Today's the day for processing the licensing system.

Our man in Havana

So the same old mess is still going to happen.

Sparks

No, in the old days it was just a mess.
Now, it's law...

Our man in Havana

Sparks wrote: »

No, in the old days it was just a mess.
Now, it's law...

Well it is going to be interesting.

iwsf

wonder what will happen if somebody from outside Ireland wants to come for a hunting holiday in Ireland and bring its own firearm ?
Will they have to go through the same process ?

Sparks

Slightly different process iwsf, one-year licence and the form goes to the Minister I think...

chem

This is all starting to smell lads! Can see alot of fokes been asked to hand in their firearms after the extentions run out. Something similar to the 1970s??? Hope im wrong on this. But lately Ive seen how underhanded some areas of the state can work:mad:

Sparks

chem wrote: »

This is all starting to smell lads!

Starting? Starting?!?! Where have you been for the last five years?

chem

Sparks wrote: »

Starting? Starting?!?! Where have you been for the last five years?

Feels like im rotten in Denmark at the min:D

Silly me having faith in the government. I really believed (for a short while) that we had started to walk upright in this country and left our stone tools for somthing better! Silly, Silly me:rolleyes:

PJ Hunter

chem wrote: »

Feels like im rotten in Denmark at the min:D

Silly me having faith in the government. I really believed (for a short while) that we had started to walk upright in this country and left our stone tools for somthing better! Silly, Silly me:rolleyes:

Silly, Silly me:rolleyes:

devils in the detail:p



http://www.dermotahern.ie/newsdetails.php?id=196


Minister Ahern continued: "The modernisation of the licensing system is a big step forward and will result in a better system all round, with benefits accruing at many levels. This Act gives the Garda Commissioner the additional powers he needs to address matters relating to firearms licensing."

Minister Ahern concluded: "The vast majority of licensed firearms holders have nothing to fear from the bringing into force of these provisions of the Act. Instead, the Act provides for a modern, comprehensive licensing regime, while at the same time outlawing unacceptable practices."

Sparks

PJ, you're looking at the wrong bill.
The fun and games started in the 2006 CJA, not the more recent 2009 CJ(MP)A - though the pistol shooters can tell you that the 2009 act didn't hold back in getting the boot in either.
And most of this stuff was all flagged on here in 2004 (and those representing us to the DoJ at the time pooh-poohed the concerns as silly scaremongering as I recall).

Sikamick

Guidelines badly written contradictory and worded wrong i.e.

www.dermotahern.ie/newsdetails.php?id=196 from Aherns website.

EXAMPLE 1:COMMUNICATION OF THE DECISION ON THE GRANTING OF A FIREARMS CERTIFICATE
Section 3 of the Firearms Act 1925 as amended, provides that a decision on an application for a firearms certificate or its renewal shall be given within 3 months from the date on which the applicant submitted a completed application. Where an application is refused, the applicant shall be informed in writing of the refusal and the reason for it. If a decision on an application is not made within this 3 month period then this is deemed to be a refusal under section 15A of the Firearms Act 1925 as inserted by section 43 of the Criminal Justice Act 2006.

Minister Ahern said: "This Act is about halting the emergence of a gun-culture in Ireland. Experience in other countries shows us that any relaxation of controls on gun ownership or registration very quickly results in dramatic growth in firearms with many longer term negative downstream consequences. I will not allow that happen on my watch."

Example 2: Rifles
Rifles should be single shot or bolt action with calibres up to .308 inch. (7.62mm). There can be cross-over between rifles used for hunting or those for target shooting. Rifles designed for military/police tactical use or with large magazine capacity are more dangerous and the difference between them and ordinary rifles does not make them any more suited to target and clay shooting. The same applies to rifles which are variants of military assault rifles, bullpups with folding or telescopic stocks or semi-automatic centrefire calibres. Rifles to be safe should have a barrel length of more than 50cm.


This section should have been used as guidelines they are more truthful: The Act introduces the most far-reaching gun control measures since the foundation of the state including:

· A ban on handguns.

· A ban on ‘practical shooting’ (a self styled extreme shooting activity).

· Ministerial powers to prohibit particular firearms or categories of firearms in a precise manner.

· A requirement for referees, background medical checks and standards for the safe keeping of guns in the home for all firearms licence applicants;

· Radically tightened licensing procedures for the renewal of currently licensed guns;

· New regulations governing target shooting Clubs and Ranges.

· Those involved in target shooting (rifle and pistol) will be subject to a more rigorous authorisation procedure by the Garda Commissioner;

· A new three year licence with outsourced fee collection and licence production resulting in greater efficiency and improved customer service at garda station level;

· New guidelines on licensing matters, published by the Garda Commissioner, which will be available to the public.


Minister Ahern continued: "The modernisation of the licensing system is a big step forward and will result in a better system all round, with benefits accruing at many levels. This Act gives the Garda Commissioner the additional powers he needs to address matters relating to firearms licensing."


To deal with the issue of ‘realistic imitation firearms‘, the Act introduces a range of measures including restrictions on their import, sale and use. Three of these measures will be introduced:



· it will be an offence to brandish a realistic imitation firearm in public;

· Garda Superintendents will have the power to authorise ‘airsoft’ venues; and the establishment of a register of dealers.
Minister Ahern concluded: "The vast majority of licensed firearms holders have nothing to fear from the bringing into force of these provisions of the Act. Instead, the Act provides for a modern, comprehensive licensing regime, while at the same time outlawing unacceptable practices."

Sikamick

Sparks

Okay sikamick, seriously man, I can't make heads nor tails of what you were trying to do there. Is the red your comment or you highlighting something? What's the blue text for? Give a lad a chance!

chem

Have to say im abit confused also mick

Sikamick

Sorry Sparks but it is becoming extremely frustrating for myself and our Club members and I am sure many other shooters. I thought the application form was complicated until I saw the Guidelines.

provides that a decision on an application for a firearms certificate or its renewal shall be given within 3 months from the date on which the applicant submitted a completed application. Where an application is refused, the applicant shall be informed in writing of the refusal and the reason for it. This part is contradicted by this part:If a decision on an application is not made within this 3 month period then this is deemed to be a refusal under section 15A of the Firearms Act 1925 as inserted by section 43 of the Criminal Justice Act 2006. Are we going to get notified or not, it should be one or the other.


Rifles:Used for clay shooting Who wrote this into the guidelines.


Guidelines:This section should have been used as guidelines they are more truthful. I think from here down explains itself.


Sikamick

PJ Hunter

chem wrote: »

Have to say im abit confused also mick

+1

· Radically tightened licensing procedures for the renewal of currently licensed guns. renewals
"The vast majority of licensed firearms holders have nothing to fear"

Sparks

Are we going to get notified or not, it should be one or the other.

It's a cop-out: if you're notified in the three months, the Super has to give you a reason. If he says nothing, you're deemed notified and he hasn't had to give you a reason. Mind you, if a DC starts seeing every applicant turn up in the DC contesting this, the Judges' patience will be gone very fast.

Rifles:Used for clay shooting Who wrote this into the guidelines.

Someone looking to stop someone opening a rifle range where the rifles were fired at clays, which doesn't seem to count as target shooting (and therefore try to sneak the rifle range in as a shotgun range and dodge the range inspection standards).

Sikamick

Re the Rifles and clay shooting I wouldn't agree with you there Sparks, I think it is more like typo error.

Sikamick

chem

Sparks wrote: »

It's a cop-out: if you're notified in the three months, the Super has to give you a reason. If he says nothing, you're deemed notified and he hasn't had to give you a reason. Mind you, if a DC starts seeing every applicant turn up in the DC contesting this, the Judges' patience will be gone very fast.

There are 101 reasons to refuse a licence or revoke it with these new laws, and get out clauses all over it for the supers. Lets face the fact folks. The government dont want guns here full stop. They are doing everything they can to try make it as hard as they can for someone to own one. I jumped trough all the hoops for them, alarmed safe connected to a digi dialer and anything else the CPO askede of me. And was still refused a licence for an SMLE (over 3 months) no letter etc...............

The guidelines only mention the ruleings which, were in support of the clamp down on guns here. Not the ones in favour of having lawfull people following their soprt/hobby. They even go as far as to tell supers that anyone looking for a gun MIGHT be up to something and to look into their applications abit more. Folkes this is the beginning of the end right here.:mad:

chem

Sikamick wrote: »

Re the Rifles and clay shooting I wouldn't agree with you there Sparks, I think it is more like typo error.

Sikamick

Or just pure miss information and ignorance!

Sikamick

PJ is this what you mean.Radically tightened licensing procedures for the renewal of currently licensed guns;

Sikamick

Grizzly 45

Sparks wrote: »

It's a cop-out: if you're notified in the three months, the Super has to give you a reason. If he says nothing, you're deemed notified and he hasn't had to give you a reason. Mind you, if a DC starts seeing every applicant turn up in the DC contesting this, the Judges' patience will be gone very fast.

Someone looking to stop someone opening a rifle range where the rifles were fired at clays, which doesn't seem to count as target shooting (and therefore try to sneak the rifle range in as a shotgun range and dodge the range inspection standards).

Must have been loads of cases of this happening to bring this onto the books....:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:,no doubt like the MC Carthyite style "proof" of the DOJ [I have the list of communists in the US Senate here in my pocket.] of IPSC being used for BG training..:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
Or more like,somone not having a clue about shooting and what they were on about or whats used for what... Like 98% of these incompetants and their minions that we elect to run this country.

BornToKill

Sikamick wrote: »

Re the Rifles and clay shooting I wouldn't agree with you there Sparks, I think it is more like typo error.

Sikamick

I've seen stationary clays used as targets for rifles. Didn't think it was that uncommon, to be honest.

BornToKill

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Like 98% of these incompetants and their minions that we elect to run this country.

Yes we do ...

Grizzly 45

[

"The vast majority of licensed firearms holders have nothing to fear"

Paraphrasing the mantra of tyrants and dictators thru history.:mad::mad::mad:
If you have done nothing wrong,you have nothing to fear..

BTK indeed we do ,and this shower have got too comfortable here over the last years,so you should then know how to voice your displeasure with them in three weeks time...
They obviously didnt listen at the local elections,maybe a good boot in the H*le on Lisbon might get their undivided attention..

Sparks

BornToKill wrote: »

Yes we do ...

+10,000.

Our man in Havana

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

[


Paraphrasing the mantra of tyrants and dictators thru history.:mad::mad::mad:
If you have done nothing wrong,you have nothing to fear..

Did a small man from Austria say that?

Grizzly 45

Indeed,
but not on the subject of firearms.[Got very bad press on that he did:pac:.]But no doubt he and his more nastier minions and fanatical hangers on quoted it plenty of times to misfortunates on their grand European tour of 39/45.
Meanwhile no doubt a large lad from Georgia,Russia and his cronies were saying that around the same time to 26million give or take ,of their own and other undesireables before they got an all expense paid holiday in Siberia,in a lead mine.
Without a doubt,every other little man with a funny hat and a chest full of self awarded medals[No not Baron Shortarrse!!:rolleyes:] has said somthing like this in every 3rd world Hell hole in the last 70 years.
More worrisome is post 9/11 we in the West are starting to bleat and baaa this on our "War on terror and drugs" abit too much for my liking..

Sikamick

BornToKill wrote: »

I've seen stationary clays used as targets for rifles. Didn't think it was that uncommon, to be honest.

________________________________________________________________

If it is not a typo and it means that you cant shoot stationary clays with a rifle it's PC gone made.

Sikamick

rrpc

Sikamick wrote: »

________________________________________________________________

If it is not a typo and it means that you cant shoot stationary clays with a rifle it's PC gone made.

Sikamick

Mick, you've taken a logical right turn and taken half of boards with you

I'll quote the bit you are having such a canary about again.

Rifles designed for military/police tactical use or with large magazine capacity are more dangerous and the difference between them and ordinary rifles does not make them any more suited to target and clay shooting.

I would hazard an educated guess that the first word/phrase should have read 'Rifles and Shotguns' for the rest to make sense. As the passage is describing how tactical/military firearms are more 'dangerous' and no more suitable for target use than conventional target firearms (not my sentiment btw), the other stuff that you are talking about is moot.

In other words, it's nothing to do with shooting at clays with rifles.

PJ Hunter

rrpc wrote: »

Mick, you've taken a logical right turn and taken half of boards with you

I'll quote the bit you are having such a canary about again.



I would hazard an educated guess that the first word/phrase should have read 'Rifles and Shotguns' for the rest to make sense. As the passage is describing how tactical/military firearms are more 'dangerous' and no more suitable for target use than conventional target firearms (not my sentiment btw), the other stuff that you are talking about is moot.

In other words, it's nothing to do with shooting at clays with rifles.

PJ is this what you mean.Radically tightened licensing procedures for the renewal of currently licensed guns;

Sikamick

it is but still don't know what this means if you know what i mean, Sikamick renewal of currently licensed guns; what you have is what you keep:)


35.—Section 9 (as substituted by section 53 of the Act of 2006) of
the Act of 1964 is amended by the substitution for subsection (6) of 35
the following:
“(6) An application for renewal of a firearm certificate shall
be in the prescribed form.”