34,000 public servants want 3.5% pay rise

DrumSteve

Pay Rise

Hmmm bad timing on the unions part I must say. Dont think they'll get it either.

Zardoz

It beggars belief.
After all the pay increases they have had over the last few years they want more.
Do these people understand basic economics ,even basic arithmetic ,that they are already grossly overpaid and that their greed could bankrupt the country.
The unions have become too strong now and all the increases splashed out during the boom are now unsustainable.

gar32

I understand that people want to be paid well in high cost country but the govenment should come out and explain basic maths to public workers. http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fpposted/archive/2009/04/08/ireland-s-deficit-balloons-relative-to-gdp.aspx

20 Billion in reduction in spending a years. HELLLO people Cop on.

jimmmy

Give them a 30% cut ( on average ) instead. And then explain to them they are then lucky to be getting the same as what their counterparts in other countries are getting. Our public service is the highest paid in the known world : it cannot continue. The national sabotage by their unions must cease.

FlutterinBantam

These people don't seem to know about the economic situation.

Irrespective of who caused the debacle, needs must, and the Unions must be totally dumb or at best intellectually challenged to believe that this claim could be conceded.

NewDubliner

jimmmy wrote: »

Give them a 30% cut ( on average ) instead. And then explain to them they are then lucky to be getting the same as what their counterparts in other countries are getting.

Wonder what would happen if a householder told the bank to take a 30% cut in mortgage repayments?

pat kenny

It's the beginning of negotiation. They know they wont get the 3.5% , but they will use it during negotiations.
Say the government wants them to take a 5% pay cut, they will rabbit on about the 3.5% the government owes them and only stand by a 1.5% pay cut.

They are essentially using the 3.5% as a perceived buffer to the inevitable pay cut.

Drumpot

This just made me sick to my stomach . .

Its the unions SIMPLY JUSTIFYING THEIR EXISTENCE at the expense of us all . .

Their is no place for the unions right now if they are going to misinform their members so badly. Right now one of the biggest threat to the economy is that union members may very well be stupid enough to follow the unions into battle over something that's remarkably unjustifiable . . .

Who want Public V Private sector debates? The unions when it suits them . .

By being completely self absorbed the unions are making Public servants look out of touch with reality (if they follow them into strike) and only further strengthens the public v private divide . .

Aidric

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

These people don't seem to know about the economic situation.

Irrespective of who caused the debacle, needs must, and the Unions must be totally dumb or at best intellectually challenged to believe that this claim could be conceded.

Any union official I've ever encountered are militant mongoloids with little or no intelligence. They're hell bent on holding the country to random and that's a pitiful situation.

Poccington

Those folks are off their heads.

I can honestly say I'm thankful, as a Public Sector worker, that I'm working in a part of the Public Sector that can't threaten strikes or any other such ****e. Everyone is up to their knees in ****e with the economy the way it is, some more than others... To ask for a pay rise is just plain greed and stupidity.

jimmmy

jimmmy wrote: »

Give them a 30% cut ( on average ) instead. And then explain to them they are then lucky to be getting the same as what their counterparts in other countries are getting. Our public service is the highest paid in the known world : it cannot continue. The national sabotage by their unions must cease.

Source?

AARRRGH

This kind of stuff makes me wish we had a hardline leader. You know, some sort of semi-facist badass who would make hard decisions and make threats of prison to whoever talks nonsense about being entitled to 50k or whatever per year.

spank_inferno

Deleted User wrote: »

Source?

I think I remember reading something from the OECD backing that up.
Especially the highest in managerial grades and many health services.

As a previous poster said, its just the opening salvo in a pay negotiation.
They arent going to low-ball themselves straight away.

NewDubliner

AARRRGH wrote: »

This kind of stuff makes me wish we had a hardline leader. You know, some sort of semi-facist badass who would make hard decisions and make threats of prison to whoever talks nonsense about being entitled to 50k or whatever per year.

Give an example of a successful country where that works.

Drumpot

spank_inferno wrote: »

I think I remember reading something from the OECD backing that up.
Especially the highest in managerial grades and many health services.

As a previous poster said, its just the opening salvo in a pay negotiation.
They arent going to low-ball themselves straight away.

I know its a union strategy to open negotiations, but there shouldnt be any negotiations . .

If a companys in trouble and needs to cut its costs, it tells the unions were to go and makes the changes it needs for the greater good . .

I actually believe that no FF leader in living history has such a fantastic opportunity to reform public finances as Cowan has. . His party are dead men walking anyways and know in the next elections they will be crucified no matter what he does. . He is perfectly placed to lockout the unions and do whats best for the country (not individual self absorbed sections of society).

Rob67

I feel this is all about brinksmanship, however it only comes off (to me) as nothing but arrogance and stupidity. Very bad judgement on behalf of the unions, as far as I'm concerned.

AARRRGH

NewDubliner wrote: »

Give an example of a successful country where that works.

China.

irish_bob

Aidric wrote: »

Any union official I've ever encountered are militant mongoloids with little or no intelligence. They're hell bent on holding the country to random and that's a pitiful situation.

most of theese dinasaurs like jack o connor are in a broader idealogical war , for them , this is about much more than pay cuts for nurses and guards , they see the country is in a mess , they have survived through years of prosperity since the berlin wall came down and believe thier time has come

irish_bob

Drumpot wrote: »

I know its a union strategy to open negotiations, but there shouldnt be any negotiations . .

If a companys in trouble and needs to cut its costs, it tells the unions were to go and makes the changes it needs for the greater good . .

I actually believe that no FF leader in living history has such a fantastic opportunity to reform public finances as Cowan has. . His party are dead men walking anyways and know in the next elections they will be crucified no matter what he does. . He is perfectly placed to lockout the unions and do whats best for the country (not individual self absorbed sections of society).

+1

cowen has absolutley nothing to loose , he is going to loose the next election anyhow so thier is nothing stopping him from going to war with the unions and representing the silent majority of private sector tax payers who have no voice at table talks , the man is so spineless , i dont know how he carrys that keg under his jumper

greendom

I'm sure not all 34,000 think this is a reasonable demand in the current climate.

mikemac

A negotiating tactic.
The Union wants an increase, the government wants a cut and some sort of agreement will be reached in the middle and the Union will claim it's a victory for the "ordinary working person"

The unions need to justify their existence and their subscription fees so they need to do something.
Though if my boss was borrowing 55 million a day, I'd have been let go over a year ago!

mikemac

greendom wrote: »

I'm sure not all 34,000 think this is a reasonable demand in the current climate.

True but if a ballot leads to a strike then realy you have no option but to strike.
If everyone in your office was on a picket line and you disagreed would you cross it?
Maybe, but I wouldn't be brave enough and I'd say most others wouldn't either.

So we'll have to see what the ballot result is. And it's pretty much guaranteed it'll lead to industrial action up to including strikes.

book smarts

NewDubliner wrote: »

Give an example of a successful country where that works.

Singapore. Lee Kwan Yew ruled for 31 years in a sham democracy as effectively a benign dictator. Unions were tightly controlled.

Peanut

Rob67 wrote: »

I feel this is all about brinksmanship, however it only comes off (to me) as nothing but arrogance and stupidity. Very bad judgement on behalf of the unions, as far as I'm concerned.

Completly agree that they have no intention of expecting the rise. It's a risky move though, the amount of ill-feeling it will undoubtedly generate could all blow up in their face.

Chris_533976

I have a feeling that this is the union LEADERS demanding this, and that 99% of the people in the union would find this quite ridiculous too. Noone in their right mind would expect a pay rise at the moment, except for the Union leaders.

The problem generally isnt the public service, its the public service UNIONS.

eoinbn

The government wants a 5% cut, the unions want a 3.5% increase, they will meet 1/2 way and agree on neither.

Really, what does it matter? 5% off the PS pay bill will save €600-700m after you factor in reductions in tax/vat due to the cuts. A 5% cut in welfare would amount to something similiar, plus another €1b in taxs from somewhere. We are still left with at least a €18b shortfall.

So i will repeat what I have been saying for the last 12 months. It's completely obvious that there is no solution so stop wasting time and call the IMF.

cfriel2002

"The government wants a 5% cut, the unions want a 3.5% increase, they will meet 1/2 way and agree on neither" ...... that would be consistent with performance to date !

....the muppets on the apprentice show are more qualified to run our little republic than the current "leaders" or the charismatic ones waiting in the wings

Dannyboy83

eoinbn wrote: »

The government wants a 5% cut, the unions want a 3.5% increase, they will meet 1/2 way and agree on neither.

Really, what does it matter? 5% off the PS pay bill will save €600-700m after you factor in reductions in tax/vat due to the cuts. A 5% cut in welfare would amount to something similiar, plus another €1b in taxs from somewhere. We are still left with at least a €18b shortfall.

So i will repeat what I have been saying for the last 12 months. It's completely obvious that there is no solution so stop wasting time and call the IMF.

http://www.financedublin.com/debtclock.php
At the rate the debt is accumulating, it is set to DOUBLE by a moment in the month of May 2013. This is a measure of the legacy the Government of Ireland is in the process of bequeathing to the children of Ireland. For an indication of how the debt is growing, subtract the figure for August 31th 2009, published by the NTMA (€69,290 million) from the current 'debt clock' total on this page.


€ 70,859million
€69,290 million
============
01,569 million since 31st August 2009.

population

Eamonn Gilmore was saying today that he won't cut public sector pay, that there were 'other alternatives', strange he didnt seem to say what they were.........

Daragh101

jimmmy wrote: »

Give them a 30% cut ( on average ) instead. And then explain to them they are then lucky to be getting the same as what their counterparts in other countries are getting. Our public service is the highest paid in the known world : it cannot continue. The national sabotage by their unions must cease.

exactly and do the same in the private sector!.

some people in public sector defo deserve a pay cut, but not nurses or gardai..imo!... anyone that does a job like that especially a burse deserves more than they get....one of the toughest jobs i could imagine!

behan29

i work in the public sector and i think the unions in this country are parasites. I hate them with a passion, i think they have at times the intelligence of my dogs left testicle and he is nutless!!