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Legalising cannibas to cure the resession?

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13567…10

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    #62
    Auvers
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,987 ✭✭✭Auvers


    starflake wrote: »
    Or go home each night and have neither ?? just a suggestion!

    yep I think thats called a choice which I am being denied by marijuana prohibition


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    #63
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 82,958 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    chachabinx wrote: »
    I am a stoner a few years now... I work full time... I go to college part time.. and instead of going home to a glass of wine I like to have a joint... Im not hurting anybody... my heath is not noticably affected...

    Everyday few days I have to buy stuff.. I can get it quicker then a pizza... there is only one or 2 days a year maybe that I have a problem gettin my hands on some...

    Would it not be a better idea for the government to open their eyes & stop brushing the problem under the carpet... like last week they got something like 500kg in a raid... I can still get some not a problem... the country is flooded with it & all the efforts from the garda aren't going to make a difference... its the same in every country...

    I spend about 200 quid a month on it & to be honest it doens't bother me because I don't drink much... if 200,000 people spend that a month thats 40million per month going into the economy rather then in offshore bank accounts belonging to criminals....

    I am a young adult & nearly everyone I associate with smoke it... whether its in work.. college & friends in general... people have smoked it for years & its not going to stop EVER

    In 2006... Dublin was the 11th most visited city in the world (can't imagine why) but would it not be great for our economy to legalise it... it could be the 2nd Amsterdam...
    And for all of you that think Amsterdam is a kip... your right it is but its no different from Dublin City!

    Just want to know how everyone feels about the situation!
    You know how I know you're stoned without you telling me?


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    #64
    Ostrom
    Registered Users Posts: 3,483 ✭✭✭Ostrom


    Auvers wrote: »
    yep I think thats called a choice which I am being denied by marijuana prohibition

    This isn't like birth control, your right to choose in this case exposes others to potential harm.


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    #65
    Auvers
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,987 ✭✭✭Auvers


    efla wrote: »
    your right to choose in this case exposes others to potential harm.

    what others?


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    #66
    wudangclan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭wudangclan


    efla wrote: »
    your right to choose in this case exposes others to potential harm.

    how?


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    #67
    Ostrom
    Registered Users Posts: 3,483 ✭✭✭Ostrom


    wudangclan wrote: »
    how?

    Creating a legal market, and as another poster suggested, actively promoting it through coffee shops - it is reasonable to assume that more would end up smoking than now. (I wasn't talking about second hand smoke)


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    #68
    Auvers
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,987 ✭✭✭Auvers


    efla wrote: »
    Creating a legal market, and as another poster suggested, actively promoting it through coffee shops - it is reasonable to assume that more would end up smoking than now. (I wasn't talking about second hand smoke)

    FFS so you are protecting people from themslelves how righteous of you :rolleyes:

    By all means you can take the choice not to smoke\drink but why do people like you have to force your opinions down my throat?


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    #69
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,610 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    Tellox wrote: »
    Are you kidding me? The tax on cigarettes far more than covers the health costs. Generally someone who smokes weed would smoke less tobacco - due to the "oversmoked" feeling you can have shortly afterwards. Now, I'm not attempting to say that legalising weed would HELP our healthcare system, but it certainly would not cripple it; especially with the tax that would be hiked onto it.

    Have you any evidence to back up those claims?
    wrote:
    As with any other over the counter medicine such as panadol, hedex.. etc etc. I'm also unable to take the vast majority of painkillers on the market (like plenty of others, due to pre-existing conditions) - take a guess as to what I do when I've a splitting migraine.

    Panadol, Hedex arent used as recreational stimulants though. Is that why people want to legalise it though? Purely for medical purposes? Somehow i dont really think thats the principal reason for it, nor a claim close to the heart of the pro camp.
    wrote:
    Where did you pull that out of? I see no less underage smokers on the street now than I did 10 years ago.

    There are plenty of studies in Ireland on it.
    wrote:
    *facepalm*

    Ok so my comment was a bit tongue in cheek. The point is that the comment is no different for an argument often put forward for those lobbying for drug legalisation that alcohol is worse and everyone who drinks it ends up in a mess on the streets, in fights etc.


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    #70
    roneythetube
    Closed Accounts Posts: 106 ✭✭roneythetube


    efla wrote: »
    I'm crushed.

    Meanwhile, back in the real world where our economic fortunes are determined by factors other than the intoxicant market, the legality of alsohol has nothing to do with it. I'm sure you will agree, as your cited 'research' and other such idiotic stoner campaign pages will tell you, alcohol causes many more deaths per year, either directly, or indirectly.

    A history of narcotics will show you something of the bigotry and misinformation that surrounded early legislation and later policing policy, so let it not be said that I'm being hypocritical - I'm well aware the current state of legislation is founded on equally mis-directing evidence - sensible though it probably appeared at the time. The point should be purely from a public health perspective - there is no rationale for introducing something potentially damaging, irrespective of how limiting the damage may be, or how much faith you have in the ability of the consumer to self-regulate.

    Alcohol has developed differently (obviously) into a profitable enterprise - despite the fact that it also holds no significant long-term benefits (dont bother posting the weekly daily mail 'shot a day cures cancer' links), burdens our healthcare system with alcohol-related illnesses, indirect admissions due to induced violence, road deaths, and numerous effects at the level of family.

    As for marijuana, are you telling me that we are able to distinguish quality without some sort of acquired taste/direction? Completely impossible without some sort of learning process. It is enough to assume taste will regulate any potential trade in contaminated marijuana?

    I have an excellent education - I smoked my way through undergrad engineering many years ago and failed out, and spent plenty of years exposed to your kind, so trust me, I am under no illusious that your 'campaign' has anything to do with enriching the public good through tax.


    Now, why not address some of the concerns raised in this thread instead of picking at my grammer and blaming 'de government'?

    I have read your reply a few times and am not really sure what you are on about? Are you a politician perhaps?:D

    Do some unbiased research into the health BENEFITS of cannabis and then come back and hang yer head in shame! Because you do not really know what you are talking about. And don't for one moment blame what you perceive to be your own personal 'failures' on any plant, substance, molecule or anything else.

    I am free to choose what I want to put into MY body and how I alter MY consciousness. No Gov or anyone else has a right to makes these choices for me.


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    #71
    wudangclan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭wudangclan


    efla wrote: »
    Creating a legal market, and as another poster suggested, actively promoting it through coffee shops - it is reasonable to assume that more would end up smoking than now. (I wasn't talking about second hand smoke)

    only in as much as people can't smoke during droughts due to unavailability(such as the current one) in which case they are resorting to smoking 'smoke' from the headshops (more harmful) or drinking alcohol (more harmful to themselves and to society at large).
    so,no!


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    #72
    roneythetube
    Closed Accounts Posts: 106 ✭✭roneythetube


    wudangclan wrote: »
    only in as much as people can't smoke during droughts (such as the current one).

    and why assume that people are going to smoke cannabis. Vaporising is the new most efficient and safe way to use this herb. Did you not know that smoking is now sooo 20th century?


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    #73
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,610 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    ScumLord wrote: »
    What additional burden? Your just assuming it'll create a similar burden to two completely different drugs.

    It is a form of treatment, you can use it to replace multiple drugs with just one. It's being researched and brought to the market as we speak, in fact it's ready as an oral spray and proving very successful it's just not being used because the government won't allow it and the medical companies would rather sell their much more expensive and patented drugs instead.

    As I already said, is it really for the medicinal benefits that the pro camp are lobbying for here?
    wrote:
    You obviously don't smoke. Smoking with friends is much more enjoyable just like drinking with friends is much more enjoyable.

    How do you know if i smoke or not and what difference does it make?


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    #74
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    efla wrote: »
    Creating a legal market, and as another poster suggested, actively promoting it through coffee shops - it is reasonable to assume that more would end up smoking than now. (I wasn't talking about second hand smoke)
    If it was promoted through coffeeshop those coffeeshops could be forbidden from allowing smoking, leaving only eating and vaporising. Most would undoubtedly go for vaporising as it's a much more controllable way of using the drug.

    The single biggest danger with cannabis use is smoking it simply because inhaling any kind of smoke is bad for you. After that any negative effects are anecdotal.

    I'm also sure an advertising ban would be in effect just like with tobacco.


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    #75
    starflake
    Registered Users Posts: 842 ✭✭✭starflake


    Auvers wrote: »
    what others?

    Me, for one.... if I count?


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    #76
    chachabinx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 93 ✭✭chachabinx


    Overheal wrote: »
    You know how I know you're stoned without you telling me?
    Ok Im not stoned but I wanna know why you said that?
    If its because I can't spell thats a condition that I've always had but I make up for it with my mathmatical genious... you can't have both!


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    #77
    starflake
    Registered Users Posts: 842 ✭✭✭starflake


    ScumLord wrote: »
    If it was promoted through coffeeshop those coffeeshops could be forbidden from allowing smoking, leaving only eating and vaporising. Most would undoubtedly go for vaporising as it's a much more controllable way of using the drug.

    The single biggest danger with cannabis use is smoking it simply because inhaling any kind of smoke is bad for you. After that any negative effects are anecdotal.

    I'm also sure an advertising ban would be in effect just like with tobacco.

    What about drug induced psychosis? Is that not a potential danger to people around drug users? No?


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    #78
    wudangclan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭wudangclan


    roneythetube wrote: »
    and why assume that people are going to smoke cannabis. Vaporising is the new most efficient and safe way to use this herb. Did you not know that smoking is now sooo 20th century?

    agreed nicotine is disgusting.
    i started using it again in my joints a few months back and suddenly my cannabis consumption went through the roof.
    just back on an even keel this week.


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    #79
    Auvers
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,987 ✭✭✭Auvers


    starflake wrote: »
    Me, for one.... if I count?

    how am I harming you my smoking in the privacy of my own home :confused:


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    #80
    wudangclan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭wudangclan


    starflake wrote: »
    What about drug induced psychosis? Is that not a potential danger to people around drug users? No?

    much rarer than alcohol or television induced psychosis.


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    #81
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    faceman wrote: »
    As I already said, is it really for the medicinal benefits that the pro camp are lobbying for here?
    No it's just another feather in the cap. I think the medical use is a no brainer when it comes to the more serious ones. If it helps them let them use it. There are many other feathers in the cap too, like industrial. Industrial hemp is a valuable comodity, possibly because it's so rare and restricted but it could be a huge boost to Irish farmers that are being screwed out of a living these days.

    How do you know if i smoke or not and what difference does it make?
    Because your assuming people who use cannabis are stupid loners that sit at home with their entire life revolving around getting high in the steriotypical tv depiction of druggies.


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    #82
    starflake
    Registered Users Posts: 842 ✭✭✭starflake


    wudangclan wrote: »
    much rarer than alcohol or television induced psychosis.

    so less important?


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    #83
    wudangclan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭wudangclan


    starflake wrote: »
    so less important?

    weighed against the harmful results of prohibiton,much less so.


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    #84
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    starflake wrote: »
    What about drug induced psychosis? Is that not a potential danger to people around drug users? No?
    No, not really, it's as rare as allergic reactions in the general population and usually brought on by chronic abuse at a young age. Studies have shown that cannabis use in early teens will lead to all kinds of mental issues but once your an adult your safe enough.


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    #85
    starflake
    Registered Users Posts: 842 ✭✭✭starflake


    wudangclan wrote: »
    weighed against the harmful results of prohibiton,much less so.

    Can you post you're research up or send me a link?


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    #86
    chachabinx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 93 ✭✭chachabinx


    Auvers wrote: »
    FFS so you are protecting people from themslelves how righteous of you :rolleyes:

    By all means you can take the choice not to smoke\drink but why do people like you have to force your opinions down my throat?
    HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY THIS... PEOPLE ARE EXPOSED TO CANNIBIS ALL THE TIME... AT PARITES... ON BUSES... ON THE STREETS... IN SCHOOL!.. AT LEAST 50 PER CENT OF MY CLASS SMOKED IN WHEN I WAS IN SCHOOL & I WENT TO A VERY UPPERCLASS SCHOOL....
    IM 22 I KNOW WHAT GOES ON AROUND ME.. THOSE WHO ARE OLDER DO NOT!


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    #87
    wudangclan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭wudangclan


    ScumLord wrote: »
    No, not really, it's as rare as allergic reactions in the general population and usually brought on by chronic abuse at a young age. Studies have shown that cannabis use in early teens will lead to all kinds of mental issues but once your an adult your safe enough.

    its also brought about as a result of breeding strains of cannabis with a higher thc and lesser cb-1 content,cb1 being an anti-psychotic agent naturally occuring in the plant to counter the psychotic effects of thc.
    legalise cannabis, regulate the strength and reduce psychosis.


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    #88
    starflake
    Registered Users Posts: 842 ✭✭✭starflake


    ScumLord wrote: »
    No, not really, it's as rare as allergic reactions in the general population and usually brought on by chronic abuse at a young age. Studies have shown that cannabis use in early teens will lead to all kinds of mental issues but once your an adult your safe enough.

    Thanks , I didn't know. So just a question... you know the way 14/15 year olds can get booze now.. If we legalize cannabis will it become more plentiful? Like, will kids end up smoking it because it's more socially acceptable like... My fear is that if smoking cannabis is legalised it will be seen as less of a deviant behaviour and more of a norm? So kids will try it and use it at a younger age? would that not lead to psychosis if abused at a young age? and will that not lead to more crime and acts of violence and more of a stain on the psychiatric services? Just a question.... I don't know alot about this... just wondering!


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    #89
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 82,958 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    chachabinx wrote: »
    Ok Im not stoned but I wanna know why you said that?
    If its because I can't spell thats a condition that I've always had but I make up for it with my mathmatical genious... you can't have both!
    Oh just the fact that your entire opening post was only 2 sentences long ;)


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    #90
    Stark
    Registered Users Posts: 20,991 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    Won't somebody please think of the VAT receipts!?


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    #91
    roneythetube
    Closed Accounts Posts: 106 ✭✭roneythetube


    starflake wrote: »
    Thanks , I didn't know. So just a question... you know the way 14/15 year olds can get booze now.. If we legalize cannabis will it become more plentiful? Like, will kids end up smoking it because it's more socially acceptable like... My fear is that if smoking cannabis is legalised it will be seen as less of a deviant behaviour and more of a norm? So kids will try it and use it at a younger age? would that not lead to psychosis if abused at a young age? and will that not lead to more crime and acts of violence and more of a stain on the psychiatric services? Just a question.... I don't know alot about this... just wondering!

    No - just look at the Dutch experience. Cannabis has been legalised (practically) for over 30 years in Holland and the Dutch teenagers have among the lowest rate of cannabis use in Europe. Unlike the Irish teenagers who (like us all) desire the forbidden fruit and therefore lash into the hash as soon as they can!
    I lived in Holland for 5 years and its no big deal among the Dutch youth. So consequently it is not abused and creates no problems.

    EDIT - good to see the poll remaining constant at around 75-25 in favour of this idea. Now if only some politician would open their eyes and see what the people (whom they are supposed to serve) want.


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