Seriously - Will The Irish Public Please cop The Hell On!

skelliser

well it worked with the pensioner medical card debacle, they made a sharpish u-turn on that!

IvySlayer

skelliser wrote: »

well it worked with the pensioner medical card debacle, they made a sharpish u-turn on that!

Back benchers had a lot to do with that, it did work. But I think there's a major difference between the medical card and telling the government to quit.

Imagine a few thousand people standing/sleeping/living outside the Dail until they called a general election. I bet most people would support them. Maybe a couple more thousand will join.

International media would then come in, advertising more support.

Maybe the government would cave.

Wagon

Biggins wrote: »

It was nothing. ONLY 5 now have volunteered to take a 10% cut.
The rest have declined quietly. Thats 140+ TD's that are currently stll milking the gravy train while telling everyone else in the state to tighten their own belts!

Ireland - WAKE THE FCUK UP!!!

Well suggest something rather than shouting out of your fúcking monitor will you!!? i hate this government and the corruption as much as the next petrson but i dont have any bloody idea how to go about getting these things changed!

tommyboy2222

When the fcuk will the bony arsed, lazy, dumb sheep of this country start to see the morally corrupt shower that is running/ruining this country and when are we going to finally get rid of them!

When they call a general election.

Húrin

Biggins wrote: »

Well if you also including me in that section, you can count me out!
I got up off my arse and is trying to waken the public!
Whats more, as a protest action, I WILL be running in the next election as a protest INDEPENDENT canidate.

Unitedpeople.ie IS my site and "no" to the government - I won't shut the fcuk up!

Greetings fellow activist. I looked at your website. Are you a political party, NGO or pressure group?

What are your plans for action? Would you be up for civil disobedience to get the gov's attention at this point?

Dean09 wrote: »

The thing that really pisses me off is everyone moans and groans in this country but does nothing about it (me included).

Some of us do things about it. This summer I and a dozen others organised Climate Camp to expose and stop the the government's inaction in the face of climate change. Their bog-cutting policy in the Midlands may have been a good idea back in the 60s but now it is not in our interests at all.

How on earth can it cost €10 million to build a 7km bike path?

Nolanger wrote: »

We need a political party devoted to people instead of the environment.

Bicycle lanes are for people. Who knows what kind of sub-humans are getting the unjustifiable cost of building it though?

skelliser

na man the sight of 20,000 pensioner outside the dail was the major factor, this is by and large seasoned ff voting country demographic.
A big no no group to piss off, what ever about of other demographics pensioners/old people are consistantly the highest demograph that vote. Annoy them and its political suicide.

If 150,000 people showed up at the dail thats serious pressure, the greens would walk

itsnotmyname

omg .........this thread make's me think that FF at least has a legit plan .......

carlmango11

Just looking at these forums shows how many people want change. I for one would be 100% prepared for any protests people would organize. Just tell me the date and I'll drag my whole family who have been complaining about the Government every day for the last 6 months

Just throwing that out there :pac:

skelliser

well ive been in contact with 2 people so far via pm here about starting something, also a few over in p.ie

need loads more to organise a protest, like reps in every single town and city etc.
a mass movement like

DonkeyStyle \o/

Biggins wrote: »

The government TD's refuse so much to take ANY form of pay cuts AT ALL or enact anything that will effect their UN-vouched, gravy train expenses scandal.

One of the many "tough decisions" they're making I'm sure.

Piste

Biggins wrote: »

The point of my speaking up here is when or what does it take for the public to get their backsides finally into gear and motivated enough to get themselves out to the streets in protest!

Again seriously, what will it take? What will be for most the breaking point because by god, if I knew what it was, I'd wish it would come soon!

When enough people are affected. Really the best thing for this country would be if the government announced ridiculous schemes all at once, like full college fees (the same value that non-EU students pay- 45K a year or so) + slashed dole + no medical cards + taxes on kittens or whatever you're having yourself. There'd be immediate uproar and hopefully we'd have kicked the government out before any of the schemes could be implemented.

Bam, sorted.

Bob_Harris

Húrin wrote: »

Some of us do things about it. This summer I and a dozen others organised Climate Camp to expose and stop the the government's inaction in the face of climate change. Their bog-cutting policy in the Midlands may have been a good idea back in the 60s but now it is not in our interests at all.

You do realise there is no concrete evidence of man made climate change, and this current shift in temperatures is a natural fluctuation of an ever changing climate?

But hey, I bet you feel all important and profound setting up your climate camp, with this great battle you have against the pure evil of climate.

I'd like to personally thank you, and people like you, for the carbon tax which we will see shortly. A tax which will effectively increase the price of all products and services. Cheers.

Lets say for a second that carbon dioxide (a minor greenhouse gas) is indeed the cause of climate change (or is it Global Warming? - whatever happened the hole in the o-zone layer btw?) do you think anything you do here in Ireland will have any positive effect on the world when other nations are pumping out uncountable multiples of what we are?

Is it just that your life is empty and you feel the need to partake in this "great battle" against climate change?

skelliser

regardless of climate change, the burning of peat is the most ineffiecient waste of time ever.

mikom

skelliser wrote: »

ineffiecient waste of time

Does not compute.

OnTheBalls

I will be at the front of the nama protest tomorrow hopefully! To be honest this country needs some civil unrest to get people off there holes. I hate the way the Irish have opinions on everything and act on nothing. The nation is a laughing stock and full of sheep.

I cannot for the life of me stomach bailing out property developers for gambling. It's insane that most of the people in this country don't care. If this happens I am emigrating. I am 21 years old and wondering who the **** the government are going to sell these houses to when they recover in value. Do they actually think property will ever be what it was again? I definately hope my peers are not sheep coting for the people their parents vote for. The Irish obsession with houses. I'm renting for the rest of my life. Probably will be living in Germany by then anyway. I am not leaving to college to get a job bailing out scum bag property investors who are thick as ****. **** that.

abouttobebanned

Great post OP.

A fine, collective example of this Ireland you are talking about could be found in an Irish studio last Friday night. The audience clapped when Tubridy grilled cowen, but then they clapped at a lot of Cowen's answers...I was perplexed as to how a group of people could change their minds so often in the space of such a short period of time. The answers of course is that the Irish public is as easily led as a jack russell with his eye on a sausage. They were easily led on voting no to lisbon, and now they're going to be easily led on voting yes. It's not hard for a government to pull the wool over these kind of eyes.

People complain about those who don't vote - oh you have to use your vote, that's what our great grandparents died for etc...Nonsense. More people, in my opinion, should stay the fcuk away from polling booths, because they haven't got a clue what they are voting for and are making a mockery of our country.

Captain Furball

Mrmoe wrote: »

The only way legally and morally that we can bring about change in this country is through the ballot box. We are better off keeping our heads down and waiting in the long grasses, ready to strike the next opportunity we get to vote. For some the next chance will be a general election for others it will be the Lisbon referendum. The most important thing each and every person can do is vote. So the next time there is an election and we vote in the next shower of b@stards with a 50% turnout I won't be placing the blame at the politicians or the people who voted for them, but the remaining 50% of people who did not even bother to get off their asses to vote. If you want change vote for it and if it doesn't happen then suck it up because thats democracy. Protests are all well and good but that energy should be used to get people out to vote on polling day because that is when it really counts.

Every sh!thead up there is the same you vote for the same sh!theads with the same sh!ty policies.The system is the problem.
Greedy fkcss

Captain Furball

OnTheBalls wrote: »

I will be at the front of the nama protest tomorrow hopefully! To be honest this country needs some civil unrest to get people off there holes. I hate the way the Irish have opinions on everything and act on nothing. The nation is a laughing stock and full of sheep.

I cannot for the life of me stomach bailing out property developers for gambling. It's insane that most of the people in this country don't care. If this happens I am emigrating. I am 21 years old and wondering who the **** the government are going to sell these houses to when they recover in value. Do they actually think property will ever be what it was again? I definately hope my peers are not sheep coting for the people their parents vote for. The Irish obsession with houses. I'm renting for the rest of my life. Probably will be living in Germany by then anyway. I am not leaving to college to get a job bailing out scum bag property investors who are thick as ****. **** that.

Your better off. Your kids will be paying for it anyway, so why bother getting them to pay for the houses?
People are like cows the more the better more tax etc etc it's all one big farm..........

abouttobebanned

abouttobebanned wrote: »

People complain about those who don't vote - oh you have to use your vote, that's what our great grandparents died for etc...Nonsense. More people, in my opinion, should stay the fcuk away from polling booths, because they haven't got a clue what they are voting for and are making a mockery of our country.

They should literally have this written above the door when you go into vote. Well f'ing said!

Biggins

Originally Posted by Biggins
Well if you also including me in that section, you can count me out!
I got up off my arse and is trying to waken the public!
Whats more, as a protest action, I WILL be running in the next election as a protest INDEPENDENT canidate.

Unitedpeople.ie IS my site and "no" to the government - I won't shut the fcuk up!

Húrin wrote: »

Greetings fellow activist. I looked at your website. Are you a political party, NGO or pressure group?

For the record.
I am a married husband with 4 children.
I have no political affiliations with ANY party, NGO or political motivated movement.
I do help a few concerned parents to further fund and publicise the need for more support/equipment for the nurses and ground doctors for Crumlin Hospital in their specialist Cancer/Scoliosis/Leukaemia sections.
I am a pissed off person seeing what is (I think) wrong and although I am 100% willing to accept some of the pain to my bank account to get things back right in this country, I (and my wife) is not willing to sit idly by and let the rest of the nation suffer, be degraded, made a fool of, treated like dumb sheep, to be laughed at by money grabbing, intimidating thugs elected to the Dail!

Unitedpeople.ie is not about trying to score points directly against FF.
As can be read, many of the items apply to all TD's that are so out of touch on all sides and morally corrupt that if we tried to make this stuff up and stick it in a novel, a critic reviewing it would claim that it was too unreal!

I, myself hope to be running (independent protest) in the next election - ONLY to remind the buggers that we, the people will not "go quietly into the night" and just accept any old crap they dish out (but unwilling to accept themselves of).
- If by some crazy miracle (I'm realistic about my chances), I was to even get somewhere with votes - I've said this before and I will say it again - 40% to 50% of my wages from such an elected position would/will be donated to 2 places.
1. The Dublin nationally used Rape Crises Centre
2. Crumlin Childrens Hospital.

No if's, no buts.
My daily agenda (listed by the hour) would be totally open to the public to show EXACTLY what the hell I was up to in my daily role of public service.
Complete transparency would be not a problem for me.

...and thats me in a nutshell. Like everyone else that is working away or unemployed, paying their taxes, with/without kids, etc.
I'm a pissed off person that sees what I feel inside is wrong and so fcuking angry at what others are blatantly getting away with that I won't shut the hell up about it and go away quietly!

This country needs a new direction, a new moral compass to re-direct itself on a straighter, decent, honest and open path, a new group of people that should without question see running a state, as a vocation and a national honour - not a money grabbing exercise and not just a job position to pass down like from father to son!

We should have political parties and individual persons with enough balls, that are willing to say:
- If you as an individual, accept "donations" from businesses, private individuals etc and don't disclose such payments - YOUR OUT!
- If your unwilling to accept the same measures as the rest of the country is being asked to accept - YOUR OUT!
- If your unwilling to give up the 5 star hotels, the limo lifts, the junkets, the unvouched expenses, etc - YOUR OUT!

NO IF'S - No BUT'S

What we have at the moment in the Dail is a sick joke - and because of them, the rest of Ireland, YOUR nation, is dying on its landbed!
* Dying in their hospital bed (if they are luck to get one)
* Dying in their home beds because the money that is out there is being mis-directed to bike roads! (again, on average 78 lives a year could be saved by funding the inoculations. Thats 78 families that shouldn't have to be devastated a year with the loss of a loved one!)
* Dying in streets due to lack of homes, available affordable drugs, and warmth (no money for the heat bills).
* Dying victims of crime who get less proper treatment by the courts than the criminals, who's more rights they are concerned about!
Its goes on and on... Its sickening!

Enough is fcuking enough! No more!

Wake up Ireland, wake the fcuk up!

Cianos

While I completely understand the frustration, I don't think improving bike lanes is a waste of money at all. Dublin infrastructure needs to be greatly improved. A better infrastructure means a much more efficient economy which means more money for health care in the long run.

Throwing money at things does not change anything in the long run. It's usually a short sighted solution..."there's a problem in X"..."give it more money and the problem will be solved". No, the problem won't be solved. Unless the system is working correctly, the problem will just raise it's head again.

Biggins

Cianos wrote: »

...Dublin infrastructure needs to be greatly improved. A better infrastructure means a much more efficient economy which means more money for health care in the long run...

I do 100% agree with you there on that point.

So it would have been better to presently spend 10 million on roads if they had to, that carry produced goods, the public in their cars/vans, firepersons, Garda and ambulance services to where they need to go in order to help keep alive the economy and the people of this country.
But for a 7km bike track costing 10 million Euro, (and here is the hypocrisy) which they say they cannot find(!) right now for clearly more vital services - when as they are claiming, money is short in the country - is amazing and also an insult to our intelligence!
To simplfy:
At the present time if you only have "X" amount of money in your pocket and you either need new drugs to save lives for a whole generation or need a bike track (which doesn't lead to the loss of average 78 lives a year), which would you buy for your family and nation?

Which should you buy first and get to the rest later when possible?

Hauk

Biggins, I must say, I commend your enthusiasm and focus.

I agree with everything you say, and good luck!

ArmaniJeanss

Biggins wrote: »

I do 100% agree with you there on that point.

So it would have been better to presently spend 10 million on roads if they had to, that carry produced goods, the public in their cars/vans, firepersons, Garda and ambulance services to where they need to go in order to help keep alive the economy and the people of this country.
But for a 7km bike track costing 10 million Euro, (and here is the hypocrisy) which they say they cannot find(!) right now for clearly more vital services - when as they are claiming, money is short in the country - is amazing and also an insult to our intelligence!
To simplfy:
At the present time if you only have "X" amount of money in your pocket and you either need new drugs to save lives for a whole generation or need a bike track (which doesn't lead to the loss of average 78 lives a year), which would you buy for your family and nation?

Which should you buy first and get to the rest later when possible?

The €10 million for the cycle lane is over ~8 years. Whereas the €10 million for the vaccine is every year. So its not a case of the latter could pay for the former.
So you are every bit as guilty as the politicians you despise when it comes to manipulation of figures.

A certain percentage of the cost of the cycle lane will be recouped every year as it encourages more people to cycle. This amount is not easily quantifiable in advance, but hopefully it will pay for itself eventually.

Finally your logic that because bicycle lanes havn't been built before, that if we had to spend €10m on transport that it should be spent on better roads for gardai, ambulance drivers, cars and vans is a really bizarre bit of logic.

Cianos

Biggins wrote: »

I do 100% agree with you there on that point.

So it would have been better to presently spend 10 million on roads if they had to, that carry produced goods, the public in their cars/vans, firepersons, Garda and ambulance services to where they need to go in order to help keep alive the economy and the people of this country.

A greatly improved system of cycle lanes would encourage a lot more people to cycle. More bikes on the road means less cars on the road. Less cars means less traffic, meaning police cars and ambulances can get through the city a lot faster. 10 million going towards "road maintenance" would just disappear down the void along with all the other millions that have been thrown at it. Hence my point, that throwing money at things to solve problems is usually just a waste...money is not a problem solver, it is a tool. It is ideas and innovation that solve problems, not money.

At the present time if you only have "X" amount of money in your pocket and you either need new drugs to save lives for a whole generation or need a bike track (which doesn't lead to the loss of average 78 lives a year), which would you buy for your family and nation?

Which should you buy first and get to the rest later when possible?

I'm not disagreeing with you that money is mismanaged. It's not like that €10m is the last €10m the government has. If it was the last €10m left in the country then your question would be worth answering. Because while you think the €10m that is going on the bike lane should go to hospitals, everyone else has their idea on what it should go to. Again, I'm not disagreeing with you that money is mismanaged. What I'm saying is that we need to get away from the simplified opinion that money solves problems.

Catenaccio!

We need an AH sort of character to get things back on track, and I ain't talking about After Hours.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

skelliser wrote: »

well Tellox wants to go on a hunger strike outside the dail.

I think for a mass protest say 150,000 people you will need to sit down and start with a plan and set a date, some saturday, the 26th of september or 3oct are the days imo
like it or not your goin to need the unions on board. To get massive numbers you will need them.

if anyone is thinking of organising something pm me im definitly willinging to get involved.

Don't need the unions, not exactly. We don't need their permission to protest. The unions are very much like the bankers imo.

Piste wrote: »

When enough people are affected. Really the best thing for this country would be if the government announced ridiculous schemes all at once, like full college fees (the same value that non-EU students pay- 45K a year or so) + slashed dole + no medical cards + taxes on kittens or whatever you're having yourself. There'd be immediate uproar and hopefully we'd have kicked the government out before any of the schemes could be implemented.

Bam, sorted.

Where do you get the 45K from? This must be at the very very top end of the scale and is very very misleading. The average is only a fraction of that for non-EU students.

abouttobebanned wrote: »

Great post OP.

A fine, collective example of this Ireland you are talking about could be found in an Irish studio last Friday night. The audience clapped when Tubridy grilled cowen, but then they clapped at a lot of Cowen's answers...I was perplexed as to how a group of people could change their minds so often in the space of such a short period of time. The answers of course is that the Irish public is as easily led as a jack russell with his eye on a sausage. They were easily led on voting no to lisbon, and now they're going to be easily led on voting yes. It's not hard for a government to pull the wool over these kind of eyes.

People complain about those who don't vote - oh you have to use your vote, that's what our great grandparents died for etc...Nonsense. More people, in my opinion, should stay the fcuk away from polling booths, because they haven't got a clue what they are voting for and are making a mockery of our country.

Did you see the same people clapping? My wild guess would be that the audience had anti cowens as well as pro cowens.

abouttobebanned

Aubree Scrawny Office wrote: »

Don't need the unions, not exactly. We don't need their permission to protest. The unions are very much like the bankers imo.



Where do you get the 45K from? This must be at the very very top end of the scale and is very very misleading. The average is only a fraction of that for non-EU students.



Did you see the same people clapping? My wild guess would be that the audience had anti cowens as well as pro cowens.

I made a point of watching closely....it was the same people

Biggins

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

The €10 million for the cycle lane is over ~8 years. Whereas the €10 million for the vaccine is every year. So its not a case of the latter could pay for the former.
So you are every bit as guilty as the politicians you despise when it comes to manipulation of figures.

A certain percentage of the cost of the cycle lane will be recouped every year as it encourages more people to cycle. This amount is not easily quantifiable in advance, but hopefully it will pay for itself eventually.

Finally your logic that because bicycle lanes haven't been built before, that if we had to spend €10m on transport that it should be spent on better roads for gardai, ambulance drivers, cars and vans is a really bizarre bit of logic.

Again, try to look at it this way. 10 million over eight years is 1.25 million a year.
Now you have hundreds per year (that were not inoculated) that is going to get cervical cancer so for the rest of their time living in the state and assuming that some actual survive for lenghty periods - each one of those is going to need further on going continuous medical health care (per year). That means doctors, nurses, use of equipment, operations(?), drugs (not cheap!) and everything else that is going to be needed to try and keep them alive for their loved ones. What does all that cost the state per year, for not clearly taking a cheaper option in the long run for all concerned?

Now which works out the cheapest in the long run? Inoculate now and for this year alone and for possibly for subsequent years till the rest of their normal lives, save the state millions in each case for each person from the above subsequent medical costs!

You make your point and its a good one.
Its hypocritical and insulting by FF however to claim on every piece of the media that "we cannot find 10 million Euro" for emergency/specialised services/etc then a short while later say "O' well we do now have 10 million Euro for a 7km bike track instead"!
Thats just plain disgusting in any language.

Cianos wrote: »

...What I'm saying is that we need to get away from the simplified opinion that money solves problems.

Long story short, I agree with you
- but what little money we do have, should be now spent in the right direction to stop further what WILL be increasing costs later on put on the state and thus the tax payer - you - as the subsequent medical costs of those not treated early enough, will progressively get larger and thus pull the state into further national debt.

Dublin_Gunner

First off, great post Biggins

Secondly, would people please stop and think first, before they start criticising the set up of NAMA and the bank bail outs?? Seriously, where are people going to get their car loans, house loans etc if the countries banking system failed. The Credit Union? :rolleyes:

Anyway, thats about the only thing I'm going to state against the general consensus of this thread.

We NEED to take action. We NEED to rally. We NEED to march. We NEED to enact change.

We're all too comfortable sitting here in front of our computers typing about how passionate we are about this sort of thing, when what we need to do, is march, with as much of the population as possible to the doors of the Dail, break down the effing doors, and pull these muppets out by the scruff of their necks.

I for one think we SHOULD organise a march, a country wide march, on the day of the Lisbon vote.

If anything is going to get attention, is would be disrupting the vote they are using to sway our attention away from what really matters, Ireland, US.

Sure, we need Europe, we all bloody know that. But we need Europe whilst having a competent government in place.

The main problem I see with this would be - who do we put in power??

How about - an accountant as head of finance, a doctor as head of health & children, a general as head of defence etc etc ya know, people who are actually relevant to the positions they hold.

Our government / country NEEDS to be run as a business. People who are harsh, willing to make tough calls, and willing to put procedure and policy in place that is beneficial to the country in the long run, NOT to the government themselves in the short run, in order to keep their ridiculously inflated wages.

Grr.