Compensation for victims of IRA voilence

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 12:31pm

Kalashnikov_Kid wrote: »

Well you were the first to patronise me. I've survived 3 months in the pubs of Surrey discussing similar arguments as above - some people happen to be a little more open minded than you.

Shows the level of intellect I'm up against. Amazing. You have me speechless. Well done guys. There's always a chance to pick up another A level or two...

Basque seperatists aren't big on my list of friends tbh, so forgive me for not recognising their flag.

out of interest, why do you not have an English flag in your list?

dlofnep · 08-09-2009 12:48pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Basque seperatists aren't big on my list of friends tbh, so forgive me for not recognising their flag.

I doubt you know much about them if you couldn't recognise their flag. You should probably save yourself the bother of discussing something you're not educated about.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

out of interest, why do you not have an English flag in your list?

Why would he?

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 12:54pm

dlofnep wrote: »

I doubt you know much about them if you couldn't recognise their flag. You should probably save yourself the bother of discussing something you're not educated about.

i wasn't going to

funny how all the terrorists stick together isn't it :rolleyes:

dlofnep wrote: »

Why would he?

Becasue he has Welsh and Scottish flags on there, so why not English, especially as he will be moving there.

DoireNod · 08-09-2009 12:58pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

funny how all the terrorists stick together isn't it :rolleyes:

Are you implying that certain posters on this thread are terrorists???

I think that's personal abuse.

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 1:01pm

DoireNod wrote: »

Are you implying that certain posters on this thread are terrorists???

I think that's personal abuse.

Sensitive much?

It is odd that all supporters of the IRA also support the Palestinians and the Basques, that is all I am saying.

dlofnep · 08-09-2009 1:02pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

funny how all the terrorists stick together isn't it :rolleyes:

An interesting observation. I agree.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Becasue he has Welsh and Scottish flags on there, so why not English, especially as he will be moving there.

Am I supposed to be enlightened by this post or something? Perhaps he finds the English flag, and all that it has stood for in history (in Ireland, the crusades, etc..) as repulsive?

dlofnep · 08-09-2009 1:04pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

It is odd that all supporters of the IRA also support the Palestinians and the Basques, that is all I am saying.

Not really when all parties involved are fighting against a foreign oppressor, which dictates the law of the land in their land. It makes perfect sense. Nothing odd whatsoever about it.

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 1:09pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Am I supposed to be enlightened by this post or something? Perhaps he finds the English flag, and all that it has stood for in history (in Ireland, the crusades, etc..) as repulsive?

but not the Scottish one?

It can't be that repulsive if KK is happy to move to England and pay taxes to this awful oppressive regime.

now, lets discuss hypocrisy again shall we?

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 1:12pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Not really when all parties involved are fighting against a foreign oppressor, which dictates the law of the land in their land. It makes perfect sense. Nothing odd whatsoever about it.

The Basques stopped being oppressed when Franco died. They are just like the IRA in that they want to impose the will of the minority on the majority by using terror tactics.

DoireNod · 08-09-2009 1:16pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Sensitive much?

It is odd that all supporters of the IRA also support the Palestinians and the Basques, that is all I am saying.

It has nothing to do with being sensitive, but rather with working within the rules of the board and attempting to have reasonable discussion. Resorting to rash statements about of some of the posters doesn't help. It's a bannable offence, right?

I don't understand why you think KK's combination of flags is odd. They are similarly affected groups. It's a statement of solidarity I believe.

dlofnep · 08-09-2009 1:16pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

The Basques stopped being oppressed when Franco died.

No they didn't. Perhaps speaking to a person from the basque country might educate you further. I have, can you say the same?

And - Coming from a guy who couldn't tell you what their flag looked like 5 minutes ago, you all of a sudden seem to be a scholar on past and present Basque civil & political conditions.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

They are just like the IRA in that they want to impose the will of the minority on the majority by using terror tactics.

Perhaps you might be confusing the Basque people with ETA? For the record, the will of the IRA (Irish unification) was the will of the majority, and not the minority. Let us not revise history.

You're not doing yourself any favours here. But I'll entertain your posts for a bit. Tell me more about the Basque people.

getz · 08-09-2009 1:20pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Not really when all parties involved are fighting against a foreign oppressor, which dictates the law of the land in their land. It makes perfect sense. Nothing odd whatsoever about it.

so you are saying that most people who live in the irish republic supported the terrorist IRA,and not the goverment elected by the irish people ?just to brush up on your history ,the crusades were sent by request of a catholic pope,and catholic england and CATHOLIC IRELAND sent men to palestine,

dlofnep · 08-09-2009 1:35pm

getz wrote: »

so you are saying that most people who live in the irish republic supported the terrorist IRA

I did not state that - I stated that they supported Irish re-unification.

And for the record, there is no such state called the "Irish republic".

LordSutch · 08-09-2009 1:41pm

DoireNod wrote: »

I don't understand why you think KK's combination of flags is odd. They are similarly affected groups. It's a statement of solidarity I believe.

Yes indeed I also 'presume' the little collection of flags has something to do with a perceived solidarity within or between (violent & non violent) seperatist movements & the optional use of the AK47 ?

P.S I live in the Republic of Ireland, or the Irish Republic if you will ..........

Scofflaw · 08-09-2009 1:42pm

Thread closure imminent, with a round of infractions also likely.

moderately,
Scofflaw

DoireNod · 08-09-2009 1:46pm

Camelot wrote: »

Yes indeed I also 'presume' the little collection of flags has something to do with a perceived solidarity within or between (violent & non violent) seperatist movements & the optional use of the AK47 ?

Well, I suppose that's your problem.

P.S I live in the Republic of Ireland, or the Irish Republic if you will ..........

Good for you.

Since thread closure is imminent. I have nothing further to say. I've stated my position and I've made my points. Unless anyone wants to dispute my position and points I've made.

getz · 08-09-2009 1:47pm

dlofnep wrote: »

I did not state that - I stated that they supported Irish re-unification.

And for the record, there is no such state called the "Irish republic".

the IRA did not support irish re-unification they used terrorism against other irishmen,to try and force their will, even against people living in the the free state[can i use that word/]

Kalashnikov_Kid · 08-09-2009 1:53pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Basque seperatists aren't big on my list of friends tbh, so forgive me for not recognising their flag.

It is comments like this that make me take your political opinion with a pich of salt, so forgive me.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

funny how all the terrorists stick together isn't it :rolleyes:

Reported for personal abuse (not that it affects me personally - more that it is against the rules of this forum - which is Politics I remind you, in case you've lost your way...). Unfortunately putting a

at the end of it doesn't change things here.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

out of interest, why do you not have an English flag in your list

Becasue he has Welsh and Scottish flags on there, so why not English, especially as he will be moving there.

but not the Scottish one?

It can't be that repulsive if KK is happy to move to England and pay taxes to this awful oppressive regime.

now, lets discuss hypocrisy again shall we?

The flags can be interpreted as symbols of nationalism (and not terrorism). You continuously confuse the two. It is still possible to have nationalist ideals and condone terrorism in this day and age. Quote me somewhere with the contrary if you disagree.

St. George's Cross hardly fits into this category for me. Hypocricy? Sorry mate, you already tried to tar me with the Brit-bashing brush and failed.

There is only one place I can see hypocricy in this thread:

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Don't patronise me, you aren't very good at it.

May I suggest you have a serious reality check before you head off to the land of the enemy, if you sit in a pub in Surrey telling everyone the IRA were not terrorists and criticising everything the British do, you may be in for a nasty surprise.

I will say it again: you are the one that brought the tone of this thread down to where it is now, by making personal slurs in the guise of backing up an argument.

Likewise, come visit a pub in Dundalk (know where that is -know how to read a map?..) and tell people there that the British Army have no case to answer (this is what you are implying in your argument). Bring some 6:57 heads with you too if you like. Let me know how you get along.

Sorry if I don't fit into the armchair republican stereotype that you despise so much. Sorry for trying to engage in rational debate with you. Sorry for making you insecure.

You are a fine specimen of the English A* education system, I'll give you that.

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 1:54pm

DoireNod wrote: »

It has nothing to do with being sensitive, but rather with working within the rules of the board and attempting to have reasonable discussion. Resorting to rash statements about of some of the posters doesn't help. It's a bannable offence, right?

Maybe, thanks by the way for your concern when KK accused me of being a member of a gang of football thugs, a rash statement no?

DoireNod wrote: »

I don't understand why you think KK's combination of flags is odd. They are similarly affected groups. It's a statement of solidarity I believe.

Scotland is oppressed? FFS someone tell Gordon Brown, or David Cameron (Or Menzies Campbell for that matter)

dlofnep wrote: »

No they didn't. Perhaps speaking to a person from the basque country might educate you further. I have, can you say the same?

And - Coming from a guy who couldn't tell you what their flag looked like 5 minutes ago, you all of a sudden seem to be a scholar on past and present Basque civil & political conditions.

Perhaps you might be confusing the Basque people with ETA? For the record, the will of the IRA (Irish unification) was the will of the majority, and not the minority. Let us not revise history.

You're not doing yourself any favours here. But I'll entertain your posts for a bit. Tell me more about the Basque people.

Personally, I couldn't give a gnats chuff about Basque people.

Good luck to them and all that but like I say, there is no oppression of Basque people and TBH, ETA aren't exactly the most popular bunch of guys in Spain or france.

my Grandfather was serving on HMS Forrester when it accompanied SS Habana out of Bilbao by the way.

Kalashnikov_Kid · 08-09-2009 1:58pm

Camelot wrote: »

Yes indeed I also 'presume' the little collection of flags has something to do with a perceived solidarity within or between (violent & non violent) seperatist movements & the optional use of the AK47 ?

P.S I live in the Republic of Ireland, or the Irish Republic if you will ..........

I presume from your username that you might have been a fan of Cromwell...your point being exactly? No, please elaborate....

INTL

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 1:59pm

Kalashnikov_Kid wrote: »

Reported for personal abuse

Likewise

Kalashnikov_Kid wrote: »

You are a fine specimen of the English A* education system, I'll give you that.

Glad I could return the compliment.

DoireNod · 08-09-2009 2:07pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Maybe, thanks by the way for your concern when KK accused me of being a member of a gang of football thugs, a rash statement no?

I didn't notice it, but I looked back through the thread.

Kalashnikov_Kid wrote: »

You're not a member of the infamous Portsmouth FC 6:57 Crew by any chance? That would explain a lot. Not nice having these demeaning assumptions thrown about is it?

I think that's a bit different to accusing someone of being a terrorist. I'm not moderator though.

Originally posted by Fratton Fred
Scotland is oppressed? FFS someone tell Gordon Brown, or David Cameron (Or Menzies Campbell for that matter)

Similarly affected groups. Yes Scotland is similar to Ireland. They are even pushing for independence.

Can we please keep this on topic? It's an important topic and I am also guilty of contributing to off topic discussion.

dvpower · 08-09-2009 2:14pm

DoireNod wrote: »

Can we please keep this on topic? It's an important topic and I am also guilty of contributing to off topic discussion.

This thread went off topic at post #2 when the whataboutery started.

getz · 08-09-2009 2:22pm

Kalashnikov_Kid wrote: »

I presume from your username that you might have been a fan of Cromwell...your point being exactly? No, please elaborate....

INTL

like most of the working classes in england and ireland ,i have never been a fan of cromwell,no one ever liked him, it was only the victorians who decided to make him a hero,but i always liked the fantasy of king arthur and the nights of the round table[ camelot] but the likes of the terrorists who even now braking news, has planted a 600lb bomb in forkhill, northern ireland just to kill irishmen woman and children, dont do anything to help a united ireland. stand up and condemn them .

Fratton Fred · 08-09-2009 2:28pm

DoireNod wrote: »

Similarly affected groups. Yes Scotland is similar to Ireland. They are even pushing for independence.

so are England. The English democrats had their first mayor elected in Doncaster

DoireNod wrote: »

Can we please keep this on topic? It's an important topic and I am also guilty of contributing to off topic discussion.

Is there anything left to discuss?

dlofnep · 08-09-2009 2:35pm

getz wrote: »

the IRA did not support irish re-unification

Yes they did.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Personally, I couldn't give a gnats chuff about Basque people.

Obviously.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Good luck to them and all that but like I say, there is no oppression of Basque people

You're not qualified to make that statement. Yes, there is oppression. I have spoken to basques personally about the issue. What makes you think that you've seen enough, read enough, or asked enough to possibly make such a clear-cut statement?

Fratton Fred wrote: »

and TBH, ETA aren't exactly the most popular bunch of guys in Spain or france.

Who said anything about ETA? You are trying to equate the entire population of Basque people with ETA. It's woeful logic.

dlofnep · 08-09-2009 2:39pm

Camelot wrote: »

P.S I live in the Republic of Ireland, or the Irish Republic if you will ..........

Pardon me for being pedantic, but there is no such state called the Republic of Ireland, or the Irish Republic. If in doubt, please refer to the constitution of Ireland. (http://www.taoiseach.gov.ie/upload/static/256.htm)

Scofflaw · 08-09-2009 2:39pm

Heavens, the tone of this thread hasn't gone up at all.

moderately,
Scofflaw

Compensation for victims of IRA voilence

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