National Postcodes to be introduced

MrMorooka

BailMeOut wrote: »

couriers not being able to find delivery addresses is the main reason for this. I

Didn't couriers say they didn't want this system?

Nermal

MrMorooka wrote: »

Didn't couriers say they didn't want this system?

They want a system that they don't have to pay for.

TheChizler

radia wrote: »

I'd be more worried about the cases where they've INCLUDED the resident's name on the system. Let's say you want to find a house to burgle that's just occupied by a woman. Chances greatly increased when the woman's name is in the address line.
Or someone says on twitter they're off on holiday and you'd like a nice map to their house to visit while they're away.
Well here you go.
You'd think for €27 million that someone could have checked the database to make sure they removed the names.

I'd imagine these are business names, sole traders, farmers etc. All publicly available. Edit: Went through a few from that list, they were either farms or registered business addresses.

ED E

BailMeOut wrote: »

eh no. This will spur on a big industry of online commerce in Ireland and the economic benefit will far exceed the any setup costs. Ireland is in the dark ages when it comes to online shopping and delivery and couriers not being able to find delivery addresses is the main reason for this. I certainly avoid online deliveries as I have to spend 30 minutes on the phone with the drivers giving turn by turn directions every time.

bring it on - this is a very good development for this nation.

An post say no. Theyre the biggest package carrier in the country IIRC.

Its not intuitive. Doesnt help Mr GLS driver in rural Roscommon.

Its not open.

Unless theres mass adoption it won't take off, and I dont see the current system getting a foothold at all.


EDIT: misread earlier post.

ukoda

ED E wrote: »

An post say no. Theyre the biggest package carrier in the country IIRC.

Its not intuitive. Doesnt help Mr GLS driver in rural Roscommon.

Its not open.

Unless theres mass adoption it won't take off, and I dont see the current system getting a foothold at all.

Lies. An Post have said publicly numerous times they will use eircode.

d

murpho999

From reading twitter and news sources such as Irish Times, Indo and Journal. Coverage and comments seem mostly negative.

Unlike us nerds in here, many people are only learning about the random codes and not working in google maps today and people are calling it a waste of money.

Also, saying that not making it a compulsory system may limit take-up which I actually agree with.

plodder

ukoda wrote: »

Lies. An Post have said publicly numerous times they will use eircode.

But, they don't particularly care whether you use it or not. They'll still deliver your post.

BailMeOut

ED E wrote: »

Doesnt help Mr GLS driver in rural Roscommon

of course it does, Mr GLS driver types the code into some device on his dash board and it takes him to the door. In fact what will happen is that Mr GLS's route for the day will be pre-determined by a system at GLS and he just follows instructions from there. This is how it works in other countries. Any cost to license the codes will be saved on more productive drivers making more delivers during his day and saving a hell of a lot of fuel and mobile phone calls.

Anything that gets delivered to your home or business will use this system eventually if they want to remain competitive.

secman

Seems there is absolutely no crossover or connection between the new eircode references and the new Street codes being erected all over the country by the local Co Co ,those new L Signs , seems rather strange...very Irish indeed

ozmo

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I would expect a more fair and balanced approach by him, bit of pro and con.

Why? - hes not a journalist - he allowed to voice his opinions.

With regards to your pastaferian tag on all your posts - I would have thought you would be only too familiar with the dangers of scientists and teachers being forced to give 'balanced' opinions even if they feel they are wrong.

moyners

Anyone else surprised that @eircode hasn't even tweeted one tweet? I would have thought they'd be using all the social media tools at their disposal on today of all days?

ukoda

plodder wrote: »

But, they don't particularly care whether you use it or not. They'll still deliver your post.

They also don't care if you knit the address onto a scarf or create a puzzle to be solved to find the address. They will go to great lengths to deliver mail. But to claim they won't use eircode is just wrong.

http://www.thejournal.ie/an-post-puzzle-mail-2-2207105-Jul2015/

TheChizler

ukoda wrote: »

They also don't care if you knit the address onto a scarf or create a puzzle to be solved to find the address. They will go to great lengths to deliver mail. But to claim they won't use eircode is just wrong.

http://www.thejournal.ie/an-post-puzzle-mail-2-2207105-Jul2015/

As an aside, a friend once sent another friend another friend a postcard with the address in the format: "NAME, might be STREET NAME I think it's number 12 but it might be something else, I think it has a green door, she goes to IT Carlow if that helps?".

It got there.

plodder

BailMeOut wrote: »

of course it does, Mr GLS driver types the code into some device on his dash board and it takes him to the door. In fact what will happen is that Mr GLS's route for the day will be pre-determined by a system at GLS and he just follows instructions from there. This is how it works in other countries. Any cost to license the codes will be saved on more productive drivers making more delivers during his day and saving a hell of a lot of fuel and mobile phone calls.

Anything that gets delivered to your home or business will use this system eventually if they want to remain competitive.

While it makes sense to have a satnav that can navigate to each and every door and that data has to be paid for, the difference is that in other countries you can do much of those other functions (sorting and routing) for free (ie. without having to license any product). So, this is just yet another cost being heaped on Irish businesses, which is why the cost of doing business (and prices generally) are so high here.

Also, noone seems to have a clue yet, when satnavs will support Eircode. The system is completely useless to the public until then.

SpaceTime

bk wrote: »

Exactly, for instance today my housemate posted my Eircode on a whatsapp group of friends of ours! The group included two friends who live in apartments in the same building. He thought the code applied to the entire building and he was trying to be helpful and tell the other two people what their code now is!

I had to tell him it applied to our apartment specifically and thus it was different for the other two people.

And he is a very smart guy, works in IT, a geek, etc. But he made a genuine mistake because he thought the code was like the British Postcode, a general code.

I'm sure many other people will make this same mistake in posting their codes, thinking they are general area codes like the UK and US systems.

So it is important for those of us who know better and to point out the dangers of posting your full address details online.

Sure the French and most continental systems apply to huge areas or whole towns.

A code like 22100 might apply to an entire area the size of one of the eircode routing codes like T23 appears to be the entire Northside/Northeast side of Cork City for example. So I'm sure it's going to cause a lot of confusion as people aren't at all used to postal codes being this personalised.

loyatemu

secman wrote: »

Seems there is absolutely no crossover or connection between the new eircode references and the new Street codes being erected all over the country by the local Co Co ,those new L Signs , seems rather strange...very Irish indeed

L roads are just a Local road number - similar to R (regional) and N (national).

BailMeOut

plodder wrote: »

Also, noone seems to have a clue yet, when satnavs will support Eircode. The system is completely useless to the public until then.

satnav's cannot adopt something that does not exist. It exists now so we are at day 1 of this development. All that is to follow and it will.

I am sure we would have more people on here complaining if the state spent all that money developing a system only to be giving it away to the likes of Fedex, UPS, DHL, etc... It will also require constant maintenance and administration which also needs to be paid for.

Yggr of Asgard

ukoda wrote: »

Lies. An Post have said publicly numerous times they will use eircode.

When quoting, you might want to include the original comment of mine, not just AnPost answer to provide context:

I said:

@Postvox thank you for not particpating in the @Eircode operated #eircode scam and continuing to deliver my mail without that nonsense.

To which they to my surprise replied with

@YggrofAsgard @Eircode Of course we will continue delivering your mail, but we will also be using the new @Eircode from today

ukoda

Yggr of Asgard wrote: »

When quoting, you might want to include the original comment of mine, not just AnPost answer to provide context:

I said:



To which they to my surprise replied with

Another poster said An Post weren't using ericode. My response was in reply to them, I used a tweet that clearly outlined An Posts position. The context or previous tweets weren't relevant to the point I was making.

plodder

BailMeOut wrote: »

satnav's cannot adopt something that does not exist. It exists now so we are at day 1 of this development. All that is to follow and it will.

Where are the plans/announcements at least? We don't know for sure they will support it.

I am sure we would have more people on here complaining if the state spent all that money developing a system only to be giving it away to the likes of Fedex, UPS, DHL, etc... It will also require constant maintenance and administration which also needs to be paid for.

No, I said those companies should (and would) pay for the databases as they exist today. No difference there. However, a slightly different structure would have enabled other uses that shouldn't be charged for (eg organising deliveries, routing).

Particularly small businesses (eg take away delvery services) should be able to organise deliveries by just looking at a map on the wall. They shouldn't be forced to buy software to decode the random code.

bk

BailMeOut wrote: »

satnav's cannot adopt something that does not exist. It exists now so we are at day 1 of this development. All that is to follow and it will.

I am sure we would have more people on here complaining if the state spent all that money developing a system only to be giving it away to the likes of Fedex, UPS, DHL, etc... It will also require constant maintenance and administration which also needs to be paid for.

I disagree completely.

This is vital national infrastructure, the development of which has already been paid for by the Irish taxpayer and thus should be freely available to everyone.

Just like the OSI maps should also be freely available in digital format to everyone too, just as it is in more progressive countries like the UK and Norway.

tvc15

bk wrote: »

I disagree completely.

This is vital national infrastructure, the development of which has already been paid for by the Irish taxpayer and thus should be freely available to everyone.

Just like the OSI maps should also be freely available in digital format to everyone too, just as it is in more progressive countries like the UK and Norway.

In fairness we could have done it properly with public money but decided to outsource it unfortunately

LeinsterDub

secman wrote: »

Seems there is absolutely no crossover or connection between the new eircode references and the new Street codes being erected all over the country by the local Co Co ,those new L Signs , seems rather strange...very Irish indeed

Why do you need a connection?

Ask for their postcode, go to website, click directions

dr.fuzzenstein

plodder wrote: »

While it makes sense to have a satnav that can navigate to each and every door and that data has to be paid for, the difference is that in other countries you can do much of those other functions (sorting and routing) for free (ie. without having to license any product). So, this is just yet another cost being heaped on Irish businesses, which is why the cost of doing business (and prices generally) are so high here.

Also, noone seems to have a clue yet, when satnavs will support Eircode. The system is completely useless to the public until then.

We'll have to wait and see. i would be very surprised if there wasn't an app or native support by Google Maps.
In the meantime, if you go to the Eircode finder on your phone and hit "Get Directions" it will launch Google Maps with the destination put in, so it is already of use with a phone.

TheChizler

bk wrote: »

I disagree completely.

This is vital national infrastructure, the development of which has already been paid for by the Irish taxpayer and thus should be freely available to everyone.

Just like the OSI maps should also be freely available in digital format to everyone too, just as it is in more progressive countries like the UK and Norway.

Well either it's spread across the tax base, or charges are aimed at those likely to profit/reduce their own costs from it.

seamus

bk wrote: »

This is vital national infrastructure, the development of which has already been paid for by the Irish taxpayer and thus should be freely available to everyone.

Completely agreed.

Yes, there is a maintenance cost for the whole system, but the actual system they've gone with is deliberately designed to require continuous maintenance and incur continuous cost.

There were other systems they could have gone with that would require far less maintenance, so the cost of giving it away for free would be minimal.

You can also go for soft-enforcement which requires commercial users to buy a licence. The big companies like UPS and DHL would still buy these licences, while the likes of small app developers and hobbyists wouldn't be hindered by the blatant money-grabbing model that's been introduced.

TheChizler

The randomness of the last 4 digits is actually the next best thing to having an extra check digit. With a sequential system, for people with similar addresses a single digit error in the postcode won't alert someone/something comparing the address to the code location, if you got a digit wrong something might end up at a neighbour's house. However in a randomised code (and they may not be random, they may be intentionally significantly different to local codes) it will be immediately obvious to someone looking up the location that the code refers to somewhere completely different to the address, and to act accordingly. A check digit would be better for this, but at the cost of adding length to the code.

Eugene Norman

seamus wrote: »

Completely agreed.

Yes, there is a maintenance cost for the whole system, but the actual system they've gone with is deliberately designed to require continuous maintenance and incur continuous cost.

There were other systems they could have gone with that would require far less maintenance, so the cost of giving it away for free would be minimal.

You can also go for soft-enforcement which requires commercial users to buy a licence. The big companies like UPS and DHL would still buy these licences, while the likes of small app developers and hobbyists wouldn't be hindered by the blatant money-grabbing model that's been introduced.

Not sure why the tax payer would be subsidising small app developers. Maybe there should be a commercial and non-commercial licence.

The negativity on eircode is why we can't have nice things.

Yggr of Asgard

ukoda wrote: »

Another poster said An Post weren't using ericode. My response was in reply to them, I used a tweet that clearly outlined An Posts position. The context or previous tweets weren't relevant to the point I was making.

Which is only 1/2 of the truth because if you read the propaganda of Eircode they state:

An Post requires the full, correct postal address to attempt delivery of the mail item.

So while AnPost might use Eircode they will require your "normal" too, so how far their answer there is true is debatable.

FreudianSlippers

Although I thought they weren't going to do this, I got a D04 XXXX and D07 XXXX for my house and rental place. I'm glad as it'll be easier to remember, but I could have sworn they said it wouldn't work that way