New Low For Cork City FC (mod note #27)

stovelid

Roar wrote: »

what's foras' agenda?

Think divorcee who hangs tough and gives out about bastard men only to jump on the first oily Lothario that cops them a wink.

Pure_Cork

stovelid wrote: »

Think divorcee who hangs tough and gives out about bastard men only to jump on the first oily Lothario that cops them a wink.

As I said above, this is probably the one and only chance City fans have to save the club, the IP, and help local businesses, players and staff recoup what they're owed. Hurl form the ditch kid. I suppose you'd be happy to screw local businesses, staff, and players, and set up Scumrock Racists FC if ye were in a spot of bother.

stovelid

Pure_Cork wrote: »

As I said above, this is probably the one and only chance City fans have to save the club, the IP, and help local businesses, players and staff recoup what they're owed. Hurl form the ditch kid. I suppose you'd be happy to screw local businesses, staff, and players, and set up Scumrock Racists FC if ye were in a spot of bother.

Failure of nerve masquerading as altruism and using the poor mouth as an excuse to hold the FAI to ransom for a license more like.

Pure_Cork

Back of the Echo today,

The sub-headline: Coughlan: New owners must be supported

Beginning of the article: It's time for all the bickering and infighting to stop. Now is the time to get behind Cork City Football Club. That's the message today from Tom Coughlan to FORAS and all the knockers of the club on the eve of a new season.

Courtesy of John MuckHale

Pure_Cork

stovelid wrote: »

Failure of nerve masquerading as altruism and using the poor mouth as an excuse to hold the FAI to ransom for a license more like.

While the takeover is subject to getting a Premier Division licence, the consortium aren't holding a gun to the head of anyone in the FAI - takeover or not, there'll be LoI football in Cork next season. If the fans made no attempt to try and takeover and save the club when the opportunity presented itself they'd get even more abuse.

Gavin "shels"

Pure_Cork wrote: »

While the takeover is subject to getting a Premier Division licence, the consortium aren't holding a gun to the head of anyone in the FAI

They kind of are I'm afraid. It's clear the FAI's goal is to keep the current Cork City FC afloat and in the LoI, therefore the consortium saying the takeover has a clause of Cork being in the Premier is holding the FAI to ransom.

Pure_Cork

Gavin shels wrote: »

They kind of are I'm afraid. It's clear the FAI's goal is to keep the current Cork City FC afloat and in the LoI, therefore the consortium saying the takeover has a clause of Cork being in the Premier is holding the FAI to ransom.

It's all down to the FAI, it's their decision. The money just isn't there to takeover the current entity in the First Division. The FAI can't expect someone to takeover the current entity in the First Division. The fact that there'll be LoI football in Cork next season regardless should make their decision even easier.

SligoBrewer

Could the FAI grant the license, and then Coughlan and Co pull out of takeover talks with license to operate for the season assured?

CiaranC

Pure_Cork wrote: »

It's all down to the FAI, it's their decision. The money just isn't there to takeover the current entity in the First Division. The FAI can't expect someone to takeover the current entity in the First Division. The fact that there'll be LoI football in Cork next season regardless should make their decision even easier.

Well if the money isnt there, then the club should be let die like every other incarnation of Cork. Instead, FORAS are jumping into bed with yet another unknown investor, taking on huge debts, litigation etc. If this goes ahead, Cork will be in exactly the same position half way through the season.

FORAS had a chance of running their own LOI club and they hadnt the balls. Pathetic.

_blank_

I don't understand why FORAS are even contemplating doing this.

Start your own club, DON'T call it Cork City. Don't do what Rovers did, the 400 Club. Don't try to preserve the history in some lame attempt to keep the name going. The Cork football fans want a club, they don't necessarily want CCFC.

FORAS is strong enough to start afresh, with no baggage, in the First Division.

Do it. Stop being gutless. Walk away from the horrorshow.

Pure_Cork

CiaranC wrote: »

Well if the money isnt there, then the club should be let die like every other incarnation of Cork. Instead, FORAS are jumping into bed with yet another unknown investor, taking on huge debts, litigation etc. If this goes ahead, Cork will be in exactly the same position half way through the season.

FORAS had a chance of running their own LOI club and they hadnt the balls. Pathetic.

Des wrote: »

I don't understand why FORAS are even contemplating doing this.

Start your own club, DON'T call it Cork City. Don't do what Rovers did, the 400 Club. Don't try to preserve the history in some lame attempt to keep the name going. The Cork football fans want a club, they don't necessarily want CCFC.

FORAS is strong enough to start afresh, with no baggage, in the First Division.

Do it. Stop being gutless. Walk away from the horrorshow.

I'm not sure how it's gutless/pathetic to take the one and only opportunity the fans will have to explore the possibility of taking over, saving the club and the IP, supporting local businesses, staff, and players. The main aim of FORAS is the guardianship of Cork City FC, taking over the club is the riskier than starting with a clean slate, so it's gutless/pathetic to explore the viability of the more difficult option? As for not having the balls to restart if CCFC goes bust, that is still on the cards and will go ahead if the takeover doesn't. I'm repeating myself, but people keep making the same point over and over again.

djpbarry

Dundalk have upped the ante by staking a claim to Cork’s place in Europe:

AS THE process of trying to establish the full extent of Cork City’s debts continued yesterday, the first signs of dissatisfaction with the amount of leniency shown to the southerners by the FAI’s licensing committee began to show with Dundalk claiming they should get City’s place in next year’s Europa League.

...

“We appreciate the FAI is in a difficult situation here,” said Dundalk’s Colm Crosson yesterday, “and we can understand why the association is keen to keep City in the Premier Division but we feel it’s clear that they did not have a tax clearance certificate on the stated date and we don’t want to appear shy about claiming what we believe to be rightfully ours.

“The impression I get at the moment,” he added, “is that it’s the independent licensing committee’s intention to grant City a licence for next year and if they can find a basis for doing that then it doesn’t seem likely that they are likely to impose sanctions of any sort. We are just saying we want even-handedness towards those clubs, like ourselves, who did comply with the various conditions and deadlines laid out in the licensing documentation when we were supposed to.”

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2010/0217/1224264629396.html

super_furry

Fair play to Dundaaaaaaaaaaawk. Hopefully Bray have the balls to come out with a similar statement on their Premier Division spot.

djpbarry

super_furry wrote: »

Fair play to Dundaaaaaaaaaaawk. Hopefully Bray have the balls to come out with a similar statement on their Premier Division spot.

They've informally 'expressed dissatisfaction':

Speaking to eleven-a-side.com, the club’s general manager Jack O’Neill said: “We’re not very happy about the current situation and the club will be having a meeting about it either after this evening’s friendly against Bohemians or tomorrow morning.

“We’ve always prepared for a Premier license and we achieved that standard yesterday, but to say we’re disappointed with the situation as it stands is an understatement to say the least.”

http://www.eleven-a-side.com/loi/news.asp?n=38101

Eddie was a bit more direct in his criticism:

He told the Irish Independent: “The reality is we have to wait until next Monday to discover what division we’re in and the transfer window closes next Monday.

“It’s a ridiculous situation we’re in, and we’re a bit of a laughing stock at this stage. I have to be careful with what I say, but if you were to ask me, would Bray have had the same decision if we were in the same position, I’d say definitely not.

“If this committee is independent and if there are strict rules in place, there could only have been one decision [on Monday], even if it would have been a difficult one. So it begs the question, are the rules there and are they the same for each club?”

http://www.eleven-a-side.com/loi/news.asp?n=38103

stovelid

Pure_Cork wrote: »

As for not having the balls to restart if CCFC goes bust, that is still on the cards and will go ahead if the takeover doesn't. I'm repeating myself, but people keep making the same point over and over again.

I'd just be worried that you're hitching your wagon to another "Saviour"

Sometimes it's too easy to encourage clubs to be supporter-run without appreciating that all clubs don't have the support, brand (for want of a better word) or circumstances to make a decent go of it but Cork is perfect for it: big (latent) support, regional patriotism, nice ground and no other clubs competing with you in Cork city. The number of local businesses and the like that have expressed support and helped you out in the past would suggest you have a great latent bedrock of support there and you could be a very successful members clubs. Same with Derry.

As said, the worry now is that the new lot will revive the same old cycle: overshoot themselves and inflate wages, leaving you lot firmly indicted in any future trouble the club may find itself in.

SligoBrewer

super_furry wrote: »

Fair play to Dundaaaaaaaaaaawk. Hopefully Bray have the balls to come out with a similar statement on their Premier Division spot.

In fairness, they don't have a ground worthy of hosting it, and a manager worthy of competing in it nor the league position to justify them asking for it.

If they get it, they get it, if they don't, they don't. Asking for it is a bit pathetic tbh.

djpbarry

SligoBrewer wrote: »

In fairness, they don't have a ground worthy of hosting it, and a manager worthy of competing in it nor the league position to justify them asking for it.

If they get it, they get it, if they don't, they don't. Asking for it is a bit pathetic tbh.

I think they're just saying what everyone else is thinking - having Cork represent the league in Europe this season would be beyond a joke. They drastically over-extended themselves (financially) to qualify in the first place, while other clubs cut their cloth according to the prevailing economic climate. Such situations cause well-intentioned, valuable individuals to become completely disillusioned with the league and they end up walking away, like Richie Sadlier, for example.

Tippex

super_furry wrote: »

Fair play to Dundaaaaaaaaaaawk. Hopefully Bray have the balls to come out with a similar statement on their Premier Division spot.

It's very difficult for the club to come out and say too much as we know the FAI are likely to fine dundalk and any other club that questions the decisions.

Gavin "shels"

Tippex wrote: »

It's very difficult for the club to come out and say too much as we know the FAI are likely to fine dundalk and any other club that questions the decisions.

Every club should just refuse to play in the League of Ireland, what would the FAI do then? Dissolve the league (they'd lose the international side)? Make up Fingal like franchises? etc...

pablomakaveli

FORAS were set up to to help with the running of Cork City and many people joined on that basis. If FORAS did'nt make an attempt to save the club now many of those members would ask why not. Remember FORAS has to answer to it's members not the supporters of other LOI clubs.

If FORAS started a new club without taking an oppurtunity to save Cork City many would be angered by that as they will see the new club as a different one that is seperate to Cork City. The idea of starting a new FORAS run club was a last resort if the Cork City went under.

I think this tripe from the other supporters about giving up and starting again is bollix. Can you honestly say you'd be happy to give up on your club and start a new one if it ran into severe financial problems without taking every oppurtunity to save the current club?

Gavin "shels"

pablomakaveli wrote: »

I think this tripe from the other supporters about giving up and starting again is bollix. Can you honestly say you'd be happy to give up on your club and start a new one if it ran into severe financial problems without taking every oppurtunity to save the current club?

You've already done that method like 10 times or so, what's another team gotta do. Sporting Cork, Racing City, plenty more names left.

getcover

Gavin shels wrote: »

How old are you, 10?:rolleyes:

Well dad, you seem to think I'm your son, so you must be heading for the pension...
Of course, when you can't take a bit of banter, it's always best to reach for the trusty "I know I'm really mature, so you must be a child" defence.


To the posters on here who can handle a bit of give and take, I'm disgusted at what happened last Monday. The fai should have thrown the book at coughlan, his company, and by extension CCFC, who, at the very least should have been relagated. It makes a farce of the licencing process, turns the league into a joke, and turns more and more people away, season after season.
We've been told by the Fai that they desperately want a Cork team in the Premier, something I don't agree with myself hence my tongue in cheek suggestion that "the League needs a Cork team".
As someone who voted against being part of the deal being offered, I'm brassed off that FORAS are involved in the bid now. However, AT NO STAGE did FORAS, or any other member of the consortium DEMAND that a Premier Licence must be handed over. It's the Fai that promised the licence, no one else.
I can't understand why the FAI didn't just announce on Monday that coughlan wasn't getting a licence, they had more than enough reasons to deny him one.

pablomakaveli

Gavin shels wrote: »

You've already done that method like 10 times or so, what's another team gotta do. Sporting Cork, Racing City, plenty more names left.

Cork City is older than i am and for many supporters it's the only Cork club they have known. Just because there have been other clubs in the past does'nt mean we should drop the one we have now and start again without making some effort to save the club.

stovelid

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/cork-debts-close-to-8364900k-2068474.html

Cork debts close to €900k

THE potential takeover of Cork City remained in the balance yesterday after the local consortium hoping to purchase the club found that it has debts of close to €900,000.

The local consortium had been informed that the debts were at €600,000, but were not prepared to purchase the club until they filed through the level of potential debt.

The Leeside outfit's tax bill, meanwhile, was cleared yesterday after their AIB account was unfrozen by the High Court on Monday, allowing Tom Coughlan to transfer the €107,653 to the Revenue's accounts.

djpbarry

Bray slam FAI over Cork fixture decision

Bray General Manager Jack O'Neill said: 'We are absolutely dismayed that the League of Ireland has issued a set of fixtures which places Cork City who currently have no licence to play in the League of Ireland for the coming season in the Premier Division while Bray Wanderers who obtained a Premier Division licence have been placed in the First Division.

'As the 10th ranked team to receive a Premier Division licence from the Independent Licence Committee we find it staggering that the fixtures have been released in such a fashion.

'It is our belief that the release of these fixtures in such a format is inherently flawed and should not have been released in this format in advance of the outcome of the High Court case involving Cork City and the decision of the Independent Club Licensing Committee on Monday 22 February.'

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2010/0218/bray.html

super_furry

No messing about there, and you have to feel for Bray. If the takeover doesn't go ahead – which could well happen seeing as the consortium with have to come up with almost €1million just to repay the debts there now – then Bray are in the ****. There'll be no decision on the make-up of the Premier Division until Monday, coincidentally the same day as the transfer window closes. Bray could be given a place in the Premier League without the time to put together a squad to compete in it.

getcover

super_furry wrote: »

Bray could be given a place in the Premier League without the time to put together a squad to compete in it.

Whichever team get the PD place, Cork or Bray, a team would have to be put in place.
I'd say there will be some sort of extension to the time limit for signing players.The Fai fudge virtually everything else, that should be easy enough for them.

super_furry

Aren't the transfer windows improssed by UEFA though? Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised in the FAI end up recruiting players for Cork, giving the ammount of bending over they've already done for them.

dreamers75

Are the consortium still going ahead even with the extra debt that wasnt known about?

getcover

dreamers75 wrote: »

Are the consortium still going ahead even with the extra debt that wasnt known about?

From what I hear, (and this might not be completely accurate), the debt is much bigger than thought at first, but they are working through it and some sort of reductions are being looked at. Some of the debt might be tnb's personal stuff, mightn't be club debt at all.
€900,000 has been reported, if it really works out at that level, they have to walk away. if the other investors don't, FORAS MUST refuse to go ahead.

The whole thing is far too dodgy, imo, let the f**ker swing for it.
(though it's a b*lls for players and staff owed money)

super_furry

Well they'd want to get their arses in gear and decide. What's the betting on another 'extension'?

stovelid

I wonder what have happened if the teams were reversed in this situation? As in: Bray in turmoil and Cork waiting to step up?

Hint: Bray's license application would have been fucked out last week.

_blank_

Not looking good now.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2010/0218/corkcity.html?

Quintas ready to pull plug on takeover

Thursday, 18 February 2010 19:41
Quintas has stated that the deal to takeover Cork City is unlikely to go through, plunging the club's future into doubt once again.

The consortium, comprising of Peter Gray, Michael O'Connell and FORAS, the Cork City Supporters Trust, have set a deadline of noon on Friday finalise the offer.

The group are concerned about a lack of verification and certainty regarding particular pledges that may have been made in securing possible loans to the club are proving to be a serious impediment for the deal progressing.

There are also issues with new debts being uncovered during the course of due diligence, as well as doubts over the title to shares within the club.

Quintas have also claimed that there is a lack of information coming from Tom Coughlan regarding many of the issues.

Well done TNB. What is this fella playing at.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/soccer/2010/0218/1224264787401.html?

Cork City takeover 'unlikely'

The proposed takeover of Cork City is on the verge of collapse this evening after the facilitators of the deal admitted in a statement a settlement is “increasingly unlikely”.

The Quintas Group, which is operating on behalf of the consortium seeking control of the club, has said a deadline of 12 noon tomorrow has been set for the deal to go through.

“However, it is looking increasingly unlikely that such a deal will take place,” read a statement.

“According to McGuire Desmond Solicitors, acting for the group, a lack of verification and certainty regarding particular pledges that may have been made in securing possible loans to the club are proving to be a serious impediment to the deal progressing.

“There are also issues with new debts being uncovered during the course of due diligence as well as doubts over the title to shares within the club.

“The group also feel that there is a lack of information coming from the current owners of the club regarding many of these issues and, with the licensing committee of the FAI due to meet early next week, a deadline of 12pm on Friday the 19th of February has been set for a decision on whether to finalise the deal to purchase Cork City FC.”

Quintas is operating on behalf of businessmen Peter Gray and Michael O’Connell, and Foras, the Cork City supporter’s group.

The consortium agreed in principle to take over the running of the club from current owner Tom Coughlan last week and have been analysing the club’s financial situation since.

On Monday, the club is succeeded in having a winding-up order sought by the Revenue Commissioners adjourned by the High Court for a week, while the FAI decided to defer a decision in relation to the club’s licensing application until both the legal and ownership issues have finally been resolved.

Should the consortium pull the plug on the takeover deal tomorrow, the future looks grim for the Leesiders.

This is the longest death ever, just pull the fúcking plug, start a new club NOT called Cork City and be done with it.

Christ almighty, what a complete embarrassment.

super_furry

What's the betting it's just more posturing on both sides? I mean how many 'deadlines' are we up to now? Got to be in the 20s. Don't worry lads it's not like the league starts in two weeks.

CiaranC

Looks like FORAS are going to end up running their own club despite their unwillingness to step up.

pablomakaveli

CiaranC wrote: »

Looks like FORAS are going to end up running their own club despite their unwillingness to step up.

They were always ready to step up if it came to that. But as i said earlier in this thread a lot of FORAS members would not be happy if FORAS passed up an oppurtunity to save the club in it's current form.

stovelid

pablomakaveli wrote: »

They were always ready to step up if it came to that.

Might end up being a great move for you long-term. Seriously. If you can find the right people to step up (surely no problem in a fan-base your size) you could be laughing.

_blank_

CiaranC wrote: »

Looks like FORAS are going to end up running their own club despite their unwillingness to step up.

Unwilling? They put in a separate licence application.

Now, I understand why they tried to help the club in it's current incarnation, but they now need to stick to their word, and pull that support like they said they would if they discovered figures didn't tally with what they were told.

That liar should be hounded out of Cork too.

getcover

I REALLY, REALLY hope this is true, but i wonder is that statement just to put pressure on coughlan? it basically says he has been dicking about, so maybe they are saying this to get him to ge his act together and hand over whatever stuff they need?
Whatever happens, it MIGHT FINALLY end today at some stage...

(though I thought that too last monday )

greenman09

what's the status today? takeover or not?

_blank_

greenman09 wrote: »

what's the status today? takeover or not?

Seems FORAS lost their balls.

Expected really.

dreamers75

FORAS applied for a licence and joined the takeover? What else can they do?

Do the shels fans have some secret recipe for taking over your club and making it great?

Mitch Connor

dreamers75 wrote: »

FORAS applied for a licence and joined the takeover? What else can they do?

Do the shels fans have some secret recipe for taking over your club and making it great?

I think Des is saying that FORAS have lost their balls with respect to their comments saying they would back out of any deal if the debts were revealed to be bigger than they were officially told, which it turns out they are (about 50% higher) and FORAS have, in turn, not backed out as they said they would.

_blank_

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I think Des is saying that FORAS have lost their balls with respect to their comments saying they would back out of any deal if the debts were revealed to be bigger than they were officially told, which it turns out they are (about 50% higher) and FORAS have, in turn, not backed out as they said they would.

This, and the fact that they put a 12:00 deadline on it, two hours later and things are still up in the air.

How many more people are going to give deadline extensions to this clown?

The FAI, the High Court and now FORAS.

Do Cork people actually know the meaning of the word "deadline"?

Are they expecting to plod along until this day two weeks and just field a team in the PD and hope no-one notices?

When are the rest of the league going to get answers. It's supposed to kick off in two weeks. TWO WEEKS! and we still don't know what teams will be in what division?!

dreamers75

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I think Des is saying that FORAS have lost their balls with respect to their comments saying they would back out of any deal if the debts were revealed to be bigger than they were officially told, which it turns out they are (about 50% higher) and FORAS have, in turn, not backed out as they said they would.

Or rightfully they have kept quiet, its not a public PR game they are playing its deciding the future of the club. They are 100% right to say nothing and still have the licence app and the possible takeover.

super_furry

This is like the 13th or 14th deadline in the whole thing.

Mitch Connor

dreamers75 wrote: »

Or rightfully they have kept quiet, its not a public PR game they are playing its deciding the future of the club. They are 100% right to say nothing and still have the licence app and the possible takeover.

So why give a deadline at all then? What was the point in it? Why not just say they'll give the club and any interested problems as much time as they want/need and that they don't care what the debt levels of the club are.

If you set a deadline, stick to it, or at least give a freaking update when it does role round, makes it pointless otherwise.

_blank_

super_furry wrote: »

This is like the 13th or 14th passed deadline in the whole thing.

You missed a very important word there.

Roar

deal virtually done is what im hearing

SligoBrewer

FORAS have as much balls as when the Irish squad arrived in Saipan tbh.