Eircon Beware of this one.

hightower1

Discodog wrote: »

Eircon have their faults but the main point of my thread is don't just believe what you are told. Eircon & Comreg both told me that it was "in the terms & conditions". I asked Eircon to forward a copy of the specific condition & they could not, because it didn't exist.

Eircon have an interesting T&C in that they say that "accessing their website indicates an acceptance of their terms & conditions". This is an unfair & unreasonable condition which could easily be challenged. After all you have to access their site to read the T&C's in the first place !.

I certainly don't think that any of the other ISP's are much better & I am having difficulty in getting information from any of them, to assist my choice. My main gripe against Eircon is their decision to censor the internet. It is amazing that everyone is up in arms when countries like China restrict site access yet we allow Eircon to behave in the same way.

Ireland is still in the dark ages when it comes to consumer rights & protection. Fortunately European law is starting to fill in the gaps but many Irish suppliers still believe that they make the rules. I wonder how many people shop in B&Q because of their "no quibble" return policy ?.

The fact that there are no "net police" made the the next best thing. Who else were better suited to stop copyright thiefs like Pirate bay and their users? Censorship implies a tyrannical body cracking down on legitimate peoples or groups... pirate bay was not legit hence the court ruling.

If there was some fancy lol "net police" and they stopped access everyone would whinge about them too with some other half baked notion of self delusional robin hood syndrome. I have no love for eircom but blocking pirate bay was the right thing to do morally more so that it may loose them business.

Discodog

If Eircom want to decide which sites their customers can view they should tell us BEFORE we sign up. Lets have Eircom Ads where they explain that they have blocked a site when practically everyone one else has not. For example UPC have made it clear that they will fight any ban. Eircom should also tell us that they have instigated a three strikes & your out program for illegal downloads BEFORE we sign up. What actually happens is Eircom make these decisions & we either have to agree with them or break our contract.

The older conservative internet user may not object. Some may applaud their actions & a lot of people may take exception & go elsewhere. Eircom are going to look total idiots if Black win their appeal. In any event many European countries have already decided that Internet censorship is totally unacceptable.

Eircom censor the most & charge the most - a great recipe for success.

Geff

www.hidemyass.com

Sorted.

hightower1

Geff wrote: »

www.hidemyass.com

Sorted.

Ok...Geff.... your going to use an online proxy ..... to block your details from....drum roll..... the people giving you access to the online proxy.

FAIL.


Discodog:
Why would an ISP advertise a shortcoming as opposed to another ISP? UPC have gone on record as saying they wont block sites and they still wont run ads saying so. There is no point. The average net user in Ireland is completely unaware of the whole thing so why even bring it up in an advert? Even if they were all aware why again I say would you advertise a shortfall????? That goes against the whole point of advertising. I would be sure the way eircom are thinking that if you use pirate bay in Ireland you will be already aware that Eircom are not allowing access to this and if your thinking of signing up you will ask. Also I am sure if you wanted out of contract with eircom ref this you can do so with no penalty. Call eircom and find out.

animaal

hightower1 wrote: »

Ok...Geff.... your going to use an online proxy ..... to block your details from....drum roll..... the people giving you access to the online proxy.

FAIL.

Erm - the online proxy will encrypt your communications such as to make it impossible for your ISP to see anything other than an encrypted connection to that proxy. It will also allow you access to any site that the ISP is trying to block.

drum roll... that's good enough for some people.

PASS.

hightower1

OMG you actually havet the first one buddy.
Online proxy will block info ONLY for the receiving end of the connection not the person supplying your connection... all the packets being sent from the connection are passing through your ISP... by your logic you connect to a proxy the proxy then serves as some kind of online connection! lol. thats ridiculous, your proxy is blocking info ...yes.... where is that info flowing through???
Your idea of a proxy is a VPN which even so the last and first leg of a VPN is your isp. How else do you connect to it? All Eircom need to is monitor the packets coming from the proxy return path and responding packets back to this.

Discodog

Hightower are you really suggesting that anyone has an instant way out of a contract because Eircom has banned Pirate Bay........FAIL !

The T&C's actually cover this in that Eircom say that they will not allow "illegal activity" which means that they will have to disconnect half of their subscribers. As for mentioning it in ads well maybe not but they should certainly point it out before you sign especially as it is something unique to them.

Gosh I wish that I was an expert on this Proxy business. But it does seem strange that people will pay up to €100 per month for protection, that according to you may be useless.

To me this is all about SP's attitudes in whether they want to be the first out of the blocks to instigate bans etc or whether they will only do so if forced to.

Now will a Proxy expert please post & referee this argument as I would like to know who is right.

By the way Animaal I would either change your screen name or hide as Hightower is into weaponry including grenade launchers !. That should test if we are being monitored.

hightower1

Discodog wrote: »

Hightower are you really suggesting that anyone has an instant way out of a contract because Eircom has banned Pirate Bay........FAIL !

The T&C's actually cover this in that Eircom say that they will not allow "illegal activity" which means that they will have to disconnect half of their subscribers. As for mentioning it in ads well maybe not but they should certainly point it out before you sign especially as it is something unique to them.

Gosh I wish that I was an expert on this Proxy business. But it does seem strange that people will pay up to €100 per month for protection, that according to you may be useless.

To me this is all about SP's attitudes in whether they want to be the first out of the blocks to instigate bans etc or whether they will only do so if forced to.

Now will a Proxy expert please post & referee this argument as I would like to know who is right.

By the way Animaal I would either change your screen name or hide as Hightower is into weaponry including grenade launchers !. That should test if we are being monitored.

On getting out of contract with eircom I suggested it may be poss but to call Eircom and find out. What have you got to loose?

In ref to the proxy, they are not useless far from it but for the purposes of trying hide info from your isp they are in that sense and also discussion on how to circumvent your ISP's practices are against boards rules.

Also discodog , in ref to grenade launchers this shows more instances of your half information and should visit the boards airsoft section...http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=830
Get yourself more informed before trying to advise others ya. Note howits not titled as "boards international weapons dealing section" ... you clearly know your stuff lol
And in relation to "ISP monitoring" if you read what you quote you will see I have stated it is poss for an ISP to monitor packets .... if you knew anything in depth you would know this is not as simplified as cracking open a packet and seeing text lol, packets need to be arranged in correct order with correct coding for it to be recognizable ...what they can do is monitor the packet types eg...jpeg, mpeg, mp4 etc.
So I will say again.... learn what you are talking about before giving "advice"

Discodog

I am intrigued how trying to circumvent an ISP's practises would be against board rules - please elucidate. As for your grenade launcher we all know that the Airsoft forum is a cover for terrorists !

Regarding "getting more informed". If you read my posts you would know that I am already out of my Eircom contract so advice from you on how to end it is unnecessary.

jor el

A proxy, like the one mentioned, will encrypt all data passing between your computer and the proxy server, rendering your ISP unable to see what's being sent or received.

Using a proxy is not illegal, or in breech of ISP terms, though you are passing everything you do to the owner of the proxy, which raises privacy concerns in itself.

hightower1

A web proxy will not hide packets from an ISP. ONLY a firewall to encrypt packet transmission would truly hide this information.

You enter www.piratebay.org to a proxy.... how do those packets get form your browser to the proxy???? ISP.

From the proxy to pirate bay.. now they cant see who you are as it will only see the middleman server i.e proxy...

Piratebay transmit packets back to proxy...

Now the proxy transmits back to you those same packets..how... over your ISP connection. These packets can be intercepted at a UBR and flagged.

Proxies will help you stay private to anyone on the receiving end of a packet but when you receive back you are not private as you still need to use the ISP to access these. Look at it this way, if it hid you from the isp and the proxy used your ip to send packets back to... they'd never reach you. That wouldn't be a very good online proxy now would it.

Not to say an ISP will monitor every connection, thats stupid BUT they surely will monitor high use. As most torrenters are inherently greedy this will show up and then can spark ISP interest and packet investigation.

There ARE ways to keep any packet enclosed and only reveal the destination IP address ... in laymans terms sealing the envelope completely with the address the only thing visible as opposed to now in which the letter is blank and the address is inside so mr.postman has to open the letter and get the address also allowing access to anything contained there in.


In terms of using online or offline wares to suggest circumventing ISP terms and conditions hence breach of contract is against boards rules seeing as anyone form an ISP or and ISP employee could be directed to a page like this where a registered user is clearly suggesting a possible way (all be it misguidedly) on how to breach their contact. In short boards would be a place publicly seen as hosting and endorsing breach of contract. This is why boards dont allow this.... also can be seen in the cable and tv forum for examples.

Also backed up by the forum charter here....-No Warez, Hackz, Appz, Crackz or copyright Movies or TV shows (advice/sourcing or discussion via bittorrent or otherwise)http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055167684

animaal

hightower1 wrote: »

A web proxy will not hide packets from an ISP. ONLY a firewall to encrypt packet transmission would truly hide this information.

Yes, that's right. But the specific service mentioned above (hidemyass) isn't a plain HTTP proxy. It does, as you mentioned above, claim to use a VPN client.

Firewalls can support encryption and proxying, but you don't need a firewall to use either.

Nick_oliveri

hightower1 wrote: »

In terms of using online or offline wares to suggest circumventing ISP terms and conditions hence breach of contract is against boards rules seeing as anyone form an ISP or and ISP employee could be directed to a page like this where a registered user is clearly suggesting a possible way (all be it misguidedly) on how to breach their contact. In short boards would be a place publicly seen as hosting and endorsing breach of contract. This is why boards dont allow this.... also can be seen in the cable and tv forum for examples.

Report the thread so, to the mods and to Eircom, if you are so bothered about it.

eircom in compliance with the Order has agreed that access to the website the PirateBay.org, its related domain names, IP addresses and URLs from the eircom network will be blocked indefinitely from the 1st September 2009.

eircom would like to reassure customers that:
eircom will not monitor customer’s activities at any stage, nor will it place any monitoring equipment or software on its network in order to facilitate this block.
eircom will not provide personal details or any information relating to customers to any third party, including the record companies.

ETA: Hightower, find me where it says that circumventing this block breaches "their contract".