The Angelus

Zillah

Dades wrote: »

shook up some hysteria and made it sound like church burnings were next on the secular agenda.

*kicks notepad under desk*

What?! No, no, of course not...

robindch

Malari wrote: »

Don't know, but my cat has bell-phobia. When the angeles comes on she runs around with her belly on the ground. She is terrified.

Ok, she's a cat, but have you tried feeding her after the angelus?

Malari

robindch wrote: »

Ok, she's a cat, but have you tried feeding her after the angelus?

She already has to comfort eat afterwards. :pac: it's a very traumatic experience on the whole.

Goduznt Xzst

Zillah wrote: »

Seeing a religious tradition constantly supported by publicly funded television and radio irks me

Rather than fight it, we should insist on having our own observance of silence while this plays in the background.

http://tmbgmilk.ytmnd.com/

robindch wrote: »

Ok, she's a cat, but have you tried feeding her after the angelus?

Reminded of this clip I watched recently

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eo7jcI8fAuI

CDfm

Mark Hamill wrote: »

RTE is owned by the state and the management is appointed by the government. This means any preference for any one religion displayed by RTE reflects on the government

RTE is governed by the Broadcasting Acts passed by the Oireachtas and its day to day activies are handled by the RTE Board.

So what other TV shows do you want dropped? Should we drop minority programming too.

philologos

Didn't RTÉ show Richard Dawkins' The Root of All Evil last year?

Turtwig

Jakkass wrote: »

Didn't RTÉ show Richard Dawkins' The Root of All Evil last year?

Yep, but they also showed a pro Intelligent Design documentary instead of Naked Science on a Sunday...now that is inexcusable!!:mad:

Nah no gripe against RTE, they generally accommodate all tastes fairly well
If only they just turned that Angulus into a reflection time thingy...

philologos

Some people argue that the Angelus already is a time of reflection. I guess, I'm so indifferent because I know I'll hear it on the way home from Maynooth anyway if I'm not at home :pac:

IM0

Zillah wrote: »

BONNNNGGG!


BONNNNGGG!


BONNNNGGG!


BONNNNGGG!


BONNNNGGG!


Get that shit off my TV please.

what! ohhhhh you meant the news

ChocolateSauce

CDfm wrote: »

RTE is governed by the Broadcasting Acts passed by the Oireachtas and its day to day activies are handled by the RTE Board.

So what other TV shows do you want dropped? Should we drop minority programming too.

Minorities actually exist, so no.

CDfm

ChocolateSauce wrote: »

Minorities actually exist, so no.

lets see.

We the majority are to drop the Angelus to appease minorities yet cant drop minority programming we dont like.

Thats great logic that is.:rolleyes:

Mark Hamill

CDfm wrote: »

lets see.

We the majority are to drop the Angelus to appease minorities yet cant drop minority programming we dont like.

Thats great logic that is.:rolleyes:

RTE isn't run for the majority, it is run for everyone. Dropping the angelus is the only choice since the "majority" dont seem to want to offer the minorities the same opportunity to put their religiously based dogma on tv for free.

Its got nothing to do with what anyone does or doesn't like, its about EQUALITY.

CDfm

Mark Hamill wrote: »

RTE isn't run for the majority, it is run for everyone. Dropping the angelus is the only choice since the "majority" dont seem to want to offer the minorities the same opportunity to put their religiously based dogma on tv for free.

Its got nothing to do with what anyone does or doesn't like, its about EQUALITY.

But you cant please everyone and everyone has different tastes. Gee whiz - if the Angelus offends you - parking outside churches while attending mass must make you apoplectic:p

Mark Hamill

CDfm wrote: »

But you cant please everyone and everyone has different tastes.

This has nothing to do with pleasing people, its about EQUALITY wether or not the pro-angelus agree with it or not. RTE is a state run business put in place to provide programming for everyone on the island, its not supposed to have a religious bias, wether or not there is a religious majority. Might as well say that RTE should only cater for women in its programming schedule as they are in the majority.

CDfm wrote: »

Gee whiz - if the Angelus offends you - parking outside churches while attending mass must make you apoplectic:p

The angelus doesn't offend me, its the religious discrimination in the state broadcaster that does.

Galvasean

The only way RTE will get rid of the Angelus is if a large enough Muslin 'rights' group kick up a huge stink and demand that their own prayers (sorry, the name escapes me) get broadcast too. This would open the floodgates for every religion to demand one, resulting in an 'all or none' decision to be made by RTE, where 'none' is the only feasible solution.

Also, RTE is paid for with taxpayers' money. Why should atheists, Muslims, Scientologists, Jews etc. have to pay for a Catholic service?

robindch

Galvasean wrote: »

Why should atheists, Muslims, Scientologists, Jews etc. have to pay for a Catholic service?

I wonder how the "let the market decide" policy proposed in the religious-education thread would work here.

Would you divide the Angelus up in proportion to the size of each religion? Or would you just add on bits, or change the background picture or sound track?

Would the atheists just have a white screen backed by white noise?

Ideas on a postcard please!

pts

robindch wrote: »

Would the atheists just have a white screen backed by white noise?

Ideas on a postcard please!

How about this on a continuous loop?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOyP44Xu5FA

kiffer

... Lads... picking battles is the way forward...

Secular/nonreligious oaths for judges and other positions: sensible
Making sure creationism is kept out of science classes: important
Complaining about 60 seconds of bell ringing and people looking thoughtful: waste of time, and makes you look more anti-theist than atheist

Dr Pepper

kiffer wrote: »

... Lads... picking battles is the way forward...

Secular/nonreligious oaths for judges and other positions: sensible
Making sure creationism is kept out of science classes: important
Complaining about 60 seconds of bell ringing and people looking thoughtful: waste of time, and makes you look more anti-theist than atheist

Good point, even though I have enjoyed the rant about the Angelus!

gaynorvader

TBH RTÉ turning the volume up on ads bothers me far more than some ringing bells, I just change the channel!

CDfm

Mark Hamill wrote: »

This has nothing to do with pleasing people, its about EQUALITY wether or not the pro-angelus agree with it or not.

So you want Muslim Prayer Time a few times a day. Arent you afraid that will open the doors for the rosary?

robindch wrote: »

Would the atheists just have a white screen backed by white noise?

Currently the Angelus has 1 minute and that is called the Good News. The Atheists have the terretorial news " The Bad News" is 59 mins. Brian Cowan who dominates it must be one of your bunch with the unholy mess the country is in.So the Angelus is only a tiny bit.

Stercus Accidit

CDfm wrote: »

So you want Muslim Prayer Time a few times a day. Arent you afraid that will open the doors for the rosary?

I'd personally be delighted if the only way the angelus could be played, was if an equal minute was dedicated to Islam, then Judaism, scientology, humanism, Buddhism etc. and watch the complaints roll in from the lapsed catholics!

Rondolfus

There's only one thing I hate more than people that believe in God and that's atheists...

"Oooh lets get rid of a few bells that make the old people happy...."

Its ironic that in this day and age its the people that don't believe in god that do most preaching.

ShooterSF

Rondolfus wrote: »

There's only one thing I hate more than people that believe in God and that's atheists...

So let me get this straight. Atheist's are top of your hate list, then people that believe in a god. Do serial killers come next?

Dades

Rondolfus wrote: »

Its ironic that in this day and age its the people that don't believe in god that do most preaching.

You've seen the "Down With The Angelus" posters and the campaign ads, then? Great!

Thanks for the generalisations, btw, do stop by again.

CDfm

Dades wrote: »

You've seen the "Down With The Angelus" posters and the campaign ads, then? Great!

Thanks for the generalisations, btw, do stop by again.

An Atheist Preacher promotes atheist beliefs.

Atheist Ireland for example fits that category.

Funglegunk

Stercus Accidit wrote: »

I'd personally be delighted if the only way the angelus could be played, was if an equal minute was dedicated to Islam, then Judaism, scientology, humanism, Buddhism etc. and watch the complaints roll in from the lapsed catholics!

How about this:

A minute of Angelus-like sequences catering to every religion broken down as follows:

Catholics - 52.4 seconds
Church of Ireland (.incl Protestant) - 1.7 seconds
Other Christian Religions - 0.4 seconds
Presbyterian - 0.3 seconds
Muslim (Islamic) - 0.5 seconds
Orthodox - 0.3 seconds
Methodist - 0.2 seconds
Other religions (perhaps a frame with all their logos, maybe that will appease them?) - 0.8 seconds
Atheists/Agnostics - 2.5 seconds
People who didn't state their religion on their census form (I assume they are Nazis) - 1 second

See, there is solution with compromise. Numbers from cso.ie btw.

Dades

CDfm wrote: »

An Atheist Preacher promotes atheist beliefs.

Atheist Ireland for example fits that category.

I'm sorry - you've lost me here.

gaynorvader

CDfm wrote: »

So you want Muslim Prayer Time a few times a day. Arent you afraid that will open the doors for the rosary?

There is quite a large portion of the population which appear as Catholics on the census, therefore it is logical for RTÉ to cater to these people, but illogical for them to cater for the small number of Muslims.

CDfm wrote:

Currently the Angelus has 1 minute and that is called the Good News. The Atheists have the terretorial news " The Bad News" is 59 mins. Brian Cowan who dominates it must be one of your bunch with the unholy mess the country is in.So the Angelus is only a tiny bit.

"The Bad News" as you label it has absolutely nothing to do with atheism exclusively. I don't know how you managed to equate something so ridiculous. The news is for everyone and usually spends a fair portion talking about religious news.

Mark Hamill

CDfm wrote: »

So you want Muslim Prayer Time a few times a day. Arent you afraid that will open the doors for the rosary?

I want whoever the programming on the tv is for to pay for it. If a muslim group wants to put the call to prayer on RTE and can pay for it, then why not?

CDfm wrote: »

Currently the Angelus has 1 minute and that is called the Good News. The Atheists have the terretorial news " The Bad News" is 59 mins. Brian Cowan who dominates it must be one of your bunch with the unholy mess the country is in.So the Angelus is only a tiny bit.

You are a troll and I'm always amazed at how you haven't been banned yet.

Dades

Mark Hamill wrote: »

You are a troll and I'm always amazed at how you haven't been banned yet.

We'll be the judges of who is trolling, thanks.

Mark Hamill

Dades wrote: »

We'll be the judges of who is trolling, thanks.

Sorry

Galvasean

CDfm wrote: »

Currently the Angelus has 1 minute and that is called the Good News. The Atheists have the terretorial news " The Bad News" is 59 mins. Brian Cowan who dominates it must be one of your bunch with the unholy mess the country is in.So the Angelus is only a tiny bit.

Ah yes, CDfm's patented "He's bad so must be an atheist" meme.
Funny how you would try lump Brian Cowen, the leader of Fianna Fail, an organisation with a 'special relationship with the Catholic Church, in with the atheists.

aidan24326

Rondolfus wrote: »

There's only one thing I hate more than people that believe in God and that's atheists...

"Oooh lets get rid of a few bells that make the old people happy...."

Its ironic that in this day and age its the people that don't believe in god that do most preaching.

You rather missed the point of this thread didn't you? Methinks this a hit and run though!

Flamed Diving

ChocolateSauce wrote: »

Let's not forget to mention that the Americans got their sh!t straight 222 years ago!

They sure did...

Flamed Diving

I don't see the point to the Angelus. Could someone (preferably a proponent) explain it's usefulness to me?

gaynorvader

Rondolfus wrote: »

There's only one thing I hate more than people that believe in God and that's atheists...

"Oooh lets get rid of a few bells that make the old people happy...."

Its ironic that in this day and age its the people that don't believe in god that do most preaching.

You realise you've included agnostics and members of non-Judo-Christian beliefs here, don't you? So, you hate all Christians and all Jews because they believe in God, and you believe everyone else does the most preaching, which I managed to glean that you have a strong dislike for from your post. Do you like anyone?

Flamed Diving wrote: »

They sure did...

They only changed to that motto relatively recently you know!

Galvasean

I see no Angelus defenders have answered my question yet so I'll say it again...

Why should I, as a non-Catholic have to pay for the Angelus (albeit indirectly)?

Cactus Col

Galvasean wrote: »

I see no Angelus defenders have answered my question yet so I'll say it again...

Why should I, as a non-Catholic have to pay for the Angelus (albeit indirectly)?

Why should I, as a non Irish speaker, have to pay for the Nuacht (albeit indirectly)?

This discussion comes up every once in a while on boards, and it's always pointless. Religious oaths are still required to be taken by those taking high offices on this little island. Surely that should be a far more pressing matter than the angelus.

I'm happy to regard the Angelus as a call to reflect on my day. It's clear by the imagery shown during it that this is how it should be interpreted.

So what if it had it's origins as a call to prayer. The angelus, like us, has evolved, and it's time for some in the IAC (the internet atheist community) to move on, and start looking forward.

Flamed Diving

gaynorvader wrote: »

They only changed to that motto relatively recently you know!

About 50 years ago. So they perhaps had their **** together for 150 years, then lost it in the 1950s.

Galvasean

Flamed Diving wrote: »

About 50 years ago. So they perhaps had their **** together for 150 years, then lost it in the 1950s.

Pretty much. War paranoia will do that.

CDfm

Galvasean wrote: »

Ah yes, CDfm's patented "He's bad so must be an atheist" meme
Funny how you would try lump Brian Cowen, the leader of Fianna Fail, an organisation with a 'special relationship with the Catholic Church, in with the atheists.

I try. What I am trying to do is put it in proportion to the programming on at the time and that its on for 1 minute out of 1440 per day.

Galvasean wrote: »

I see no Angelus defenders have answered my question yet so I'll say it again...

Why should I, as a non-Catholic have to pay for the Angelus (albeit indirectly)?

I pay for football programmes I dont watch. The real thing is that its down to tradition just like Sunday Mass on telly is for people who may be old or too ill to attend. In some areas you no longer have churches or church bells and it may provide a link to the tradition and give an isolated person a sence of community.

So I would say religious broadcasting of that type is aimed at the old and ill as a public service issue.

Another issue that is worth mentioning is that originally TVs and Radios were probably turned off by the faithfull and they stopped viewing to say the Angelus etc. This in turn would have affected viewing/listenership numbers and in turn advertising returns. So I am speculating but I imagine that it gives a type of ratings boost to RTE.It would be interesting to know the figures it brings in.

gaynorvader

CDfm wrote: »

I try. What I am trying to do is put it in proportion to the programming on at the time and that its on for 1 minute out of 1440 per day.
(...)

I think you may have missed his point. He was referring to your prejudice and discrimination of atheists with your comment that the country is in a mess because our leaders are atheist (something I don't even think is true).

Flamed Diving

gaynorvader wrote: »

I think you may have missed his point. He was referring to your prejudice and discrimination of atheists with your comment that the country is in a mess because our leaders are atheist (something I don't even think is true).

Gaynor, his magic tome says it is justified because we are lowly unbelievers. So I guess that's ok.

gaynorvader

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Gaynor, his magic tome says it is justified because we are lowly unbelievers. So I guess that's ok.

Actually, I believe his "magic tome" says something along the lines of "First remove the log from your own eye before attempting to remove the splinter from your neighbour's". Of course, I'm sure that's contradicted in some other part

toiletduck

Cactus Col wrote: »

Why should I, as a non Irish speaker, have to pay for the Nuacht (albeit indirectly)?

There's nothing in the RTE charter or any laws that I'm aware of, regarding endorsing one language over another (or lack thereof!). That would be the difference.

This discussion comes up every once in a while on boards, and it's always pointless. Religious oaths are still required to be taken by those taking high offices on this little island. Surely that should be a far more pressing matter than the angelus.

There is a campaign regarding that at the moment.

Flamed Diving

gaynorvader wrote: »

Actually, I believe his "magic tome" says something along the lines of "First remove the log from your own eye before attempting to remove the splinter from your neighbour's". Of course, I'm sure that's contradicted in some other part

Ah, yeah. I think in Romans 21:2

First remove the splinter from your neighbours eye before attempting to remove the log from yours"

But of course, this was New Testament, so the context was different because it was a different time.

Although God's absolute, timeless morality still holds.

:pac:

CDfm

gaynorvader wrote: »

I think you may have missed his point. He was referring to your prejudice and discrimination of atheists with your comment that the country is in a mess because our leaders are atheist (something I don't even think is true).

Ok - so I stretched the point a little and was a little naughty- its the spirit of the thread to exagerate a bit.

I don't think the Angelus discriminates against atheists. There are some aspects in the country especially education where you could say there is a catholic bias that politicians have left non catholics down. Its probably something Galvesean and I agree on.

The Angelus is one we probably don't but I did give what I thought was a realistic answer when he asked for someone to give reasons to support it.

gaynorvader

CDfm wrote: »

Ok - so I stretched the point a little and was a little naughty- its the spirit of the thread to exagerate a bit.

I don't think the Angelus discriminates against atheists. There are some aspects in the country especially education where you could say there is a catholic bias that politicians have left non catholics down. Its probably something Galvesean and I agree on.

The Angelus is one we probably don't but I did give what I thought was a realistic answer when he asked for someone to give reasons to support it.

Fair enough. I happen to agree that the Angelus is not a big deal. You might as well give out about a certain type of car advertisement. I just thought you were being a little silly with your posts, turns out it was intentional!

CDfm

gaynorvader wrote: »

I think you may have missed his point. He was referring to your prejudice and discrimination of atheists with your comment that the country is in a mess because our leaders are atheist (something I don't even think is true).

Other than Ivana Bacik we dont have any politician who is openly atheist and she is more known as the Queen Bee of politically correct politics and feminism than atheism. Her constituency as a Senator ,if Im not mistaken, drew on that of David Norris more known for his openly gay celebrity.

I think its about time politicans were more open about their religious orientation as I think the disclosures they make are more concerned with negative impact on opinion polls than honesty.

Certainly, I would not let the religious orientation of a politician sway me if I didnt like his/her political ideas.