The Official Bernard Dunne v Poonsawat Kratingdaengym thread

blond45

im glad that dunn lost cos for one i dont like him ,two his head got so big for his shoulders when he won the last time. good he done good for ireland but any where he went he brought around that huge belt. must go on ranting and raven about him. dont hate me for my thoughts.

Happy Monday

blond45 wrote: »

im glad that dunn lost cos for one i dont like him ,two his head got so big for his shoulders when he won the last time. good he done good for ireland but any where he went he brought around that huge belt. must go on ranting and raven about him. dont hate me for my thoughts.

Don't you think he deserved to celebrate the fact that he was world champion after a lifetime spent getting there.

All the best to Bernard Dunne in the future!

fryup

Poonsawat points win

did he have any choice in his opponent or did he have to fight PK??

PirateShampoo

Poonsawat points win

fryup wrote: »

did he have any choice in his opponent or did he have to fight PK??

No it was mandatory, if he didn't fight he would be stripped of his belt.

Ive always said Dunne was over rated and over hyped, and your not a world class fighter because you have one good fight.

If he was the better fighter then why did he get ko'd 80 seconds into the 3rd round.

I don't think he was pushed had enough at the start of his run, he fought countless nobody's who he blow away in a round or 2. He needed to get harder and skilled opponents but went for the easy cash option, and the said truth was that as soon as he was forced to fight a real world class opponent he was well beaten.

Saying all that though i did feel sorry for him last night, he looked devastated.

T100

Liamario wrote: »

Oh and Jimmy McGee is a laughing stock. He is so unbelieveably biased. It's like he can only see Bernard's punches, to the point that he didn't even see the first punch that downed Dunne. Absolutely insane. Wouldn't have him commenting on a bare fist fight, let alone an international event

The fact that he missed the first knockdown punch is a tribute to Poonsawat's speed and agility. Most people didn't see it until the replay.
Bernard certainly didn't see it and he was a lot closer than Jimmy.

mark renton

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

PirateShampoo wrote: »

No it was mandatory, if he didn't fight he would be stripped of his belt.

Ive always said Dunne was over rated and over hyped, and your not a world class fighter because you have one good fight.

If he was the better fighter then why did he get ko'd 80 seconds into the 3rd round.

I don't think he was pushed had enough at the start of his run, he fought countless nobody's who he blow away in a round or 2. He needed to get harder and skilled opponents but went for the easy cash option, and the said truth was that as soon as he was forced to fight a real world class opponent he was well beaten.

Saying all that though i did feel sorry for him last night, he looked devastated.

Where have you said he was overrated and over hyped ? because it was never on this forum

When did he "blow away people in a round or 2?" please give facts

He bacame number 1 in Europe then stepped up to world class level - he didnt just step into the ring for world title fight

He was forced into fighting a mandatory challenger that even the superstars of this division would like to avoid

Please keep the bulls*it for AH

T100

A reception is being held this afternoon by the Thai-Irish community to celebrate Poon's victory. Should be fun.

All the pre-fight analaysis suggested the outcome. Poonsawat was odds-on fav for weeks in Bangkok betting market. Our patriotism is what made hime fav here. The Thai was actually favourite at the start on Paddy Power. Looks like international money came late.

Bernard fought a good fight in the 1st round and a half but Poon is without question a better boxer.

Well done to both.

Handsome Bob

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

PirateShampoo wrote: »

I don't think he was pushed had enough at the start of his run, he fought countless nobody's who he blow away in a round or 2. He needed to get harder and skilled opponents but went for the easy cash option, and the said truth was that as soon as he was forced to fight a real world class opponent he was well beaten.

To be fair nearly every boxer fights journeymen that quick work are made of before they begin to go after the big fights. Hatton, Khan and Sutherland are just three names that immediately spring to mind. I imagine it's down to confidence building as well as being able to command decent pay days for when their big fight actually comes.

mark renton

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

blond45 wrote: »

im glad that dunn lost cos for one i dont like him ,two his head got so big for his shoulders when he won the last time. good he done good for ireland but any where he went he brought around that huge belt. must go on ranting and raven about him. dont hate me for my thoughts.

we dont hate ye for your thoughts - most likely you hate yourself more than anybody else could

also a point to note that everywhere he brought that belt were 6/7/8 year old kids and older looking at him and thinking I could do that someday, those kids then walk into gyms around the country based solely on that thought and may give us other world title fight nights in Dublin

PirateShampoo

Poonsawat points win

john47832 wrote: »

Where have you said he was overrated and over hyped ? because it was never on this forum

When did he "blow away people in a round or 2?" please give facts

He bacame number 1 in Europe then stepped up to world class level - he didnt just step into the ring for world title fight

He was forced into fighting a mandatory challenger that even the superstars of this division would like to avoid

Please keep the bulls*it for AH

Not gonna search my posts to satisfiy you, but heres a nice list of the Dunne's results.

http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=081166&cat=boxer

You may apoligise to me in private if you wish.

PirateShampoo

Poonsawat points win

john47832 wrote: »

he didnt just step into the ring for world title fight

He was forced into fighting a mandatory challenger that even the superstars of this division would like to avoid

Well if you cant run with the big boys dont enter the race.

Guy:Incognito

Only getting a chance to post now, so most of its probably been said , havent read through yet.

But what was Dunne(or his corner) thinking? After he got put down clean the first time he was clearly shaken. What eejit decided it would be a good idea for him to go back at the guy swinging punches? He walked back in another 2 times. You can maybe excuse poor judgement once but the 3rd knockdown was totally avoidable.

Why didnt he defend and see out the round after the first knockdown? Write off the round and regroup in the corner, come back out fighting then when he's steady again.

Handsome Bob

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

Stekelly wrote: »

But what was Dunne(or his corner) thinking? After he got put down clean the first time he was clearly shaken. What eejit decided it would be a good idea for him to go back at the guy swinging punches? He walked back in another 2 times. You can maybe excuse poor judgement once but the 3rd knockdown was totally avoidable.

I don't know, I mean I don't think his corner could have done anything. It kind of reminded me of Hatton against the Pac Man when Hatton just threw all his training to the wind and reverted to what he knew best, which was slugging it out. Except in this situation Barnard had actually sticked to the plan for the first two rounds (unlike Ricky dropping the plan the second the first bell rang!) and he did so well. I think Bernard just got caught up with the emotions of the crowd and started to box for them instead of himself. That being said Poonsawat was putting on immense pressure, he had Bernard on the back foot constantly and he couldn't keep him at arms length.

mark renton

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Not gonna search my posts to satisfiy you, but heres a nice list of the Dunne's results.

http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=081166&cat=boxer

You may apoligise to me in private if you wish.

1 since 2003 - in this case the opponent was was only defeated twice - one of those fights against a European champ and World Title challenger, the other against a record of 14 wins from 14

youre overemphasizing your opinion to try make it sound better

you can get away with that on other forums where sounding good is a requirement however when you post crap on this forum please be expected to feel stupid, which I'd imagine you have a lot of experience with

johnnyrotten

Poonsawat points win

People are entitled to their opinions about Dunne.
The clear and simple fact is that the best fighter won - No Question!
IMHO I think Bernard should hang up his gloves, Join the Dublin Fire Brigade and do the occasional TV commentry.
Well done to the champion and well done to Bernard, you are always going to be the World Champ in most eyes

PirateShampoo

Poonsawat points win

And your trying to give his opponents more credit than they are due, Dunne isnt a world class boxer and wont be remembered out side of Ireland. Alot of his fights where against below par fighters who where put infront of him to put on a show for the paying mass's.

Now i know your feelings are hurt because your man got knocked out but try not to get personnal.

mark renton

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

PirateShampoo wrote: »

And your trying to give his opponents more credit than they are due, Dunne isnt a world class boxer and wont be remembered out side of Ireland. Alot of his fights where against below par fighters who where put infront of him to put on a show for the paying mass's.

Now i know your feelings are hurt because your man got knocked out but try not to get personnal.

I was not giving his opponents any more credit - opponents records are there for all to see

I was pointing out the bulls**t opinion you posted which was attempted to be dressed up as fact

everyone is entitled to post opinion - however if you attempt to dress it up as fact then, as I have previously said, be prepared to feel stupid

fryup

Poonsawat points win

Liamario wrote: »

Oh and Jimmy McGee is a laughing stock. He is so unbelieveably biased. It's like he can only see Bernard's punches, to the point that he didn't even see the first punch that downed Dunne. Absolutely insane. Wouldn't have him commenting on a bare fist fight, let alone an international event

T100 wrote: »

The fact that he missed the first knockdown punch is a tribute to Poonsawat's speed and agility. Most people didn't see it until the replay.
Bernard certainly didn't see it and he was a lot closer than Jimmy.

i didn't see it the first time either, but having said that.. it is time for Jimmy to step down, his over-biased commentary & analysis is cringeworthy which usually ends up in him putting the jinx on people

PirateShampoo

Poonsawat points win

john47832 wrote: »

I was not giving his opponents any more credit - opponents records are there for all to see

I was pointing out the bulls**t opinion you posted which was attempted to be dressed up as fact

everyone is entitled to post opinion - however if you attempt to dress it up as fact then, as I have previously said, be prepared to feel stupid

Take a look at his pro record and show me how its bull****?

And drop the personnal stuff, if you cant debate something without getting all worked up stop posting.

mark renton

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

PirateShampoo wrote: »

I don't think he was pushed had enough at the start of his run, he fought countless nobody's who he blow away in a round or 2.

would you like to factualize what you are talking about here?

PirateShampoo

Poonsawat points win

john47832 wrote: »

would you like to factualize what you are talking about here?

Click the link or would you like me to copy and paste?


http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=081166&cat=boxer

mark renton

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

Ahh I see - I was giving you credit for being just a little stupid, seems I was being generous

your talking about his first 7 fights??

so you think he should have fought the likes vasquez on his debut?

walshb

Well, was at my forst pro bout last night and the place was certainly buzzing.
Great atmosphere, but disappointing end to a decent 3 rd scrap.

Everyone knows that I have been critical of Dunne as a top pro and when one
analyses his career, one cannot help but see the holes. Th guy fought his heart out last night and wasn't disgraced. He simply hasn't the chin, strength or punch resistance to compete against the best in the division.

He even looks weak at the weight. Folks were getting far too confident due to the win over Cordoba. The man who impressed me in that win was Dunne, not Cordoba. I wasn't impressed with Ricardo However, he still had Dunne on queer street several times, ad he is not a puncher.

I knew deep down that Dunne was doomed once he met anyone with
a good punch. He met Kiko and the excuse was that he was caught cold.

Well, the near loss to Voronin should have alarmed many. He came back ater Kiko with three decent wns against poor opposition and then met
Cordoba. Had Cordoba been a puncher, or had he the accuracy he would have taken Dunne out.

The masses there last night was something to behold and the pressure on Bernard must have been immense. See, most there last night IMO weren't real fight fans. I admire Bernard for the ability to give his all in there.

The writing was on the wall from the first bell. PK was pushing Dunne back for the whole three rds and I knew Bernard would have to take him out, because he wasn't going to go 12 at that pace, AND on the back foot.

During the second rd PK started to get to Dunne and in the third it was all over. I still want to watch it on tv, as although I could see form Block J, it wasn't as clear as the tv will show. Was I mpressed wit PK? Well, he isn'ta boxer. He is a strong come forward puncher whom
I think loses to Lopez or Vasquez or Marquez rather easily. He has strength and a good punch, and this
is bad for Bernard

rich1874

Dunne points win

If it's any consolation to Dunne, he was beaten by the best bantamweight figther to come along in a very long time( since vasquez maybe). And i don't agree with people saying Dunne had it too soft early on, you fight what's put in front of you and the Bantamweight division has been a pretty weak division for years. If there can be any critiscism of Dunne(and it would be a shame to tear him apart considering all he's done for Irish boxing), it's that when things started to unravel in the third round he did what he absolutely should not have done, and that is start swinging hooks and walking on to punches. He didn't use his jab and his telling height advantage to any good effect and deserved to be knocked out. And Poonsawat knew he had the fight in the bag from minute one(supplemented by holding his hands in the air as he walked back to his corner in 1 and 2), he was just waiting for Dunne to panic and start swinging completey unnecessary punches.

As for the commentary team they were pretty disgraceful. I've been a big fan of Jimmy Mcgee for a long time. But last night his bias was cringeworthy, and he called Bernard Dunne's second knock down 'one of those phantom knockdowns' even though it was plain for all to see he was absolutely floored by a left hook. And that other Dave 'boy' chap was equally bad.

By the way anyone know if you can watch it again on RTE.ie?

walshb

PirateShampoo wrote: »

And your trying to give his opponents more credit than they are due, Dunne isnt a world class boxer and wont be remembered out side of Ireland. Alot of his fights where against below par fighters who where put infront of him to put on a show for the paying mass's.

Now i know your feelings are hurt because your man got knocked out but try not to get personnal.

His opponents were not world class, not crap, but not great. I think a middle ground needs to be reached. Cordoba was the one top ten fighter Bernard beat and to me, I wasn't impressed with Cordoba. Far too many other bouts against average guys and all hyped up.

rich1874

Dunne points win

Nevermind, you can watch it on rte player on rte.ie.

Donny_DMC

walshb wrote: »

His opponents were not world class, not crap, but not great. I think a middle ground needs to be reached. Cordoba was the one top ten fighter Bernard beat and to me, I wasn't impressed with Cordoba. Far too many other bouts against average guys and all hyped up.

Whilst I agree with the primary content I feel I do have to raise one point- Cordoba did hold a win over Celestino Caballero, the legitimate No.1 in the enforced absence of Israel Vasquez.


I've joined this thread extremely late, but in skimming through I think the boxing fraternity had already realised that Dunne was a product of media propaganda and Peter's promotion. He's not a bad guy, but it was inevitable that once he faced a legitimate threat he would be heavily beaten.

Much lesser fighters in Voronin, Walstad, Faccio and even the aged Machado had all nearly proved Dunne's undoing;
It was lucky that Dunne never stepped in to face the likes of Vasquez, Rafael Marquez, the aforementioned Caballero or the Canadian Molitor.

Still I wish him luck, he can surely mount a couple of comeback fights which will allow him to make him some nice money for his lovely family.

walshb

The win over Caballero was in 2004. Like I said, Cordoba was rated, but in now way the best in the division. I had Bernard to beat Cordoba if he could avoid the consistent shots. Cordoba was simply not up to world champion material IMO. The guy gassed in the end, something Dunne himself alluded to.

The win over Ricardo was a great performnace from Dunne, it showed heart and guts and improved stamina and strength, but when one analyses it, it is clear that Bernard still had the weak chin and was going to beaten by any puncher. Cordoba was not a reat puncher and was terribly inaccurate.

Dunne has limitations, and too many to be world best. There are guys in the division like Ponce, Ruiz , Escalante, Lopez, Caballero who would simply blow through him. Add in PK and Vasquez and Marquez and Bernard just doesn't cut it at the top level

Donny_DMC

walshb wrote: »

The win over Caballero was in 2004. Like I said, Cordoba was rated, but in now way the best in the division. I had Bernard to beat Cordoba if he could avoid the consistent shots. Cordoba was simply not up to world champion material IMO. The guy gassed in the end, something Dunne himself alluded to.

The win over Ricardo was a great performnace from Dunne, it showed heart and guts and improved stamina and strength, but when one analyses it, it is clear that Bernard still had the weak chin and was going to beaten by any puncher. Cordoba was not a reat puncher and was terribly inaccurate.

Dunne has limitations, and too many to be world best. There are guys in the division like Ponce, Ruiz , Escalante, Lopez, Caballero who would simply blow through him. Add in PK and Vasquez and Marquez and Bernard just doesn't cut it at the top level

A win over Caballero in any year is significant.
I thoroughly agree that Cordoba was far from the best man at 122 and I agree he did not signify an actual World Champ.

I think you raise a point that many of the overly-faithful miss; Dunne barely beat Cordoba, he was within a hair of being taken out himself and a more mature Cordoba may well have done it.

Its a deep division. I feel it may be open for Rafael Marquez to take over, if rumours that Vasquez and Caballero are moving to feather are true.
Juanma is going to be a superstar I feel

mark renton

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

Donny_DMC wrote: »

I think you raise a point that many of the overly-faithful miss; Dunne barely beat Cordoba, he was within a hair of being taken out himself and a more mature Cordoba may well have done it.

Also a point to note that Bernard nearly ended Cordoba in 3 rounds, and had it not been for the clash of heads could possibly have made for a much easier fight

super_metroid

Bernard Dunne spars with youngster !


2 minutes later......

walshb

john47832 wrote: »

Also a point to note that Bernard nearly ended Cordoba in 3 rounds, and had it not been for the clash of heads could possibly have made for a much easier fight

Yes, good point, and proves that Ricardo really wasn't WC material.
I mean, Dunne can throw a shot, but he's not a hitter. Dunne was
even shocked when that shot landed and knocked down Ricardo.

Had Cordoba been a hitter with accuracy, rd 6 would not hace come for Dunne. It's swings and roundabouts.

Look, Caballero was the WBA champ at 122 and the WBA created this fictitious second world belt that Cordoba won by beating a rather average
fighter. This is the sad state that boxing is in. 5 or 6 lads claiming to be the worlds champion. Sad.

Call Me Jimmy

Poonsawat points win

Poonsawat looked absolutely class. It was just a matter of time until he closed him down and even though I think dunne could have ran away a little more, he would have only been getting himself a few extra rounds I think.

Would like to see tyson fury(sp?) fighting without an injury. I dunno if it was the bad technique that caused the injury or the injury that caused the bad technique but he looks like he has some power!

Brian Peters has alot to answer for,he is the main reason for this ill will towards Dunne.

The prick charges a minimum of 50 euro to watch Dunne fight tomato cans,ads on radio proclaim the greatest night in boxing history.

People who actually know anything about boxing,stare at the tv in disbelief when these fights take place,you can be sure they werent paying to watch.

It actually feels looking at his career that alot of his fans have been ripped off and mislead,because 90% of the people there,dont have a clue about boxing and actually believed he was the best in the world and he has been fighting the best fighters in his division all of this time.


Hopefully Peters crawls back into whatever hole he came from.
I cant remember whether it was Moloney or Warren,but I rememeber one of them talking about how he has no clue,is a joke in negotiations and very little boxing knowledge etc.Hopefully he doesnt ever gets his hands on another fighter.

but1er

Dunne points win

Mr. Miyagi teached the karate kid well

Spiritoftheseventies

Rey Whining Self-confidence wrote: »

Brian Peters has alot to answer for,he is the main reason for this ill will towards Dunne.

The prick charges a minimum of 50 euro to watch Dunne fight tomato cans,ads on radio proclaim the greatest night in boxing history.

People who actually know anything about boxing,stare at the tv in disbelief when these fights take place,you can be sure they werent paying to watch.

It actually feels looking at his career that alot of his fans have been ripped off and mislead,because 90% of the people there,dont have a clue about boxing and actually believed he was the best in the world and he has been fighting the best fighters in his division all of this time.


Hopefully Peters crawls back into whatever hole he came from.
I cant remember whether it was Moloney or Warren,but I rememeber one of them talking about how he has no clue,is a joke in negotiations and very little boxing knowledge etc.Hopefully he doesnt ever gets his hands on another fighter.

Sutherlands family apparently not talking to Frank Warren. Assume Dunne's clan still talking to Peters. Either way, Dunne has always been looked after well. His team. got him back on his feet after last defeat. Sutherland's dad found out four hours later about his son while news was all over internet. Not a very good indictment on Sutherland's management team I would think.

bayviewclose

bayviewclose wrote: »

Sutherlands family apparently not talking to Frank Warren. Assume Dunne's clan still talking to Peters. Either way, Dunne has always been looked after well. His team. got him back on his feet after last defeat. Sutherland's dad found out four hours later about his son while news was all over internet. Not a very good indictment on Sutherland's management team I would think.

Yeah that was a major cockup but it really has nothing to do with the promoting of fights though.

Liamario

Poonsawat points win

T100 wrote: »

The fact that he missed the first knockdown punch is a tribute to Poonsawat's speed and agility. Most people didn't see it until the replay.
Bernard certainly didn't see it and he was a lot closer than Jimmy.

Man, I saw that punch clear as bloody crystal. It wasn't particularly quick or strong, but the camera had a perfect view of it. Fair enough, McGee may not have had an angle on the punch, but if you were watching it on tv, you really should have seen it.

Danye

bayviewclose wrote: »

Sutherlands family apparently not talking to Frank Warren. Assume Dunne's clan still talking to Peters. Either way, Dunne has always been looked after well. His team. got him back on his feet after last defeat. Sutherland's dad found out four hours later about his son while news was all over internet. Not a very good indictment on Sutherland's management team I would think.

Just to point out, its Frank Moloney that was Darrens manager...

T-K-O

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

I'm very disappointed but not really that surprised. I've always said that Dunne needed to fight his game against the better guys in the division.

I'm more disappointed for Dunne on a personal level, I think a win last night would have guaranteed a payday to retire from.

While Dunne's body shape has improved in the last 18 months he still looks weak at the weight. His opponents always appear ripped and comfortable at the weight, Dunne IMO just looks skinny.

I've been told he makes the weight comfortably but I dont believe it and I remember when he was in the states he fought as a feather weight, 8 years on hes fighting at super ban.

This is irrelevant when we discuss last nights bout, but if Dunne is to come back he should really consider moving up.

Running Bing

Rey Whining Self-confidence wrote: »

Brian Peters has alot to answer for,he is the main reason for this ill will towards Dunne.

The prick charges a minimum of 50 euro to watch Dunne fight tomato cans,ads on radio proclaim the greatest night in boxing history.

People who actually know anything about boxing,stare at the tv in disbelief when these fights take place,you can be sure they werent paying to watch.

It actually feels looking at his career that alot of his fans have been ripped off and mislead,because 90% of the people there,dont have a clue about boxing and actually believed he was the best in the world and he has been fighting the best fighters in his division all of this time.


Hopefully Peters crawls back into whatever hole he came from.
I cant remember whether it was Moloney or Warren,but I rememeber one of them talking about how he has no clue,is a joke in negotiations and very little boxing knowledge etc.Hopefully he doesnt ever gets his hands on another fighter.

Peters has fvck all to answer for.


He has a job to do and he does it impeccably. He essentially got Dunne a world championship belt by fighting a lot of quite soft opponents in his own back yard. He made himself and Dunne a lot of money in the process and he always packs the o2 out.


The prices are an absolute p1ss take....thats why I dont pay it but plenty of people seem happy to pay it and if thats the case why should he take money out of his own pocket and Dunnes pocket by charging less? (not to mention the large gates help in attracting opponents to actually come here and fight).

FrankGrimes

I was absolutely gutted for Bernard last night. I just couldn't see how this opponent was right for him and I hoped against hope that it wouldn't end the way it did. Devastated for him. I'll forever be greatful to Bernard for some of the great nights he gave us, in particular the buzz in the stadium for the Cordoba fight will stay with me for a long time.

I generally try and gauge an athlete's delivery on their potential and that is the main thing I use to form my opinion of them. For example, Kevin Kilbane is a footballer with limited skills but has managed to have a lengthy career in the top flight of football = over achiever. Jimmy White clearly had the skills to win world titles but didn't have the mentality and never did it = under achiever. Sonia O'Sullivan had the talent to win Olympic gold but didn't, though that was largely due to a Romanian drug cheat so is a bad example. David Gillick getting 6th in World Champs 400m: I heard several people mock him for 'almost coming last' whereas what he did was really quite exceptional.

When I make an honest assessment of it, despite my huge admiration of Bernard, I never thought a strong case could be made to say he clearly had the talent that should automatically lead to a world title. And forget what belt it was, he did that, he managed to over achieve and win a world title. How any of these keyboard warriors can have anything but respect for the man after that is beyond me and says more about those people than it does about Bernard.

I was heartened by the first round and was hoping Bernard could keep Poonsawat at that length for 4 or 5 rounds and then hope that PK's punches might have had a little bit of power sapped from them so he could exchange a few every now and then and then get back to the outside. But in reality, PK was just getting a feel for Bernard's punches and once he felt Bernard couldn't hurt him, the outcome was inevitable. I really don't see how Bernard could beat this guy even in a rematch. There may be something to the suggestions that with a 13 week training camp he was over-trained and I agree that he looked skinny rather than lean, featherweight seems more and more to be his natural weight.

I was screaming at the TV for Bernard to use the full ring after the first knockdown in particular. He neither ran away or tried to cling on like Macklin's opponent did on Friday - he was caught in the no man's land that is the last place you want to be in that situation. But most people that have actually boxed and have actually been knocked out or been close to it know that comments like 'his corner were to blame' or 'he was far to cocky going back after him when he got up' are misinformed at best. The reality is that definitely after the second knockdown, Bernard's eyes showed the telltale signs of that darkness that comes over your eyes in those situations. It's pretty hard to even hear or see anything when your brain has been shaken like that, let alone have your wits about you to move away promptly.

Whether you think he was lucky to get there, or if he could or should get back to that level (can't see it happening), there is no denying that the man was a World Champion and he can be proud of himself for that. But forgetting about the discussion on how he stacks up against other champions, it is the following speech that he gave immediately after the most painful and humiliating experience in his professional career that to me shows what a true champion Bernard Dunne is:

Bernard Dunne:
It's a tough time for Ireland at the moment, and Irish boxing people especially, with the passing of Darren and with Ireland generally in a tough place. I wanted so badly to lift the mood and give people a bit of joy.

Even if you don't rate the guy compared to the top level champions, surely he deserves respect?

T-K-O

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

FrankGrimes wrote: »

I was absolutely gutted for Bernard last night. I just couldn't see how this opponent was right for him and I hoped against hope that it wouldn't end the way it did. Devastated for him. I'll forever be greatful to Bernard for some of the great nights he gave us, in particular the buzz in the stadium for the Cordoba fight will stay with me for a long time.

I generally try and gauge an athlete's delivery on their potential and that is the main thing I use to form my opinion of them. For example, Kevin Kilbane is a footballer with limited skills but has managed to have a lengthy career in the top flight of football = over achiever. Jimmy White clearly had the skills to win world titles but didn't have the mentality and never did it = under achiever. Sonia O'Sullivan had the talent to win Olympic gold but didn't, though that was largely due to a Romanian drug cheat so is a bad example. David Gillick getting 6th in World Champs 400m: I heard several people mock him for 'almost coming last' whereas what he did was really quite exceptional.

When I make an honest assessment of it, despite my huge admiration of Bernard, I never thought a strong case could be made to say he clearly had the talent that should automatically lead to a world title. And forget what belt it was, he did that, he managed to over achieve and win a world title. How any of these keyboard warriors can have anything but respect for the man after that is beyond me and says more about those people than it does about Bernard.

I was heartened by the first round and was hoping Bernard could keep Poonsawat at that length for 4 or 5 rounds and then hope that PK's punches might have had a little bit of power sapped from them so he could exchange a few every now and then and then get back to the outside. But in reality, PK was just getting a feel for Bernard's punches and once he felt Bernard couldn't hurt him, the outcome was inevitable. I really don't see how Bernard could beat this guy even in a rematch. There may be something to the suggestions that with a 13 week training camp he was over-trained and I agree that he looked skinny rather than lean, featherweight seems more and more to be his natural weight.

I was screaming at the TV for Bernard to use the full ring after the first knockdown in particular. He neither ran away or tried to cling on like Macklin's opponent did on Friday - he was caught in the no man's land that is the last place you want to be in that situation. But most people that have actually boxed and have actually been knocked out or been close to it know that comments like 'his corner were to blame' or 'he was far to cocky going back after him when he got up' are misinformed at best. The reality is that definitely after the second knockdown, Bernard's eyes showed the telltale signs of that darkness that comes over your eyes in those situations. It's pretty hard to even hear or see anything when your brain has been shaken like that, let alone have your wits about you to move away promptly.

Whether you think he was lucky to get there, or if he could or should get back to that level (can't see it happening), there is no denying that the man was a World Champion and he can be proud of himself for that. But forgetting about the discussion on how he stacks up against other champions, it is the following speech that he gave immediately after the most painful and humiliating experience in his professional career that to me shows what a true champion Bernard Dunne is:



Even if you don't rate the guy compared to the top level champions, surely he deserves respect?

Excellent post. The guy has put his life into the sport and brought boxing back onto our TV screens. I was at every Dunne fight in Ireland a few abroad. I've nothing but respect for the guy. If top ten is his limit there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Guys on here are to quick to criticize, and lets be honest only a few know what their talking about the rest just love to see guys fall.

c1979

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

Fair play to Bernard. He brought the Irish people a EBU and World title.

He was fighting for his fans last night and that was is downfall, he should have been boring and ran for the whole fight.

There are alot of haters out there especially outside of Dublin who love it when Bernard gets KO'ed. To be honest I think Bernard should pack it in he can't take a punch and will never operate at World Class level.

He may move up to feather but you have to ask the question why did he move down in the first place so I doubt this is on the cards.

I just want to thank Bernard for entertaining me for the last 10 years from the satdium as an amateur to the new point as a pro.

Best of luck in the future (hopefully outside the ring)

DonkeyStyle \o/

Poonsawat points win

walshb wrote: »

See, most there last night IMO weren't real fight fans.

Aye, did anyone else notice all the booing during the fighter entrances?! It was like a feckin WWE smackdown event or something.
IIRC the opponents of both Dunne and Fury were both met with boo's and stony silence... I couldn't believe it... there aren't any "bad guys" here folks, they're professional athletes, show a bit of respect.

Spiritoftheseventies

Danye wrote: »

Just to point out, its Frank Moloney that was Darrens manager...

Yes got my two franks confused. But point still applies. Brian Peters still got Dunne a shot at the title in a relatively short time after Dunne had suffered his first defeat. From what I read, Sutherland had been sidelined a bit and I think the way his team handled things particularly with regards to his family does not look good for them.
Lets not be too harsh on Peters. End of the day, he got the bums on the seats and without him who knows if Dunne would have been as successful.
It was sad for Dunne last night but how many can say they had a title belt in their possession at one stage in their career. Not many.

Dangerous Man

I think WalshB's analysis is spot on. I've always liked Bernard but he's never really fought anybody truly world-class. Perhaps Cordoba was world-class but he was also naive in the fight against Bernard. Cordoba should really have won that fight. PK showed up Bernard's weaknesses. Bernard should have been holding on for dear life in the 3rd insteadof stupidly swiging for the fences. I think it's ridiculous that Peters wanted to put Bernard in against Vasquez. It would have been a massacre. Having said all of that - I don't think he should quit. He might get one more shot, who knows?

efb

bayviewclose wrote: »

It was sad for Dunne last night but how many can say they had a title belt in their possession at one stage in their career. Not many.

Far too many IMHO.

WBwhatnow???

T-K-O

Other - no contest, draw, technical draw etc

Dangerous Man wrote: »

I think WalshB's analysis is spot on. I've always liked Bernard but he's never really fought anybody truly world-class. Perhaps Cordoba was world-class but he was also naive in the fight against Bernard. Cordoba should really have won that fight. PK showed up Bernard's weaknesses. Bernard should have been holding on for dear life in the 3rd insteadof stupidly swiging for the fences. I think it's ridiculous that Peters wanted to put Bernard in against Vasquez. It would have been a massacre. Having said all of that - I don't think he should quit. He might get one more shot, who knows?

Is a top ten fighter not world class ?

Spiritoftheseventies

Danye wrote: »

Just to point out, its Frank Moloney that was Darrens manager...

Yes got my two franks confused. But point still applies. Brian Peters still got Dunne a shot at the title in a relatively short time after Dunne had suffered his first defeat. From what I read, Sutherland had been sidelined a bit and I think the way his team handled things particularly with regards to his family does not look good for them.
Lets not be too harsh on Peters. End of the day, he got the bums on the seats and without him who knows if Dunne would have been as successful.
It was sad for Dunne last night but how many can say they had a title belt in their possession at one stage in their career. Not many.