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oh dear god, Libertas at it again

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    #122
    thetruthknower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5 ✭thetruthknower


    theres a difference between a democracy and a republic you know.


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    #123
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    prinz wrote: »
    I think Jim Corr is back :rolleyes:

    nope thats the truthknower jim corr will not be back that was a hit and run. which definatly doesn't help the no camp


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    #124
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    thetruthknower wrote: »
    theres a difference between a democracy and a republic you know.

    What year do you think we became a republic? :confused:


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    #125
    thetruthknower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5 ✭thetruthknower


    prinz wrote: »
    What section of the Lisbon Treaty gives dictatorial like powers to Brian Cowen and friends?

    :)


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    #126
    OldJay
    Closed Accounts Posts: 943 ✭✭✭OldJay


    prinz wrote: »
    What year do you think we became a republic? :confused:

    1949


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    #127
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    thetruthknower wrote: »
    :)

    That's it? That's your in depth knowledge of the Lisbon Treaty? :pac:


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    #128
    Cool Mo D
    Registered Users Posts: 1,419 ✭✭✭Cool Mo D


    thetruthknower wrote: »
    theres a difference between a democracy and a republic you know.

    There is a difference, but they are not mutually exclusive, it's possibly to be both.

    A Republic is any government that is not a form of monarchy, and the people have at least a nominal say.

    A Democracy is a government chosen by or comprising of the people.

    Ireland is a Republic and a Democracy.
    The USA is a Republic and a Democracy.
    Iran is a Republic, but not a Democracy.
    China is a Republic, but not a Democracy.
    The UK is a Democracy but not a Republic.
    Australia is a Democracy but not a Republic.

    Ireland became a democratic nation-state after the war of independence, but we did not become a republic until the Republic of Ireland act in 1949, when we removed the British monarch as out titular head of state.


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    #129
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    Sam Vimes wrote: »
    91% of economists, 90% of businesses, the majority of trade unions, retail Ireland, farmers groups, fishermans groups, multiple chambers of commerce, the Hotels federation, the small firms association (so much for big business), the Irish Exporters Association, Irish Franchise Association etc etc etc disagree with you and I think they know better.


    But regardless, this treaty is not about economic recovery and that's not why it's needed. The EU needs this treaty, otherwise why would they spend all this time and effort writing it?

    of course these big businesses will want a ratification on lisbon but i can assure you the working class of these businesses will not have that idea. ibec and siptu want it but the grassroots will be voting no so don't confuse yourself with this logic.


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    #130
    Sam Vimes
    Registered Users Posts: 21,611 ✭✭✭✭Sam Vimes


    zenno wrote: »
    of course these big businesses will want a ratification on lisbon but i can assure you the working class of these businesses will not have that idea. ibec and siptu want it but the grassroots will be voting no so don't confuse yourself with this logic.

    I find it mind boggling that so many people on the no side think they understand so well why big businesses (and the small firms association which you seem to have ignored) are for the treaty while simultaneously saying that a yes vote will have no effect on the economy. Do you not see any connection between all these businesses making more money and economic recovery :confused:


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    #131
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    What is is with a few No posters knowing what will happen on Friday?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #132
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    Sam Vimes wrote: »
    I find it mind boggling that so many people on the no side think they understand so well why big businesses (and the small firms association which you seem to have ignored) are for the treaty while simultaneously saying that a yes vote will have no effect on the economy. Do you not see any connection between all these businesses making more money and economic recovery :confused:

    I find this mind boggling, that you believe a yes vote will make an economic recovery possible, where in gods name in the treaty does it say anything about fulfilling economic recovery to ireland or the eu. how many times do i have to say that lisbon will not make economic recovery any faster especially to this country. you seem to be only thinking of big business but you do not for one second consider working class people in this. your comment is false.


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    #133
    Sam Vimes
    Registered Users Posts: 21,611 ✭✭✭✭Sam Vimes


    zenno wrote: »
    I find this mind boggling, that you believe a yes vote will make an economic recovery possible, where in gods name in the treaty does it say anything about fulfilling economic recovery to ireland or the eu. how many times do i have to say that lisbon will not make economic recovery any faster especially to this country.

    zenno on the internet who has other reasons for wanting a no vote tells me that voting yes will have no effect on the economy but these people tell me it will:
    American Chamber of Commerce
    Construction Industry Federation (CIF)
    Consumer Electronic Distributors Association (CEDA)
    Cork Chamber of Commerce
    Cork City Business Association
    Dublin Chamber of Commerce
    Dublin City Business Association
    Engineers Ireland
    Fashion & Footwear Federation
    Financial Services Ireland
    Galway City Business Association
    IBEC
    ICMSA
    ICT Ireland
    ICTU
    Institute of Chartered Accountants in Ireland
    Institute of Professional Auctioneers and Valuers
    Irish Banking Federation
    Irish Congress of Trade Unions
    Irish Consultative Committee of Accountancy Bodies
    Irish Dairy Industry Association (IDIA)
    Irish Exporters Association (IEA)
    Irish Farmers Association
    Irish Fish Producers’ Organisation
    Irish Franchise Association
    Irish Hardware & Building Materials Association
    Irish Hotels Federation (IHF)
    Irish Medical Devices Association (IMDA)
    Irish Sheep and Cattle Farmers Association
    Irish Software Association (ISA)
    Irish Taxation Institute
    Irish Tourist Industry Confederation (ITIC)
    Irish Travel Agents Association (ITAA)
    Killybegs Fishermen’s Organisation
    Limerick Chamber of Commerce
    Limerick City Business Association
    Network Dublin
    North Dublin Chamber of Commerce
    Pharmachemical Ireland
    Retail Ireland
    SIPTU
    Small Firms Association (SFA)
    Society of Irish Motor Industry (SIMI)
    South Dublin Chamber
    Telecoms and Internet Federation (TIF)
    Waterford Chamber of Commerce
    Honestly, who would you believe?
    zenno wrote: »
    you seem to be only thinking of big business but you do not for one second consider working class people in this. your comment is false.
    I'm thinking of both. Working class people work for big businesses. What is good for them is not necessarily bad for everyone else. What makes you think it's bad for workers? The trade unions don't seem to think so


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    #134
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    zenno wrote: »
    you seem to be only thinking of big business but you do not for one second consider working class people in this.

    Would you say the same to Proinsias de Rossa?


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    #135
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    prinz wrote: »
    Would you say the same to Proinsias de Rossa?

    pointless comment.


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    #136
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    zenno wrote: »
    pointless comment.

    How so? As he is an ardent supported of the Lison Treaty, I am sure that a man who has put his life into serving "working class people" would have considered them, don't you think?


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    #137
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    stevenmartin99 wrote: »
    Dont WASTE YOUR VOTE!
    If your unsure of what to vote look at http://www.coircampaign.org/index.ph...actsandfigures

    If your unsure of what to vote - VOTE NO!

    Dont vote YES if you are unsure of why you are doing so

    this is the 18th thread you copied and pasted the exact same post

    are there any moderators around at all? report send

    :eek:


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    #138
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    ei.sdraob wrote: »
    this is the 18th thread you copied and pasted the exact same post

    are there any moderators around at all? report send

    :eek:

    Look at the link.

    That is what they do, copy and paste.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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