Seriously - Will The Irish Public Please cop The Hell On!

meglome

Biggins wrote: »

It was nothing. ONLY 5 now have volunteered to take a 10% cut.
The rest have declined quietly. Thats 140+ TD's that are currently stll milking the gravy train while telling everyone else in the state to tighten their own belts!

Ireland - WAKE THE FCUK UP!!!

Just a thought but maybe we shouldn't vote for them. I wonder why we voted for many of them in the first place but we did. I think we should take a long hard look at ourselves.

Overheal

My name is URL wrote: »

Yeah, it's the Irish taxpayer funding all Depts.

The spending on health this year will be over 40% of the budget !!

Why the fcuk should it be even more than that just because the HSE won't spend it correctly? I don't care what anyone says or thinks of me for saying this but using spending from other depts as a platform to incite hatred is low

I say good luck to the Depts that are spending the money allocated to them wisely.. it's not a health issue at all so there's no reason to use it as a bullet point

I have to agree here a bit. Biggins I love your passion and its in the right place. But I have to raise a brow when I see a hospital needing 9m euro to save 78 lives. It shouldnt be about numbers, morally. But unfortunately, it is. Its just like Organ Donation. And if Health is in fact 40% of the Budget, what is being done with it all?

If you need money for Crumlin, I think its fine to point fingers at cycle lanes, but also I think you need to run your finger down the existing Healthcare Budget and find out whats working and what is not.

monument

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

If fairness, a cycle lane does not encourage people to cycle, or promote cycling in any way. Its just a way to provide a slightly safer option for something you could already do...

With your average Dublin cycle lane, I would agree. But this is a fully segregated track which links the north and south of the city.

Just look at the numbers using the segregated cycle track along the coast up to Fairview Park and Clontarf. This new track links in with that and makes that even more attractive.

And it's not just for commuting.

monument

peasant wrote: »

- the designated breast cancer ward in Galway was full beyond capacity before this measure, is now overloaded and is facing yet more cuts in capacity ...no money in the health budget, you see

- it takes longer to travel to Galway by car than it does to Dublin ...bad roads, you see

- there are no trains to Galway ...refurb of the already existing western rail corridor shelved, you see

- the frequency of buses running to Galway has just been cut ...no money, you see

- never mind taking the plane ...you'd have to go to Dublin first because there are no subsidies for a west coast air-link, you see

What has any of that got to do with spending money on something which is aimed at improving general heath and transport in Dublin???

Lord Trollington

Banbh wrote: »

Well we have a golden opportunity to get rid of this rotten government by simply voting NO next week - the General Election would then be certain.

There is no point in voting No in an attempt to get rid of teh government...It wont.

Also you would be only cutting off your nose to spite your face if we done that.

We need Europe now more than we ever did before.

Marching and protesting against the government is the only way to go.

peasant

monument wrote: »

What has any of that got to do with spending money on something which is aimed at improving general heath and transport in Dublin???

Everything actually ...believe it or not, there is a whole country outside of Dublin. Sections of which are being hung out to dry, wither and die.
10 million would create a REAL difference there and not just blisters on the arse of some Dub fair weather cyclists.

monument

peasant wrote: »

Everything actually ...believe it or not, there is a whole country outside of Dublin. Sections of which are being hung out to dry, wither and die.

You seem to have just made your argument into Dublin vs everywhere.

peasant wrote: »

10 million would create a REAL difference there and not just blisters on the arse of some Dub fair weather cyclists.

What do not see is that this -- along with other things which are being done to promote cycling -- will make a REAL difference.

Obesity is a REAL problem.

Transport is a REAL problem.

Noise from motor traffic is a REAL problem.

Air pollution from motor traffic is a REAL problem.

peasant

monument wrote: »

What do not see is that this --

What I do see however is someone who'll buy into any sort of badly construed governement propaganda.

I have a nice bridge there, btw ...if you're interested.

monument

peasant wrote: »

What I do see however is someone who'll buy into any sort of badly construed governement propaganda.

I have a nice bridge there, btw ...if you're interested.

Was building the Luas was also propaganda? Or is it just this planned cycling infrastructure which is propaganda?

First it seemed to be about promoting cycling would not make a REAL difference, then it's funding for Dublin vs elsewhere, now it's all propaganda? Where are the goal posts going next?

monument

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Funding, and misspent public funds, are a REAL problem.

And what has that to do with this planned cycle track?

peasant

monument wrote: »

Where are the goal posts going next?

Back to the real issue, hopefully. That the governement have squandered our money, thrown it away, sunk it in quangos and parish pump projects. Enriched themselves and their cronies. Used it to appease potential opposition and to buy votes and support while all the time neglecting the common good of everybody/the majority.

And that they will continue doing so until we get the feckers away from power.

monument

peasant wrote: »

Back to the real issue, hopefully. That the governement have squandered our money, thrown it away, sunk it in quangos and parish pump projects. Enriched themselves and their cronies. Used it to appease potential opposition and to buy votes and support while all the time neglecting the common good of everybody/the majority.

And that they will continue doing so until we get the feckers away from power.

It would be great if all of you could focus on really waste, there's surely enough examples of it rather than giving out about a cycle track which will have benefits?

Otacon

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Funding, and misspent public funds, are a REAL problem.

monument wrote: »

And what has that to do with this planned cycle track?

I think the misspent public funds bit is the relevant bit there. I could be wrong.

Would you agree that in a time when many, arguably more important, projects are being down-sized or even cut, such as the previously mentioned health services, the Government should be prioritising where public money is spent a bit better?

A cycle track that will service a relatively small number of people in a relatively small area, versus a pretty important hospital ward serving more people who need all the help they can get - a fairly simple choice really.

Poccington

Otacon wrote: »

I think the misspent public funds bit is the relevant bit there. I could be wrong.

Would you agree that in a time when many, arguably more important, projects are being down-sized or even cut, such as the previously mentioned health services, the Government should be prioritising where public money is spent a bit better?

A cycle track that will service a relatively small number of people in a relatively small area, versus a pretty important hospital ward serving more people who need all the help they can get - a fairly simple choice really.

The comparison you're making is for two different projects, from two different departments being funded from two different budgets.

Why should other departments have to suffer or axe certain projects because the DoH is obviously going wrong somewhere with how it's using it's budget?

me-skywalker

ScumLord wrote: »

I'm surprised the unemployed haven't taken to the street in large numbers, they have the time to do so now.

I dont know if this was a joke or not but this idea is brilliant! im being made redundant in two months and this si somethign im certainly going to bring up and try get a movement on. im only sad im only getting active this late and im still in my 20's!!

TD's taxing there own car? car insurance? ESB bills? Electricity Bills? Rent? High Interest mortgages? low benefit Pensions and AVC's? TV Licences? waste charges? heating costs? fuel charges? food? protection insurance? education costs? schools? childcare? medical costs? once off gp visits? consistent prescription medicines? transport, buses, trains? repairs and maintenance? holidays? savings?

its a wonder the people of this country can stand this fckin intolerable disgrace!!

dr.bollocko

Right. Thread back.
If you want to discuss the Lisbon treaty do so in the EU forum in politics.

I have no interest in meandering through misinformed bile and nonsense about it so take any arguments about it there. A number of posts have been deleted on this thread from both sides. That is because this is not the place for discussion of Lisbon.

Biggins

Otacon wrote: »

I think the misspent public funds bit is the relevant bit there. I could be wrong.

Would you agree that in a time when many, arguably more important, projects are being down-sized or even cut, such as the previously mentioned health services, the Government should be prioritising where public money is spent a bit better?

A cycle track that will service a relatively small number of people in a relatively small area, versus a pretty important hospital ward serving more people who need all the help they can get - a fairly simple choice really.

I'm all for having such tracks, but its just the timing of spending on it when at such a tight financial time, the same amount of money could be spent on protecting a generation of girls.
A protection that could for the following years save the country (by lesser medial costs, etc as described previously) a lot, lot more money and lives in the long run.
I'm not anti-cyclist, I'm one myself at times but that just it, its all about appropriate timing!

I appreciate those that are advocating for the other side.
Many (to their credit) are have to put forwards a good argument for their case and I actually can see their points.

ctrl-alt-delete

Biggins wrote: »

My question to this forum is:

When the fcuk will the bony arsed, lazy, dumb sheep of this country start to see the morally corrupt shower that is running/ruining this country and when are we going to finally get rid of them!

Its fcuking disgusting whats going on! :mad:

What is there to replace them with, bony arsed, lazy, dumb sheep? or you even,

No thanks.

Keep up the good work though.

peasant

Biggins wrote: »

I appreciate those that are advocating for the other side.
Many (to their credit) are have to put forwards a good argument for their case and I actually can see their points.

There is one minor detail though

The building of this cycle track has been anounced not because it is good and sensible or for any of the other possible positve reasons

No

It has been pushed through so that Gormley and consorts can score some more browney points on how they're pushing the green agenda.

Why do they need browney points you ask?

Because they have a party conference this Saturday where the grassroots of the green party want to discuss if and how the Green Party should be further involved in governement ...and in particular if they should allow their governement ministers and dail members to back NAMA.

So please ...if you are a Green Party member and you are going to this conference, tell them you're not taking any bribes, tell them you're not blinded by the illusion of influence that FF lets you have, tell them to stick their cycle path where the sun don't shine and tell them to do the one and only honourable thing left to do and instruct your misguided leaders to pull up their moral socks, take a hard look in the mirror and put an end to this shambles of a governement !

Piste

Aubree Scrawny Office wrote: »

Where do you get the 45K from? This must be at the very very top end of the scale and is very very misleading. The average is only a fraction of that for non-EU students.

Just my course, it's the only one whose fees I know. Yeah I'd say other courses are probablly much less.

Piste

Biggins wrote: »

I'm all for having such tracks, but its just the timing of spending on it when at such a tight financial time, the same amount of money could be spent on protecting a generation of girls.
A protection that could for the following years save the country (by lesser medial costs, etc as described previously) a lot, lot more money and lives in the long run.
I'm not anti-cyclist, I'm one myself at times but that just it, its all about appropriate timing!

I appreciate those that are advocating for the other side.
Many (to their credit) are have to put forwards a good argument for their case and I actually can see their points.

You're manipulating figures again, 10 million would only be a year's worth of vaccines, hardly a "generation".

You need to look at the bigger picture. This cycle track is a once off cost of 10 million euro, plus maintenance costs which should be minimal as bicycles don't really do much road damage.

The benefits of this are

-fewer road accidents cause by bikes and cars colliding
-health benefits as people cycle more
-more efficient road transport as hopefully the new cycle path will mean fewer cars on the road meaning gardaí and ambulances can get around.

You'd probably find that between accidents avoided, obesity avoided in some people who take up cycling and the ability of ambulances and gardaí to get around faster that this cycle track could save more lives over time than the 78 (if that figure is accurate) you claim a cervical cancer vaccine could save in a year.

Obviously this is totally speculative, it's impossible to come up with figures for possibilities.

Gummy Panda

I still don't understand this thread. Each department gets a budget and one department has decided to use it budget to fund the creation of bicycle lanes. Another department has had it's budget but is cutting services as it has management issues. It's oblivious that throwing more money at the HSE isn't going to fix it, so why take money from a department that is giving us bang for our buck?

Now I'm speaking from a person who was knocked down when cycling and now suffers occasional back pains. I also had a family member also in a near fatal accident due to cycling on Dublin roads.

I think bicycle lanes would be used if they were there. At the moment, some roads in Dublin are a death trap for cycling especially in morning traffic. If there was less chance of me having accident on Dublin roads, I'd take back up cycling.

Biggins

Piste wrote: »

...You'd probably find that between accidents avoided, obesity avoided in some people who take up cycling and the ability of ambulances and gardaí to get around faster that this cycle track could save more lives over time than the 78 (if that figure is accurate) you claim a cervical cancer vaccine could save in a year.

Obviously this is totally speculative, it's impossible to come up with figures for possibilities.

Just for the record: the average annual of number 78 lives that are lost to cervical cancer, is a number that has been quoted in the media over the last few days.
I can only assume that they came to this number when doing their research and adding up the numbers of lives already lost and then doing their further ratio maths.

Nothing you state is inaccurate. FF timing and wrong direction of their funds is however distasteful when at the same time beforehand - they say they can't even find the money in the first place!

Grumppy Panda: I take your point. I too was run over/into by a motorbike while a teenager on a bike and suffered badly for it.
The money needed currently for the specialist cancer services was/is not for the HSE but for Crumlin Hospital direct.
In October they are going ahead with closing more specialised services - services available in one place in the country which is now being chopped and stopped.
Given that my daughter is one of those directly effected, hopefully then you can understand my (and others) anger at the gov' saying they can't find money one week and a few weeks later saying yes they can but they are going to spend it on a bike track instead!
Something just doesn't seem right!

pog it

Irish people won't do anything! Apart from complaining amongst themselves, when it comes to voting and their family is X or Y or Z they will vote according to what goes in their family. Saw it it in my own rural constituency- the two most intelligent candidates weren't big party, and they didn't get in. It's truly sad what people in Ireland are willing to put up with- moan, moan, moan but so so easily bought when it's election time. Pathetic.

Politically wise, I have given up on people doing anything. The students, older people, Individuals- they are the only ones to say, do anything. Why else are we in this position putting up with the greed and corruption? Shaking our heads at it?

I've done my bit protesting to TDS, writing to newspapers- BUT I am only one person. I couldn't try any harder. I brought to people's attention- along with others in my hometown- when it was coming up to election time last time, the corruption of an elected TD- we did the flyers, everything, and due to our campaign a seriously corrupt person lost his seat. And boy was the steam coming off him after. Woo hoo. I did something to stop it.

Please

---

do something. A letter, phone call. These TDs only respond to things that may affect their political future!

Blowfish

Biggins wrote: »

Just for the record: the average annual of number 78 lives that are lost to cervical cancer, is a number that has been quoted in the media over the last few days.
I can only assume that they came to this number when doing their research and adding up the numbers of lives already lost and then doing their further ratio maths.

Nothing you state is inaccurate. FF timing and wrong direction of their funds is however distasteful when at the same time beforehand - they say they can't even find the money in the first place!

Grumppy Panda: I take your point. I too was run over/into by a motorbike while a teenager on a bike and suffered badly for it.
The money needed currently for the specialist cancer services was/is not for the HSE but for Crumlin Hospital direct.
In October they are going ahead with closing more specialised services - services available in one place in the country which is now being chopped and stopped.
Given that my daughter is one of those directly effected, hopefully then you can understand my (and others) anger at the gov' saying they can't find money one week and a few weeks later saying yes they can but they are going to spend it on a bike track instead!
Something just doesn't seem right!

I don't think anybody on this thread would disagree that Crumlin etc. is a worthy cause, however I would agree with Monument that your anger is misplaced. The cycle lane is an efficient use of money which will provide a valuable service. The same cannot be said for a lot of the HSE spending. Some examples:

€51 million in consultancy fees in 4 years. These consultants haven't taken a pay cut, instead they've just had their pay rise reduced.
€334,000 in security costs...for one person.
Using 22 of their staff for a day, to take blood from 53 people.
€6,000 a week to move people around a place needlessly.
€10,000,000 more to move people around needlessly.
€25,000 per year increase in wages for hospital doctors, to a reported value of €140 million.
Spending money on an empty shuttle bus.
Bloating management.
€292 million on expenses (excluding bonuses).
€98 million more than they need to on medicines every year.
All this, while refusing offers of facilities for Cystic Fibrosis sufferers.

I understand your frustration at them cutting back services, however it was the HSE itself that, rather than cut back the ridiculous inefficiencies and waste, would rather cut back on services that are vital to some. They could easily keep Crumlin open if they really wanted to. It's them that you should be angry with, not the DoT for building a cycle lane.

lostexpectation

don't take it out on the s2s project, its a seawall and cycle/path

biggins the world doesn't jump to your beefs

Terry

"Cop".
It's a hard "C"

Biggins

Blowfish wrote: »

...I understand your frustration at them cutting back services, however it was the HSE itself that, rather than cut back the ridiculous inefficiencies and waste, would rather cut back on services that are vital to some. They could easily keep Crumlin open if they really wanted to. It's them that you should be angry with, not the DoT for building a cycle lane.

I take your point and I agree with you. What is angering and frustrating is NOT that the issue is about just a bike track but about the fact that they can find money for such items when they say they can't find it for other items AT ALL.
That is the angering hypocrisy part on the part of the government.
My apologies if I appear to be angry towards cyclists. Not the intention.
I (and many like me) are indeed angry at the government and its constant lies.

lostexpectation wrote: »

don't take it out on the s2s project, its a seawall and cycle/path

biggins the world doesn't jump to your beefs

I should hope not.
I'd be the first to admit, I'm far from perfect and often just as wrong as I am right.
That said, I wish to god the public would "jump" to something - anything more often than just moan between friends and then stay complacent!

skelliser

red c poll today
ff 24%

depressing or what
this is what your up against, 1 in 4 will vote for them no matter what

Whiskey Devil

The only thing worse than a Fianna Fáil led government is a Fine Gael/Labour Coalition! An Taoiseach ENDA KENNY. No thanks.