Should Turbo be banned at our Ranbats?

Cunny-Funt

Agreed kirby although I don't presume pads are 'better' or the more evolved version of the old arcade sticks for SF, I am of the opinion that ultimately a stick probably is the best tool for the game, its more to do with the evolution of WHERE these games are played, in other words the move from the old arcades to the consoles, and the fact that these two scenes merge together and some stick users need to get over the fact that these games are not made JUST for them any more. Its about allowing users from 2 different origins to play the same game. And trust me I'm am being low key

Although I'd like to clarify one thing. Its not about making it 'easier'. Its about making it as 'difficult/easy' as its meant to be for the user. The command of PPP or KKK is not supposed to be a difficult thing to do, but the layout of a pad makes it more so then it should be (however more so being debatable), its STILL more so thus PPP and KKK button bindings were added.

& btw pad users have to deal with pressing these buttons with the same hand that does the input motions, where as stick users don't.

**edit** ah kirbys post is changed a bit now from when I posted this so it might not make sense but screw it. lol.

mr_kyle

@ Cunny-Funt

Well that was quite a rant.

The last two events I have ran have allowed button binding.

*edit*

BTW I noticed you did not address that our (Northern Irelands) current best player up here is a pad player who does not use binding. It is hardly elitism when I can see with my own two eyes that a good player our best player doesn't need to use binding on a pad.

Kirby

mr_kyle wrote: »

The last two events I have ran have allowed button binding.

mr_kyle wrote: »

Both turbo and button bindings are banned up here.

mr_kyle

Rules for ranking battles and one off events differ Kirby. The last two one off events I've tried to catch a more casual crowd.

*edit*

Since how things are run up here seems to be of great interest and not on topic on this current thread. If anyone has any more questions about NI event rules, please make a thread.

Azza

Easy on there Cunny. You'd swear a stick user repeatedly ran over your dog or something. Mr_Klye has stated the best player up North is a pad user so he's clearly not dissing pad users and is clearly not an 'arcade stick elitist'. He like many others feal that button binding takes away from the skill required to play the game regardless of the user being pad or stick based, which is his opinion to and he's entitled to it so please respect that. Personally I don't think its necessarily encourages laziness, some people from a console background and new to the fighting games would not even be thinking about such things. Its what they are use to and maybe perhaps be reluctant to change. Its the default setting in game so they just used it as it is. The benefit of the in games binds is extremely small and is an in game feature of SF IV so for that reason I don't think it should be banned. Turbo could potentially give a much bigger advantage so its a much more obvious choice for banning.


I do believe a stick is a better control system and that players (myself included) handicap themselves on a 8 button stick but using the 2 additional buttons. While it does make the rather simply matter of pressing of 2 or 3 buttons even easier, the extra distance your fingers has to travel hurts execution. But ultimately the benefit is so small I can't really imaging it being enough of difference to change the outcome of a match between two players.

NeoKubrick wrote:

We're on the subject of the tournament stick, now, Azza. Keep up.

Thats the subject I was on, I was talking about my TE stick. No slacking from me.

NeoKubrick wrote:

Kudos to whomever changed the name from the dire 'Irish Ranking Battles' to Inferno Ranbat, by the way.

Thanks. The name is a reference to the insane heat upstairs in the XGC. Don't think it was ever officially called Irish Ranking Battles, just used that for thread title I think.

Anyway we are sorting or wondering too far off topic. So lets get back to discussing turbo or just move on.

Cunny-Funt

Azza wrote: »

Easy on there Cunny. You'd swear a stick user repeatedly ran over your dog or something.

Well...sniff..I really miss Mr.Tinkels. He was the best damn dog a guy could have

Look I laid out my argument with some thought out points as to clearly give a background to my point of view. People can just dismiss all my points as a rant if they want. But I was making my case.

Just because it was said the best player up there uses a pad, doesn't negate the continual insinuations that pad players who use bindings are scrubish casuals and not good players.

And tourneys that allow bindings = casual tourneys only.

My point is being ignored, I'm not saying Arcade Stick elitism is someone who's totally against Pads, its about refusing to acknowledge the change in times, and insisting that pad users play the game with the very same setup as arcade stick users, despite the fact the game is not meant to be played on a pad with the very same set up as stick users.


In my opinion this is arcade stick elitism and I am also entitled to my opinion. Kyle I'm not trying to insult you by using that term, I mean no disrespect, I'm just laying out my argument and giving my point of view. This is the impression your giving me from your posts in this thread. I'm not attacking you just expressing my opinions on your opinions.

Banning pad users from using ppp and kkk bindings is arcade stick elitism, that's my opinion. Please don't take offense to that.

NeoKubrick wrote: »

Kudos to whomever changed the name from the dire 'Irish Ranking Battles' to Inferno Ranbat, by the way.

What was do dire about it? Unimaginative alright, but dire? I do love the new name though.

Kirby

Well I wanted "Sweaty Smell No Windows Ranbat" but Inferno was probably simpler

K.O.Kiki

I think Azza suggested the name at like 3am, and I was like "sure, whatever".

mr_kyle

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

Look I laid out my argument with some thought out points as to clearly give a background to my point of view. People can just dismiss all my points as a rant if they want. But I was making my case.

If you laid out your argument with some thought then why do you give answers to statements or questions I never made? Why do you say people when you mean me?

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

Just because it was said the best player up there uses a pad, doesn't negate the continual insinuations that pad players who use bindings are scrubish casuals and not good players.

You have taken this well out of context for a reason I can not fathom. The USA tournaments allow binding and I'm sure most of there players are better than the NI crowd. Infact, I'm sure there are loads of fantastic players out there that do! I do not think that using binding = a bad player, I did not say that at all. You read something I did not intend into it.

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

And tourneys that allow bindings = casual tourneys only.

Evo and SVB used / are using binding, are they casual tournaments? I do not think you thought that one out very well.

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

My point is being ignored, I'm not saying Arcade Stick elitism is someone who's totally against Pads, its about refusing to acknowledge the change in times,

Please note I did say that the two most recent events allowed binding. If the players up here want button binding, that is what they will get. How did you decide this?

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

and insisting that pad users play the game with the very same setup as arcade stick users, despite the fact the game is not meant to be played on a pad with the very same set up as stick users.

Well, allowing bindings for just pads introduces double standards. One set of rules for one group, with another set of rules for the other = double standards.

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

In my opinion this is arcade stick elitism and I am also entitled to my opinion. Kyle I'm not trying to insult you by using that term, I mean no disrespect, I'm just laying out my argument and giving my point of view. This is the impression your giving me from your posts in this thread. I'm not attacking you just expressing my opinions on your opinions.

Your opinion about me is well wrong. Your decisions about me are based on what you think I think rather than on work that I have done for the community up here. As I have previously stated, in your multi quote post you answer questions / statements I don't even make!

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

Banning pad users from using ppp and kkk bindings is arcade stick elitism, that's my opinion. Please don't take offense to that.

In the last season of RBs up here button binding were banned regardless of controller choice. So, it was not just pad users who could not bind. It is fair because it applies to everyone. It doesn't effect pad players more because our best player up here is a pad player. He whoops the stick users, myself and Mike included. I've stated this all before, I can not make it any clearer.

I would take offense to it if any of your points about me were actually valid. As it stands the best I can do is correct you.

In summation;

1 - Even though I do not like it, I do not think pad players that use bindings are scrubby.

2 - I am not against button binding it tournaments, as shown by the previous two events I have ran.

Cunny please take anything else to PM.

*edit*

Can this please be locked?

Cunny-Funt

mr_kyle wrote: »

If you laid out your argument with some thought then why do you give answers to statements or questions I never made? Why do you say people when you mean me?

I was arguing against the idea that people using the bindings on pads were at an advantage for the moves that require those bindings versus those using sticks. Since your against bindings for pad users I assumed that you were of the opposite view.

I was also was making the case on fingers needed etc etc to press the 3 punches or 3 kicks on a pad, and this is something you brought up no?

And lastly although you might have used the word 'rant' you were not the only one to dismiss my points.

mr_kyle wrote: »

You have taken this well out of context for a reason I can not fathom. The USA tournaments allow binding and I'm sure most of there players are better than the NI crowd. Infact, I'm sure there are loads of fantastic players out there that do! I do not think that using binding = a bad player, I did not say that at all. You read something I did not intend into it.

You said "good players don't use bindings". Is it that hard to fathom that from that statement I might have gotten the impression that your opinion is that those that use bindings are then...bad players? Fair enough if that's not what you intented to mean. But it was a logical conclusion.

mr_kyle wrote: »

Evo and SVB used / are using binding, are they casual tournaments? I do not think you thought that one out very well.

This was the exact point I was making, you mentioned a few times that you'd run 'casual' tourneys to appease the players that want to bind. But when you run 'skillful' tournys, no bindings allowed.

Yet events such as Evo do allow bindings and are considered skillful. Thus it seemed to me that just you yourself viewed bindings as something only the casual/new players use.

mr_kyle wrote: »

Please note I did say that the two most recent events allowed binding. If the players up here want button binding, that is what they will get. How did you decide this?

It was in reference once again to the ideas behind why bindings should not be allowed (pad players should use the same set up as stick players thinking) I was explaining what I view arcade stick elitism as in that sentence.

mr_kyle wrote: »

Well, allowing bindings for just pads introduces double standards. One set of rules for one group, with another set of rules for the other = double standards.

Agree to disagree I suppose.

mr_kyle wrote: »

Your opinion about me is well wrong. Your decisions about me are based on what you think I think rather than on work that I have done for the community up here. As I have previously stated, in your multi quote post you answer questions / statements I don't even make!

Fair enough, and yes my opinion as I already said comes from your posts in this thread. I tried to explain here where I got these impressions. I good trawl though your posts and post particular sentences but I don't wanna argue with you. You say I've misunderstood you? Fair enough, but I didn't get my misunderstandings from thin air.

mr_kyle wrote: »

In the last season of RBs up here button binding were banned regardless of controller choice. So, it was not just pad users who could not bind. It is fair because it applies to everyone. It doesn't effect pad players more because our best player up here is a pad player.

I highly disagree with this reasoning. But thats your opinion. Fair enough. Imo, A: pads aint as universal as sticks in terms of button layout shape etc etc. B: just cause one guy is good at pressing the ppp kkks on his particular pad doesnt make it as easy for everyone as pressing those buttons on a stick is for stick users. Not arguing just explaining my reasoning.

mr_kyle wrote: »

1 - Even though I do not like it, I do not think pad players that use bindings are scrubby.

Fair enough.

mr_kyle wrote: »

2 - I am not against button binding it tournaments, as shown by the previous two events I have ran.

Fair enough also, but you did say in post 66 that you were for banning them. So I don't think my impressions, even if they were wrong, where that unreasonable given what you said.

mr_kyle wrote: »

Cunny please take anything else to PM.

No need man, its just a discussion, its all good.

If you say your not something, I wont disagree with you but I at least should be able to show you how I came to that impression no?

Anyways peace man.

mr_kyle

Cunny-Funt wrote: »

Anyways peace man.

You know what? I'm really glad you said this. The one difference we have in reasoning clearly isn't a problem imo. But also you are right in that a couple of my phrases are a bit harsh - despite not meaning to infer anything. I appreciate what you said chap, thanks.

Cunny-Funt

Cool. I wasnt looking for a flame war , I don't wanna see that pop up on these forums, I do like discussing this stuff and I do come across pretty blunt at times, its just the way I type/am. Of course, I've had discussions on this topic before with people who were very anti joypad anything, pure arcade stick elitists like, and I probably saw a few things you said and projected the assumption that you were one of those characters I've encounterd before.

You know how it is with the internet. :rolleyes: