Suppression of free speech in Galway, Ireland

dlofnep

Justind wrote: »

If you don't think there's a connection between the No to Lisbon movement and these 'action' groups then that's not my problem.

I wasn't responding to you.

But there is no correlation between people who oppose the Israeli occupation of Palestine and Lisbon. Two separate issues. What you are doing is using guilt by association to lesson the issue.

This man was highlighting an important issue, where 1000's of innocent people have lost their lives, and 1000's more have been displaced from their homes. A man then lies to the Gardaí in an attempt to suppress the information, and it seemingly works - because based on his lies, the man his arrested.

It's BS and a disgusting abuse of power. If you don't see something wrong with some Johnny randomer lieing to the Gardaí in an attempt to have an innocent man arrested and suppress free speech, then something is seriously wrong.

OldJay

RedPlanet wrote: »

If you've ever visited Galway you'd know that the Ireland-Palestine Solidarity Campaign has been a regular feature of Shop St for a number of years. Long, long before the Lisbon treaty

Yep. There are no alliances between these groups and various others decrying the Lisbon Treaty. Sure, sure. . . :rolleyes:

RedPlanet wrote: »

Why don't you ask the Ireland-Palestine Solidarity Campaign that very question?
http://www.ipsc.ie/
It's a bit pointless repeatedly posting that question here.

I think they've enough problems of their own with in-fighting to be bothered with curious questions on why they don't bother protesting anymore.

dlofnep

Justind wrote: »

Yep. There are no alliances between these groups and various others decrying the Lisbon Treaty. Sure, sure. . . :rolleyes:

It has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

Maidir le Lisbon - It was rejected by the majority of the Irish people last time around. Do they all have a hidden agenda too?

Stick to the issue at hand. A blatant lie from the member of public which results in an innocent man arrested for highlighting the plight of the Palestinian people.

Nodin

Justind wrote: »

Yep. There are no alliances between these groups and various others decrying the Lisbon Treaty. Sure, sure. . .

Its irrelevant. The galway branch has kept a higher public profile than any other for years. What you're dragging lisbon intO this for is beyond me.

RedPlanet

Justind wrote: »

Yep. There are no alliances between these groups and various others decrying the Lisbon Treaty. Sure, sure. . . :rolleyes:

Israel/Palestine and the Lisbon Treaty are 2 very different topics.
It's possible that members of one are also members of another, but who cares? What is your point?
Are you suggesting that an Israel/Palestine awareness campaign in Galway is in actuality, a No-to-Lisbon campaign in disguise?

Justind wrote: »

I think they've enough problems of their own with in-fighting to be bothered with curious questions on why they don't bother protesting anymore.

I suspect the answer to your question would be that they do, and have done protests outside the Israeli embassy. However the guy that sets up the table in Shop St. in Galway is running a local awareness campaign and there is more foot-traffic on Shop St. in Galway then there is outside the Israeli embassy in Dublin. And besides, i bet the geezer lives in... you guessed it Galway.
:rolleyes:

ukgalwaymcguire

since i have lived in this country (1 year) i have had my neighbours call racists names to my daughter who is 11 and mixed race, which i reported to the gardi, they did nothing.
i have had in the first 5 weeks of living here, the previous occupant of my house (moved out 18 months before i was even in the country) kick my door off, in a drunken and drug induced state, run round my house with a knife after my children,(2 age 14 and 10 at the time) lucky i am able to get the better of many a adult,(for a woman im tall and large build god knows what he would of done to a smaller lady not prepared to fight a man)) and i threw him down the stairs (he ran up with a knife after my children) the gardi were called, and they took him away , let him out the next morning, left it 6 months to re arrest him with charges by which time he had skipped the country to the U.K, tell me he is also wanted on drug charges (dealing class a) in dublin.

the police in this country are ****e.. they have there priorites a*se about face, and most have the collective intelligence of a ant.
the only reason there is not more crime in ireland is because the people of themselves and nothing to do with the gards or laws.

this is appauling, there was no unbiased collection of information from both sides, and gather evidence of the situtation that had taken place.
the gentleman who was arrested i HOPE he takes the whole thing further, for investigation into police practice, and takes the whole route with full media coverage as the police in this country need a kick up the ar*e as far as human rights, and up holding the law are concerned,
he has my sympathy, and next time im in shop street, i will tell him so.

to the american couple who tried to intervene, and state what actually happened, if you open your mouth over here in ireland and dont have a irish accent, your speaking on deaf ears!!! fact from my own experience and this shows my point!

OldJay

RedPlanet wrote: »

Are you suggesting that an Israel/Palestine awareness campaign in Galway is in actuality, a No-to-Lisbon campaign in disguise?

No I'm not so no need for the sarcastic pseudo-rhetoricals thanks.
As I said, leftist groups such as these are currently and in a co-ordinated fashion, mobilising for the Lisbon No vote ie. the No to Lisbon movement is using them.
Its that simple.

RedPlanet wrote: »

I suspect the answer to your question would be that they do, and have done protests outside the Israeli embassy

Not enough, it would seem. They haven't been there since January/February. 'Fairweather' protestors?
"What you fightin'?"..."Watchya got?" :rolleyes:
Too busy nipping away at themselves.

Riskymove

dlofnep wrote: »

Lisbon - It was rejected by the majority of the Irish people last time around.

no it wasn't

source

Bottom line, the Garda had the right and the legal power to do what he did.

The protester was acting in contravention of this section:

Section 7 Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994.

7.—(1) It shall be an offence for any person in a public place to distribute or display any writing, sign or visible representation which is threatening, abusive, insulting or obscene with intent to provoke a breach of the peace or being reckless as to whether a breach of the peace may be occasioned.
(2) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £500 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 3 months or to both.

The Garda then issued a direction under Section 8, requiring the protester to leave the area:

Section 8 Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994

8.—(1) Where a member of the Garda Síochána finds a person in a public place and suspects, with reasonable cause, that such person—
( a ) is or has been acting in a manner contrary to the provisions of section 4, 5, 6, 7 or 9, or
( b ) without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, is acting in a manner which consists of loitering in a public place in circumstances, which may include the company of other persons, that give rise to a reasonable apprehension for the safety of persons or the safety of property or for the maintenance of the public peace, the member may direct the person so suspected to do either or both of the following, that is to say:
(i) desist from acting in such a manner, and
(ii) leave immediately the vicinity of the place concerned in a peaceable or orderly manner.
(2) It shall be an offence for any person, without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, to fail to comply with a direction given by a member of the Garda Síochána under this section.
(3) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £500 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6 months or to both.

Which he refused to do, so the Garda then arrested the protester under Section 24 for failing to comply with his direction under Section 8.

Section 24 Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994

24.—(1) Where a member of the Garda Síochána finds any person committing an offence under a relevant provision, the member may arrest such person without warrant.
(2) Where a member of the Garda Síochána is of the opinion that an offence has been committed under a relevant provision, the member may—
( a ) demand the name and address of any person whom the member suspects, with reasonable cause, has committed, or whom the member finds committing, such an offence, and
( b ) arrest without warrant any such person who fails or refuses to give his name and address when demanded, or gives a name or address which the member has reasonable grounds for believing is false or misleading.
(3) Any person who fails or refuses to give his name and address when demanded by virtue of subsection (2), or gives a name or address when so demanded which is false or misleading, shall be guilty of an offence.
(4) A person guilty of an offence under subsection (3) shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £500 or to a term of imprisonment not exceeding 6 months or to both.
(5) In this section "relevant provision" means section 4, 6, 7, 8, 11, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18 or 19.

While the old man may (according to that video, which is heavily edited) have started on the protester, I would imagine it is because he found the literature and posters that the protester was displaying both, insulting and offensive.

irish_bob

ukgalwaymcguire wrote: »

since i have lived in this country (1 year) i have had my neighbours call racists names to my daughter who is 11 and mixed race, which i reported to the gardi, they did nothing.
i have had in the first 5 weeks of living here, the previous occupant of my house (moved out 18 months before i was even in the country) kick my door off, in a drunken and drug induced state, run round my house with a knife after my children,(2 age 14 and 10 at the time) lucky i am able to get the better of many a adult,(for a woman im tall and large build god knows what he would of done to a smaller lady not prepared to fight a man)) and i threw him down the stairs (he ran up with a knife after my children) the gardi were called, and they took him away , let him out the next morning, left it 6 months to re arrest him with charges by which time he had skipped the country to the U.K, tell me he is also wanted on drug charges (dealing class a) in dublin.

the police in this country are ****e.. they have there priorites a*se about face, and most have the collective intelligence of a ant.
the only reason there is not more crime in ireland is because the people of themselves and nothing to do with the gards or laws.

this is appauling, there was no unbiased collection of information from both sides, and gather evidence of the situtation that had taken place.
the gentleman who was arrested i HOPE he takes the whole thing further, for investigation into police practice, and takes the whole route with full media coverage as the police in this country need a kick up the ar*e as far as human rights, and up holding the law are concerned,
he has my sympathy, and next time im in shop street, i will tell him so.

to the american couple who tried to intervene, and state what actually happened, if you open your mouth over here in ireland and dont have a irish accent, your speaking on deaf ears!!! fact from my own experience and this shows my point!

thier also the highest paid police force in europe

RedPlanet

Justind wrote: »

As I said, leftist groups such as these are currently and in a co-ordinated fashion, mobilising for the Lisbon No vote ie. the No to Lisbon movement is using them.
Its that simple.

I'm really trying to follow you, but your not making much sense.
Are you saying that the Ireland-Palestine Solidarity awareness table in Galway these many years, is in reality covertly part of a coordinated No-To-Lisbon movement?
And it's something to do with Leftist political leanings?
And what, this is some big conspiracy against us. :eek:

Cannibal Ox

RedPlanet wrote:

Are you saying that the Ireland-Palestine Solidarity awareness table in Galway these many years, is in reality covertly part of a coordinated No-To-Lisbon movement?

From the story you quoted

Tommy Donnellan of IFPAL (Irish Friends of Palestine Against Lisbon)

Not sure why they've become anti-Lisbon, considering it has nothing to do with Israel and Palestine.

prinz

The Garda was perfectly within his rights. Fair play. He gave yer man enough chances to just drop it and let the whole thing rest.

AlekSmart

While the old man may (according to that video, which is heavily edited) have started on the protester, I would imagine it is because he found the literature and posters that the protester was displaying both, insulting and offensive.

Yep i`m with foinse here....

Lotsa folks rushin in to kick the oul jew for his rantin without knowing what occurred in the lead up to Tommy Donnelan rushin for his Video

Cam.Maidir le Lisbon - It was rejected by the majority of the Irish people last time around. Do they all have a hidden agenda too?

Sadly Dlonfep,Lisbon was rejected only by the majority of the Irish electorate who could bother their arse to go along to a 12 hour Polling Booth located close to their residence.....so if Tom D`s "Public Awareness" campaign is to achieve any result he`s probably correct in notching it up a tad...

I still can`t see why,if Tom D`s anti-Zionism is of such paramount importance he simply does`nt stick with it as the sole plank of his Galway Tent ?

For example he could "Do" Palestine on a Saturday and then Lisbon on another day thus avoiding any crossover confusion as the native Irish find such complexity rather off-putting.

As others have already pointed out the best bit of advice came from the American gent with regard do doing onesself favours...sadly his wise counsel was`nt heeded....:cool:

lugha

AlekSmart wrote: »

Lotsa folks rushin in to kick the oul jew for his rantin without knowing what occurred in the lead up to Tommy Donnelan rushin for his Video

Haven't people gotten terribly sensitive? Imagine that old geezer getting so wound up at someone showing solidarity with a people whose democratically elected leaders have as an objective, the annihilation of his own. :rolleyes:

Fr Tod Umptious

I'm going to set up a stall in Galway saying that people should boycott Palestinian goods because Palestinians blow up innocent civilians (in Israel).

I wonder how long I'll last (will possibly be attacked by the pro Palestinian majority before the guards arrive)

wes

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I'm going to set up a stall in Galway saying that people should boycott Palestinian goods because Palestinians blow up innocent civilians (in Israel).

I wonder how long I'll last (will possibly be attacked by the pro Palestinian majority before the guards arrive)

Its actually alreading happening to Gaza btw (actually its more of a full on blockade and in the West Bank, there movement is severly restricted as well), 1.5 million people being brought to the brink of starvation, in a act of collective punishment and all aided and abetted by the US and EU.

OldJay

RedPlanet wrote: »

I'm really trying to follow you, but your not making much sense.
Are you saying that the Ireland-Palestine Solidarity awareness table in Galway these many years, is in reality covertly part of a coordinated No-To-Lisbon movement?
And it's something to do with Leftist political leanings?
And what, this is some big conspiracy against us. :eek:

No, I'm saying that groups such as those which have been mentioned in this thread are openly in cahoots with an anti-Lisbon movement.
Yes they are 'leftist' and tend to adhere to 'leftist' causes no matter what.
I'm not saying anything about "conspiracies". None of their allegiance to the No vote is exactly hard to spot. :rolleyes:

RedPlanet

[QUOTE=foinse;61874834
The protester was acting in contravention of this section:

Section 7 Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994.

7.—(1) It shall be an offence for any person in a public place to distribute or display any writing, sign or visible representation which is threatening, abusive, insulting or obscene with intent to provoke a breach of the peace or being reckless as to whether a breach of the peace may be occasioned.
(2) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £500 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 3 months or to both.
[/quote]
Yer man has had that stall open for a number of years.
According the law cited, the prosecution would have to show intent to provoke a breach of the peace. Being the case that a number of years and countless members of the public have passed that stall, it is unlikely that he is intending on breaching the peace.

prinz

Section 7 Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994.

Quote:
7.—(1) It shall be an offence for any person in a public place to distribute or display any writing, sign or visible representation which is threatening, abusive, insulting or obscene with intent to provoke a breach of the peace or being reckless as to whether a breach of the peace may be occasioned.

RedPlanet wrote: »

Yer man has had that stall open for a number of years. According the law cited, the prosecution would have to show intent to provoke a breach of the peace. Being the case that a number of years and countless members of the public have passed that stall, it is unlikely that he is intending on breaching the peace.

You highlighted the wrong part chappy. He was being reckless in engaging with passersby in a manner to anyone with an ounce of impartiality could see was bordering on reckless in that between all the parties involved the tension and aggravation was being racheted up over and over with loud, and aggressive behaviour. The fact that he was arrested, although originally coming under the section above, IMO has less to do with his stall etc and more to do with his interaction with the garda on the scene, and he made his own bed in that regard.

RedPlanet

prinz wrote: »

You highlighted the wrong part

Again, the fact that he's been there for several years and countless thousands (millions?) have meandered past without a breach of the peace would indicate the problem is not his stand, but the weirdo that started shouting abuse at him.

ei.sdraob

RedPlanet wrote: »

Again, the fact that he's been there for several years and countless thousands (millions?) have meandered past without a breach of the peace would indicate the problem is not his stand, but the weirdo that started shouting abuse at him.

exactly i am a Galway native and seen the guy on dozen occasions not causing any hassle to anyone, while trying to spread his message

he got provoked ...

source

RedPlanet wrote: »

Again, the fact that he's been there for several years and countless thousands (millions?) have meandered past without a breach of the peace would indicate the problem is not his stand, but the weirdo that started shouting abuse at him.

millions and thousands of previous passers-by obviously weren't offended by him, however it only takes one person to be offended and to make a complaint, maybe no Israelites had passed this guy previously, I can't say what previous passers-by have felt, but that guy certainly looked offended and insulted by what the protester was saying/displaying.

Kalashnikov_Kid

Its getting the thumbs up all round in the Emergency Services forum so the Garda must have done the right thing then :rolleyes:

prinz

RedPlanet wrote: »

Again, the fact that he's been there for several years and countless thousands (millions?) have meandered past without a breach of the peace would indicate the problem is not his stand, but the weirdo that started shouting abuse at him.

ei.sdraob wrote: »

exactly i am a Galway native and seen the guy on dozen occasions not causing any hassle to anyone, while trying to spread his message

he got provoked ...

That may well be but he was reckless in continuing the breach of the peace. If he had obeyed the lawful request of the garda, he could have his stall back up on the same spot today and no one would be any the wiser. Instead he played a part in causing the breach, he willfully refused lawful instruction, and he committed a breach of the peace IMO solely on the manner in which he communicated with the garda therefore he was within his rights to arrest him, what cause his stall promotes etc. is irrelevant.

The same situation is evident every day outside the GPO in Dublin with a number of groups, yet they don't rise to argument because they know what the result would be. The gardaí cannot just close down a stall because people object to it. They can however request people to move, desist etc, if that person is willfully engaging with passersby, in the knowledge that a breach of the peace may occur. Which he did.

RedPlanet

foinse wrote: »

millions and thousands of previous passers-by obviously weren't offended by him, however it only takes one person to be offended and to make a complaint, maybe no Israelites had passed this guy previously, I can't say what previous passers-by have felt, but that guy certainly looked offended and insulted by what the protester was saying/displaying.

You don't have a right Not-To-Be-Offended.
If your rather liberal interpretation of the law would be correct, then we'd have basically no political views in public.
All a YES campaigner would have to do, is to complain about being "offended" by some of the NO literature.
And vise-versa.

prinz

RedPlanet wrote: »

You don't have a right Not-To-Be-Offended.
If your rather liberal interpretation of the law would be correct, then we'd have basically no political views in public.
All a YES campaigner would have to do, is to complain about being "offended" by some of the NO literature.
And vise-versa.

You seem to be confusing a ban on presenting a certain 'opinion', and being asked to move along in an effort to diffuse a situation. The garda was not shutting this guy down because of his stall If he had ignored the people who took issue with his stall on the other hand... there's nothing the garda could do in that situation. I know this as I had a chat with a garda in Dublin related to something similar.

RedPlanet

prinz wrote: »

You seem to be confusing a ban on presenting a certain 'opinion', and being asked to move along in an effort to diffuse a situation. The garda was not shutting this guy down because of his stall

Far easier to tell a single tourist to move along, then shutting down a public awareness campaign's table with all the attendent free-speech / civil rights issues that go along with that decision.

prinz

RedPlanet wrote: »

Far easier to tell a single tourist to move along, then shutting down a public awareness campaign's table with all the attendent free-speech / civil rights issues that go along with that decision.

What free speech / civil rights issues? . Again you're confusing the issue about why he was arrested, why the garda was requesting he close up shop.

lugha

Don’t know what all the fuss is about anyway. There were no losers here. The Jewish folk got their man, the Garda chalked up another arrest and what’s his name has banged himself a nifty propaganda video. Everybody wins!

Raiser

An Israeli, a Yank and a Piglet?

- Is this a Joke?

Soldie

I think the policeman handled the situation quite well, the protestor wasn't doing himself any favours. Why am I not surprised to see the left-wing pro-Palestine brigade rushing in to defend the protestor? Would they be doing the same thing if he was protesting against Palestinian terrorists?

panda100

Nuggles wrote: »

Protest if you will, but if you're going to achieve anything protesting, you should try engaging in sensible debate instead of shouting brainless slogans at the public.

In all fairness to Tommy Donnellan I think the whole point of the stall is to inform,debate and discuss. He also did ask the Israeli man who shouting abuse at him to engage in a civil discussion did he not? How is this shouting Brainless slogans??

His arrest is ridiculous. This is not a dangerous man . Its actually sickening to think that this is whom the garda choose to arrest when there are so many rapists and real criminals who never get arrested.

However, I think Tommy should have put his camera down as it would have been intimidating for the American tourist and the others around. Also he made the situation worse by talking over the garda and provoking him almost in places. Does this warrant arrest though? No!

prinz

panda100 wrote: »

His arrest is ridiculous. This is not a dangerous man . Its actually sickening to think that this is whom the garda choose to arrest when there are so many rapists and real criminals who never get arrested. However, I think Tommy should have put his camera down as it would have been intimidating for the American tourist and the others around. Also he made the situation worse by talking over the garda and provoking him almost in places. Does this warrant arrest though? No![/

The gardaí don't walk around the country choosing who to arrest. If Tommy had listened to the garda and followed instructions he wouldn't have been arrested.

RedPlanet

prinz wrote: »

The gardaí don't walk around the country choosing who to arrest. If Tommy had listened to the garda and followed instructions he wouldn't have been arrested.

The only way he could have avoided arrest was if he had closed his stall.
It's a free-speech issue.
The guard (and some posters here) simply don't like the message. (Pro Palestine or No to Lisbon).

Maybe somebody who knows the protester might keep an eye on the case if and when it goes to court and keep us updated. Then we can all find out whether the arrest was lawful or not?

And in my opinion it was. Everything was done the way foinse pointed out. He wasn't arrested for the protest he was arrested for failing to comply with a garda direction after two complaints were received.

Maybe if there was an un-edited video we would no better but he may not have been recording constantly which could explain missing parts.

Finally, the only issue the garda in the video had with the recording was when he was trying to speak to witnesses. If you were a witness giving a garda a statement would you like it recorded and posted online for the whole world to see?

prinz

RedPlanet wrote: »

The only way he could have avoided arrest was if he had closed his stall.
It's a free-speech issue.
The guard (and some posters here) simply don't like the message. (Pro Palestine or No to Lisbon).

:pac: okay, right. So the garda was walking down the street and thought to himself 'I don't like that message - I think I'll arrest him' :pac: This is the kind of attitude that turns people like Tommy into laughing stocks to begin with.

RedPlanet

RedPlanet wrote: »

The only way he could have avoided arrest was if he had closed his stall.
It's a free-speech issue.
The guard (and some posters here) simply don't like the message. (Pro Palestine or No to Lisbon).

Nobody here is disputing the right to freedom of speech. Anybody can protest about whatever they want, abortion, animal testing, lisbon, the EU, the war in Afghanistan, etc. It only becomes an issue if there is a complaint received from a member of the public in which case the Gardai have to act on that complaint. The protesters will usually be directed to pack up and move on which they usually do. If not then then they are committing an offence under Section 8 of the Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994.

RedPlanet

foreign wrote: »

Maybe if there was an un-edited video we would no better but he may not have been recording constantly which could explain missing parts.

If anyone seriously believes that Tommy was shouting obscenities or calling the israeli tourist a "murderer", then you need your head examined.
Tommy has had that stall there for a number of years and i don't recall ever a fuss being made.
You obviously aren't giving any credibility to the 2 yanks statements to the gard, that clearly said Tommy was doing absoluetly nothing.

If you were a witness giving a garda a statement would you like it recorded and posted online for the whole world to see?

If i were in a public place, on a public road speaking to a gard over a contentious issue, it woudn't surprise me. And i wouldn't believe i had some right to privacy not to be filmed/recorded.

conf101

You can't just baint this in black and white and pin all the blame on any one person. The garda should have dealt with the situation better, and hopefully he looks back on it and thinks the same, but the fact of the matter is that this Tommy Donnellan guy did himself absolutely no favours. He was being downright belligerant and non-cooperative. He was probably right to feel aggrieved at being told to shut down his stand but by acting in the way he did he pretty much left the garda with no choice. I also agree with some posters who said that it probably suited him to get arrested.

As for the abusive old man. Well it's clear from the video that he was being aggressive and antagonising towards Donnellan but we have no idea what happened in the lead up to that and unless anyone was there when it happened then anything else is just speculation.

I actually think the garda did well to remain calm but made wrong decisions in how to handle the situation but Donnellan has no-one but himself to blame for getting arrested, it should never have come to that. I mean what the hell did he think he was playing at trying to video the garda talking to the American couple?? I'm sure he's no fool and knew exactly what he was doing!!

prinz

RedPlanet wrote: »

If i were in a public place, on a public road speaking to a gard over a contentious issue, it woudn't surprise me. And i wouldn't believe i had some right to privacy not to be filmed/recorded.

Yup so you don't really know anything about rights and the law, which just clarifies why you can't see the real reason behind the arrest.

RedPlanet

foreign wrote: »

Nobody here is disputing the right to freedom of speech. Anybody can protest about whatever they want, abortion, animal testing, lisbon, the EU, the war in Afghanistan, etc. It only becomes an issue if there is a complaint received from a member of the public in which case the Gardai have to act on that complaint. The protesters will usually be directed to pack up and move on which they usually do. If not then then they are committing an offence under Section 8 of the Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994.

But in the video the american's spoke to the gard to set the record straight.
They said Tommy wasn't doing anything, and this guy (israeli guy) walking down the street starting shouting obscenities and making a scene.

Have you forgotten that bit?

RedPlanet

conf101 wrote: »

As for the abusive old man. Well it's clear from the video that he was being aggressive and antagonising towards Donnellan but we have no idea what happened in the lead up to that and unless anyone was there when it happened then anything else is just speculation.

It's not just speculation because we have the statement the 2 americans were giving the guards that exonerate Tommy's version of events

RedPlanet

prinz wrote: »

Yup so you don't really know anything about rights and the law, which just clarifies why you can't see the real reason behind the arrest.

Next time i'm at a bank machine, or see a CTV camera i'll keep that in mind.
If i kick up a fuss, make a load of noise can complain to the gards, will they remove that recording equipment?

prinz

RedPlanet wrote: »

But in the video the american's spoke to the gard to set the record straight.
They said Tommy wasn't doing anything, and this guy (israeli guy) walking down the street starting shouting obscenities and making a scene.
Have you forgotten that bit?

Everything the garda did was by the book, and perfectly within his remit to keep the peace. Why can't you just accept that? The onus is on the stall holder/ protestor not to engage in behaviour likely to result in a breach of the peace. He didn't.

prinz

RedPlanet wrote: »

Next time i'm at a bank machine, or see a CTV camera i'll keep that in mind.
If i kick up a fuss, make a load of noise can complain to the gards, will they remove that recording equipment?

Do you normally give statements to the gardaí at an ATM machine? Where the video and audio of the conversation is being recorded by someone involved in the incident you are speaking to the garda about? As it happens nobody has the automatic right to film you like that without your permission, without the proper legal permits etc ( i.e. tv crews, film crews etc ). If I grab a videocam and start following you around all day without your permission how long would it be before you called the garda

Bogger77

Justind wrote: »

Big style.

Wonder if the PC used by this 'Boycott Israeli Goods' fella contains an Intel chip (now where in the world would that have been designed?) :rolleyes:

Since most of the main telco's in Ireland use Israeli billing software, whoall of the "Boycott the Zionists" use for telephone, mobile and landline?

Foleyart

Wee note on the bru ha ha, I passed the altercation in Galway on Saturday. The sound on the video makes it appear that Tommy is talking very loudly at people, it is just his proximity to the microphone. He wasnt shouting at anyone that I could hear. Complete overreaction by the guard though and badly handled to boot.Badly handled all round.

Wow. How did this one get to 7 pages?

Man gives Garda guff, and gets arrested in a situation where he had it coming. Where is the big news? In any other country they'd have waded in for the cheek he was giving. Bet he wouldn't try it on with a policeman in the States, a Gendarme or member of the Carabinieri. Not that I condone how they respond. But even as a matter of courtesy this Garda acted in a civil manner and was entitled to some civility in response.

I guess the real lesson here is that hopefully the speaker will understand that, if he got that thick about a Garda in Galway, maybe he understands a little more how both sides react and feel in the Middle East when homes and lives are on the line, for both communities...

kmick

Hard to know who was in the wrong here because I was not there but if any Garda ever tells me to stop filming or taking pictures in a public place I wont be complying. Some things are worth going to court for and that for me is one of them. Its outrageous that the gardai feel they can order people to stop taking a record under any circumstances.