Chivalry; dead & gone or alive & strong?

Will

Is there a place for chivalry in modern society? Is it old fashioned and out dated? Is it demeaning to the modern woman?

My thinking on it, is that it doesn't take much to be nice and hold the door for a woman (or a man for that matter) or offer a friend your coat if they are cold. Was talking a long while ago to a friend and she was saying that it annoys her when I or anyone else holds a door open for her, that she is perfectly capable of going through a door herself.

This took me by surprise, I was always taught as a kid to be courteous and mannerly. My friends remark more or less threw me as I tried to think and ask her why she found it irritating. We talked about it some more and we came to the conclusion above. I tried to explain that I wasn't trying to imply she couldn't walk through a door or hold one open, but that I was just being courteous.

I still do it with other people, as i said it's nice to be nice and doesn't really harm anyone.

Anywho what think ye fair men of the Gentlemen's Club?

edit: The ladies opinions are most welcome also, thanks!

Gran Hermano

I will hold a door open for anyone - regardless of race, gender, age.
If some woman misconstrues that as sexist behaviour on my behalf she is
only highlighting an ignorance and lack of basic manners on her side.

I am not questioning a woman's physical ability to open a door for herself
and if she is deluded to think so I pity her.

Shy_Dave!

I've always held the door open for people, gave them a seat on the bus, been mannerly courteous polite etc, and it would really annoy me if someone was actually offended by that, it really doesn't make sense to me :P

Futurecrook

Gran Hermano wrote: »

I will hold a door open for anyone - regardless of race, gender, age.

Exactly. I don't understand women who think that it is somehow "demeaning". To me it's just good manners. I'd do the same for anyone else.

If I'm interested in a guy, the fact that he is "chivalrous" will always score him extra points. It's always nice to meet a nice, mannerly thoughtful person. I definitely wouldn't get annoyed with someone holding a door open for me or offering me a coat on a night out.

helimachoptor

Definitely still alive and well, stopped on the M50 on Sunday to help change a tire for a girl

khennessy86

From a female perspective, i say keep it up,
as another user says it doesnt hurt to be nice, i'll hold a door open for someone or give up a seat, i have to say though theres nothing worse when you hold a door for someone , and they can't even manage a simple thanks,

keep up the chivarly lads, its alway's appreciated, and not demeaning .

Snowie

The way I see it is, as you said will its not hard to be a bit of a gentleman and hold a door open, or give a jacket to a female friend whos cold.

I dunno if this is true or correct But I think some women get shocked buy it, I think some women may think "Oh whats he after?" and other women genrally apprciate it...

your friend said that if she's perfectly able to hold a door this may be the case, but not why you me or any other men do it, becuase i think at times its the right thing to do.

Other times its not like for instance giving an old lady a buss seat ona full bus. or helping an old lady with her bags of a train all things I have no problem doing and if I see a girl in my own age group struggeling with a heavy case Il offer her help .

Its not wrong but to behonest some times its because there taking so damm long and offering your help is a hand for them and other times it becuase she looks like shes getting flusterd and strugeling.

I don't see any harm in it.

shellyboo

Futurecrook wrote: »

Exactly. I don't understand women who think that it is somehow "demeaning". To me it's just good manners. I'd do the same for anyone else.

If I'm interested in a guy, the fact that he is "chivalrous" will always score him extra points. It's always nice to meet a nice, mannerly thoughtful person. I definitely wouldn't get annoyed with someone holding a door open for me or offering me a coat on a night out.

I agree entirely. Any acts of door-holding, seat-pulling-out, car-door-opening, bag-carrying, coat-giving, umbrella-holding etc are massive brownie point earners for me.

I love a man who's not afraid to be chivalrous, and I think guys appreciate a woman who can take it in the spirit that it's intended.

minidazzler

I hold the door for everyone, if a woman got annoyed by it I would just tell her this and walk away.

My problem is though, when you are walking toward a door ahead of someone and you don't know how far back they are Do you.
A) HOld the door regardless and risk having to wait an awkward 7 seconds for them to reach the door.
Let the door close and risk it closing in their face?

CDfm

I try but don't find it disconcerting if someone doesn't take up the offer and like doing it.

A few years back I was on a date and we were walking up the Grand Canal with me on the outside. Very seriously, I got a lecture on the origan of men walking on the outside and sword drawing, sewage disposal etc in times past. No big deal and her point proved she triumphantly walked on the outside while I meekly took the inside track.

It had been raining earlier and when the next car...Splash.Head to toe left hand side soaked- rhs not so bad. Me totally dry. My sides hurt from laughing.

Red Sleeping Beauty

I'm not chivalrous and I hate.
I am however nice to men and women and hold doors open for anyone and if someone drops something or needs a hand I'll offer (if I can). Sod this "be nice to a woman" crap just cause she's got a vagina. Does my tits in :mad:

Red Sleeping Beauty

minidazzler wrote: »

I hold the door for everyone, if a woman got annoyed by it I would just tell her this and walk away.

My problem is though, when you are walking toward a door ahead of someone and you don't know how far back they are Do you.
A) HOld the door regardless and risk having to wait an awkward 7 seconds for them to reach the door.
Let the door close and risk it closing in their face?

I wait the few seconds depending on how many feet away they are and how fast they're walking. That counts for people of all ages regardless of sex.

CDfm

Alan Rouge wrote: »

Sod this "be nice to a woman" crap just cause she's got a vagina.

:DLOL most unattached blokes do just that

c0mpliant

I got this from a friend of mine too. The exact same arguement, word for fraking word, which makes me wonder if its the same person, or are they simply getting a memo with all the talking points on it.

I held the door open for her and she practically assaults me verbally in front of large number of people. "Do you not think I can open the door for myself? I've been opening doors my whole life, I don't need you opening it for me!" Complete with a look that I would have only have expected (prior to this) if I had fed a baby a jalapeno pepper covered in tabasco sauce, or if she had walked in on me with her mother. We proceded to have a "discussion" in which I tried to convince her that I wasn't suggesting that she didn't have the strength to open the door, or that when I was walking on the outside of the path earlier in the day I wasn't trying to suggest that I was protecting her. While she tried her best to imply that I was some sort of sexist chauvinistic scumbag because I thought it was polite to hold the door open for woman (ignoring the fact that I had said I hold the door open for all not just based on gender) and that I would continue to do so as well as certain other aspects of being a gentleman/chivalrous.

I was afraid that perhaps I had gotten the wrong end of the stick so I surveyed all women I knew and they said that at the worst they didn't find it offensive and best they found it an admirable quality. I decided to file the incident as perhaps a slight over-reaction

I think your friend is looking for something to complain about!!
I ALWAYS appreciate a guy who holds open a door for me, and i think it'd be the height of rudeness to berate him for it!! At the same time i wouldnt stand there expecting him to open it if we were both going for the same door! i think a bit of chivalry is always appreciated, but the kind that comes naturally, not the sleazy i want to get into your pants kind. Girls can see that a mile off IMHO!!
Anyway boys, i just wanted to say keep it up because this girl is grateful that there are still a few gentlemen around!!

c0mpliant

newbie85 wrote: »

I think your friend is looking for something to complain about!!
I ALWAYS appreciate a guy who holds open a door for me, and i think it'd be the height of rudeness to berate him for it!! At the same time i wouldnt stand there expecting him to open it if we were both going for the same door! i think a bit of chivalry is always appreciated, but the kind that comes naturally, not the sleazy i want to get into your pants kind. Girls can see that a mile off IMHO!!
Anyway boys, i just wanted to say keep it up because this girl is grateful that there are still a few gentlemen around!!

Thank you, I thought it was weird and I swear I must have looked like a dear caught in headlights when she said it, I didn't know whether to let go of the door or keep holding it!

CDfm

c0mpliant - I think you do get a few bunny boilers and drama queens who use that one as a reverse put down so its not original either.As a guy, I on the other hand think its very thoughtful of someone to hold a door open if my hands are full with a briefcase and umbrella.

You shouldnt be embarressed of having manners - but if you get a repeat just say - that you hold the door for guys too but will make an exception for her should she want you to.

I always think when I get a plastic bag in a shop that its impolite for the assistant not to open it as I am crap at that and they are trained.

c0mpliant

CDfm wrote: »

You shouldnt be embarressed of having manners - but if you get a repeat just say - that you hold the door for guys too but will make an exception for her should she want you to.

I always think when I get a plastic bag in a shop that its impolite for the assistant not to open it as I am crap at that and they are trained.

You're bang on about saying that, but she didn't really want to hear that part, she was happy with the rant!

You're also bang on about the plastic bags, although I worked in a shop once, didn't receive any training on the matter, I still to this day spend 20 minutes changing the bins in my place...

CDfm

CDfm wrote: »

I always think when I get a plastic bag in a shop that its impolite for the assistant not to open it as I am crap at that and they are trained.

c0mpliant wrote: »

You're also bang on about the plastic bags, although I worked in a shop once, didn't receive any training on the matter, I still to this day spend 20 minutes changing the bins in my place...

Guys, i can solve your problems! just breathe on the top of the bag as if you wanted to make condensation on a window!! Hey presto you'll be able to open it!!

CDfm

newbie85 wrote: »

Guys, i can solve your problems! just breathe on the top of the bag as if you wanted to make condensation on a window!! Hey presto you'll be able to open it!!

I can hear the scream "Pervert" thru the shop

lol once you don't start rubbing the bag against your legs to open it i'm sure you'll get away with it!!:)

Gran Hermano

newbie85 wrote: »

lol once you don't start rubbing the bag against your legs to open it i'm sure you'll get away with it!!:)

That's not a gentlemanly way to refer to the female shop assistant...:D

Gran Hermano

Gran Hermano wrote: »

That's not a gentlemanly way to refer to the female shop assistant...:D

LMAO! But i'm never going to be a gentleMAN!:)

CDfm

c0mpliant wrote: »

You're bang on about saying that, but she didn't really want to hear that part, she was happy with the rant!

Not exactly the tie to nod sagely and ask "that time of the month?":pac:

Gran Hermano

CDfm wrote: »

Not exactly the tie to nod sagely and ask "that time of the month?":pac:

Just tell any woman who berates you for holding open a door that you were taught to assist the old, the infirm and the mentally disabled.
Failing that just tell her you thought she was pregnant

c0mpliant

Gran Hermano wrote: »

Just tell any woman who berates you for holding open a door that you were taught to assist the old, the infirm and the mentally disabled.
Failing that just tell her you thought she was pregnant

Adding fuel to the fire is a phrase that springs to mind. I still prefer to defuse the situation rather than throwing a piece of uranium at a much large piece of uranium!

Stheno

I think it's basic good manners to hold a door open for someone if they are behind you, regardless of their gender.

In the case where someone is a few seconds behind me, I'd often ask them were they coming in, and hold the door, it's only a few seconds.

I've come across people carrying heavy stuff (computer equipment etc) and getting doors closing in their faces etc, and it's just awful.

actua11

nouggatti wrote: »

I think it's basic good manners to hold a door open for someone if they are behind you, regardless of their gender.

It is, but there's always the "I'm able to open doors myself thanks" response!

Chivalry is alive but for what ever reason, it's often frowned upon.

CDfm

c0mpliant wrote: »

Adding fuel to the fire is a phrase that springs to mind. I still prefer to defuse the situation rather than throwing a piece of uranium at a much large piece of uranium!

That means you are accepting a tantrum from someone old enough to know better and that is not good.You should be able to say "excuse me-why the outburst" , if someone offers you a vcoffee you dont want byou dont say "piss off£ and the "I can open doors myself" is only impressive if you are under 5.

c0mpliant

nouggatti wrote: »

I've come across people carrying heavy stuff (computer equipment etc) and getting doors closing in their faces etc, and it's just awful.

Has anyone ever worked in a place that are security crazy and don't let you hold the door open for people because they need to swipe through. I had such a moral conundrum everyday when I was in a support services company in Ballycoolin. As I watched them come close to the door, the countdown music would start in my head as I weighed the potential snubbing I would give them in favour of security policy, or risk another rather stern talking to from security who's only job is to jump on "tailgater's"!

Otis Driftwood

I wouldnt really look at chivalry as holding a door open because I would do that for anyone,male or female,as others have said,its just good manners,plain and simple.

I would take chivalry to mean things like pulling herselfs chair out before she sits down,taking off or putting on her jacket when entering/leaving a place,opening the car door for her or giving her your jacket without her having to ask.

If that makes me a sexist pig then stick an apple in my mouth and hang me on a spit cos Im never going to change.

c0mpliant

nedtheshed wrote: »

If that makes me a sexist pig then stick an apple in my mouth and hang me on a spit cos Im never going to change.

Well said man. Couldn't agree more

Stheno

c0mpliant wrote: »

Has anyone ever worked in a place that are security crazy and don't let you hold the door open for people because they need to swipe through. I had such a moral conundrum everyday when I was in a support services company in Ballycoolin. As I watched them come close to the door, the countdown music would start in my head as I weighed the potential snubbing I would give them in favour of security policy, or risk another rather stern talking to from security who's only job is to jump on "tailgater's"!

Yeah, worked in two places like that, one I'd be arriving in with my hands full of stuff, and the swipe thingy was about five feet from the doors, you'd swipe with your badge in your mouth/various stuff precariously balanced, then scuttle like a demented chicken to make the door on time, whilst the supercilious security people stood buy nodding sagely :rolleyes:

CDfm

nedtheshed wrote: »

If that makes me a sexist pig then stick an apple in my mouth and hang me on a spit cos Im never going to change.

Is there any particular type of apple you recommend. My girlfriend has left a bowl( more like a bucket) of fruit for me and Im sure I can find an appropriate apple.

Otis Driftwood

CDfm wrote: »

Is there any particular type of apple you recommend. My girlfriend has left a bowl( more like a bucket) of fruit for me and Im sure I can find an appropriate apple.

I have always been partial to golden delicious but Im not sure how well they would go with roast Neddy.:pac:

Stheno

nedtheshed wrote: »

I have always been partial to golden delicious but Im not sure how well they would go with roast Neddy.:pac:

When I read your post it reminded me of a book I read recently about the crusades and how they used steel pears which expanded in a victims mouth.

I now have a vision of a pigs head stretched by a rusty steel pear

L31mr0d

nouggatti wrote: »

I've come across people carrying heavy stuff (computer equipment etc) and getting doors closing in their faces etc, and it's just awful.

How attractive where the people carrying the heavy stuff?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F--v5MP9ZSk

Homicidal_jesus

LOVE IT!
2 foot grey area brilliant!!

c0mpliant

Poor Elton John..."Someone like Elton John would need to be travelling at the speed of light just to get in the 4.5 feet distance and even then he may find the door locked"
lol

maherro

now to figure where I am on the scale.....

Emme

Shy_Dave! wrote: »

I've always held the door open for people, gave them a seat on the bus, been mannerly courteous polite etc, and it would really annoy me if someone was actually offended by that, it really doesn't make sense to me :P

I grew up on a farm and was expected to pull my weight as much as any guy and any feminine helplessness was ridiculed. I wasn't allowed to drive a car until I could change a tyre unaided and had a basic knowledge of motor maintenance. However, even though I am capable of opening my own doors, carrying my own stuff, changing my own tyres if somebody, male or female, is polite enough to help me do any of the above and more I always smile and thank them. It's rude not do.

It is extremely rude to barge ahead of a person in a corridor, go through the doors and leave them to swing in that person's face. The men where I work always do it, I work in a university. It doesn't matter if the person is male or female. By contrast I've notice that delivery guys are always very chivalrous even if they are laden down with stuff. I always try to open doors for them, they've got a job to do and at the end of the day they're as important as Professor Swinging Doors and Dr Barge Past.



The title of this thread should be "Manners, dead & gone or alive & strong?"