Get flu jab or be jailed - in IRELAND

CarolineDarcy

This is a disgrace. You are a true peasant if you think that this jab should be forced on people.

humanji

CarolineDarcy wrote: »

This is a disgrace. You are a true peasant if you think that this jab should be forced on people.

Does anyone here think that? The debate is over whether it will happen or not.

Captain Furball

lol obvious trolling .

VinnyTGM

If it is going to be mandatory, they can forget about vaccinating me, I've always had a thing about needles and they can fup off if there thinking about this.

IrelandSpirit

Bottom line is: I would have to be tasered, bludgeoned half-dead and black-bagged before anyone sticks a f*cking needle in me against my freely-given consent – and at least one of the basterds is going down with me.

And I personally know at least five people here who’d do the same, who know five people more, who know five people more, etc, etc…

HSE must be out of their tiny f*cking minds to even contemplate it.

uprising

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

Bottom line is: I would have to be tasered, bludgeoned half-dead and black-bagged before anyone sticks a f*cking needle in me against my freely-given consent – and at least one of the basterds is going down with me.

And I personally know at least five people here who’d do the same, who know five people more, who know five people more, etc, etc…

HSE must be out of their tiny f*cking minds to even contemplate it.

Do you know me?, if you do, you now know 6.

IrelandSpirit

uprising wrote: »

Do you know me?, if you do, you now know 6.

Thank you my brother! Spoken like true freeman

tallaght01

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

HSE must be out of their tiny f*cking minds to even contemplate it.

just to be clear, the HSE are not contemplating mandatory swine flu vaccination.

IrelandSpirit

tallaght01 wrote: »

just to be clear, the HSE are not contemplating mandatory swine flu vaccination.

Until I see a sworn affidavit from the minister for health under full commercial liability to the contrary, I have little choice but to reserve judgment on what the HSE may or may not be contemplating. I’m in the process of drawing up such a document.

Personally, I wouldn’t put it past them to have thought about it, and it’s looking increasingly likely the UK’s going down that route – there’s a protest in London next week over plans there for mandatory inoculations, if you’re interested link below:

“The Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI) have taken over the control of the UK vaccination schedule and now have the power to bring in new vaccines without government approval even if they haven't been safety tested. Prior to this, all new vaccines would have to pass through parliament and be voted on before they were introduced. Now the government is compelled to agree with anything JCVI say, even if there is no science to back it up…”

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=15401

thecommander

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

Until I see a sworn affidavit from the minister for health under full commercial liability to the contrary, I have little choice but to reserve judgment on what the HSE may or may not be contemplating. I’m in the process of drawing up such a document.

If I told you the HSE had no plans to send us all to the moon would you require them to issue a statement officially denying it before you believe them?

Slugs

thecommander wrote: »

If I told you the HSE had no plans to send us all to the moon would you require them to issue a statement officially denying it before you believe them?

How out of context is that... Are other Governments doing the same? No. Then we have no reason to think our state owned health service would. However, are they planning in the UK, a governing body so closely linked to ours, and which our government deals with on a daily basis? Yes they are, would it be safe to assume that it's possible our government could do the same? Yes it is.

And Irelandspirit, make that 7

IrelandSpirit

thecommander wrote: »

If I told you the HSE had no plans to send us all to the moon would you require them to issue a statement officially denying it before you believe them?

Oh man, do ya know how much I wanted to go to the moon as a kid? I’d be thrilled to bits if they were building us spaceships!
I’d almost forgive them for force-medicating us with fluoride all these years…

Nah, I take that last bit back

IrelandSpirit

Slugs wrote: »

How out of context is that... Are other Governments doing the same? No. Then we have no reason to think our state owned health service would. However, are they planning in the UK, a governing body so closely linked to ours, and which our government deals with on a daily basis? Yes they are, would it be safe to assume that it's possible our government could do the same? Yes it is.

And Irelandspirit, make that 7

7 and counting! Thank for jumping in there

Let’s just hope it doesn’t come to that here – Norway, Israel, Switzerland, Greece, are going ahead with forced vaccinations (last time I checked) and France, US and UK are looking increasingly likely and a strong resistance is forming, as it is in Australia and Canada… it’s been a while since I looked into this properly – Lisbon distractions – but our lot better pray they’re not that stupid.
It’s one thing getting taxed into the ground to pay off their bankster buddies in Frankfurt, quite another messing with fundamental freedoms… then again, the power the WHO has over their members is near total once they've declared a 'pandemic'…

Slugs

Aye, indeed, the WHO can suck my f*cking balls as far as I'm concerned, but that doesn't matter to me. I'm out of Ireland in the Next few years, Ireland's mistakes are going to be payed for in blood, and this country isn't worth saving so long as the government lacks passionate patriots who give a f*ck about this country.

6th

Lads, can we tone down the aggressive/offensive posting.

tallaght01

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

Until I see a sworn affidavit from the minister for health under full commercial liability to the contrary, I have little choice but to reserve judgment on what the HSE may or may not be contemplating. I’m in the process of drawing up such a document.

Personally, I wouldn’t put it past them to have thought about it, and it’s looking increasingly likely the UK’s going down that route – there’s a protest in London next week over plans there for mandatory inoculations, if you’re interested link below:

“The Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI) have taken over the control of the UK vaccination schedule and now have the power to bring in new vaccines without government approval even if they haven't been safety tested. Prior to this, all new vaccines would have to pass through parliament and be voted on before they were introduced. Now the government is compelled to agree with anything JCVI say, even if there is no science to back it up…”

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=15401

I don't think you're going to get an affidavit, so it's going to be a worrisome few months for you. But for the benefit of anyone else reading this who might be worried about mandatory vaccinations, take the above with a pinch of salt.

The JCVI have not "taken over" vaccination in the UK. They have been the advisory committee to the govt since the 60s. The secretary of state for health takes their advice on board, and may or may not choose to act on it. That has not changed. There are no plans for mandatory vaccination in the UK.

There are no plans for mandatory vaccinations in Ireland.

Someone else mentioned Australia. I'm involved at quite a senior level in the pandemic planning in Oz. Mandatory vaccination hasn't even been mentioned. In fact, we've just started rolling out our flu vaccine clinics. They're entirely voluntary.

I know it's a CT forum, and I have no bother with that. It's all a bit of fun. But I'd hate for people to be genuinely worried about this, as seems to be the case.

In most cases, the conspiracy websites are linking to legislation that most countries have to allow for mandatory vaccinations. That's the case for something like a smallpox outbreak or ebola.

But there's no one in Ireland going to forcibly vaccinate you.

IrelandSpirit

Slugs wrote: »

Aye, indeed, the WHO can suck my f*cking balls as far as I'm concerned, but that doesn't matter to me. I'm out of Ireland in the Next few years, Ireland's mistakes are going to be payed for in blood, and this country isn't worth saving so long as the government lacks passionate patriots who give a f*ck about this country.

I hear ya. Mandatory inoculations are almost the last straw for me too. Just the rumour of it happening here’s a massive wake-up call. I can’t see it being enforced militarily though, like they’re planning in other countries – there’s just not enough resources and too many in the army here feel the same as us. Trust me on that. I reckon if the WHO takes over, they’ll play dirty as in: ‘no jab, no job’, ‘no jab, your kids can’t go to school’, ‘no jab, can’t fly on plane’ etc, etc.

As for Ireland as a nation? Don’t give up yet, my friend. There’s a lot more of us (and a lot more to Ireland) than our so-called a government. In many ways this will be a test to see for them too, to do the job we pay them for and show some integrity and honour, and finally represent this country.

IrelandSpirit

tallaght01 wrote: »

I don't think you're going to get an affidavit, so it's going to be a worrisome few months for you. But for the benefit of anyone else reading this who might be worried about mandatory vaccinations, take the above with a pinch of salt.

The JCVI have not "taken over" vaccination in the UK. They have been the advisory committee to the govt since the 60s. The secretary of state for health takes their advice on board, and may or may not choose to act on it. That has not changed. There are no plans for mandatory vaccination in the UK.

There are no plans for mandatory vaccinations in Ireland.

Someone else mentioned Australia. I'm involved at quite a senior level in the pandemic planning in Oz. Mandatory vaccination hasn't even been mentioned. In fact, we've just started rolling out our flu vaccine clinics. They're entirely voluntary.

I know it's a CT forum, and I have no bother with that. It's all a bit of fun. But I'd hate for people to be genuinely worried about this, as seems to be the case.

In most cases, the conspiracy websites are linking to legislation that most countries have to allow for mandatory vaccinations. That's the case for something like a smallpox outbreak or ebola.

But there's no one in Ireland going to forcibly vaccinate you.

Tallaght01, myself and couple of friends here will be writing seeking assurances that plans for mandatory vaccinations are not being considered here, as they are in many other countries, and also as regards the safety of said vaccine. That is all.

Answering people’s concerns is one of the jobs we pay them to do. If everything is in order and above board, then we will receive those assurances, in writing, and we will post them up for everybody to see. We will all sleep well that night.

If, however, like you say, we do not receive those assurance then it will indeed be a worrisome situation.

I do know this is a CT forum, but with all due respect, when mainstream newspapers too run articles like ‘Get Flu Jab, or Go to JAIL’, it’s pretty obvious to me that our HSE have been considering mandatory inoculations.

tallaght01

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

Tallaght01, myself and couple of friends here will be writing seeking assurances that plans for mandatory vaccinations are not being considered here, as they are in many other countries, and also as regards the safety of said vaccine. That is all.

Answering people’s concerns is one of the jobs we pay them to do. If everything is in order and above board, then we will receive those assurances, in writing, and we will post them up for everybody to see. We will all sleep well that night.

If, however, like you say, we do not receive those assurance then it will indeed be a worrisome situation.

I do know this is a CT forum, but with all due respect, when mainstream newspapers too run articles like ‘Get Flu Jab, or Go to JAIL’, it’s pretty obvious to me that our HSE have been considering mandatory inoculations.

You might get something if you write to them. But I wouldn't take the media as being gospel, to be honest.

There have been studies done on the swine flu vaccine. the new england journal of medicine published one a few weeks ago, where there were no serious effects. A lof of the info you want is out there.

IrelandSpirit

tallaght01 wrote: »

You might get something if you write to them. But I wouldn't take the media as being gospel, to be honest.

There have been studies done on the swine flu vaccine. the new england journal of medicine published one a few weeks ago, where there were no serious effects. A lof of the info you want is out there.

I bloody-well hope we get something – that’s their job, and if there’s nothing to hide, then there’s nothing to hide.

Agreed, mainstream media are not gospel; I see them as perhaps a testing-ground for things – sometimes they throw stuff out there to test our responses to controversial issues. IMHO that’s what that article in the Star was primarily doing, and sentiments similar to what you see here are the response.

I’ve read many reports on the secondary effects of this vaccine too. That is largely not the issue here; freewill and our right to make our own informed choices is the issue. It’s simply a question of sovereignty.

tallaght01

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

I bloody-well hope we get something – that’s their job, and if there’s nothing to hide, then there’s nothing to hide.

Agreed, mainstream media are not gospel; I see them as perhaps a testing-ground for things – sometimes they throw stuff out there to test our responses to controversial issues. IMHO that’s what that article in the Star was primarily doing, and sentiments similar to what you see here are the response.

I’ve read many reports on the secondary effects of this vaccine too. That is largely not the issue here; freewill and our right to make our own informed choices is the issue. It’s simply a question of sovereignty.

That vaccine is very very safe. Though I could be accused of bias as I'm involved in testing it on kids. But the vaccine safety issue is essentially baseless.

But, in fairless, if someone tried to forcibly vaccinate me, they'd have to kill me, just out of principle. The government knows that to be the case for a lt of people. So, even if some fool thought madatory jabs were the way to go for swine flu, it would e too much hassle.

So, we just reserve that legislation for bugs that have a significant public health threat to the population.Much more so than swine flu. It's a potentially serious infection, but it's nothing like smallpox or ebola.

the_dark_side

I think that the IRA should reform, and collude with the loyalist paramilitaries, so as to protect us from our own government

IrelandSpirit

Well, I was gonna suggest you perhaps dig a little deeper but you sound like a conscientious individual and I’m sure you’ve already done so… can I ask you something, do you have a link perhaps to the results of the trials you’re conducting there, or is it too early?

Edit: to tallaght01

IrelandSpirit

the_dark_side wrote: »

I think that the IRA should reform, and collude with the loyalist paramilitaries, so as to protect us from our own government

LOL! Now THAT would be something to see!

tallaght01

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

Well, I was gonna suggest you perhaps dig a little deeper but you sound like a conscientious individual and I’m sure you’ve already done so… can I ask you something, do you have a link perhaps to the results of the trials you’re conducting there, or is it too early?

Edit: to tallaght01

Still collating the data on the kids. Though any of the kids I've jabbed have had no side effects. But those results won't be out for a few weeks yet. Edit: actually, that's a lie. There have been side effects comparable to other vaccines...a few sore arms, a few high temps, a few headaches etc. the usual vaccine side effects.

But the adult results are here:

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0907413

Lots of scientific mumbo jumbo, tbh. But feel free to ask any question if I'm online. I'll give you honest answers. I test the vaccine, but I don't work for or get paid by the drug companies. I work for a kids hospital. I get my wages whether the vaccine works or not, and I'm only interested in the welfare of the kids.

Now, the vaccine being tested in that paper is the one we're using in Oz. A different firm will make the one in Ireland. There will be some small differences in how it's made. I think the irish one will have some adjuncts in it that we don't have. But that's the only difference (I think).

IrelandSpirit

tallaght01 wrote: »

Still collating the data on the kids. Though any of the kids I've jabbed have had no side effects. But those results won't be out for a few weeks yet. Edit: actually, that's a lie. There have been side effects comparable to other vaccines...a few sore arms, a few high temps, a few headaches etc. the usual vaccine side effects.

But the adult results are here:

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0907413

Lots of scientific mumbo jumbo, tbh. But feel free to ask any question if I'm online. I'll give you honest answers. I test the vaccine, but I don't work for or get paid by the drug companies. I work for a kids hospital. I get my wages whether the vaccine works or not, and I'm only interested in the welfare of the kids.

Now, the vaccine being tested in that paper is the one we're using in Oz. A different firm will make the one in Ireland. There will be some small differences in how it's made. I think the irish one will have some adjuncts in it that we don't have. But that's the only difference (I think).

Thank you very much for that – I’ll take a look at that link you provided, and thanks too for the offer of explaining the mumbo-jumbo – I’ve friends here who I can ask too if (when!) I run into problems

Interesting (and worrying) though, that it’s not the same vaccine tested in Oz as the one we’re getting here. It’s precisely the adjuvants which are my main concern; specifically the oil-based ones like squalene – amongst others.


In any case, good to hear the kids didn’t get any serious reactions, and thanks again.

6th

IrelandSpirit, in future use the report post function.

espinolman

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

Interesting (and worrying) though, that it’s not the same vaccine tested in Oz as the one we’re getting here. It’s precisely the adjuvants which are my main concern; specifically the oil-based ones like squalene – amongst others.

Squalene , was'nt that linked to gulf war syndrome ?

espinolman

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

In any case, good to hear the kids didn’t get any serious reactions, and thanks again.

Yes it is good to hear the guinea pigs
kids did'nt get any serious reactions , is'nt it .

IrelandSpirit

espinolman wrote: »

Yes it is good to hear the guinea pigs
kids did'nt get any serious reactions , is'nt it .

Yeah, I am happy those kids are alright, aren’t you?

I was being polite to tallaght01, he’s entitled his opinions as much as the next person, I was not condoning them

IrelandSpirit

espinolman wrote: »

Squalene , was'nt that linked to gulf war syndrome ?

Yep. I know two people with gulf war syndrome, us army, both vets from the 1st gulf war, and also one British army with something similar (Falklands vet), though in the latter case it's not as severe – all-over body rashes, mainly. All were vaccinated to high heaven before their tours of duty.

ferngully

Good point,
I have just been on the Lisbon for Dummies......
Well last time I voted yes.....but I was questioning my choice......
Well after reading this thread and posts like this......
This time I am Voting No.......
I aint avin no Freddie Vaccine!!!!!!!! :eek:

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Article 2 E[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif]The Union (i.e. the newly created entity that will come about from ratification). shall have competence to carry out actions [/font]to support[font=Arial, sans-serif], coordinate [/font]or supplement[font=Arial, sans-serif] the actions of the Member States. The areas of such action shall, at European level, be:[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif](a) protection and improvement of human health;[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif](b) industry;[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif](c) culture;[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif](d) tourism;[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif](e) education, vocational training, youth and sport;[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif](f) civil protection;[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif](g) administrative cooperation.’[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif][END OF EXTRACT FROM OFFICIAL EU TEXT][/font]


[font=Arial, sans-serif]My take on that is the [/font][font=Arial, sans-serif]"(a) protection and improvement of human health" [/font][font=Arial, sans-serif]is a blanket term an could include forced vaccinations for 'our safety'.
[/font][/quote]

tallaght01

espinolman wrote: »

Yes it is good to hear the guinea pigs
kids did'nt get any serious reactions , is'nt it .

Just to knock this kind of thing on the head......The reason why we haven't got data available for the kids yet is because we waited for the adult safety data to be available before we would allow any kids to have it.

Then, we offered it to parents who wanted it. We don't force people. But we were inundated with people wanting to be part of the study. We don't pay for people to be involved, though we pay their transport costs to get to us.

We were interviewed on national radio about the study, and hundreds of people contacted us the same day asking could they enrol their kids. One set of parents turned up, and they didn't seem 100% certain, so I suggested they didn't get their kid vaccinated.

So, there's not some evil scientist conspiracy going on. Swine flu was a it problem in Oz at the time, and parents were seeing the effects, and wanted a vaccine.

IrelandSpirit

Lads, I think it’s a waste of time arguing about what people choose to do under conditions where they’re still free to choose. And this is not about further polarising the issue of whether or not vaccination in general is effective. We all have varying outlooks about all that, which should be respected – everybody here’s coming from a good place and would not knowingly cause harm in that regard.

It may well be that there are no plans for mandatory vaccination in Ireland, but I think we should be focussing on what we can do to prevent that from happening in case there is.

macshadow

Hi tallaght01, i don't know if it's been mentioned here already that 72 kilos of the swine flu vaccine that was contaminated with the bird flu virus was sent to 18 countries by baxter and was only discovered when astute lab workers in the czech rep tested the vaccine on rats and they died. What are the chances that this was an accident? could this happen again?
I understand that baxter have made similar cock up's in the past.
Have a look at www.theflucase.com if you haven't already.

johnrey

humanji wrote: »

Anything more concrete than a tabloid and a blog?

You will find the truth about it here <snipped by bonkey - no spam thanks>

drkpower

johnrey wrote: »

You will find the truth about it here <snipped by bonkey - no spam thanks>

Perhaps you might try and make an argument yourself rather than just posting links to someone else's views. Anyone can google links that support their argument but that isnt really the point of a discussion site.

johnrey

drkpower wrote: »

Perhaps you might try and make an argument yourself rather than just posting links to someone else's views. Anyone can google links that support their argument but that isnt really the point of a discussion site.

In order to discuss you first need information ! So why re invent the wheel, get the info and then discuss.

drkpower

johnrey wrote: »

In order to discuss you first need information ! So why re invent the wheel, get the info and then discuss.

Absolutely, formulate your own view based on the information to hand and then summarise that view into a digestible form and post it here.

Simply posting pages and pages of another's views is tedious and pointless. Should I reply by posting a 100 page study from Science with no coommentary, analysis or view of my own? Where would that get anyone?

johnrey

drkpower wrote: »

Absolutely, formulate your own view based on the information to hand and then summarise that view into a digestible form and post it here.

Simply posting pages and pages of another's views is tedious and pointless. Should I reply by posting a 100 page study from Science with no coommentary, analysis or view of my own? Where would that get anyone?

OK If something appears to be wrong it more than likely is. The best way, in my opinion, to find out what is going on is to follow the money trail. In this case it ends up with the same man who made equal somes of money from the American involvement in Iraq, one Donald Rumsfeld! So in who's interest is it to have a so called pandemic?

drkpower

johnrey wrote: »

OK If something appears to be wrong it more than likely is. The best way, in my opinion, to find out what is going on is to follow the money trail. In this case it ends up with the same man who made equal somes of money from the American involvement in Iraq, one Donald Rumsfeld! So in who's interest is it to have a so called pandemic?

That's better.
Now I know not to engage with you because what you say makes no sense whatsoever:D

Diogenes

johnrey wrote: »

OK If something appears to be wrong it more than likely is. The best way, in my opinion, to find out what is going on is to follow the money trail. In this case it ends up with the same man who made equal somes of money from the American involvement in Iraq, one Donald Rumsfeld! So in who's interest is it to have a so called pandemic?

The argument is a piece of false logic, it's like claiming shovel manufactures, created the American gold rush, because they benefited from it.

Of course pharmaceutical manufactures are going to see a share price flux over a medical crisis.

However the same must be said about those people who claim the vaccine doesn't work, or will have side effects, or will make you catch the virus, and therefore you should buy our alternative treatment. If you're being cynical about the motives of one side of the debate, why be so trusting of the other.

Essentially your argument is one side is making more money, ergo they must be bad. However the people making vaccines, have to adhere to strict regulations, employee thousands of people, highly educated in many parts, who feel both ethical and moral obligations (before you ask I've just come back from visiting a group of friends of mine two of whom have PHDs and their duties include quality control on vaccines), do you really look at your circle of friends and assume that some of them could be culpable in mass deceit?

Meanwhile the hysterical anti vaccine crowd promote nonsense, and snakeoil, and make nonsense claims, and charge astonishing amounts for their alternatives, have no oversight, and yet you trust them?

And you think we're gullible?

Nehaxak

Nehaxak wrote: »

I've made enquiries on this directly to the HSE here over the last hour or so via phone and they said the report in the Star is not true and they have no intentions of making the flu jab mandatory. The girl I was speaking too also went off on my bahalf to enquire the same of her collegues senior to herself.

In regards the availability of the jab without Themerosal, she said the HSE has no input on this matter and referred me to the IMB - which I'll follow up on tomorrow and see what I can get from them in regards that matter.

Seeing as how this thread is continuing, thought it worth mentioning in case you were not already aware, that the HSE for once are actually listening to people and are now distributing the version of the swine flu vaccine without themerosal alongside the version with themerosal. Only at the moment available from the HSE clinics and not from your gp. The version without is for those of us who prefer not to inject ourselves or our children with mercury based preservative.
Nice to see finally that even the HSE recognise the possible problems with themerosal in vaccines.

Excuse any spelling mistakes in the above, can't see wtf I'm typing on the iPhone

rameire

Nehaxak wrote: »

Seeing as how this thread is continuing, thought it worth mentioning in case you were not already aware, that the HSE for once are actually listening to people and are now distributing the version of the swine flu vaccine without themerosal alongside the version with themerosal. Only at the moment available from the HSE clinics and not from your gp. The version without is for those of us who prefer not to inject ourselves or our children with mercury based preservative.
Nice to see finally that even the HSE recognise the possible problems with themerosal in vaccines.

Excuse any spelling mistakes in the above, can't see wtf I'm typing on the iPhone

that vaccine has been available since the programme of vaccinations in ireland has started. and their is a reason it is not available in your local doc.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=62876549&postcount=221

bonkey

Diogenes wrote: »

And you think we're gullible?

Lets keep this civil.

No-one has called you gullible or implied same since this thread was resurrected.

bonkey

Nehaxak wrote: »

Seeing as how this thread is continuing, thought it worth mentioning in case you were not already aware, that the HSE for once are actually listening to people and are now distributing the version of the swine flu vaccine without themerosal alongside the version with themerosal. Only at the moment available from the HSE clinics and not from your gp. The version without is for those of us who prefer not to inject ourselves or our children with mercury based preservative.
Nice to see finally that even the HSE recognise the possible problems with themerosal in vaccines.

Or maybe the HSE recognises the problem with people perceiving a problem with thimerosal, and so is willing to spend more taxpayer money to avoid a non-issue having a non-trivial effect?

What I find most interesting is the progression of conspiracy theories. At this point, my impression is that the majority of people who started out with "the government are trying to poison us" have now taken a stance of "the government is trying to poison us by giving us this vaccine instead of that one.

You've now made the next logical step, of applauding the decision to allow you to freely choose "that one" over the one that the mass hysteria has led you to believe is unsafe.

If I was an evil mastermind who wanted to poison people...I'd probably try and plan takeup of something safe, then start rumours and whip up a media storm about it, so that everyone focussed on that one and then flocked to my poisoned one.

If and when more governments start saying "if you are really worried with vaccine X, then take vaccine Y. We'll use your taxes to pay the difference, so its not like we care"....I expect that we'll start hearing the conspiracy theories about how the whole scare was kicked off by Big Pharma so that they could sell more of the more expensive vaccine...or how its because the non-adjuvant one is really the scary one.

And getting back to the original topic of this thread....still no sign of enforced vaccination with jail as the alternative...not just in Ireland, but anywhere.

tallaght01

bonkey wrote: »

Or maybe the HSE recognises the problem with people perceiving a problem with thimerosal, and so is willing to spend more taxpayer money to avoid a non-issue having a non-trivial effect?

.

This.



Plus thimerosal is a preservative. It's put in the ones in that GPs give out because it's a preservative. Each vial has enough vaccine to give to, say, 10 people.
But that may happen over 3 or 4 days, depending on the surgery, so you need a preservative, so it doesnt go off in those few days. You might open your vial at 4pm on a friday and not use the rest of it until monday.

In a vaccine clinic, you're just giving vaccines all day. You'll go through a 10 person vial in an hour. So, why would you put a preservative in it?

This policy has nothing to do with safety.

I know I'm banging my head against a rick wall, but thimerosal was taken out of Danish vaccines. they made this into a study. What would happen to kids in a population where they were no longer receiving thimerosal, compared to their older brothers and sisters who did receive it.

The group who DIDN'T get thimerosal had HIGHER levels of autism.

The thimerosal argument is one of the greatest crocks of nonsense that people have ever expended their energy on.

Drug companies peddle all sorts of rubbish that doesn't work. But one of their greatest PR coups was to get the public concentrating on an ingredient that is A) widely tested over the last 60 years and is essential in multi-dose vials.

Now there's a conspiracy theory in there somewhere.

But anyone who still thinks there's a problem with thimerosal quite simply has not read the studies. I don't mean googling stuff and I don't mean posting youtube videos of "Experts" with "PhDs" saying they've reveiwed the studies and come to the conclusion that it's dangerous. I'm talking about reading the studies properly.


With the exception of drkpower, it looks like not one single other person who has posted here is familiar with the actual scientific evidence, yet there's an amazing amount of opinion being given out.

tallaght01

Also, how many people are now in jail in Ireland for refusing the vaccine? Are we going to keep a count?

IrelandSpirit

tallaght01 wrote: »

Also, how many people are now in jail in Ireland for refusing the vaccine? Are we going to keep a count?

Nobody's in jail, it's not mandatory here. But the WHO could enforce it under the current level 6 pandemic rating : Dr Rauni Kilde, the Finnish former Chief Medical Officer for Lapland:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=185HKE2c5Gg

Though as she says, it's looking increasingly unlikely that they will invoke their powers to force anybody into a mandatory vaccination program.

IMO there'd be just too much resistance.

Diogenes

IrelandSpirit wrote: »

Nobody's in jail, it's not mandatory here. But the WHO could enforce it under the current level 6 pandemic rating : Dr Rauni Kilde, the Finnish former Chief Medical Officer for Lapland:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=185HKE2c5Gg

I've already linked to what a questionable source that woman is

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rauni-Leena_Luukanen-Kilde#Kilde.27s_rescue_by_extraterrestrials

Though as she says, it's looking increasingly unlikely that they will invoke their powers to force anybody into a mandatory vaccination program.

IMO there'd be just too much resistance.

This is pretty much a win win for conspiracy theories isn't it?

If there is no mandatory vaccination campaign, it's not because the threat wasn't significant it's because CTers informed the public of the dangers of the vaccine.

If there is a mandatory vaccination (and thats a massive if) they'll claim victory and claim they forced the government into using "safe" vaccines.

If the virus isn't serious and theres no no massive outbreak, they'll claim victory because see the virus was actually caused by the vaccine.


Theres a massive idiot in the states, called Captain Eric May leader of a self styled group of wingnuts called "Ghost Troop", every few months they predict another false flag terrorist attack on US soil, and when it doesn't materialise they claim they raised enough awareness to prevent the government from doing it.