N7 - Newlands Cross upgrade

AugustusMinimus

Conba wrote: »

I found some solace in a really fascinating talk by Tony Seba (on YouTube) where he presented a number of eye-popping stats. Because we're such bad drivers - "At best 95% of highway surface is not being used at any given time".

And, "If all cars had Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC) we would have 40% more highway capacity"

"If all cars had ACC and inter-vehicle communication we would have 273% greater capacity on highways"

"Fully autonomous vehicles could end congestion by increasing highway capacity by > 3.7 times"

BUT (it gets better)....

"Cars are parked 96% of the time"

"With all Car As A Service (Uber et al), on demand mobility, we'll pay 10 x less. Self Driving Car cost per mile ~ 80-90% less. Assuming a Share-to-own ratio of 5 (Zipcar has 15) we would need 80% fewer cars. => 80% fewer parking spaces required."

That's my kind of future.

Correct lane usage alone would solve just about all problems on the M7/N7 coming out of Dublin over night. Doesn't seem to be any drive to do anything bout MLM's and overtaking lane hoggers sadly.

_Kaiser_

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Correct lane usage alone would solve just about all problems on the M7/N7 coming out of Dublin over night. Doesn't seem to be any drive to do anything bout MLM's and overtaking lane hoggers sadly.

Well disagree as ye may but when using the outbound 3-lane stretch of the N7 I generally sit out in lane 3 till well beyond Naas unless the road around me is clear in which case I'll move over.

Why? Only one lane of eejits to worry about as opposed to on either side, plus I drive in such a manner that I'm never holding anyone else up - which is not to say I drive the stretch at 160 km/h either! (null points me)

I drive according to the prevailing conditions - which includes weather, visibility, surface AND the behaviour of other drivers - and in the absence of enforcement beyond "speeding" and tax checks, or basic things like people being able to merge at speed rather than 40 km/h below it, or leave a motorway in good time rather than at the last instant and diving across 2/3 lanes to do it, or changing lanes without indicating or forcing their way in regardless, or driving along at 10-20 km/h under the limit when there's no reason for it, I will not be weaving in and out just to blindly follow rules that others ignore.

L1011

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Well disagree as ye may but when using the outbound 3-lane stretch of the N7 I generally sit out in lane 3 till well beyond Naas unless the road around me is clear in which case I'll move over.

There is no lane 3 beyond Naas.

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Why? Only one lane of eejits to worry about as opposed to on either side, plus I drive in such a manner that I'm never holding anyone else up - which is not to say I drive the stretch at 160 km/h either! (null points me)

Your assumptions about what makes a lane suitable and the law do not meet. You are damn lucky *not* to have points in this situation I'd say; particularly if you do in fact lane hog on a two lane section too. You are very, very much part of the problem.

Keep left.

Schadenfreudia

According to the NRA website the N5 Ballaghadreen bypass, the N40 Cork junctions and the Newlands Cross over-bridge are still all classed as "under construction".

Could this be because if they removed them there would only be two projects ongoing; the Arklow-Rathnew N11 and the yet-to-start M18/M17?

Apologies if this observation is in the wrong place..can't see where else to put it!

jd

Schadenfreudia wrote: »

According to the NRA website the N5 Ballaghadreen bypass, the N40 Cork junctions and the Newlands Cross over-bridge are still all classed as "under construction".

Could this be because if they removed them there would only be two projects ongoing; the Arklow-Rathnew N11 and the yet-to-start M18/M17?

Apologies if this observation is in the wrong place..can't see where else to put it!

Newlands Cross is still under construction, the scheme is not yet completely finished. Ask anybody who is using the Belgard or Fonthill Roads!

AugustusMinimus

Not certain if the 2 flyovers in Cork are fully finished either. While the subsidence work on the Sarsfield roundabout is finished, its quite possible some tidy up work is still required.

screamer

Well no crashes tonight southbound, but looking at the traffic this morning heading for the big smoke, I'd say a lot of people off work and shopping.....

_Kaiser_

L1011 wrote: »

There is no lane 3 beyond Naas.


Your assumptions about what makes a lane suitable and the law do not meet. You are damn lucky *not* to have points in this situation I'd say; particularly if you do in fact lane hog on a two lane section too. You are very, very much part of the problem.

Keep left.

As above, I'll drive in a manner appropriate to the conditions at the time - traffic volume, road surface, weather conditions and visibility AND the behaviour of other drivers.

If that means cruising steadily in the outer lane as necessary so as to avoid the tailgating, last-minute lane changers, dawdlers and so on then that's what I'll do.

My safety and that of my passengers (and by extension others) > blindly following rules that most ignore or are not even aware of - including AGS I might add! I've witnessed several crazy manoeuvres in full view of Garda cars who didn't move an inch to deal with it. Indeed tailgating and poor driving seems to be the hallmark of many of our boys and girls in blue as well.

As for "lane hogging", that implies holding others up. It's very rare I'm overtaken - but then I drive at a consistent speed and not 10-20 km/h below the limit when there's no reason to do so. I see no reason to dawdle along with the sheep myself.

I'll move left when I deem it safe and appropriate to do so and not beforehand. Thankfuilly, once you hit the 120 stretch at Naas though things usually calm down as the traffic stretches out so there's no longer a problem.

First Up

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

As above, I'll drive in a manner appropriate to the conditions at the time - traffic volume, road surface, weather conditions and visibility AND the behaviour of other drivers.

If that means cruising steadily in the outer lane as necessary so as to avoid the tailgating, last-minute lane changers, dawdlers and so on then that's what I'll do.

My safety and that of my passengers (and by extension others) > blindly following rules that most ignore or are not even aware of - including AGS I might add! I've witnessed several crazy manoeuvres in full view of Garda cars who didn't move an inch to deal with it. Indeed tailgating and poor driving seems to be the hallmark of many of our boys and girls in blue as well.

As for "lane hogging", that implies holding others up. It's very rare I'm overtaken - but then I drive at a consistent speed and not 10-20 km/h below the limit when there's no reason to do so. I see no reason to dawdle along with the sheep myself.

I'll move left when I deem it safe and appropriate to do so and not beforehand. Thankfuilly, once you hit the 120 stretch at Naas though things usually calm down as the traffic stretches out so there's no longer a problem.

And I hope that you are suitably punished for it. Have you ever considered how your permanent presence in the outside line is CAUSING other drivers to tailgate, change lanes at the last minute and the rest?

Selfish, inconsiderate gobsh*te.

veryangryman

First Up wrote: »

And I hope that you are suitably punished for it. Have you ever considered how your permanent presence in the outside line is CAUSING other drivers to tailgate, change lanes at the last minute and the rest?

Selfish, inconsiderate gobsh*te.

Echoing these sentiments * 10. Your not in traffic, you are traffic. Acting the maggot is unacceptable, selfish and contributes to accidents.

Fair play to you for admitting it, alot of others don't. Still it doesn't excuse it.

_Kaiser_

First Up wrote: »

And I hope that you are suitably punished for it. Have you ever considered how your permanent presence in the outside line is CAUSING other drivers to tailgate, change lanes at the last minute and the rest?

Selfish, inconsiderate gobsh*te.

(a) not permanent - only when necessary to avoid aforementioned dawdling and such in the other lanes

(b) It's very rare I'm overtaken (or that someone is looking to overtake) BECAUSE I don't dawdle unnecessarily so not holding anyone up

Very mature with the childish abuse though!

L1011

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

As above, I'll drive in a manner appropriate to the conditions at the time - traffic volume, road surface, weather conditions and visibility AND the behaviour of other drivers.

If that means cruising steadily in the outer lane as necessary so as to avoid the tailgating, last-minute lane changers, dawdlers and so on then that's what I'll do.

My safety and that of my passengers (and by extension others) > blindly following rules that most ignore or are not even aware of - including AGS I might add! I've witnessed several crazy manoeuvres in full view of Garda cars who didn't move an inch to deal with it. Indeed tailgating and poor driving seems to be the hallmark of many of our boys and girls in blue as well.

As for "lane hogging", that implies holding others up. It's very rare I'm overtaken - but then I drive at a consistent speed and not 10-20 km/h below the limit when there's no reason to do so. I see no reason to dawdle along with the sheep myself.

I'll move left when I deem it safe and appropriate to do so and not beforehand. Thankfuilly, once you hit the 120 stretch at Naas though things usually calm down as the traffic stretches out so there's no longer a problem.

Of course it's rare you're overtaken - you're hogging lane 3 and forcing people to make illegal manoeuvres to do so.

You are entirely part of the problem you're pretending is other drivers.

Deedsie

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

(a) not permanent - only when necessary to avoid aforementioned dawdling and such in the other lanes

(b) It's very rare I'm overtaken (or that someone is looking to overtake) BECAUSE I don't dawdle unnecessarily so not holding anyone up

Very mature with the childish abuse though!

To be fair you are patting yourself on the back for breaking the rules of the road to suit yourself? Because everyone else does it seems to be your justification.

That's more childish in my opinion.

_Kaiser_

Deedsie wrote: »

To be fair you are patting yourself on the back for breaking the rules of the road to suit yourself? Because everyone else does it seems to be your justification.

That's more childish in my opinion.

Bottom line is that you can drive whatever way you like yourself but I can guarantee you you won't be held up by me or having to undertake me because I don't dawdle along at 10-20 km/h under the limit when there's no just cause for it.

When appropriate to do so I will keep left, but if it means getting held up in a convoy of dawdlers or people weaving in and out of lanes as they merge/exit then not a chance

First Up

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

(a) not permanent - only when necessary to avoid aforementioned dawdling and such in the other lanes

(b) It's very rare I'm overtaken (or that someone is looking to overtake) BECAUSE I don't dawdle unnecessarily so not holding anyone up

Very mature with the childish abuse though!

If you think that was abuse you should see what I really think.

You obviously have no idea of how a motorway or multi-lane road is supposed to operate. Granted neither do a lot of other drivers but you blocking the outside lane stops that lane from being used for what it is intended and forces drivers inside to do things they shouldn't, such as tailgate and undertake.

You are a menace to other road users but I suspect you don't care because you are a selfish, inconsiderate gobsh*te.

_Kaiser_

First Up wrote: »

If you think that was abuse you should see what I really think.

You obviously have no idea of how a motorway or multi-lane road is supposed to operate. Granted neither do a lot of other drivers but you blocking the outside lane stops that lane from being used for what it is intended and forces drivers inside to do things they shouldn't, such as tailgate and undertake.

You are a menace to other road users but I suspect you don't care because you are a selfish, inconsiderate gobsh*te.

You clearly are not reading what I'm writing so let me spell it out for you...

Lane 1: Trucks and other cars doing maybe 80/90 km/h
Lane 2: Cars doing 90-95 km/h
= Damn right I'll move out into Lane 3

If limit = 100/120 and the road is clear, visibility is good and it's safe to do so, I'll do that 100/120 (ish - maybe a few km over and yes I know the difference between indicated and real speeds) .. given that's the maximum permissible limit who am I holding up/blocking?

When safe to move back left I will - but not just because some idiot wants to try and bully his way past either

So is your argument "damn you for doing the limit/slightly over in lane 3 and overtaking others because I want to speed and you're holding me up and won't move out of my way until it's safe to do so" then?

L1011

If you're "in Lane 3 til after Naas" you clearly have an utterly ridiculous idea of what "safe" for pulling over is.

You are part of the problem. You are one of the crap drivers - as much as you're trying to transfer this to other people.

Get out of Lane 3 except when overtaking, keep left. Keeping left is pretty much the most essential rule of the road and you're acting as if its irrelevant to you.

First Up

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

You clearly are not reading what I'm writing so let me spell it out for you...

Lane 1: Trucks and other cars doing maybe 80/90 km/h
Lane 2: Cars doing 90-95 km/h
= Damn right I'll move out into Lane 3

If limit = 100/120 and the road is clear, visibility is good and it's safe to do so, I'll do that 100/120 (ish - maybe a few km over and yes I know the difference between indicated and real speeds) .. given that's the maximum permissible limit who am I holding up/blocking?

When safe to move back left I will - but not just because some idiot wants to try and bully his way past either

So is your argument "damn you for doing the limit/slightly over in lane 3 and overtaking others because I want to speed and you're holding me up and won't move out of my way until it's safe to do so" then?

Thanks for this further demonstration of your ignorance. It isn't about you "holding people up". Its about drivers in Lane 2 having the option of moving into lane 3 if they need it. This could be because of slower moving traffic inside, cars merging onto the motorway or some incident that calls for a quick manoeuvre. Lane 1 is the driving lane, lane 2 is the overtaking lane and lane 3 is for exceptional (and brief) usage, not for oafs like you to take over.

tvc15

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

You clearly are not reading what I'm writing so let me spell it out for you...

Lane 1: Trucks and other cars doing maybe 80/90 km/h
Lane 2: Cars doing 90-95 km/h
= Damn right I'll move out into Lane 3

If limit = 100/120 and the road is clear, visibility is good and it's safe to do so, I'll do that 100/120 (ish - maybe a few km over and yes I know the difference between indicated and real speeds) .. given that's the maximum permissible limit who am I holding up/blocking?

When safe to move back left I will - but not just because some idiot wants to try and bully his way past either

So is your argument "damn you for doing the limit/slightly over in lane 3 and overtaking others because I want to speed and you're holding me up and won't move out of my way until it's safe to do so" then?

I don't see the problem with this if it is commuting traffic, you are passing cars in the 3rd lane. There is traffic so it would be insane to weave in and out of lane 2 and lane 1 is moving 20kmh slower than the speed limit.

There are people (including some on here with anger issues) who think correct lane usage is everyone else pulling into lanes 1 and 2 so they can fly along unhindered in lane 3. Part of the problem is people's insistence that it is other people's fault that they are not moving along and it is because other people are terrible drivers!

Leaving Dublin between 4 and 7 means that very rarely will there be light enough traffic for the proper practice of lane usage

NSAman

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

You clearly are not reading what I'm writing so let me spell it out for you...

Lane 1: Trucks and other cars doing maybe 80/90 km/h
Lane 2: Cars doing 90-95 km/h
= Damn right I'll move out into Lane 3

If limit = 100/120 and the road is clear, visibility is good and it's safe to do so, I'll do that 100/120 (ish - maybe a few km over and yes I know the difference between indicated and real speeds) .. given that's the maximum permissible limit who am I holding up/blocking?

When safe to move back left I will - but not just because some idiot wants to try and bully his way past either

So is your argument "damn you for doing the limit/slightly over in lane 3 and overtaking others because I want to speed and you're holding me up and won't move out of my way until it's safe to do so" then?

I bet you were the fool i met the other night going into Dublin 105 kph in the overtaking lane nothing on the inside lane and when I flashed him to move over he slowed down to 90, still nothing on the inside lane, so I had to undertake him, and was greeted by wanker jesture, car behind me did the same again a wanker jesture, and the car behind him, then he speeds up and tries to block the last car... if you were in an 08 D Mazda, learn the bloody rules of the road you are a menace.

L1011

tvc15 wrote: »

There are people (including some on here with anger issues) who think correct lane usage is everyone else pulling into lanes 1 and 2 so they can fly along unhindered in lane 3. Part of the problem is people's insistence that it is other people's fault that they are not moving along and it is because other people are terrible drivers!

No, there's nobody on here that thinks that.

There are plenty of people who realise that when you have crap drivers hogging 3 that most of the other crap drivers will assume that 2 is the driving lane and 1 will be all but empty - which is what happens on the N7, the M50, three lane sections of the N4 and M1, etc, etc.

_Kaiser_

tvc15 wrote: »

I don't see the problem with this if it is commuting traffic, you are passing cars in the 3rd lane. There is traffic so it would be insane to weave in and out of lane 2 and lane 1 is moving 20kmh slower than the speed limit.

There are people (including some on here with anger issues) who think correct lane usage is everyone else pulling into lanes 1 and 2 so they can fly along unhindered in lane 3. Part of the problem is people's insistence that it is other people's fault that they are not moving along and it is because other people are terrible drivers!

Leaving Dublin between 4 and 7 means that very rarely will there be light enough traffic for the proper practice of lane usage

Finally someone who gets it.. I think you're spot on with the above too from the reactions here.

_Kaiser_

NSAman wrote: »

I bet you were the fool i met the other night going into Dublin 105 kph in the overtaking lane nothing on the inside lane and when I flashed him to move over he slowed down to 90, still nothing on the inside lane, so I had to undertake him, and was greeted by wanker jesture, car behind me did the same again a wanker jesture, and the car behind him, then he speeds up and tries to block the last car... if you were in an 08 D Mazda, learn the bloody rules of the road you are a menace.

Nope not me.. I don't bother getting involved in carry-on like that but I don't give in to bullying and muppetry either.

_Kaiser_

L1011 wrote: »

No, there's nobody on here that thinks that.

There are plenty of people who realise that when you have crap drivers hogging 3 that most of the other crap drivers will assume that 2 is the driving lane and 1 will be all but empty - which is what happens on the N7, the M50, three lane sections of the N4 and M1, etc, etc.

I don't know what time you're using the M/N7 but anytime I'm on it there's pretty much a steady stream in ALL lanes

L1011

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I don't know what time you're using the M/N7 but anytime I'm on it there's pretty much a steady stream in ALL lanes

You're in Lane 3, by your own admission, the entire time - how do you know what Lane 1 is like?

_Kaiser_

L1011 wrote: »

You're in Lane 3, by your own admission, the entire time - how do you know what Lane 1 is like?

Because I'm constantly aware of and looking at the traffic around me and react accordingly?

Granted yes there are many drivers out there with tunnel vision who can barely see beyond their own bonnet... the amount of times I've come across this type who start drifting to the right to overtake before checking if there's other cars and NEVER use indicators (or use them as they're al;ready halfway between lanes). I've gotten quite good at spotting them over time.

xabi

In fairness to Kaiser he did say he moves left when there is room, lane behaviour changes in rush hour, its not possible to apply the correct rules of moving left after overtaking as usually all lanes are full. Its the morons who stay in lanes 2 and 3 when there is plenty of room to move over that annoy me.

First Up

L1011 wrote: »

You're in Lane 3, by your own admission, the entire time - how do you know what Lane 1 is like?

We are plagued in this country with cowboy drivers, of whom this pillock is a good example. The only solution would be some serious enforcement but there seems little prospect of that. The RSA and Gardai are obsessed with the morning after Christmas parties and nice convenient speed traps in places like the Stillorgan Rd. Anything that calls for a bit of work, like motorway patrols or cracking down on cars with wonky lights is too much trouble.

But I must say the new flyover at Newlands Cross is a great improvement.

L1011

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Because I'm constantly aware of and looking at the traffic around me and react accordingly?

Based on your claim that its not "safe" to move out of Lane 3 until after Naas, I really doubt you are.

Please learn the actual laws about driving in this country and obey them. You are one rather significant part of the problem on the N7, as much as you try and deflect the blame to others.

josip

Until we get a law in Ireland that gives priority to the motorist trying to move into the outer/overtaking lanes on a motorway, over those already in the lane, this will continue to be the normal style of motorway driving.

Many drivers will be reluctant in pull back into inner lanes for fear of getting trapped behind slower moving traffic and not being able to get back out again when they want to.

Is this an actual law on German autobahns or is it just convention?