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Cannabis should be legalized in Ireland To pull Our country out of ression

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    oconcuc wrote: »

    But once you are an adult, shouldn't that decision be left up to you? And not a misguided government policy directed at generally law-abiding members of the community.

    True it should Im all for legalising it in Ireland lets see if it works. If it does not then back it goes on the black list.


  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    Zambia232 wrote: »
    True it should Im all for legalising it in Ireland lets see if it works. If it does not then back it goes on the black list.

    I'm not coming from a different perspective than it would make things better if it were legal.

    I am saying that the State has no right to tell you what you can and cannot take. The only right the State has is to perhaps regulate and tax to lessen harms associated with any drugs use.

    We have rights recognised both by our own Constitution and the European Convention of Human Rights to privacy, bodily integrity and expression. A corollary right to use drugs is perfectly reconcilable with these rights.

    Putting any substance on a black list has failed. This goes for cocaine, heroin, MDMA etc.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭ordinarywoman


    oconcuc wrote: »
    There is NO evidence whatsoever to indicate cannabis causes cancer. Even when smoked.

    there is no evidence to support that canabis/hemp causes cancer, there is however evidence supporting that the active ingredients THC,CBN,and CBD can CURE cancer

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n31Nuj_AvTg

    the problem is in ireland we mix tobacco in our joints, in the US they wouldn't dream of mixing gods herb with chemically trated tobacco...they use vaporisors,bongs, or eat the oil, the leaves and stems and roots of the plant can be used to make a salve that works as a rub on cure, antibiotic, canibinoids have proven to be affective against MRSA among other bacteria, by the london school of pharmacy....

    Granny Storn list was republished with 420 pages of reserch done on how effective canabis is medicinally,by DRs and scientists,its all there the good the bad and the ugly... pages and pages of testomonies from people saying canabis has cured me...and why arn't people screaming it from the rooftops??(well they are)+


    Money.Big Pharma Companies...who back hand legislation...
    Amazingly when paracetamol was bought in was around the same time that refer madness began....
    We've been lied to for all these years...

    in the old days when people looked at the healing qualities of plants twas normal....now you have to have a huge hospital bill...and drs opinions out the wazoo...and a government spouting 'drugs are Bad' and discuss our failing ecomomy over a few pints in Galway...


  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    there is no evidence to support that canabis/hemp causes cancer, there is however evidence supporting that the active ingredients THC,CBN,and CBD can CURE cancer

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n31Nuj_AvTg

    the problem is in ireland we mix tobacco in our joints, in the US they wouldn't dream of mixing gods herb with chemically trated tobacco...they use vaporisors,bongs, or eat the oil, the leaves and stems and roots of the plant can be used to make a salve that works as a rub on cure, antibiotic, canibinoids have proven to be affective against MRSA among other bacteria, by the london school of pharmacy....

    Granny Storn list was republished with 420 pages of reserch done on how effective canabis is medicinally,by DRs and scientists,its all there the good the bad and the ugly... pages and pages of testomonies from people saying canabis has cured me...and why arn't people screaming it from the rooftops??(well they are)+


    Money.Big Pharma Companies...who back hand legislation...
    Amazingly when paracetamol was bought in was around the same time that refer madness began....
    We've been lied to for all these years...

    in the old days when people looked at the healing qualities of plants twas normal....now you have to have a huge hospital bill...and drs opinions out the wazoo...and a government spouting 'drugs are Bad' and discuss our failing ecomomy over a few pints in Galway...

    You should note that big pharmaceutical firms are preparing to buy up huge tracts of land in California (Mendocino County in the so-called "Emerald Triange"), in a pre-emptive move as many feel Proposition 19 (The November referendum that could see cannabis completely legalised in the State). It appears as if they may begin to try to control the market if normalised and regulated. They are experienced in dealing with State regulations and inspections and have access to huge funds.

    See

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/may/09/marijuana-legalise-california-drugs-cartels


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    Victor wrote: »
    If the country was stoned, would any work actually get done?

    Nobody's suggesting we all get mashed from morning till night. Drink is legal and we somehow manage to get work done. (Except on really ropey mornings)

    Are you saying that cannabis smoking doesn't cause lung or throat cancers and the associated intoxication doesn't cause accidents?


    No


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,060 ✭✭✭darkmaster2


    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/oct/10/facebook-cofounder-donation-legalise-cannabis
    Facebook co-founder Sean Parker is giving $100,000 (£62,640) to the push for the legalisation of cannabis in California. Campaigners had complained they were short of cash in the run-up to a vote on the measure on 2 November.
    His contribution follows two donations by his fellow co-founder, Dustin Moskovitz, totalling $70,000. Polls suggest voters will approve legalising cannabis. A survey by Public Policy Polling last monthfound 47% for and 38% against.
    The ballot coincides with mid-term elections for a new California governor as well as Congress. Legalisation could take effect the day after the ballot, making California the first state in the US to do so.
    Parker, 30, founded the music-sharing site Napster when he was 19 and went on to raise funds for the social networking site Facebook, becoming its first president. He has since left the company, though he retains a stake and is worth millions. His donation was listed this week in filings issued by the campaign for Proposition 19, also known as the Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010. Parker has made no public statement about the donation.
    Stephen Gutwillig, a spokesman for Drug Policy Alliance, which is spearheading the legalisation campaign and is the main beneficiary of the donation, told Associated Press: "What's interesting here is that [Parker] is a member of the generation that really gets it. We think he's pivotal to the future of drug policy reform in the country."
    Others say cannabis is much stronger than it was in the 1960s and 1970s and is dangerous, impacting on the health services and the workplace
    In an ironic twist, advocates of reform have complained of a ban by Facebook on adverts supporting Proposition 19. Facebook has responded that company policy only prohibits images of drugs, and not adverts either in favour or against legalisation.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,146 ✭✭✭youcrazyjesus!


    It should be decriminalised and legalised along with all other drugs. There should be an amnesty for all drugs mules in prison. Locking people up for possession is counter productive and extremely expensive.

    Legalising all drugs and taxing them will result in net benefits to the State of 1 billion a year bare minimum.

    And I say this as a non user of any drug other than alcohol.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭ordinarywoman


    It should be decriminalised and legalised along with all other drugs. There should be an amnesty for all drugs mules in prison. Locking people up for possession is counter productive and extremely expensive.

    Legalising all drugs and taxing them will result in net benefits to the State of 1 billion a year bare minimum.

    And I say this as a non user of any drug other than alcohol.


    Decriminalization is definatly the way to go...it could be so financially benificial to the counrty all things considered...


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    It should be decriminalised and legalised along with all other drugs. There should be an amnesty for all drugs mules in prison. Locking people up for possession is counter productive and extremely expensive.

    Legalising all drugs and taxing them will result in net benefits to the State of 1 billion a year bare minimum.

    And I say this as a non user of any drug other than alcohol.

    I'd agree decriminalise all but would you consider legalising cannabis? seems wasted tax opportunity to me. plus wouldn't have pointless medical trials/legislation for people who have cancer etc. Looks like it will be legalised for that now that America have done it and Harney recently dropped her point blank refusal stance


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭ordinarywoman


    I'd agree decriminalise all but would you consider legalising cannabis? seems wasted tax opportunity to me. plus wouldn't have pointless medical trials/legislation for people who have cancer etc. Looks like it will be legalised for that now that America have done it and Harney recently dropped her point blank refusal stance


    decrimilizing/legalising does it really matter...so long as there is no prison sentance for using a harmless and mecinally benifical herb...we should be demanding our constitutional right to put what ever we want into our own bodies ...heal thyself....
    the government is is huge need of one thing...money...legalising mj, using it both medicinally and otherwise will generate huge profit, employment, its a renewable green energy....they would be stupid not to look at it...

    Weither are not Prop 19 is passed in the US MJ with become legal in California because Arnie has passed the legislation himxself already and it will come into effect in december...and its currently use medicinally in 16 states in America, decriminalised in Canada, decriminalised in holland, Portugal, tolerated in france, spain, and italy...italy is also looking at it medicinally...

    Medicianl Mj is coming...they can no longer lie and tell us its not benifical when its been proved otherwise by professors worldwide...


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭ordinarywoman


    it makes me so furious to think that the answer is there...staring them in the faces...


  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    it makes me so furious to think that the answer is there...staring them in the faces...

    I have been researching Drug Policy for a number of years now. I have interviewed dozens of Police in London and Glasgow, Lawyers for the Crown Prosecution Service, Addiction Counselors, Psychiatrists and most importantly politicians.

    There are two major ideas motivating the war on drugs.

    Firstly, the often well-meaning yet misguided belief that criminalising is the most effective way of regulating. This is my particular area of interest.

    But more worryingly, and an area outside of my research grant, is an underlying knowledge that the war on drugs is one of the most effective tools to distract public opinion. All too often, when news of a major anti-drugs initiative is broadcast, it correlates closely with another major issue of public concern.

    You may have noticed this recently with the Head Shop fiasco. This story was run, with universal political support, during some of the most tumultuous months of modern Ireland's economic and social history.

    The same thing happens here in London. When a story around political or police corruption at local level is about to break or has broken, some new anti-drug initiative in the community is formulated.

    Politicians and Law enforcement alike have a vested interest in continuing the war on drugs, as it effectively distracts the public from scrutinising what they are supposed to be doing.

    If you look at sentencing for crimes in Ireland, Drugs offenses are the only sentence, other than murder, to carry a mandatory minimum sentence. Rape, Manslaughter, Fraud, Burglary etc. have no mandatory minimum. In fact, you will regularly here of drug offenders receiving in excess of the 10 year sentence under Section 15A of the Misuse of Drugs Act. When was the last time you saw a rapist get more than a ten year sentence? It takes the most serious of cases for a Child Molester to get anything close to what many Drug Offenders can get sentenced.

    Interesting where our society puts its priorities? Child Molester is less bad than a guy who imported 20kg of Weed?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,697 ✭✭✭MaceFace


    oconcuc wrote: »

    Firstly, the often well-meaning yet misguided belief that criminalising is the most effective way of regulating. This is my particular area of interest.

    I have been arguing against legalisation for a while on this thread for this very reason, but I am honest enough to say now that I was wrong.
    The war on drugs is lost and there is no alternative to legalising.

    The reasons for my change in mind was the brilliant Channel 4 documentary Our Drugs War which was shown a number of months back.
    Episode 1:


    It goes to show that if someone puts up a valid argument, people will listen, but all to often on this forum, the huge majority that want it legalised do so for personal reasons (i.e. easier access) and that is never going to win an argument.

    Also, there is 0% chance of cannabis being legalised in Ireland and it will stay that way until there is a change in world opinion, which quite frankly ain't going to happen.


  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    MaceFace wrote: »
    I have been arguing against legalisation for a while on this thread for this very reason, but I am honest enough to say now that I was wrong.
    The war on drugs is lost and there is no alternative to legalising.

    The reasons for my change in mind was the brilliant Channel 4 documentary Our Drugs War which was shown a number of months back.
    Episode 1:


    It goes to show that if someone puts up a valid argument, people will listen, but all to often on this forum, the huge majority that want it legalised do so for personal reasons (i.e. easier access) and that is never going to win an argument.

    Also, there is 0% chance of cannabis being legalised in Ireland and it will stay that way until there is a change in world opinion, which quite frankly ain't going to happen.

    Hello MaceFace,

    I am glad you have taken the time to assess and scrutinise your own views on this area. I am even happier that following this process you have come to the same conclusions as many have, when they actually look at the evidence.

    The Angus MacQueen documentary was very well done, and well timed. It was great to see people working on the front line of addiction treatment and the so-called war on drugs getting their views across.

    Too many of us are led by the hand into unquestioning and unfounded opinions that the war on drugs is a good, effective and a morally justifiable crusade.

    I think I may have recommended a book to you earlier in this thread, and will do so again, as it gives an Irish insight into the War on Drugs.

    It is "The Irish War on Drugs: The Seductive Folly of Prohibition" by Dr Paul O'Mahony of Trinity College Dublin (Manchester University Press, October 14, 2008)

    It is extremely reader friendly, and will give you some detailed statistics on the reality of drug use and criminalisation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,743 ✭✭✭kleefarr


    Nodferatu wrote: »
    there is no HARDLINE evidence to show cannabis causes cancer but its a well known fact tobacco does cause lung cancer

    Also heard that Alcohol cause mouth cancer.
    One fact of the matter way it doesn't get legalised is there is no easy way to detect it in drivers like alcohol can be.
    There is no doubt that the lesser of the two evils is Marijuana and there are many reasons why we are not allowed it. But, the day will come.
    I also think that serious thought should be given to the affects of alcohol on our world and the havoc it causes when misused.
    Interchange the two drugs and the world would be a better happier place in my opinion.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 844 ✭✭✭Elevator


    kleefarr wrote: »
    Also heard that Alcohol cause mouth cancer.
    One fact of the matter way it doesn't get legalised is there is no easy way to detect it in drivers like alcohol can be.
    There is no doubt that the lesser of the two evils is Marijuana and there are many reasons why we are not allowed it. But, the day will come.
    I also think that serious thought should be given to the affects of alcohol on our world and the havoc it causes when misused.
    Interchange the two drugs and the world would be a better happier place in my opinion.

    look the only reason it was banned in the first place was that it interfeered with big american business (ie printing, textile etc etc) and had absolutely nothing to do with the good of our health!! the truth about this wonderful plant has been suppressed long enough and now we find ourselves in a place where or yanky leaders are relaxing the laws the second they need the cah injection to their econemy!! the most versatile plant on the planet and all we hear about is the smoking of it.

    I would love to grow tons of it here, take over a massive industrial estate and set up many different businesses all using hemp as their raw materials. I would make an absolute fortune!!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,629 ✭✭✭NullZer0


    I say we just impose additional tax on Bavaria, Buckfast and Linden Village :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    kleefarr wrote: »
    Also heard that Alcohol cause mouth cancer.
    One fact of the matter way it doesn't get legalised is there is no easy way to detect it in drivers like alcohol can be.

    There are a number of trial roadside test kits that can determine the impact cannabis is having on your driving. These are saliva test kits, in Australia and Canada. There are also a range of very simple and cheap urine test kits that determine the amount of thc in your blood and fat. Though this would be a very unhelpful system of testing as cannabis can be detected through urinalysis long after it has stopped affecting your cognitive functions.

    Road safety is only a very recent addition to the "justification for criminalisation" list. It had no bearing whatsoever when the Misuse of Drugs Act was being drafted. All the reasons cited in court cases and by politicians, even to this day, for ongoing criminalisation are based on conclusions that have been wholly disproved by modern evidence based research.

    For examples see, the gateway drug theory, the cancer theory, the sexual predator theory,............

    The only argument that had some merit was that it may contribute to or exacerbate pre-existing schizophrenic tendencies. As a stressful workplace can.

    The one valid and proven argument is that cannabis misuse (not simple use, and most use is not misuse) leads to a-motivation and laziness. Like daytime TV.


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,163 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    If you want to legalise cannabis to increase tourism then you might as well build a wall around Temple Bar, coz I for one wouldnt be going in there.
    Can you imagine the usual crowd of hammered staggers also off their faces on drugs? Oh yes please.
    You wouldnt get a nice mellow chilled atmosphere that you imagine. You would get a cesspool of petty crime, drunk and disorderly behaviour 7 days a week and no end of trouble.

    Madness.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 844 ✭✭✭Elevator


    GreeBo wrote: »
    If you want to legalise cannabis to increase tourism then you might as well build a wall around Temple Bar, coz I for one wouldnt be going in there.
    Can you imagine the usual crowd of hammered staggers also off their faces on drugs? Oh yes please.
    You wouldnt get a nice mellow chilled atmosphere that you imagine. You would get a cesspool of petty crime, drunk and disorderly behaviour 7 days a week and no end of trouble.

    Madness.

    they may be better off smokn some sweet ganja than drinking watered down pints and jäger bombs

    ***newsflash***

    there were legal/illegal drugs down temple bar last weekend and guess what??

    there will be same drugs down there next weekend coming too. what are we going to do??


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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,069 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    GreeBo wrote: »
    If you want to legalise cannabis to increase tourism then you might as well build a wall around Temple Bar, coz I for one wouldnt be going in there.
    Can you imagine the usual crowd of hammered staggers also off their faces on drugs? Oh yes please.
    You wouldnt get a nice mellow chilled atmosphere that you imagine. You would get a cesspool of petty crime, drunk and disorderly behaviour 7 days a week and no end of trouble.

    Madness.

    Or perhaps disallow it in already busy tourist areas? Anyway, I think legalisation would be ridiculous, and cause more problems in the long run than it would solve. The possession of small quantities for personal use should simply be decriminalised to take the strain off the courts and Gardai.


  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    GreeBo wrote: »
    If you want to legalise cannabis to increase tourism then you might as well build a wall around Temple Bar, coz I for one wouldnt be going in there.
    Can you imagine the usual crowd of hammered staggers also off their faces on drugs? Oh yes please.
    You wouldnt get a nice mellow chilled atmosphere that you imagine. You would get a cesspool of petty crime, drunk and disorderly behaviour 7 days a week and no end of trouble.

    Madness.

    That is an excellent point. The key there would be strict licensing of the sale and consumption of cannabis or any other drug. So you would limit any point of sale in areas such as temple bar, where there has been no rational planning for the distribution of liquor licenses.

    You would not permit on the street consumption, as with alcohol.

    If you want to avoid an Amsterdam-style scenario, then don't follow the Dutch model, which is unregulated decriminalisation. Not legalisation and full regulation, which is what the people of California will be voting on this November.

    The Dutch model does not deal with the natural issues that result from an unregulated market. They are beginning to clamp down on the prevalence of Coffee shops, but so much of their tourist industry is based on it now, economic factors are stifling any progressive changes.

    If a State takes full responsibility, and learns from the past mistakes of a laissez faire system of alcohol and tobacco regulation (which society is now starting to come to terms with), a much more effective and mature economy could develop.


  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    Or perhaps disallow it in already busy tourist areas? Anyway, I think legalisation would be ridiculous, and cause more problems in the long run than it would solve. The possession of small quantities for personal use should simply be decriminalised to take the strain off the courts and Gardai.

    Decriminalising possession does not deal with the ongoing and far more serious problem of the criminally controlled black market in drugs. All this gang violence that has sprung up over the last 3 decades is motivated by the vast profits earned in the illegal market.

    If you decriminalise, you still leave these people to earn their living from supplying the products in very high demand.

    There is no quality control, no price control, no tax re-balancing and no substantial drop in drug related crime under a decriminalised model.

    You say decriminalisation would ease the strain on Gardai and the Courts? They are not arresting and locking people up for simple possession.

    Decriminalisation does not deal with the real issues around drug use, it merely removes on the more draconian sticks in the Criminal Justice system.

    What problems do you suppose legalisation could add to the current catastrophe that is prohibition?


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,069 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    oconcuc wrote: »
    Decriminalising possession does not deal with the ongoing and far more serious problem of the criminally controlled black market in drugs. All this gang violence that has sprung up over the last 3 decades is motivated by the vast profits earned in the illegal market.

    If you decriminalise, you still leave these people to earn their living from supplying the products in very high demand.

    There is no quality control, no price control, no tax re-balancing and no substantial drop in drug related crime under a decriminalised model.

    You say decriminalisation would ease the strain on Gardai and the Courts? They are not arresting and locking people up for simple possession.

    Decriminalisation does not deal with the real issues around drug use, it merely removes on the more draconian sticks in the Criminal Justice system.

    What problems do you suppose legalisation could add to the current catastrophe that is prohibition?

    There'll always be a black market, it still exists for alcohol and cigarettes. Is it possible that legalisation would drive the price and quality of stuff down in that market?

    Are we just talking about cannabis here or all drugs? I don't think I'd like to live in a society where the use of heroin or cocaine is widely viewed as acceptable, and in time it would be viewed as acceptable by the vast majority of people. That might mean that more people are likely to fall back on it and the benefits of legal use would be diminished by the number of people negatively affected by use


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 844 ✭✭✭Elevator


    cannibas has continued to be banned cos our yanky neighbours say so but mark my words as soon as they relax their laws the rest of the world will follow. as Bill Hicks puts it, "a plant that's been around for 80bn yeArs suddenly gets banned in the last century!!"

    it's so mental it's scary!! we need this plant to be grown everywhere for it's many uses and not just it's theraputic properties.

    also on the subject of quality if it were to be decriminalised/legalised, we would be able to grow it for our own use and if ya just can't seem to grasp the simplistic nature of growing what needs very little help growing (it's a weed jim, but not as know it!!) then I'm sure you'll find someone who has and for a small monatery donation would part with some.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    There'll always be a black market, it still exists for alcohol and cigarettes. Is it possible that legalisation would drive the price and quality of stuff down in that market?

    Well Í'm in Netherlands now, city bout the size of belfast. Never been offered weed or any other drugs on the street. In Amsterdam been offered coke/E but not weed.

    I know a dutch guy who smokes a lot and he also buys in coffee shops.

    How big is the black market for alcohol? Can't say I know anyone who's ever bought it from a dealer.

    Black market for cigs because the govt gave into the anti-smoking lobby and lost run of themselves with taxes/


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5 John Lennon Peace Love and FF


    Tobacco kills 750.000 per year

    Alcohol kills 400.000 per year

    coffee kills 4.500 per year

    aspirin kills 7.500 per year

    Cannabis Kills 0 what you say 0 dont believe me look in google videos for a video called

    THE UNION , THE BUSINESS BEHIND CANNABIS ,,,

    Its all in it ,,

    from professors from Harvard uni and many more top Law official's


    THE UNION , THE BUSINESS BEHIND CANNABIS ,,,

    when you see the video please comment on this truly

    Totally agree man, I think Cowen should do the right thing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,163 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    Elevator wrote: »
    they may be better off smokn some sweet ganja than drinking watered down pints and jäger bombs

    ***newsflash***

    there were legal/illegal drugs down temple bar last weekend and guess what??

    there will be same drugs down there next weekend coming too. what are we going to do??

    ***newsflash***
    If you dont see the difference between levels of illegal drug use and the corresponding increased levels due to legalising drug then any logical arguments are wasted on you (and you are probably stoned)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭ordinarywoman


    GreeBo wrote: »
    ***newsflash***
    If you dont see the difference between levels of illegal drug use and the corresponding increased levels due to legalising drug then any logical arguments are wasted on you (and you are probably stoned)


    reserch has proved that legalising mj does not increase its usage....its is less toxic than alcohol or tobacco...
    i wouldn't be bothered going into temple bar anyway...i dont go into the bars in my hometown...because i dont like drunk people...i never have, they are messy arguementitive and whingy, with no co-ordination...and it always ends in tears but that is not the point of this thread in honesty...

    People world wide have been taking drugs since the dawn of time.if it be alcohol,mj,coke whatever...we chose our own poison..and that is not going to change weither it is legalised or not....and neither is the Saturday night party in Temple Bar

    This is about weither our government has the balls to legalise it or decriminalise it for monitary reasons to pull ourselves out of the mess that our government put us in the first place...
    And it would work...if you look at it in totality...not just mj...but the hemp plant...
    The whole marijuana plant is usable medicinally, even down to the roots...

    And Hemp can be used for fuel, clothes textiles paper, insulation...again there is NO WASTE...it is a RENEWABLE GREEN ENERGY...

    and as far as the legal system goes first the gardi have to waste their time reserching and finding dealers, time and effort to bust them, court costs, prison costs... and then we the tax payer end up paying for a dealers stay at the states request...

    ITs a weed...a GOD given weed , that grows in the soil like the carrots you had for your dinner last night and mj has proven to cure cancer...unlike tobacco which has be proven to cause cancer and thats legal...our government should be bought to justice for allowing sick patients die without even considering mj as a life saving medicine...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭oconcuc


    GreeBo wrote: »
    ***newsflash***
    If you dont see the difference between levels of illegal drug use and the corresponding increased levels due to legalising drug then any logical arguments are wasted on you (and you are probably stoned)

    There is no evidence to support any contention that legalisation will result in increased use.

    If you are in any doubt, look at the rate of use of cannabis in the Netherlands where the population have de facto legalised access to cannabis.

    Regular cannabis use rates in the Netherlands are around 5.5% currently. Not significantly more than before they moderated their laws in the 1970's, and their rates are currently less than France, the UK and Ireland, where cannabis is illegal.

    When the Netherlands began normalising their drugs laws, there were many here, and abroad, who predicted apocalyptic results, with the entire region descending into a hedonistic, drug-fueled chaos.

    It still amazes me that despite the evidence, this argument is trotted out time and again as a justification for continued use of the criminal law as deterrent against drug use.

    That is just with cannabis, who large portions of the population think is relatively harmless. Do you somehow think that the public would be more likely to increase their use of heroin, just because the government says they will no longer criminalise the use and supply of it? People are aware of how dangerous heroin is, why would that change just because the criminal law changes? Do you really believe people will be queuing up to begin using heroin if they government said it was no longer illegal?

    Would you suddenly decide that, despite the huge risks to your health, you would begin taking heroin?

    This argument, is not supported by any evidence whatsoever. Just because a substance is no longer illegal, doesn't mean that as a consequence a government or a society endorse it's use.

    We criminalised suicide until 25 years ago. Were you in the mood for some suicide when the government announced it was no longer a criminal offense to kill yourself? Was there are noticeable increase in the number of suicides when it was decriminalised?

    These arguments were also made before the decriminalisation of homosexuality in 1993. Politicians and judges felt that if the criminal sanctions were removed, all the men in Ireland would abandon their families and begin having affairs with their male neighbours and friends.

    If these are the only foundations for laws that see otherwise lawful people tarred with the label criminal, every day, and profit the most dangerous and unscrupulous individuals in our society, then the law is an absurdity.


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