M17/M18 - Gort to Tuam [open to traffic]

Charlie Charolais

serfboard wrote: »

Yes there is.

This project is a stupid PPP. Why stupid? Because the consortium that builds the motorway borrows the money and then charges the government a premium in annual payments. This is an "off-balance sheet" and expensive way for the government to borrow money for infrastructure, when it would be far cheaper for them to borrow it directly. But then we can't 'cos ... /rant

Anyway, the consortium has borrowed the money to build the motorway, but won't get any payments in from the government until the project is finished. The quicker the payments start coming in from the government, the sooner the consortium can start re-paying their loan.

So that's the incentive.

Puts on awkward hat....

But, if the first payment from the gov is due in April 2018, i.e. The consortium borrow & spend the full 550 by April 2017, finish the road, but have not income until April 2018, that’s 12 months repayments without an income
It would suit the consortium & drivers to finish early but the not gov
I do recall the M4 was completed early, the consortium proposed they rent the road to the gov until the agreed takeover date, didn’t happen

L1011

Charlie Charolais wrote: »

Puts on awkward hat....

But, if the first payment from the gov is due in April 2018, i.e. The consortium borrow & spend the full 550 by April 2017, finish the road, but have not income until April 2018, that’s 12 months repayments without an income
It would suit the consortium & drivers to finish early but the not gov
I do recall the M4 was completed early, the consortium proposed they rent the road to the gov until the agreed takeover date, didn’t happen

This provides no cost incentive to finish early but absolutely no disincentive either should it occur - the debt is still going to be there and requiring interest/coupon payments regardless. I doubt this scenario is valid to begin with, though.

Carawaystick

The M1 North of Dunleer was financed by PPP and the contract has an end date, with payments starting from road opening date, which sped construction up.

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The m17 at castlelambert 07/10/16 looking towards rathmorissylooking towards tuamannagh hill sisk have started on the jersey barrier looking towards rathmorissylooking towards tuam

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The m18 rathmorissy to gort 07/10/16234gortroegalway to dublin railway linecoldwood looking towards rathmorissylooking towards gort parknacapp looking towards gortlooking towards rathmorissyrinn looking towards gortlooking towards rathmorissykilternan looking towards gortlooking towards rathmorissyparkatleva looking towards rathmorissy

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RATHMORRISY to gort part two raheen/kiltartan looking towards rathmorissylooking towards gortCoole parkgort

red bull

Whats the reason for delay with the opening of the flyover at coldwood

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The m17 at cloondarane 2.5kms form tuam looking towards rathmorissy 10/10/16 looking towards tuam

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The m17 at killeelaun looking towards rathmorissylooking towards tuam 1.5kms

spacetweek

If that's going to a be future exit, it'll be very tight and low-powered

Middle Man

spacetweek wrote: »

If that's going to a be future exit, it'll be very tight and low-powered

Same spec as the slips on the Gort to Crusheen scheme - seems a lot better than the ones on the Ennis Bypass, but far inferior to the ones at Annagh Hill.

ELCAT2009

Passed through tuam this morning just after 7am and it was still dark so cant be sure but looks like the pedestrian foot bridge for the bypass at west wing has arrived sitting on a truck just the galway side of Tuam! Don't think the foundations are all poured yet for it but great to see it arrived!

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The m17 laraghmore to annagh hill 10/10/162345678

Czhornet

Just wondering if there are any plans for public lighting at the Kiltiernan Interchange? I thought all motorway junctions had to lit up in hours of darkness, can be dangerous enough to unfamiliar drivers!

serfboard

Charlie Charolais wrote: »

I do recall the M4 was completed early, the consortium proposed they rent the road to the gov until the agreed takeover date, didn’t happen

I don't understand how this happened though, since the M4 (Kilcock->Kinnegad) is a tolled PPP model - the consortiums repayments come from tolls, so it should have been opened as soon as it was finished?

AFAIK, there are three types of road PPP - the tolled model (e.g. M6 Ballinasloe->Galway), the toll-supported model (M3 and Shannon Tunnel) and the repayment model (M17/M18).

As I said before, the replayment model is the worst value-for-money for the state, since it's the state paying money to a company who borrows the money who repay it to their lenders. If we had just borrowed the money directly and built it ourselves, it would have been cheaper. After all, our borrowing rates have never been lower.

Cookiemunster

serfboard wrote: »

As I said before, the replayment model is the worst value-for-money for the state, since it's the state paying money to a company who borrows the money who repay it to their lenders. If we had just borrowed the money directly and built it ourselves, it would have been cheaper. After all, our borrowing rates have never been lower.

It's off book this way. It may work out more expensive, but it's €500m less on the national debt. It's ridiculous, but that's the way it is.

serfboard

Cookiemunster wrote: »

It's off book this way. It may work out more expensive, but it's €500m less on the national debt. It's ridiculous, but that's the way it is.

Thanks - I knew that already and said so ...

serfboard wrote: »

This is an "off-balance sheet" and expensive way for the government to borrow money for infrastructure, when it would be far cheaper for them to borrow it directly. But then we can't 'cos ...

... and we both agree how stupid it is. It's like a vulture fund owning your mortgage and you applying for a new loan and saying: "I don't owe any money to a bank currently".

We still have to repay the €500m so it's the same feckin thing. Except it's worse.

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The m17 at kilseagh looking towards rathmorissy 11/10/16looking towards tuam

spacetweek

Signage poles up on the M17 no less!

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spacetweek wrote: »

Signage poles up on the M17 no less!

And we have to wait another 18 months before it opens, ah right

serfboard

ELCAT2009 wrote: »

Passed through tuam this morning just after 7am and it was still dark so cant be sure but looks like the pedestrian foot bridge for the bypass at west wing has arrived sitting on a truck just the galway side of Tuam! Don't think the foundations are all poured yet for it but great to see it arrived!

Installed this morning. (Sorry no pics).

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The flyover at laraghmore on the m17234

marno21

In addition to the actual M17/M18 motorways and Tuam BP, there is a smaller scheme to realign the N63 between Abbeyknockmoy and the Annagh Hill interchange as part of the M17/M18 overall scheme.

The CPOs along the route have recently been approved: http://galwaybayfm.ie/progress-plans-long-awaited-n63-improvement-works/

Once complete, this will mean the route from Abbeyknockmoy to Galway will all be of high standard.

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The m17 at castlelambert 14/10/16 looking towards rathmorissylooking towards tuam

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Pedestrian foot bridge at the start of the tuam bypass

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The first flyover on the m17 at castlelambert

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The last 8 kms of the m17 pic1 looking towards rathmorissy all the rest heading towards tuam part one 15/10/162345678910

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Part two 11121314151617181920

godskitchen

m17 wrote: »

Pedestrian foot bridge at the start of the tuam bypass

I passed this yesterday, it looks very low.

I'm sure it will be fine but while driving past I was trying to work out if an excavator on a low loader could get under it.....

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The m17 at brockagh corofin2