Ultra Street Fighter 4 Discussion Thread

Scavenger XIII

Stylesclash07 wrote: »

will gamestop have them today

wat

D4RK ONION

Stylesclash07 wrote: »

will gamestop have them today

I agree!

Doctor DooM

Ramza wrote: »

I wish online had a rematch option, I hate having to go back to lobby every time =[




But you brought up 3s? And then Kiki went on a rave :pac:

I mentioned it in passing, and specifically pointed out I didn't want to have a go at 3S in the next post when I said it.
Also regretting it right now

Move along people, if you want to talk about it any further you know where my pm is. Questioning mod decisions on thread on boards = big no no.

bush

Ramza wrote: »

I wish online had a rematch option, I hate having to go back to lobby every time =[

Ye that would be common sense, something they lack at capcom.

Placebo

less of the capcom bashing.

Ramza

Doctor DooM wrote: »

I mentioned it in passing, and specifically pointed out I didn't want to have a go at 3S in the next post when I said it.
Also regretting it right now

Move along people, if you want to talk about it any further you know where my pm is. Questioning mod decisions on thread on boards = big no no.

K

I can't wait to try out Yun, playing him in 3s and all. Wonder what he'll be like in AE.

GENEI JIN

Doctor DooM

Ramza wrote: »

K

I can't wait to try out Yun, playing him in 3s and all. Wonder what he'll be like in AE.

GENEI JIN

Having no attachment to either Yang actually looks the more fun to me to play. Will certainly be giving him a run.

Creature

Considering that T Hawk got no nerfs only buffs, especially this, I wont be trying out the twins. Instead I'll be stomping them into the dirt with my mighty totem! Muhahahahaha!

Azza

I imagine T.Hawk is at least 5:5 with the twins. Honda and Zangief probably beat them.

Creature

Yeah 5:5 at least, probably 6:4. I think you can punish a blocked dive kick with an spd so that knocks off a significant part of their game.

Azza

I'd imagine Dive Kick will probably have to be blocked quite high for you to be able to SPD it.

Ramza

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Having no attachment to either Yang actually looks the more fun to me to play. Will certainly be giving him a run.

Yeah Yang looks legit too. I didn't play him much in 3s, I can use him but only to an okish level. I find him to be one of the funnest to play in 3s, even more than Yun and he's my sub :pac: I'll deffo give them both a go

Malice

Apologies if this has already been asked but I'm not reading through the other 104 pages in this thread . I picked up Super Street Fighter IV earlier this week and I'm quite enjoying it so far. I'm not a complete noob to the SF games. I had the original Street Fighter on the C-64 and I've fond memories of hanging around the Savoy in Galway playing SFII and of course SFII - Championship Edition. The buzz that went around the schoolyard when we realised we could play as M. Bison, Vega etc. was something else . I also had Street Fighter Alpha III but didn't play it a whole lot.

Anyway, my question is to do with the combos in Challenge Mode in SSFIV. Are they meant to be that difficult? I can do most of them up to around level 8 depending on the character but then it just seems like no matter what I input it doesn't complete the challenge. :mad:

Am I meant to buffer certain directional buttons or attacks? If the combo calls for a crouching attack can I do it using either down or down/forward?

Also, is there a ranking list of the available characters available anywhere? I started using Juri just because the player select cursor starts on her but I've no idea how she compares to other characters.

Azza

Yeah the combos are difficult.
Some characters combo's are much tougher than others.

There is many different type of combo's, some of them simple and some of them requiring more advanced techniques. I would not worry about nothing being able to do some of this stuff yet.

There is two character ranking lists.
The first one and latest one is from America.
http://iplaywinner.com/super-street-fighter-4-tiers/

This second one here is the Japanese is slightly older.
http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/oct/17/street-fighter-4-tiers-character-rankings/

Generally people would regard the Japanese Tier listings as more accurate because they are regarded as being able to play the game to a higher standard than American players. However there is some debate about the accuracy of the Japanese tier list due to the fact that SSFIV was not released in the arcades in Japan and many of the best Japanese players didn't play the game.

In a few months time Arcade Edition will be available as DLC for the console versions. This will add new characters and rebalances the old characters, so the tier list will probably changes several times as people get to grip with the new version of the game.

The general opinion of Juri is that she's isn't a great character.

If your on Xbox and got a mic, I can talk you through some of of the challenges and explain some of the techniques needed.

AeoNGriM

Hi Malice, welcome to the magical world of Super SF4! With regards to the combos in the game, they can be very challenging. They are all about patience, practice and timing. After almost 2 years of playing Vanilla SF4, I still have trouble with a lot of them. It's relatively easy to pick up the game and start playing, but it can be very difficult to master given that it is practically a totally different game engine to what you were previously used to in the earlier SF games.

There is a VERY good playlist of tutorial videos I came across on YouTube to help you advance from beginner through intermediate up to advanced level if you want to take it that far. The videos were created by a Canadian YouTuber called VesperArcade. You can find his channel here http://www.youtube.com/user/VesperArcade

He does assume if you are watching his videos that you will be using a stick, but everything he covers is totally relevant to playing with a pad. There are quite a few very sucessful pad only players, but in general using a stick gives you more control (although some would disagree!), although it can a month or so to get used to the transition from pad to stick.

Check the link below for a tier list of how the characters are currently ranked in a Player vs Player match, assuming both players are of equal skill. To read it, you compare a character on the left with the character matchup across the top. Anything less than 5 means the match is not in that characters favour, above 5 means it is. So for example, if we look at Akuma vs GU (Guile) we see that the match is 6/4 in Akuma's favour, however Akuma vs DI (M.Bison) is 4/6 against Akuma. DI is Dictator (M.Bison), Boxer is Balrog and Claw is Vega. Also, the characters are ranked A through D in order of strongest to weakest, relatively speaking of course!

http://iplaywinner.com/news/2011/1/5/super-street-fighter-4-tier-list-january-2011.html

Hope this helps you get to grips with this awesome game, if you have any other questions fire em out and one of the chaps on here should be able to sort you out

K.O.Kiki

Azza wrote:

In a few months time Arcade Edition will be available as DLC for the console versions. This will add new characters and rebalances the old characters, so the tier list will probably changes several times as people get to grip with the new version of the game.

Careful now, we don't know this for certain yet.

@Malice: a lot of trial combos are "Link" combos, meaning that you have to hit the attacks with perfect timing such that the 2nd attack comes out DIRECTLY AFTER 1st.
It takes a bit of getting used to alright.

Malice

Thanks for the info, I'll check out those links in depth later. I'm surprised at some of the positions though. I had always intuitively thought that Ryu and Ken would be among the highest-ranked characters and that's certainly not true in Ken's case.

Azza wrote: »

If your on Xbox and got a mic, I can talk you through some of of the challenges and explain some of the techniques needed.

Thanks for the offer but I'm on PS3. I can't stand the XBox controller.

In fact the first thing I did after I got the game was to remap the controller into something more sensible (at least to me) so I changed the controls to:
[] - MP
/\ - HP
X - MK
O - HK
L1 - PPP
L2 - KKK
R1 - LP
R2 - LK

Coming from a Tekken background the whole concept of different strength attacks is a bit difficult to get my head around. Am I missing out on a lot by avoiding using the light attacks? I don't wrap my right hand around the controller, I tend to position it so my index and middle fingers are over the attack buttons. By doing that I can't really reach the R1/R2 buttons without changing grip which is difficult in the middle of a fight .

K.O.Kiki

Light attacks are god in SF.

cr.LK is fast, must be blocked low, can be used to bait stuff on wakeup, can combo into specials (e.g. tatsu).
It is also the cornerstone of OS Throw Escape.

Malice

AeoNGriM wrote: »

There is a VERY good playlist of tutorial videos I came across on YouTube to help you advance from beginner through intermediate up to advanced level if you want to take it that far. The videos were created by a Canadian YouTuber called VesperArcade. You can find his channel here http://www.youtube.com/user/VesperArcade

He does assume if you are watching his videos that you will be using a stick, but everything he covers is totally relevant to playing with a pad. There are quite a few very sucessful pad only players, but in general using a stick gives you more control (although some would disagree!), although it can a month or so to get used to the transition from pad to stick.

Thanks for that. I will definitely check that out. I have a Namco Arcade Stick somewhere but I didn't like using it.

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

@Malice: a lot of trial combos are "Link" combos, meaning that you have to hit the attacks with perfect timing such that the 2nd attack comes out DIRECTLY AFTER 1st.
It takes a bit of getting used to alright.

That's what I was afraid of. I remember practicing the Electric Wind Godfist for ages on Tekken III. I gave up in the end because I could never do it consistently.

Malice

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

Light attacks are god in SF.

cr.LK is fast, must be blocked low, can be used to bait stuff on wakeup, can combo into specials (e.g. tatsu).
It is also the cornerstone of OS Throw Escape.

Damn, I may have to revisit my control layout so.

AeoNGriM

Malice wrote: »

Thanks for the info, I'll check out those links in depth later. I'm surprised at some of the positions though. I had always intuitively thought that Ryu and Ken would be among the highest-ranked characters and that's certainly not true in Ken's case.

Thanks for the offer but I'm on PS3. I can't stand the XBox controller.

In fact the first thing I did after I got the game was to remap the controller into something more sensible (at least to me) so I changed the controls to:
[] - MP
/\ - HP
X - MK
O - HK
L1 - PPP
L2 - KKK
R1 - LP
R2 - LK

Coming from a Tekken background the whole concept of different strength attacks is a bit difficult to get my head around. Am I missing out on a lot by avoiding using the light attacks? I don't wrap my right hand around the controller, I tend to position it so my index and middle fingers are over the attack buttons. By doing that I can't really reach the R1/R2 buttons without changing grip which is difficult in the middle of a fight .

This is a bit technical so bear with me. The game runs at a steady 60 frames per second. Every attack or special move has an animation associated with it. Each animation lasts for a certain number of onscreen frames. Each attack has 3 seperate stages in it's animation: the Startup, Active and Recovery stages. No move in the game hits your opponent as soon as you press the button, there are a certain number of frames in the animation of each move before the hitbox on the end of your characters foot/fist/whatever becomes active. This is called the Startup stage. When the hitbox becomes active, it lasts for a certain number of animated frames- this is the Active stage. After the hitbox disappears, there are a number of animated frames in which your character recovers from throwing out the attack. This is the Recovery stage, and you cannot block/jump or do anything until it ends.

Light attacks have the least number of startup and recovery frames but do light damage, heavy attacks have the most number of startup and recovery frames but do the most damage, medium attacks are somewhere in the middle. In general, light attacks are used to start combos. Because heavy attacks will leave you vulnerable to a counterattack if your opponent blocks it due to their long Recovery stage, chaining light attacks together allows you to 'Hit Confirm' ie it extends a combo long enough so that your brain can register that your attacks are actually connecting and doing damage so you can finish with a special move or heavy attack. If you just used special moves or heavy attacks all the time, you leave yourself wide open due to the length of time it takes your character to recover from attacks.

VesperArcade covers all of this in his tutorial series, and explains it a lot better than I can. It can be a bit over your head at first, but you get the hang of it eventually.

K.O.Kiki

I learned EWGF using the double-tap method:

RP on both Triangle & R1.
When I do f,d,d/f+RP, I tap Triangle (thumb), then R1 really quickly.

You can do a similar thing in the SFIV engine: the "plink".
The buttons have a set order of importance:
HK>HP>MK>MP>LK>LP
What this means is that if you press, for example, HP+LK, you will only get HP to come out.
You can exploit this by doing:
"press HP, hold HP, press LK *while holding* HP"
(in symbols: HP~LK)
This tricks the game into registering the HP input twice.

A sample Ryu combo would be:
cr.MP, cr.MP, cr.HK

which is easier if you do:
cr.MP~LP, cr.MP~LP, cr.HK~MK

J0hnick

Azza wrote: »

In a few months time Arcade Edition will be available as DLC for the console versions. This will add new characters and rebalances the old characters, so the tier list will probably changes several times as people get to grip with the new version of the game.

Someone posted this theoretical Tier List for AE based on who the top 150 Japanese players are using and there BP, the top ones make sense judging from what a lot of people have been saying but some other dont. Deejay for example was slap bang in the middle of the tier list in Super and got nothing but buffs, so there's no way he's that low, Gouken also got mostly buffs so I cant see why he dropped either.

Anyway, here it is.

1. Yun
2. Fei Long
3. Yang
4. Sagat
5. Ken
6. Akuma
7. M.Bison (Dictator)
8. C.Viper
9. Makoto
10. Ryu
11. Sakura
12. E.Honda
13. Guile
14. Chun Li
15. Cody
16. Balrog (Boxer)
17. Abel
18. Dhalsim
19. Rufus
20. Seth
21. Blanka
22. Vega (Claw)
23. Cammy
24. Zangief
25. Adon
26. Ibuki
27. Dudley
28. Guy
29. T.Hawk
30. Deejay
31. Juri
32. Gen
33. Rose
34. El Fuerte
35. Gouken
36. Hakan
37. Dan

Malice

J0hnick wrote: »

Someone posted this theoretical Tier List for AE based on who the top 150 Japanese players are using and there BP

What's BP? British Petroleum? Break Point? Boiling Point?

Jim

Malice wrote: »

What's BP? British Petroleum? Break Point? Boiling Point?

Can't tell if you're being sarcastic, but I'll bite.

Battle Points.

Sairus

Ah, nice to see Rose back where she belongs. :rolleyes:

The list does seem a little lumpy from half ways down.

Sagat06

Wow Honda and Rufus got destroyed

Orim

You have to remember that it's based on usage and top players. So obviously some people are going to higher and lower based on the players that using them.

Fletcher91

11. Sakura

Didn't see that coming. What did they do to her? She must've gotten some serious buffs.

J0hnick

Fletcher91 wrote: »

Didn't see that coming. What did they do to her? She must've gotten some serious buffs.

• Close Medium Punch has less recovery.

• Crouching Medium Punch and Kick can combo from a hit confirm.

• Far Standing Medium Punch can be Canceled, just like Ryu.

• Vulnerable hitbox on far Standing Medium Kick reduced, making it harder to hit her out of it.

• Air Arcing Hurricane Kick can get more airborne hits.

• Recovery time on her Fireball reduced.

• Other various adjustments on making hitboxes bigger, damage, and recovery done to make her stronger.

• Forward dash reduced to 16 frames
• EX Otoshi will track crouching targets better

Also, Daido Mago and Tokido said this about her in an interview,

Tokido: Sakura seems a bit dangerous, doesn’t she?

Mago: I’ve been thinking that really, Sakura is strong as hell, isn’t she?

Daigo: Yeah her attack power has been buffed a bit.

Tokido: Her ability to buffer Shouoken off of Crouching MK is definitely strong.

Mago: Crouching HP as an anti-air is crazy good too, even if you use it only once, most, if not all characters will eat it.

Orim wrote: »

You have to remember that it's based on usage and top players. So obviously some people are going to higher and lower based on the players that using them.

Correct, and win:loss ratio, but its not as accurate as a proper Tier list. For example, Gen is still really low but one of the players in the top 10 is a Gen player.