 90mm screws work better than coach screws and go in easily with a decent cordless screwdriver , you can use say 4 in each joint. My sons bed (he is about 14stone probably more) uses 2x1inch slats spaced with one inch gaps and I found I didn't need any extra reinforcing, one slat did break but that was my fault as I was a piece of timber short and used up a bit with a knot right in the middle

2x1 P4S (planned on four sides) you'll get from any buiders merchants. The 4x4 isn't really a building or carpenters common size but you'll easily get fence posts that size. Problem with fence posts is the chemical treatment so best not used in a childs bed.

Don't forget any sizes from a saw mill may be very nominal so check what size your 4x4's really are, also you might be back with the chemical problem of treated timber from some "saw mills".