Confusion regarding qualifications & teaching

Derrygirl

Deleted

TheDriver

couple of things come to mind: Is she using up tax credits from earlier in the year that she had unused or is she paid on an hourly rate i.e. no holiday pay etc as we had temps here getting same as myself yet they get nothing for mid terms etc.

Derrygirl

Yes driver, forgot to mention she is on an hourly rate ie no holiday pay etc

TheDriver

suppose if you take out the 18 weeks in secondary system that you won't get paid for, then its not a massive pay, particularly as you are still responsible for the class.
Think we are all a bit guilty of labelling kids, no matter what.

mark renton

thats about 50 quid an hour - it encourages me to wanna be a teacher

rainbowtrout

Derrygirl wrote: »

I was VERY shocked:eek: to see that her take home pay was almost 2,700euro (for 1 month which was 62 hours work). The girl in question has a JEB diploma and is currently studying for the higher certificate in literacy (through Waterford Institute of Technology). 2.5years ago she was a secretary. However i, as a qualified teacher cannot understand this both my husband and myself are university educated and in good jobs and neither of us earn anywhere near this. Some may congratulate her but i find that difficult as i cannot see how somone without a university degree, teacher training etc can earn this or can even fulfill the requirements of the job- planning, assessment, schemes of work etc. ESpecially when there appears to be so many other more suitably qualified poeple seeking employment.

To be honest you just sound bitter and p*ssed off that she earns more than you. So what if you're university educated? That doesn't automatically entitle you to a higher wage. Ask anyone who has a degree and is sitting in a call centre for 8 hours a day listening to abuse from customers for 19k a year like my brother is currently. There are also plenty of people out there (maybe not so much at the moment) who don't have a third level education, but did an apprenticeship or trade and earn far more than I do.

If you're not happy with your wage, change job. Your attitude towards your sister in law is quite condescending as well. Who says she can't plan a class or put together a scheme of work? She does hold a JEB diploma, admittedly it's not something I rate very highly mainly due to inconsistency in it's delivery in different centres but they do show people how to plan a lesson and scheme of work. She's working towards a full literacy qualification and is a literacy tutor. I don't see the problem really. As a teacher myself I have never done a course in literacy so I wouldn't be too comfortable putting together a scheme of work for literacy classes. Your sister in law would probably be better qualified to do so.

mark renton

rainbowtrout wrote: »

As a teacher myself .

may I ask how much you get an hour?

rainbowtrout

john47832 wrote: »

may I ask how much you get an hour?

No, because

1. It's none of your business
2. I don't get paid by the hour, I'm permanent
3. Teacher salaries are freely available for all to see on the Teachers Unions websites.

implausible

Derrygirl wrote: »

Yes driver, forgot to mention she is on an hourly rate ie no holiday pay etc

That hourly rate probably includes holiday pay. I know subs in our school who earn more per week than I do. They are on a higher rate per hour to compensate for not getting paid over the holidays.

A lot of Youthreach workers don't have full teaching qualifications as the VECs traditionally had trouble recruiting people to this sector (no security of tenure, difficult students etc.). However, with the present shortage of jobs, this will change.

TheDriver

************sitting here waiting for the usual couple of anti teacher boardsies to find this thread and start on an unmerciful rant about teacher salaries.............sure we have the country ruined!******************

amacca

TheDriver wrote: »

************sitting here waiting for the usual couple of anti teacher boardsies to find this thread and start on an unmerciful rant about teacher salaries.............sure we have the country ruined!******************

Yeah, they are an awful shower altogether!

mark renton

rainbowtrout wrote: »

No, because

1. It's none of your business
2. I don't get paid by the hour, I'm permanent
3. Teacher salaries are freely available for all to see on the Teachers Unions websites.

actually 3 cancels out 1 and 2 can be calculated by dividing your salary by the numbers of hours worked

rainbowtrout

john47832 wrote: »

actually 1 cancels out 3 and 2 can be calculated by dividing your salary by the numbers of hours worked

actually it doesn't because you don't know where I am on the scale.

TheDriver

try working out how many hours a teacher actually works as opposed to class contact time

P.S> John what do you work at and how much do you get an hour?

dandelion

PLenty of university educated teachers cannot teach or prepare lesson plans, how do you know if you are any good at it ?

With the right approach your sister in law might be a much better teacher than you!

I have done many courses over the years including a JEB diploma. I met several people on the course who will never be good teachers, and others who excel at the job. I lecture part time and go to great efforts to provide value to all my students just like JEB taught me.

I have three adult children and have met countless fully qualified teachers over the years who were useless.

Might I suggest that the issue you have with your SIL is a projection of your general unhappiness with something else, or are you really the begrudging and narrow minded character you have portrayed on this post?

mark renton

TheDriver wrote: »

try working out how many hours a teacher actually works as opposed to class contact time

P.S> John what do you work at and how much do you get an hour?

we cant divide salary by class contact time because if you have no class contact time for a day and yet still get paid then we cannot reasonably deduct

PS this is about Teaching/Pay related

I am not permitted to divert this thread off topic and would be reprimanded if I did so

UpseyDaisy09

Hey all!

Gosh this has got a little heated! I am a browser who doesnt normally post but felt this needed a response. I qualified 2years ago as a secondary teacher got a maternity post first year out and have just subbed since then. Currently there is nothing on the horizon, so yes i am annoyed that others with less formal qualifications (on paper Dandelion, regardless of who can and cannot teach, that cannot be judged on a discussions forum!!) can be employed in such a capacity; especially when one notes the wages!
I am now up to my neck in student debt and still have a part time job, it is soul destroying. I think the point the OP was trying to make was that how can a person currently studying for a literacy cert be employed as a literacy tutor? i certainly was unable to teach (not inculding unpaid teaching practice!) during training. Regardless of degrees etc im sure the course mentioned fully qualifies the person in question; if so perhaps i should look into that.
What does everyone else think?

mark renton

I think the pay is also related to the subjects, rightly so I believe - compare IT to english

now if an English tutor was earning more than an IT tutor I don't think that would be right - all the details that have to be understood in IT compared against English - sure we all speak English, its not that difficult

(just checked for spelling errors )

rainbowtrout

UpseyDaisy09 wrote: »

i am annoyed that others with less formal qualifications (on paper Dandelion, regardless of who can and cannot teach, that cannot be judged on a discussions forum!!) can be employed in such a capacity; especially when one notes the wages!

Wages don't really come into it. Until you know what the exact qualifications are for the position in question, you can't say a person with 'less formal qualifications is not suitable'. If all that is required to teach IT in this centre is the JEB diploma then she is qualified. It may also be the case that there was no suitable applicant for the position of literacy tutor, so they gave it to the most suitable one available. My school didn't have a qualified learning support/resource teacher until this year, but the hours for resource still existed and were on people's timetables.

lauralee28

john47832 wrote: »

I think the pay is also related to the subjects, rightly so I believe - compare IT to english

now if an English tutor was earning more than an IT tutor I don't think that would be right - all the details that have to be understood in IT compared against English - sure we all speak English, its not that difficult

(just checked for spelling errors )

What a post? I have never read anything so ridiculous on an education forum?! Salaries based on subject? Laughable to say the least...

mark renton

lauralee28 wrote: »

What a post? I have never read anything so ridiculous on an education forum?! Salaries based on subject? Laughable to say the least...

Now cmon - seriously - do you really think an Art / English Tutor should be paid on even terms with IT / Maths Tutors??

No chance

rainbowtrout

john47832 wrote: »

Now cmon - seriously - do you really think an Art / English Tutor should be paid on even terms with IT / Maths Tutors??

No chance

Now you're just trolling

pathway33

lauralee28 wrote: »

What a post? I have never read anything so ridiculous on an education forum?! Salaries based on subject? Laughable to say the least...

there are incentives for maths teachers in the UK in the form of a £9,000 training grant rather than £6000 for say english. Also for maths there is a golden hello of £5000 so subjects do determine what goes into your bank account.

rainbowtrout

pathway33 wrote: »

there are incentives for maths teachers in the UK in the form of a £9,000 training grant rather than £6000 for say english. Also for maths there is a golden hello of £5000 so subjects do determine what goes into your bank account.

we're not in the UK though.... although a friend of mine is an English teacher and got the golden hello in the UK

mark renton

Pay as ye Play

the tougher the subject - the higher the pay

rainbowtrout: what part of this do you not comprehend?

if a Medical Doctor teaches a Medical class are you really saying that they should be on a pay par with other, lesser difficulty subjects?

rainbowtrout

john47832 wrote: »

Pay as ye Play

the tougher the subject - the higher the pay

rainbowtrout: what part of this do you not comprehend?

if a Medical Doctor teaches a Medical class are you really saying that they should be on a pay par with other, lesser difficulty subjects?

Difficulty of a subject is subjective. Some people find certain subjects easier than others. That doesn't mean the teacher should be paid more or less. You obviously don't know much about the teaching system in this country either.


The other misconception: Medicine is difficult.

Again, medicine is perceived as difficult because the points needed for it are high because it's popular and there are a small number of places. It doesn't mean the course is necessarily difficult and that teachers should get paid more for the subject.

I find maths and science easy, I find English literature and poetry hard. My friend is the opposite. I am a science teacher, she is an English teacher. Should one of us be paid more than the other?

implausible

john47832 wrote: »

Now cmon - seriously - do you really think an Art / English Tutor should be paid on even terms with IT / Maths Tutors??

Yes.

All subjects are difficult/easy in their own way. You have just demeaned two subject areas in your quest to make an invalid point!

I hope that you've taught in both areas and that is what your opinion is based on.

implausible

john47832 wrote: »

now if an English tutor was earning more than an IT tutor I don't think that would be right - all the details that have to be understood in IT compared against English - sure we all speak English, its not that difficult

5 pages on tension and conflict in the poetry of Derek Walcott for tomorrow please:D

mark renton

deemark wrote: »

Yes.

All subjects are difficult/easy in their own way. You have just demeaned two subject areas in your quest to make an invalid point!

My quest is not to make an invalid point, merely to welcome some people to reality - I dont try to demean subjects, but the reality is that some are easier than others, be it subjective on an individual basis we can take this as a percentage - I dont have figures but we can surely agree if a survey was conducted on the difficulty of subjects then the usual suspects would be regarded as easier.

mark renton

deemark wrote: »

5 pages on tension and conflict in the poetry of Derek Walcott for tomorrow please:D

I would actually if I had the time, just to prove a point that it is not that difficult - I dont like English, and particurlarly Poetry however I do believe that the majority of people would pass a standard exam in English

TheDriver

john47832 wrote: »

reality .

This my friend is something you obviously are lacking and also clearly have never taught and merely recall your own experiences from your days in school. Sounds more like a troll every post you submit.

Again I ask if you want to throw stones at teachers, what do you work as and how much do you earn? Good for goose........

mark renton

Yes Driver whatever you say - My posts have been on topic and and in direct relation to the OP

as you are now submitting accusations I will have to reject your request before this becomes personal

spurious

john47832 wrote: »

I would actually if I had the time, just to prove a point that it is not that difficult - I dont like English, and particurlarly Poetry however I do believe that the majority of people would pass a standard exam in English

So do you think someone who teaches a child with a high literacy level the delights and intricacies of Shakespeare at Higher LC level should be taught less than the person who teaches the illiterate, disengaged child to pass Ordinary Level English at JC?

Which do you think is more difficult? Which should be paid more?

Good teaching is not about what you teach, it's about how you teach.