NAMA - are you marching on Saturday?

Blackjack

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Actually the rumblings from the bond markets are that they would much prefer a strong government and clean banking system than the hobbled affair NAMA would produce.

Wouldn't we all.

How do you propose we get both?

Amhran Nua

Blackjack wrote: »

Do tell us - what do Amhrán Nua propose?. Is this how you propose we deal with the current Financial crisis?.

Yes, thats the overview. Would you like to know more about any particular aspect of it?

Blackjack wrote: »

Wouldn't we all.

How do you propose we get both?

Vote for Amhrán Nua representatives, would be the best method.

A union support

onekeano wrote: »

Lenihen stated that the discount would be 30% ie. paying €54 billion from a value of €77 billion. This was not true, as the Minister knows the €77 billion included €9 billion of interest that had been rolled up. So the real figure, is €54 billion from a value of €68 billion which is a 20% discount!!!:mad:

If NAMA is so independent how come Brian Lenihan reserves the right to tell NAMA to reconsider offers on particular sites, take a site bought in Ballsbridge for say €400 million and NAMA offer €200 million. Mr Lenihan can tell NAMA to reconsider the offer made to a man who is a close friend of the Taoiseach who first appointed Mr Lenihan a minister - can this be right?:(

Given the above, is it any wonder that shares prices in the major banks have already risen by around 2000% since the NAMA scheme was announced? Its hardly because the shareholders & financial institutions are delighted for the taxpayer....:D

The march is being organised by the irishpeoplesunion which is a single campaigning on a single issue ie. No to NAMA

Roy

This March is not being organised by Irish People's Union. We organised last Saturday's (12th Sept 2009) March.

We are participating in this Saturday's march (marching under our own banner), to protest about NAMA in its current form and will be doing the same this Saturday. NAMA is our current campaign, which is reflecting the majority view of our members.

Please note however that Irish People's Union was set up by Dave Browne to give a collective voice to people living in Ireland, and if there is only one single campaign or issue it is not NAMA - it is -

We the people of ireland need a voice - Brian Cowen was right "We need to GET REAL!" Let's show how real we can be Tomorrow !!

We are here to stay and will continue to grow and reach the target set by Dave of 250,000 members, the time this will take is up to each and every one of us. For offical position of Irish People's Union go to www.irishpeopleunion.com

Finally regarding joining, associating, endorsing, marching under a flag or banner,..... etc. My view is, if you agree with something then support it, if you oppose it, then oppose it. Let's not continue to be divided, just because of who's idea it was, flag is flying or banner is at the front.

PLEASE for everyone's sake STAND UP, STAND TOGETHER and be counted

Together we are BETTER !!!
(the views expressed here are my own personal views)

Amhran Nua

A union support wrote: »

Please note however that Irish People's Union was set up by Dave Browne to give a collective voice to people living in Ireland

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but was it not set up by people who didn't want to pay the increases in mortgage rates being set by the banks (already well under the European average) and sort of latched onto NAMA as it went along?

peasant

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Vote for Amhrán Nua representatives, would be the best method.

Who are you anyway?

Answers in this thread please

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055684305

(would be nice to hear some names, see some faces)

Amhran Nua

peasant wrote: »

Who are you anyway?

Answers in this thread please

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055684305

(would be nice to hear some names, see some faces)

Oho, I was wondering why there was no specific dedicated politics forum, its under the rest of the forums. I'll drop up some info so!

Blackjack

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Yes, thats the overview. Would you like to know more about any particular aspect of it?

This bit for a start:
"Set up the Irish Common Investment Market, where public limited companies can offer up shares to the public to buy and sell on the internet, without intervention from middlemen. The original idea of the stock market was to allow people to invest in companies, which has long since transformed into a system that benefits very few companies. The ICIM will be very tightly regulated, and linked with the Revenue Commissioners and Finance Departments, but will essentially allow easy direct buying and selling of shares in many more companies than are currently allowed, giving them access to capital without debt."

then you can explain the below, and how you intend to implement:


"The situation we find ourselves in at the moment is that enormous sums of money have been handed out to banks, and are continuing to be handed out, directly from the tax coffers of Ireland. These unelected, for-profit companies using the financial resources of citizens to inflate their accounts is one thing, but the expected improvements in performance has not occurred.

So in the immediate short term, there are two goals:

* Preserve the deposits of Irish citizens: By assuming the good assets of the banks under an umbrella National Credit Agency, whether by nationalisation or other routes, and selling on these assets, the value of the deposits of Irish citizens are to be protected during the transition phase. No changes in ATMs or bank procedures will take place initially, and the entire transition will be managed over the period of a year. Once these deposits are protected, shareholders and other investors will be taken care of from the remainder of the assets, which will be passed on to another agency for proper disposal.
* Ensure that credit continues to flow to those businesses that need it: The second part of the functions of the banks is to ensure that businesses receive short term credit in order to continue functioning, in the time period between for example the production of products and the sale of these products. These short term loans to good risk businesses will be supplied by the NCA.
"

Count Dooku

Blackjack wrote: »

* Preserve the deposits of Irish citizens: By assuming the good assets of the banks under an umbrella National Credit Agency, whether by nationalisation or other routes, and selling on these assets, the value of the deposits of Irish citizens are to be protected during the transition phase.

Too late
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2009/0910/1224254205482.html
Banks are selling good assets on full speed

Amhran Nua

Blackjack wrote: »

This bit for a start:
"Set up the Irish Common Investment Market

This is a mechanism by which companies and new startups can source funding without having to go to VCs or banks. It works just like the stock market, except any limited company can participate. If you like a company's ideas, use your credit card and buy €20 of shares in them. Multiply by 2000 people and you have a good fund with which to start off almost any business, low risk for punters, no repayments for companies. Think the dragon's den with an audience of millions of investors.

Blackjack wrote: »

* Preserve the deposits of Irish citizens: By assuming the good assets of the banks under an umbrella National Credit Agency
* Ensure that credit continues to flow to those businesses that need it: The second part of the functions of the banks is to ensure that businesses receive short term credit in order to continue functioning, in the time period between for example the production of products and the sale of these products. These short term loans to good risk businesses will be supplied by the NCA.
"

Actually, although we have had that in place since March, a very similar implementation was mentioned last week by David McWilliams, which is an encouraging sign. Instead of using the banks' good assets (see CDs link there), he wanted to get the EU to tide us over until the deposits are safe, but the core idea is the very same. The NCA loans would be combined witht he ICIM to provide a very very robust environment for entrepreneurship and ongoing credit for businesses. What it won't do is restart the property boom.

There's a discussion on the group going on over here if you'd like to move it across to keep it all under the one roof so to speak.

Count Dooku wrote: »

Too late
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2009/0910/1224254205482.html
Banks are selling good assets on full speed

Yup, they must have been reading our policy papers. They have over €100 billion in there, to put things into perspective.

Blackjack

Amhran Nua wrote: »

This is a mechanism by which companies and new startups can source funding without having to go to VCs or banks. It works just like the stock market, except any limited company can participate. If you like a company's ideas, use your credit card and buy €20 of shares in them. Multiply by 2000 people and you have a good fund with which to start off almost any business, low risk for punters, no repayments for companies. Think the dragon's den with an audience of millions of investors.

Interesting idea - how do you prevent this from turning into a scam, thereby protecting the investors?.

Amhran Nua

Blackjack wrote: »

Interesting idea - how do you prevent this from turning into a scam, thereby protecting the investors?.

There are a few ways of doing that, the most important is positively identifying investors, which the credit card companies do for us already. It hasn't yet been determined whether or not to keep it purely domestic or to open it to foreign investors (which would lead to a serious influx of capital into the economy, making it very tempting, but making regulation a lot tougher). On top of that you could issue a unique ID to each person that signs up to trade, like online banking does now.

For those without much knowledge of how businesses work, we could set it up with a fairly simple risk/reward colour rating - a well established business with small margins would be low risk, low return, and something new but possibly lucrative could be high risk, high return. This also raises the difficulty of people just putting all their money in the local Spar and leaving the entrepreneurs in the cold, but we could organise combined investment vehicles which would take on a basket of stocks from low to high risk.

If it proves to be the case that small businesses and entrepreneurs still aren't getting funding, we might motivate the insurance companies to get involved in a very limited capacity.

Initial assessment and ongoing assessment of risk and return could be organised by accountancy offices in the normal course of business, assets, liabilities, profits and losses, along with local enterprise boards to put the final seal of approval on it.

Also each firm would have its own profile within the ICIM, and only one section of those would be press releases and company news. Beyond that, the normal obligations of limited companies to shareholders should be sufficient to protect investors. Yes there will be scams, its impossible to avoid that even in the main stock market (look at Madoff and his carry on), yes there will be losses, but there will be plenty of gains and profits made as well.

Amhran Nua

Oh yes, and one last thing, make gains on this market tax free. What you lose in tax revenues you more than make up in increased employment and liquidity in the economy.