When will the government start taxing lump sum pension payments?

Fighting Irish

This situation doesn't affect me at all but leave the people who worked hard alone, just cut the dole to €2 a week, the strong will survive

jimmmy

Fighting Irish wrote: »

This situation doesn't affect me at all
but leave the people who worked hard alone,

You are lucky if the situation does not affect you, but it does affect everyone else in this country, directly or indirectly , due to government borrowing etc.

Fighting Irish wrote: »

just cut the dole to €2 a week, the strong will survive

Disagree there. There is scope for reducing social welfare ( it is often mentioned it is 3 times here compared to what it is in the UK for example ) but I think the major cuts / greatest savings should be in other areas .
After all, why should the govt borrow money so retired public servants can "Help offspring with house deposits", ( the words of one retired public servant on this very thread ), among other things.

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

The question was
"What, do you suspect , are these tax free lump sums of over 100,000.00 euro, are spent on so ?" First on your list was " "Help offspring with house deposits" . I asked you several times " do you not accept that retired public servants, using this windfall cheque, were in some part responsible for helping create the property bubble so ? ", and you refused to answer, so I changed the question slightly, in an effort to help you answer it, but you failed to answer all these questions. It certainly is not telling a lie ! lol lol.

You changed the question, and said that you had not. That is a lie.

jimmmy

P. Breathnach wrote: »

You changed the question, and said that you had not. That is a lie.

I asked you a different question, seeing as you had not the manners to answer the first question. Nothing deceitful about that. :rolleyes: I never went back and edited a question or anything, which is what you are implying. I did not ask you the exact same question in every post I make, I never claimed or would want to do that.
Now instead of trying to divert attention by accusing anothing poster of "lies" lol lol:D, maybe you would attempt to answer at least one of the questions you were asked ?

parsi

jimmmy wrote: »

I would say ...we all know...Few people i

Is it so hard to go find figures to back up your argument ?

jimmmy

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Everybody who has completed the full period of pensionable service (40 years in most cases) gets what is quaintly expressed as a lump sum of 60/40ths of final pay, and a pension of 40/80ths.

Well Parsi, in reply to "Is it so hard to go find figures to back up your argument ?", thanks to Mr. Breatnach again for confirming the figures I already gave. See above. The CSO will confirm average public sector pay (across all ages, promotion grades etc ) is 966 per week, but will not confirm the average salary of public sector people at retirement age. ( maybe they are on a sickie or stress break ). As said before, it would be reasonable to assume that people retire on a higher salary than average public sector salary, due to promotion, age, experience etc. Those are the facts, parsi....now what do you say....the same old "I would say ...we all know...Few people i" ?

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

I asked you a different question, seeing as you had not the manners to answer the first question. Nothing deceitful about that. :rolleyes: I never went back and edited a question or anything, which is what you are implying. I did not ask you the exact same question in every post I make, I never claimed or would want to do that.

What a piece of nonsense! I made no such suggestion.

Now instead of trying to divert attention by accusing anothing poster of "lies" lol lol:D, maybe you would attempt to answer at least one of the questions you were asked ?

You are not entitled to badger me to answer any question. In particular it is inappropriate to badger me to answer a question based on a false premise. It is audacious hypocrisy when you ignore simple questions put to you, such as the one I put to you twice.

dresden8

P. Breathnach wrote: »

What a piece of nonsense! I made no such suggestion.



You are not entitled to badger me to answer any question. In particular it is inappropriate to badger me to answer a question based on a false premise. It is audacious hypocrisy when you ignore simple questions put to you, such as the one I put to you twice.

P. You're so busted.

Jimmmy has discovered the conspiracy of retired public servants to destroy the country by sinking their "windfall", wrested from the cold dead hands of the private sector, into property and thus drive the country off a cliff.

Damn you retired public servants!!!!

No doubt he's off on another forum telling them he was talking to a retired public servant who told him that the public service owns half the country and used their "windfall" to engineer a collapse in the economy so they could get cheap builders for the underground lair and monorail.

You should know better than to engage with him.

di2772

Jimmmy,
How about just one backed up fact?

jimmmy

di2772 wrote: »

Jimmmy,
How about just one backed up fact?

Which fact do you want ? As explained earlier "As regards the size of the tax free windfall cheque lump sum, P. Breathnach has confirmed it is 60/40 of annual salary at retirement. Given annual public service salary of approx 50,000 ( the c.s.o. will confirm average public sector pay is 966 per week ), and bearing in mind this is across all ages / grades etc of over 300,000 people, what do you think the average salary of those at retirement age is ? The CSO will not answer this question. ( they are probably on another sickie / stress day lol ). 60/40 of the retiring salary , or 1.5 times to you and me, is the tax free lump sum. Half the retiring salary is the pension after that. "
Do you not think the government should tax lump sum payments ( across all sectors ) ?

jimmmy

dresden8 wrote: »

P. You're so busted.

Jimmmy has discovered the conspiracy of retired public servants to destroy the country by sinking their "windfall", wrested from the cold dead hands of the private sector, into property and thus drive the country off a cliff.

P.Breathach is not busted, he just replied to my question ( on the first page of this thread : check it out for yourself ) "What, do you suspect , are these tax free lump sums of over 100,000.00 euro, are spent on so ?" . First on Mr. Breathnachs list ( and he is entitled to his opinion, he is a retired public servant ) was " "Help offspring with house deposits" .:D:D:D

erictheviking

jimmmy wrote: »

Which fact do you want ? As explained earlier "As regards the size of the tax free windfall cheque lump sum, P. Breathnach has confirmed it is 60/40 of annual salary at retirement.AFTER 40 YEARS SERVICE :rolleyes:Given annual public service salary of approx 50,000 ( the c.s.o. will confirm average public sector pay is 966 per week ),This could mean that the top 2% are on 500k a year while the bottom 20% are on the minimum wage its a meaningless statistic,
and bearing in mind this is across all ages / grades etc of over 300,000 people, what do you think the average salary of those at retirement age is ? The CSO will not answer this question. Why would the CSO look into this? They only do basic stats!!
( they are probably on another sickie / stress day lol ). :rolleyes: What an absolutely idiotic, moronic, bitter and twisted staement.
60/40 of the retiring salary , or 1.5 times to you and me, is the tax free lump sum. Half the retiring salary is the pension after that. "
Do you not think the government should tax lump sum payments ( across all sectors ) ?

The more I read the more it makes me laugh. You are a total wind up merchant!
Your posts offer nothing to a sensible debate. Its just inflammatory comments all the time. Are you 12? As I've said before you have some neck!:D
Get a job Sonny!:D

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

Which fact do you want ? As explained earlier "As regards the size of the tax free windfall cheque lump sum, P. Breathnach has confirmed ...

So I am now an authority? Speaking as an authority, I say that you misused information I supplied in this thread.

jimmmy

P. Breathnach wrote: »

So I am now an authority?

I do not know if you consider yourself an authority or not. I could not care less if you are an authority or not, and think it of little relevance to the discussion, but at least I answer your question, unlike you.

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Speaking as an authority, I say that you misused information I supplied in this thread.

The information you supplied "Help offspring with house deposits" was part of your reply to the question "What, do you suspect , are these tax free lump sums of over 100,000.00 euro, are spent on so ?" . Its there in black and white for everyone to see, on the first page of this thread. I commented on the other uses that you said people spend the money on. I certainly do not misuse "information" ( as you call it ) lol lol :D:D even if it comes from you "Speaking as an authority" ( your words, not mine )

dresden8

See what I mean?

How many smilies does he use on average in each post?

Are they supposed to be discussion points?

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

I do not know if you consider yourself an authority or not. I could not care less if you are an authority or not, and think it of little relevance to the discussion, but at least I answer your question, unlike you.

You need to learn some English. If you cite somebody's words or work as evidence in support of what you say, you are treating that person as an authority.

dfbemt

Lets just ignore this jimmmy.

Like every other public servant I competed for my job by applying and interviewing. Approx 10,000 applied for my job which was part of a 100 intake 16 years ago into Dublin Fire Brigade.

Jimmmy could have applied for that if he wanted. He could have applied to be a Garda, a teacher, a nurse, a clerical officer, a litter warden or any other public service job that exists.

Don't tell me that our pension is the reason that this country is going down the plug. You could have chosen it also. Maybe it didn't appeal to you, maybe your application failed hence your bitterness but it is not our fault.

We signed up to these terms and conditions. We have embraced change. We pay an additional levy that the private sector does not have to pay.

Go on the anti NAMA march today if you have so much to say. Attend the many other marches that will take place over the winter but never forget that it is the public service that keeps the country working, not politicians, not bankers, not developers.

Grow up.

di2772

Jimmmy.
Is there any point reading your posts. You seem to make it up as you go along.
Im sorry but you just make me laugh now.
Especially when you quote a fellow poster, who you dont even know as cobfirmation of your "facts".
You are wasted here. You should be on stage.

Quick question Jimmmy. How much are per year you going to get in your pension - paid for by the tax payer? About €11k a year, at todays retes? I hope you are paying €11k PRSI each year so, just so the rest of us dont have to cover you.

jimmmy

P. Breathnach wrote: »

You need to learn some English.

I actually know enough English, having got a honour in it in the higher Leaving cert paper years ago. Thats enough for me, thank you.

P. Breathnach wrote: »

If you cite somebody's words or work as evidence in support of what you say,.

You confirmed a fact for me ( as requested by someone else ) which I have already given ( " As regards the size of the tax free windfall cheque lump sum, P. Breathnach has confirmed it is 60/40 of annual salary at retirement.")

P. Breathnach wrote: »

you are treating that person as an authority.

This is hardly treating you as an authority...however you are a retired public servant, and if in reply to the question ( on the first page of this thread ) "What, do you suspect , are these tax free lump sums of over 100,000.00 euro, are spent on so ?" you, Mr. Breathnach reply with a list starting with "Help offspring with house deposits", then I respect your opinion. You can claim to be an authority on such matters if you so wish to : I merely wished to find out from your experience and in your opinion what such lump sums were spent on. Your reply was candid and highy informative, thank you.;)

jimmmy

dfbemt wrote: »

Like every other public servant I competed for my job by applying and interviewing. Approx 10,000 applied for my job which was part of a 100 intake 16 years ago into Dublin Fire Brigade.

Shows how much people wanted a public service job in this country so....and how many people would almost certainly be willing to do it for considerably less that you are paid. Your reply is predictable coming from a public servant ...." why did you not get a job as a public servant so "....but not everyone in the country can or should be a public servant. Someone has to be a net contributer to the government. We cannot all be the best paid public servants in the known world, under the highest paid prime minister ( taoiseach ) in the world.

amacca

jimmmy wrote: »

Paying for houses for offspring was at the top of your list of what retired public servants do with their tax free lump sum cheque. Given the large numbers of people who retired from the public service during the boom years, do you not accept that retired public servants, using this tax free cheque, were in some part responsible for helping create the property bubble so ?

I cant actually believe you are serious here. So larger numbers than usual retired from the public sector during the boom (bubble) years and are in some part responsible for the property bubble, is that it.

Of course they are in some part responsible, so in fact are large numbers of private sector workers who rushed out and bought overpriced houses. So what is your point? Are you saying they are more responsible? or is the above quote just a non-argument......weak James, very weak, you are not even doing your own side any favours here. Your irrational need to demonise the public sector at every turn is sort of amusing at this stage.

I would suspect that many more private sector workers bought overpriced houses during the bubble, does that make them more responsible for the bubble as they would be in....lets see how would you say it, the majority.

The above is of course a ridiculous argument. The blame for our bubble lies with gombeen politicians and their developer friends, cheap easy supply of credit, our loss of control of our interest rates, a whole media industry in cahoots with auctioneers constantly whipping up a buying frenzy and finally with peoples willingness to get involved in bidding wars because they so desperately needed to have that house right now without thinking about the debt they would be saddled with and the asset it would be collateralised on. Both public and private sector workers got involved in this and seeing as their are many more private sector workers are you saying that the public sector workers were buying more houses or spending money on houses more recklessly than their private sector counterparts?

In any event trying to tar public sector workers as being responsible in the main for the property bubble is ridiculous.

(if your above post wasnt trying to suggest that then its a non-argument and I for one think you should either apologise for it or realise its stupidity)

erictheviking

jimmmy wrote: »

Shows how much people wanted a public service job in this country so....and how many people would almost certainly be willing to do it for considerably less that you are paid. Your reply is predictable coming from a public servant ...." why did you not get a job as a public servant so "....but not everyone in the country can or should be a public servant. Someone has to be a net contributer to the government.:D:D:D We cannot all be the best paid public servants in the known world, under the highest paid prime minister ( taoiseach ) in the world.

What do you contribute? Straight answer now...No BS:rolleyes:!


I would say you don't work by the amount of time you spend posting!
Please don't try and tell us otherwise.

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

I actually know enough English, having got a honour in it in the higher Leaving cert paper years ago. Thats enough for me, thank you.

I have learned many things since my schooldays, including the idea of authority and what a financial windfall is. Are you now telling us that you are a complete person, with no need to learn anything?

You confirmed a fact for me ( as requested by someone else ) which I have already given ( " As regards the size of the tax free windfall cheque lump sum, P. Breathnach has confirmed it is 60/40 of annual salary at retirement.")

No, I did not confirm a fact for you. I gave factual information for anybody who wanted to know.

This is hardly treating you as an authority

Once you cite me as a source whose word can be believed, that is indeed treating me as an authority.

jimmmy

erictheviking wrote: »

What do you contribute?

None of your business, and not relevant to the thread. I do , and have, however, pay a lot of tax.

erictheviking wrote: »

I would say you don't work by the amount of time you spend posting!

At least I do not post during working hours while being paid by the govt, which some on this board admit to...;)

jimmmy

P. Breathnach wrote: »

I have learned many things since my schooldays,.

Indeed, have'nt we all.

P. Breathnach wrote: »

including the idea of authority .

Good. It was you who first used this word, and indeed you claimed to be "Speaking as an authority," ( your words, not mine ):D

P. Breathnach wrote: »

and what a financial windfall is. .

Indeed, you were very quich to know what people sometimes done with them...see your post at the bottom of page one of this thread.

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Are you now telling us that you are a complete person, with no need to learn anything?.

No, I never suggested that. Indeed I even asked your opinion on "What, do you suspect , are these tax free lump sums of over 100,000.00 euro, are spent on so ?" and you, Mr. Breathnach replied with a list starting with "Help offspring with house deposits",

P. Breathnach wrote: »

No, I did not confirm a fact for you. I gave factual information for anybody who wanted to know..

:D

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Once you cite me as a source whose word can be believed, that is indeed treating me as an authority.

I did not say your word could be believed or not ; please keep more on thread

erictheviking

jimmmy wrote: »

None of your business, and not relevant to the thread. I do , and have, however, pay a lot of tax.

You feel its no problem at all to pry into any PS workers details but a curt "None of your business" is your reply when questioned :D.

Please don't make out as though you are some sort of super contributor to the irish economy. We all pay tax, even the PS workers.
Whats the problem? You make out you are a NET contributor to govt. coffers:rolleyes: so What industry do you work in?...If you work:rolleyes:....or do you need time to think of a makey uppy answer?:D

jimmmy wrote: »

At least I do not post during working hours while being paid by the govt, which some on this board admit to...;)

Will you kop on. You post on here 24/7
POT....KETTLE...BLACK..anyone?

P. Breathnach

jimmmy, you are a waste of time.

jimmmy

Mr. Breathnach, I think a bit less of the personal attacks would be better for your argument....most people would expect more from a retired public servant.

jimmmy

erictheviking wrote: »

You feel its no problem at all to pry into any PS workers details but a curt "None of your business" is your reply when questioned :D.

I have not "pryed" in to any PS workers details...even Mr. Breathnach volunteered the info that he was retired public sector....I never asked anyone the question "What do you contribute?", which I was asked.

erictheviking wrote: »

Please don't make out as though you are some sort of super contributor to the irish economy.

I am not super, there are many more who contribute more than I do.

erictheviking wrote: »

We all pay tax, even the PS workers.

The PS workers, as has been explained before by other poster, hand back to the government with some of the money the govt gives them. eg the govt giving 100 euro and taking back 30 in tax is the same as giving them 70 to start with.

Some people actually write cheques to the revenue commissioners , and give them a considerable amount of money each year, instead of the other way around.

erictheviking wrote: »

so What industry do you work in?...If you work:rolleyes:....or do you need time to think of a makey uppy answer?:D

Private industry, the rest is n.o.y.b. and not relevant to this thread. I do not ask other posters what they work at.

P. Breathnach

jimmmy wrote: »

Mr. Breathnach, I think a bit less of the personal attacks would be better for your argument....most people would expect more from a retired public servant.

Leave moderating to the moderators.