Ultra Street Fighter 4 Discussion Thread

Placebo

I dont think the game is going to take any sudden unintended direction.
Even with the introduction of vanilla sagat, what are you going to transition to ?
MVC3 is completely different, i dont think there will be any 100% transition overs. You may lose the odd srk,ken fanboy. But thats a good thing.

Also 3s is getting an online release, it must have done something right !?

K.O.Kiki

In fairness, 3S is perilously close to being a 2-horse race.

S tier:
SA3 Yun, SA2 Chun

A tier:
SA3 Ken, SA2 Makoto, SA3 Dudley

A- tier:
SA1 Akuma, SA3 Urien

B+ tier:
SA1 Ibuki, SA2 Alex, SA2 Yang

C tier:
Elena, Necro, Oro, Ryu, Hugo

Crap tier:
Q, Twelve, Sean

"Little emo wanker" tier:
Remy

(tier list is approximate)

Dreddybajs

Ken is easily up there with Yun and Chun even though they are both stronger overall. Also lol at "SA2 Makoto" etc.

K.O.Kiki

SA3 Ken is good, only reason he's not S tier is because his Super doesn't do massive damage.

SA2 Makoto: huge (60%+?) stun from 1 *super*, lots of EX meter.
SA3 Dudley: 3 fast super bars, and nasty juggle potential.

SA1 Akuma for having the game's only truly good fireball game.
SA3 Urien for Aegis Reflector.

SA1 Ibuki for nasty reset juggles, stun and a painful chip super.
SA2 Yang because EX Mantis Slash is really good. Also SA2 has 1f startup IIRC, so good punisher if you need it.
SA2 Alex is solid IMHO.

And we all understand why the "Crap tier" characters rarely win.

Ramza

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

SA3 Ken is good, only reason he's not S tier is because his Super doesn't do massive damage.

SA2 Makoto: huge (60%+?) stun from 1 *super*, lots of EX meter.
SA3 Dudley: 3 fast super bars, and nasty juggle potential.

SA1 Akuma for having the game's only truly good fireball game.
SA3 Urien for Aegis Reflector.

SA1 Ibuki for nasty reset juggles, stun and a painful chip super.
SA2 Yang because EX Mantis Slash is really good. Also SA2 has 1f startup IIRC, so good punisher if you need it.
SA2 Alex is solid IMHO.

And we all understand why the "Crap tier" characters rarely win.

No, No, No :pac:

Anyway, not to go off topic with 3s or whatever, but I honestly don't feel that the whole "same 3 characters zz" argument makes any sense. For example at SVB there was 2 Chun-Li players, who were very good, and I think one Ken, and Rakurai and someone else only used Yun. They were all very good players, but there was a huge mix at SVB this year, 4 Uriens (myself included), 2 Yangs (one who was very nasty and made top 8), Pedram with Necro (who made top 8 and even got 4th place iirc), and 3 Hugos, a sick Oro player, and two twelve players. I could go through a few more characters but it wouldn't add onto my argument. I know there usually is A LOT of Chun/Yun/Ken but really, does it really stop you from enjoying the/a game? Hey it hasn't stopped me from using who I like, and playing HOW I like. So please stop the whole 2/3 horse race argument because it's just annoying now, and there isn't a whole lot of truth to it either. You need to play the game to get it. I've seen some pretty interesting playstyles in my almost 7 years of playing 3s

Dreddybajs wrote: »

Ken is easily up there with Yun and Chun even though they are both stronger overall. Also lol at "SA2 Makoto" etc.

My view on top 3s characters is like, Yun, Chun, Makoto, Dudley, Ken. I don't think is as close to Chun/Yun as people think even though as you say they both have things stronger than him (though Ken is still a seriously strong character)

But this thread/age is about SF4 so I will try my best to try and get my opinion across.

The main worry seems to be that SF4 will be shifted in a new direction game-play wise and maybe as far as character usage goes. I don't think this is true and people are worrying over nothing. It will still be SF4. It's still the game you loved and played for last 2 years. Like what Hound said, I think people are worrying wayy too much, and using 3s as an example is not merely viable imo.

If you play a defensive style continue to play a defensive style, who's stopping you?

erinsoup

People arguing about 3S balance? (in the SSF4 thread no less)

Might as well read SRK forums

A-Trak

Ramza wrote: »

No, No, No :pac:

Anyway, not to go off topic with 3s or whatever,
[Lots and lots of 3s text]

So please stop the whole 2/3 horse race argument because it's just annoying now, and there isn't a whole lot of truth to it either.
[Lots of text on 3s balance.]

My view on top 3s characters is like, Yun, Chun,[/End]

3S is far from balanced,

Ramza

LOL

Never said it was And Doom was the one who brought up 3s so..

so maybe you should

Dea-

never mind

Doctor DooM

Actually lads if people are going to discuss 3S tiers I am really going to have to insist Remy gets his own "little emo wanker" tier.

K.O.Kiki

Done.

Placebo

cant use SVB as a good test subset for 3S. Not big enough/Years after game at its peak etc etc . Time will tell what Online version is like, perhaps then we can see

Ken B

They had better balance it by the time 3S online comes out....

J0hnick

Ken B wrote: »

They had better balance it by the time 3S online comes out....

The community is pretty split on it, all the uber hardcore players like Pyrolee and 5star (who wont even play the PS2 port due to the MINOR differences) don't want it touched, everyone else who was sick of seeing an army of Yun and Chun want it rebalanced.

K.O.Kiki

While a rebalance COULD be achieved (potentially), I say fvck it -- you either learn to defeat BS, or you learn Chun/Yun/Ken.

Also Ono has confirmed months ago it's built on the more common Rev.A board (the one with Urien unblockables, etc.)

Azza

Back on thread guys. Create a 3S online thread if you want to to talk about it.

Scavenger XIII

Azza wrote: »

Back on thread guys. Create a 3S online thread if you want to to talk about it.

You don't remember the awesome 3S Online thread(or Ramza Vs. Boards.ie as it may also be known)?

Owwmykneecap

Placebo wrote: »

cant use SVB as a good test subset for 3S. Not big enough/Years after game at its peak etc etc . Time will tell what Online version is like, perhaps then we can see

That and it was played mainly by mentalists on 14 inch b/w tv's using swap discs.

Placebo

Owwmykneecap wrote: »

That and it was played mainly by mentalists on 14 inch b/w tv's using swap discs.

they sure did make me feel like a SURFACER

with their black and white tv's and old wooden sticks and really od

Ramza

I actually have no ****ing idea how this thread came to be talking about 3s lol

Placebo wrote: »

cant use SVB as a good test subset for 3S. Not big enough/Years after game at its peak etc etc . Time will tell what Online version is like, perhaps then we can see

Yeah, you're right. I was just using as an example from my own experience. ^^

And KiKi (sorry again Azza but just want my chance to reply before this thread goes back on track), I don't agree with that. I ****ing hate Chun-Li. It's one of my nightmare matches with Urien. Ken is a nightmare for Urien too, and Yun is ok. From a Urien players' perspective I have no choice, like everyone else, to learn my matchups (which I have). I feel there is quite a few people who are merely speculating to this "bs" of which you speak KiKi. And I can't really hold credit to people who don't play the game much, who speak of balance like I said in the 3sOE thread. I just can't, if we're going to talk about balance. After all there are like, 5 people who active play or have played 3s on this board?

I don't know what you mean by learn to defeat BS or use Chun/Yun/Ken. Some people are ****ing lazy man and would rather bitch on forums (Q.Q) than learn matchups. Just saying yo.
Don't get me wrong, am not defending the game but I just feel a lot of people complain too much about Yun/Chun/Ken. Don't you see that Yun/Chun/Ken is completely irrelevant as Dreddy said, every game has a distinguished top tier, so it's always going to be X/Y/Z etc. Check the last SBO results for SF4 and tell me it's not the same :pac:

The game would be sick(er) if some changes were made, trust me!

Scavenger XIII wrote: »

You don't remember the awesome 3S Online thread(or Ramza Vs. Boards.ie as it may also be known)?

Ah, the 20 page crusade lol. I know I'm sounding like an elitist but after playing the game for so long I have to disagree with a lot of what was and has been said. I just cannot take credit from people who don't play the game when discussing balance, I'm sorry. Mere speculation or iteration of certain arguments is boring.

The bottom line is really, err, is it really Yun/Chun/Ken you don't like or is it learning matchups you don't like? :pac:. If I said say, hypothetically, the new top 3 are, Dudley/Makoto/Yang, would you say aww yeah no more Chun/Yun/Ken or would you still bitch about top tier oh noes I need to learn matchups zzzzzz

Be honest

K.O.Kiki

But you ARE an OTT fanboy of 3S.
We won't really hold it against you, but you are

You keep going on about "experience", yet you don't get what I mean by BS?

It's simple: every FG has BS.
Virtua Fighter, low punch is BS.
Tekken, fast, mid, safe launchers are BS.
SF2, safe keep-away is BS.
etc.

In that vein, Chun's very powerful normals/kara throw, Yun's SA3 free damage, Ken's everything are BS.
I never said they were unbeatable. They're something players have to deal with quickly, and they make those 3 very powerful compared to the rest of the cast, but I never said it's impossible.

Are you saying my Q is free? My Q is crap, but at least I tried to learn his matchups -- until I just got frustrated and picked Ken/Chun/Makoto, since winning is "easier" with them.


And for the record, the only true changes I want in this game:
Yang Rekka motion changed to Abel Rekka (qcf, f, f instead of qcfx3) -- personal preference.
Fix errant hitboxes (there's only a few of those).

Everything else you just learn to deal with, even Chun with 2 stocks.

Ramza

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

But you ARE an OTT fanboy of 3S.
We won't really hold it against you, but you are

You keep going on about "experience", yet you don't get what I mean by BS?

It's simple: every FG has BS.
Virtua Fighter, low punch is BS.
Tekken, fast, mid, safe launchers are BS.
SF2, safe keep-away is BS.
etc.

In that vein, Chun's very powerful normals/kara throw, Yun's SA3 free damage, Ken's everything are BS.
I never said they were unbeatable. They're something players have to deal with quickly, and they make those 3 very powerful compared to the rest of the cast, but I never said it's impossible.

Are you saying my Q is free? My Q is crap, but at least I tried to learn his matchups -- until I just got frustrated and picked Ken/Chun/Makoto, since winning is "easier" with them.


And for the record, the only true changes I want in this game:
Yang Rekka motion changed to Abel Rekka (qcf, f, f instead of qcfx3) -- personal preference.
Fix errant hitboxes (there's only a few of those).

Everything else you just learn to deal with, even Chun with 2 stocks.

I love 3s but I'm not overly defending it, even if it seems I am =/

I play a tonne of other games too you know to the level/time I play 3s too, it's just 3s/ST are the only ones I can realistically play opponents' in...

Yes Kiki I get what you mean by BS but to be honest there isn't much BS, apart from Chun having maybe two meters on her SA2 and GJ meter being way too small. That's it imo

Can't comment on VF
Fast mid safe launchers are not BS
WTF is safe keep away lmao, please don't start on SF2 now..

SA3 is not free damage, lulz. It's strong and they shud nerf the meter
Yes Kiki deal with as in learn matchups. You complain about Chun's normals but, it's quite fun/easy to bait her into an out footsie. She has sick normals I know but cmon dude. I think you're over exaggerating here. Ken's solid and really has nothing wrong with him IMO, he's not even top tier

Like I said before KiKi, and no offence but that post was utter garbage for the most part, and it's that uninformed stuff like that, I cannot take seriously

There was definitely truth to some of it like I said before, I'm not trying to defend this game

No, learn to rekka plz

Yes, fix some hitboxes

chopperbyrne

You couldn't be any more wrong Kiki.

A-Trak

FFS lads, I can't stomach this roundabout debate again.

*unsubs from thread*

Ramza

Either can I, i thought I already made it clear, this is SF4 thread :S

im done

Doctor DooM

Furthermore, don't ignore a mod when they tell you to stop talking about something. Really.

Don't want to have to start handing out infractions and that crap lads.

AeoNGriM

Everyone is ignoring the REAL issues.....why the hell are Makoto's feet bigger than her head??!! And what about the poor overworked pottery maker who's pots are continually smashed into oblivion??!! Clay doesn't grow on trees you know......well it doesn't!

Doctor DooM

AeoNGriM wrote: »

Everyone is ignoring the REAL issues.....why the hell are Makoto's feet bigger than her head??!! And what about the poor overworked pottery maker who's pots are continually smashed into oblivion??!! Clay doesn't grow on trees you know......well it doesn't!

The pots are apparently important enough to warrant discussion at tournaments...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERWAk6ETxZI

A-Trak

When AE comes to consoles, I hope to jaysus they bring Chamionship mode back.

The group lobbies in super are a welcome edition, but the tournament mode and group battle are a massive ball of fail. I think I've played either mode about twice each.

Ramza

I wish online had a rematch option, I hate having to go back to lobby every time =[

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Furthermore, don't ignore a mod when they tell you to stop talking about something. Really.

Don't want to have to start handing out infractions and that crap lads.

But you brought up 3s? And then Kiki went on a rave :pac:

Stylesclash07

will gamestop have them today