Can we do anything about our dog?

jimmycrackcorm

We've had our dog for three years from being a puppy but now we don't know if we can trust her any longer. I don't know what breed she is as we rescued her from a shelter and she is some sort of mongrel; As such we didn't know what sort of temperment to expect, however it hasn't turned out very well.

She is basically untrained for obedience and generally doesn't listen to us if we call her. In fact if we go out to bring her in from the garden she runs and hides instead. However once she is in we can get her to sit, lie down etc for treats.

If she gets out the front she hides under the car. As both my OH and myself try to get her out she has turned very vicious and bit my OH and I narrowly missed getting bit also this evening as I was putting some chocolate treats out in front of her to coax her out. Under the car seems to be some sort of territory thing as once she is back in the house she is back to normal. I don't know if we can really trust her. We have a child and she is generally ok with him but isn't as tolerant as she is with us, however she hates other children and when our childs friends have been around she will turn vicious on them if they even try to pet her.

Is there anything we can do other than get rid of her? If she can turn on us and attack us like that then what;s to say she might one day become vicious in a normal situation.

PetrovthePrat

Hey,you've asked if there's anything you can do besides getting rid of her. What have you tried? You said she's not obedience trained. Dude,get her trained. For her sake and for the sake of how good a pet you could have,get her trained. Either in classes or at home,but get her trained.

meepins

If you happen to have the National geographic channel you can watch some dog whisperer episodes. There is so much good advice on that show and it will give you a better understanding of what is required to train your dog and repair your relationship.

We have a child and she is generally ok with him but isn't as tolerant as she is with us, however she hates other children and when our childs friends have been around she will turn vicious on them if they even try to pet her.

I don't know the context of these encounters but she may be fearful of children.
It is worrying she turns aggressive particularly with children and it's understandable why you are thinking of getting rid but you can probably rectify this if you persevere and get professional advice.

Best of luck and tell us how it works out for you.

jimmycrackcorm

What are the chances of success when the dog is three years old? Even with training - can we really trust the dog especially as we are thinking of having a baby?

dee o gee

meepins wrote: »

If you happen to have the National geographic channel you can watch some dog whisperer episodes. There is so much good advice on that show and it will give you a better understanding of what is required to train your dog and repair your relationship.

Please don't just copy what you see on the dog whisperer, what you see working on one dog doesn't necessarily mean it will work on another, all dogs are different. There interesting programmes to watch and they do give a bit of an insight to dog behaviour but some of the things he does I don't fully agree with such as alpha rolls.
I would suggest getting in touch with a good dog behaviourist, as really nobody can suggest what to do with him without actually seeing him especially as it is quite a serious issue.

Edited to add: The chances of retraining a dog at three are good, they are still quite young at three, but I still do suggest going to a good behaviourist as to work out why she is snapping.
Is it something just recently that she has started or has she always been like this??

Magenta

dee o gee wrote: »

Please don't just copy what you see on the dog whisperer, what you see working on one dog doesn't necessarily mean it will work on another, all dogs are different.

Don't follow the Dog Whisperer OP. Cesar Milan's methods are based on bullying and intimidating the dog and from the sounds of things, your dog will not react well to it.

You say she is not obedience trained. That is not her fault, but yours. Dogs do not train themselves, you have to train them.

meepins

dee o gee wrote: »

Please don't just copy what you see on the dog whisperer, what you see working on one dog doesn't necessarily mean it will work on another, all dogs are different.

I was suggesting the program as it gives insight into the amount of work required to rehabilitate dogs with varying problems. There are plenty of good things to learn from the program whether you have had lots of dogs or are planning on getting a dog. The guy is a professional and always states on his show not to attempt his techniques unless you are experienced.

persevere and get professional advice

^

Top Dog

Get a dog behaviourist out to your house, or get the dog enrolled in some obedience classes for a start.

Do you spend much time with the dog? Like going for walks and basically building the bond with it?

And at 3 years of age its definitely NOT too late to start - many dogs are rehomed from rescues that are much older than that and they can learn so no reason that your dog can't too.

YOURFACE!

You need to bulid up a relationship with the dog and then he will begin to trust you more. I agree that brining him to training classes will help this, taking him for walks and playing will help establish a good bond. A happy is dog is a well trained dog that loves being with his family and knows what his job is!
I would be wary about having kids around him. You know how kids are they can be a bit rough so for the dogs sake and the kids, get them to leave him alone.

Please do not use Cesar Milans approach to training your dog. He really is a bully and is only happy when the dogs are totally submissive. You can have a well trained, happy dog without having a submissive dog. Try using positive reinforcement techniques like clicker training instead. Heres a link to Karen Pryors website http://www.clickertraining.com/ I have used clicker training with my dogs and horses in the past and its amzing. They really want to learn and have a great time doing it! Good Luck!

Lee1982

if you have her from a pup you should have started training from day 1 its not too late 3 is not old at all get on to a trainer asap and have her put on the right road,with time and determination she will be fine

petangels

Tara and Lisa are great.. check out dog training ireland

lorebringer

My advise is to get in a good behaviourist and trainer, Dog Training Ireland is a good place to start. Most dogs are not "vicious", they just react badly to certain situations. Get an expert in and see what can be done. Good luck!

Lizard Queen

I would recomends anne rodgers she is an animal behaviourist and shes very good and patient check out wagsandwoofs.ie

Aru

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

We've had our dog for three years from being a puppy but now we don't know if we can trust her any longer. I don't know what breed she is as we rescued her from a shelter and she is some sort of mongrel; As such we didn't know what sort of temperment to expect, however it hasn't turned out very well.

She is basically untrained for obedience and generally doesn't listen to us if we call her. In fact if we go out to bring her in from the garden she runs and hides instead. However once she is in we can get her to sit, lie down etc for treats.

If she gets out the front she hides under the car. As both my OH and myself try to get her out she has turned very vicious and bit my OH and I narrowly missed getting bit also this evening as I was putting some chocolate treats out in front of her to coax her out. Under the car seems to be some sort of territory thing as once she is back in the house she is back to normal. I don't know if we can really trust her. We have a child and she is generally ok with him but isn't as tolerant as she is with us, however she hates other children and when our childs friends have been around she will turn vicious on them if they even try to pet her.

Is there anything we can do other than get rid of her? If she can turn on us and attack us like that then what;s to say she might one day become vicious in a normal situation.

so shes obedient inside but not outside ya?
is she lead trained?
if she is then take her out to the backyard on the lead a few times a day for short sessions(5mins)retrain her to the basic commands esp sit stay and come... be gentle esp wit the come command she needs to want to come to you and not be afraid...
get her used to this on the lead before you let her off at all when you trust her off lead ..put her back on it and do the same in the front of the house without the car their...when you trust her to obey bring in the car...by this stage she should be more intreasted in you than going under the car..
also make the backyard a fun place for her to play with you fetch can be a great game once the dog learns recall..

if she doesnt like strange kids petting her then put her in a different room to the kids and dont let her have the opertunity to bite them at least until you feel she can be trusted..

with your own child you need to establish new boundrys for both the dog and the child...
some dogs simply do not like kids rough play..
so teach the kid not to play rough or harass the dog..
kids can sometimes be quicker to retrain than dogs so thats a good place to start...

Does the dog have anywhere she can go to be alone and just relax..a basket,crate etc.. if she has make that the dogs place that once shes in it noone is aloud to disrupt or play with her(this includes adults.kids learn by example)if that place is the couch then change it to her basket..dogs taking over the couch or a chair is not a good thing..

get your kid to play with the dog in different ways fetch etc
also get your kid to feed the dog her meals(after ye have eaten) the dog will learn to associate the kid with good things like food and will learn her place in the house rankings (beneath the child)

just a few ideas you could try...good luck with your dog and dont give up on her yet..
but if you are seriously thinking abut rehoming her then contact the shelter you got her from they mite be able to find her a family with no kids

mollycash

for as long as i can remember we have taken in stray dogs and cats, some old some young. i honestly believe if you take the time and have patience any dog can be trained and will eventually bond with you.
people think once you stop it pissing on your carpets then job done then wonder why 2 years on the dog is still misbehaving and causing hassle.

honestly 50% of people with dogs out there shouldnt have them.

argosy2006

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cffj0vOBWsc&feature=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZD_p1trwYM&feature=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfijzsKvVis&feature=related

PetrovthePrat

mollycash wrote: »

for as long as i can remember we have taken in stray dogs and cats, some old some young. i honestly believe if you take the time and have patience any dog can be trained and will eventually bond with you.
people think once you stop it pissing on your carpets then job done then wonder why 2 years on the dog is still misbehaving and causing hassle.

honestly 50% of people with dogs out there shouldnt have them.

So very true. I really think education should be mandatory for animal owners. But Ireland could never introduce something sensible.

Steve30x

[EDIT] For the sake of not starting any more arguments I am deleting my post.

Whispered

People who don't agree with you and with intimidating tactics when it comes to training are oversensitive?? You then say in your next breath that you're "changing your methods". If you agree with bullying and intimidation for your dog, then so be it, you're not going to change based on "oversensitive" advice, but please stop trying to advocate these methods with people. You started a thread where you said some things people did not agree with (rightly so IMO) and since you've mentioned it in 2 seperate threads that I've noticed. Both times saying people are oversensitive. For your own enjoyment of the forum (it has loads of lovely people, great advice and a good few laughs), I'd suggest you get over it and try engage in conversation without trying to get sly digs in at people in unrelated threads.

You're right, humans are not wild animals, then again neither are domestic dogs. (the clue is in the word "domestic")

cruel things are not on TV?? Are you serious? Watch "the deadliest catch" for the crab fishing, cruelty at it's finest. I'm sure there are many more showing cruelty, thats the first which springs into my head.

I used to watch the dog whisperer and I thought that while I didn't agree with some of what he did, some of it was great to see in action, until I saw 2 particular shows. One was where a dog had a prong collar - and he LEFT IT ON. I've noticed it a lot since. Absolutely disgraceful. Anyone worth the paper their "qualifications" are written on knows that to use painful methods on ANY dog, but especially a nervous one is going to be counter productive.

Then a recent one, he wanted to teach the dogs to stay away from snakes. A very noble idea, yes, and maybe the shock collar he resorted to use was the only way, certainly better than a dog being bitten and dying. But why, if it, "doesn't hurt" did he not take a shock himself? To see poor daddy pull to get away from him when the shock hit him, and ceasar walking him towards the snake, knowing his dog would get a shock. It sickens me to even think about it.

OP you have every chance to retrain your dog, but please get professional advice. After a few years of little training, you will most likely need it. It will be worth it. Good luck.

PetrovthePrat

I can see this thread degenerating into an argument about training methods,which is fine,I like reading vitirol and venom online,but it's not gonna be helpful for the OP. JimmyCrackCorm,get yourself a class you're comfortable with,or at the very least get a book (or a dvd,better again) from a reputable trainer. As for a certain Mexican of note,there's a huge disclaimer that flashes up every time he meets a dog saying "don't try this at home". Not a ringing endorsment for imitation.

wexford202

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

What are the chances of success when the dog is three years old? Even with training - can we really trust the dog especially as we are thinking of having a baby?

OP you do not seem overly like someone that is looking for to get the dogs temperment sorted but more looking for someone to say get rid of it.

The answer is I would never trust any dog with a baby whether it is the best in the world or the worst in the world. My do is great but will be very supervised when my baby arrives. I can't trust him in a room with my shoes so I certainly cannot trust him with a baby on his own.

When you got the dog I am sure you were aware of the fact that a dog does tend to live quite a while. so if you were palnning a baby maybe you should have thought more about getting the dog in the first place.

The reality of it is if you want the dog sorted go to the professionals with it and if you don't its back to the pound for the doggie. The reality is nobody knows when they go to the shelter to pick their dog what it will be like however you should have been aware that you were picking something that you should have been willing to put the effort in at all reasonable costs to give the dog a fair chance.

Steve30x

@ PetrovthePrat I wasnt trying to start an argument but it does seem like some people think so. I retract my previous statement (Again)

Whispered

Steve30x wrote: »

.... no matter how over sensitive you are. ....a hatred towards you

well thats getting a bit personal isn't it.

Steve30x wrote: »

Your continualy on my case

no I'm not, I commented on your posts, as did many people. This is a public forum after all. No matter what you say, people will comment on it. But what is the point pulling grievences from threads into other ones? Just have the conversation thats being had, and talk about the other posts on the other thread.

Starting a thread with "some people are oversensitive", due to a conversation which is completly seperate is silly IMO.

Anyway, this is pulling the thread OT, OP & mods I'm sorry.

Steve, I'm not getting into this with you here, again I would suggest commenting on posts as opposed to insulting the posters. Or reporting problem posts.

I'm not going to avoid commenting on your posts, as that is what the forum is for but just report the post if you don't like it.

Steve30x

helena.ryan wrote: »

well thats getting a bit personal isn't it.

no I'm not, I commented on your posts, as did many people. This is a public forum after all. No matter what you say, people will comment on it. But what is the point pulling grievences from threads into other ones? Just have the conversation thats being had, and talk about the other posts on the other thread.

Starting a thread with "some people are oversensitive", due to a conversation which is completly seperate is silly IMO.

Anyway, this is pulling the thread OT, OP & mods I'm sorry.

Steve, I'm not getting into this with you here, again I would suggest commenting on posts as opposed to insulting the posters. Or reporting problem posts.

I'm not going to avoid commenting on your posts, as that is what the forum is for but just report the post if you don't like it.

I'm not going say what I want to say on here any more becauser its OT> Read your PM.

jimmycrackcorm

wexford202 wrote: »

OP you do not seem overly like someone that is looking for to get the dogs temperment sorted but more looking for someone to say get rid of it.

We like the dog and our child adores her. I just don't want to turn round one day and find out that despite training the dog, she turns on someone. Perhaps the right answer, is to get rid of the dog....

The answer is I would never trust any dog with a baby whether it is the best in the world or the worst in the world. My do is great but will be very supervised when my baby arrives. I can't trust him in a room with my shoes so I certainly cannot trust him with a baby on his own.

When I say baby, I'm thinking more as a toddler and up as obviously a baby wouldn't be left alone.

When you got the dog I am sure you were aware of the fact that a dog does tend to live quite a while. so if you were palnning a baby maybe you should have thought more about getting the dog in the first place.

Why does a dog somehow prevent an accidental pregnancy?

The reality of it is if you want the dog sorted go to the professionals with it and if you don't its back to the pound for the doggie. The reality is nobody knows when they go to the shelter to pick their dog what it will be like however you should have been aware that you were picking something that you should have been willing to put the effort in at all reasonable costs to give the dog a fair chance.

It might be worth it if results could be guaranteed but I wouldn't like to bet my child's safety on it. Going back to your first point I'd like to know the facts instead of the theory. The Vet told my OH that if the dog isn't trained properly by three years of age it is very difficult to change.

We spent a lot of money with a pet "Psychologist" a while back when she first attacked a neighbours kid when he came into the back garden to retrieve his ball. This incidentally was the first time she turned to being vicious - we never had any sign before and it was, I believe, a territorial issue.

star-pants

OP - unfortunately none of us can really say if your dog is re-trainable or not as we don't personally know the dog.

If you love the dog and would like to keep it - then I would try training, the trainers are professionals and you could ask their advice as to whether they believe the dog can be made safer around your family/neighbours.

Obviously you are concerned for your own and other children as you should be, but it also may not be the dogs fault if it's not shown enough discipline (I'm not giving out to you btw, and you may not have been aware, as might some of us not be, but the dog might have needed a firmer hand (not literally!) regarding training).

If you're willing to give it a try - please do. If not, then when giving up the dog make sure you let the shelter (or wherever you give the dog) know of the dogs behaviour and any training/psychology you've had done.

Magenta

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Why does a dog somehow prevent an accidental pregnancy?

Preventing accidental pregancy is up to youself, no one said it had anything to do with the dog.

Whispered

OP if you do have to get rid of the dog, please don't bring it to the pound. Contact a shelter who will take a dog with agression problems. TBH it doesn't sound too bad and in the right environment, withput the worry of a new baby, the dog could do very well.

I think it's very important to let people know that if your dog appears agressive, or snaps there is an alternative to the pound or getting it PTS. A friend of my mam got her JR PTS after it bit a child who had been harassing it in the garden for hours. He was so well loved and great with kids usually, but got hurt and snapped. I only found out about it after the dog was PTS. The whole family was devastated, but thought that it was what had to be done. They didn't realise that there are other options.

wexford202

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Why does a dog somehow prevent an accidental pregnancy?

I never said your dog prevents accidential pregnancy??????????

I am saying when you get a dog it is meant to fit in to all aspects of your life.

You are now bring up different things like he has bitten a child, and also that you have already gotten help for it.

If you don't want your dog don't keep it.

Also don't do to the pound or the shelter again if you are not willing to see the full picture. Many dogs there have been mistreated and have behaviour problem. When you go to the pound you are looking to give an animal a second chance and willing to do all you can to take care of it.

If you wanted an easy life with your dog and hassle free it wouldn't be the first place I would go.

Ther is nobody in the world going to give you a pat on the back and say well done you tried. That just doesn't happen. If you instill no confidence int he dog which you obviously don't then don't keep it.

I am not saying the above to be mean or cruel to you. I am just being real about it.

Fannymcslap

mollycash wrote: »

for as long as i can remember we have taken in stray dogs and cats, some old some young. i honestly believe if you take the time and have patience any dog can be trained and will eventually bond with you.
people think once you stop it pissing on your carpets then job done then wonder why 2 years on the dog is still misbehaving and causing hassle.

honestly 50% of people with dogs out there shouldnt have them.

That's the most sense I've seen on this thread, well said.

funkyjebus

If you are that worried, especially given there is a child involved, ask a professional, not boards.ie