Anglo tells investigators "No dice"

dresden8

And the Director of Corporate enforcement agrees with them.

What kind of sick joke is this?

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16550527/

Bosses at the now-nationalised bank insisted some should remain under wraps and after seven months of negotiations a deal was reached that allowed certain records to be kept secret.

Mr Appleby's office insisted they would not be hamstrung without the "small amount" of material, which relates specifically to the key areas being investigated.

"I don't think we feel handicapped, it's a small element of the overall volume," said a spokesman.

Are these guys allergic to search warrants and arrests?

Appleby has to go. Lenihan has to go and the whole board of Anglo has to go, especially "our" representative Dukes.

Edit: In my rage I mis-spelt Anglo in the title, can a mod fix please?

tech77

dresden8 wrote: »

And the Director of Corporate enforcement agrees with them.

What kind of sick joke is this?

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16550527/



Are these guys allergic to search warrants and arrests?

Appleby has to go. Lenihan has to go and the whole board of Anglo has to go, especially "our" representative Dukes.

Edit: In my rage I mis-spelt Anglo in the title, can a mod fix please?

FWIW just heard on the news there that Seanie Fitz is defaulting on more than 100 million.
Incredible.

Fulton Crown

Steady on boys...steady on there..this is complicated stuff..remember the old saying "the wheels of justice grind slow but exceedingly small" or something to that effect.

We are only at the early stages of this now..there is a long way to go.

All the signals are that these tossers will have to pay up..even the sh1t stupid politicos know the public won't stand for anything else.

Gormeley came out fairly strong on the subject today...big dependance on the media to keep the heat on people like Greystones man, Mayo Man, Ailesbury Road Man , Naas man and the various other "Tent" men.
If nothin happend or nobody is in the chokey this time twelve months ..we'll know that the nod and wink boys have stuffed us once again.

The Naas mans Audi deal is small beer but will be a good barometer of what is to come.

John Q Taxpayer and his childrens children will be paying for these tossers for years to come.

hallelujajordan

dresden8 wrote: »

And the Director of Corporate enforcement agrees with them.

What kind of sick joke is this?

http://news.eircom.net/breakingnews/16550527/



Are these guys allergic to search warrants and arrests?

Appleby has to go. Lenihan has to go and the whole board of Anglo has to go, especially "our" representative Dukes.

Edit: In my rage I mis-spelt Anglo in the title, can a mod fix please?

Relax man . . . . the worst thing that could happen now is that someone breaks the rules and the whole thing falls apart on legal technicalities. They are entitled to due process so let them have it. .

BTW Calling for Lenihan to go on this is a little bit of an overreaction, No ?

dresden8

hallelujajordan wrote: »

Relax man . . . . the worst thing that could happen now is that someone breaks the rules and the whole thing falls apart on legal technicalities. They are entitled to due process so let them have it. .

BTW Calling for Lenihan to go on this is a little bit of an overreaction, No ?

The Director of corporate enforcement is carrying out an investigation into the bank that is bringing down this country. The bank tells him to feck off, he can't see all the files, and he agrees?

You don't see a problem there?

No wonder this country is fncked.

Fulton Crown

dresden8 wrote: »

The Director of corporate enforcement is carrying out an investigation into the bank that is bringing down this country. The bank tells him to feck off, he can't see all the files, and he agrees?

You don't see a problem there?

No wonder this country is fncked.

Shades of grey pal....theres always grey.

The bank didn't tell him to feck orf..thay had a discussion and there are complicated legals around some of the files which are not vital to the investigation but could hold it up unduly.

They are parked for the moment ..but the investigation is continuing.

Think of the media though pal...why is there such a fat cat squabble around the Indo Group just now ?

Interesting don't you think given the vital role the media has in keeping the hot poker up these tossers orifi.

Biggins

At this stage its just another screw-up to add to the list of many screw-up this state is letting others get away with.

Nothing surprises me any more.
...and the wasters in the Dail wonder why they are losing support, wondering why they are hated and wondering why someone actually took to firebombing a government office building!

This stuff thats coming out is just the tip of the iceberg and folk are SERIOUSLY getting pissed off.
Time is running out for the politicians to get their act together and they just can't see that.

AlekSmart

Steady on boys...steady on there..this is complicated stuff..remember the old saying "the wheels of justice grind slow but exceedingly small" or something to that effect.

We are only at the early stages of this now..there is a long way to go.

All the signals are that these tossers will have to pay up..even the sh1t stupid politicos know the public won't stand for anything else.

Yes perhaps such a level of confidence in Irish Law is not quite as solid as it should be....one only needs to look at the manner in which the Zoe/Shipsey alliance has reduced BOTH of the Irish Superior Courts to the status of irrelevant co-conspiritors in a con-job designed to ensure the survival of a seriously insolvent corporate entity.

Make no mistake those "Sh1t Stupid Politicos" know EXACTLY what the Public are prepared to stand for and that knowledge allows them quite a bit more stunting yet before having to worry about that Lamp Standard outside the gate........ :mad:

Fulton Crown

AlekSmart wrote: »

Yes perhaps such a level of confidence in Irish Law is not quite as solid as it should be....one only needs to look at the manner in which the Zoe/Shipsey alliance has reduced BOTH of the Irish Superior Courts to the status of irrelevant co-conspiritors in a con-job designed to ensure the survival of a seriously insolvent corporate entity.

Make no mistake those "Sh1t Stupid Politicos" know EXACTLY what the Public are prepared to stand for and that knowledge allows them quite a bit more stunting yet before having to worry about that Lamp Standard outside the gate........ :mad:

How so my learned friend ?

Ensuretheir survival ?? Now thats interesting..can you fill me in on how their survival is ensured ?

Agree somewhat about the politicos though....South kerry man and the daughter of Three Houses man will probably keep getting elected

Not to mention Gun Runner man.....::(:(

dresden8

How can the Director of Corporate enforcement carry out an investigation into possibly corrupt/improper/illegal dealing within the bank when he doesn't know what's going on?

What's Anglo saying about those files, "I swear, they're the honest ones"

It will be interesting in 10 years time when the names attached to those "sensitive" files are released.

Why is Lenihan obstructing this investigation? After all, he is Mr. Anglo now.

Who is he protecting?

Pal.

Liam Byrne

This is the same bank that let Lenihan agree to bail them out before they came clean on how badly they were in the **** with illegal lending and lies ?

Their opinion shouldn't matter a damn at this stage! :mad: :mad: :mad:

Who the **** are Fianna Failure trying to look after ?

If they don't get their act together I'm going to have a tonne of manure waiting in place over the doorstep for when these ****ers come knocking in a month or so's time when the inevitable General Election is called.

At this stage it's beyond a joke; and the ONLY explanation that I can come up with is that FF are DELIBERATELY bolloxing everything they can up in order to be kicked out so that they don't have to work to clean up their mess.

I know that's far-fetched, but surely NO-ONE is that far out of touch with reality as these pricks seem to be ?

Biggins

Liam Byrne wrote: »

...I know that's far-fetched, but surely NO-ONE is that far out of touch with reality as these pricks seem to be ?

True, after all Bertie himself has yet to sort out his tax clearance certificate and yet he's still a sitting TD representing the country and as such advocating what ever FF policies related to tax, they wish to push on the rest of us!

Seriously, you couldn't make this crap up if you wanted to!
Madness!

Martyr

they should be lined up against a wall and shot for what they're doin to this country.

Seth Brundle

Martyr wrote: »

they should be lined up against a wall and shot for what they're doin to this country.

I don't know if most folk would agree with the idea of shooting them.


It would be too quick with no suffering!

Fulton Crown

How can the Director of Corporate enforcement carry out an investigation into possibly corrupt/improper/illegal dealing within the bank when he doesn't know what's going on?

Look pal ..he has enough information to go ahead with for the moment / the Garda fraud squad are in there too remember ?

Why is Lenihan obstructing this investigation? After all, he is Mr. Anglo now.

Hardly obstructing it friend surely...if ever I need a sweeping statement I'll give you a call !

Who is he protecting?

Look pal he is protecting nobody.....someone is watching a bit too much TV methinks.....

peasant

Fulton Crown

how about instead of name dropping and calling everyone your "pal" you explain to us upset mere mortals how exactly it is considered normal legal procedure to keep files under wrap when there is an invetigation going on?

Fulton Crown

peasant wrote: »

Fulton Crown

how about instead of name dropping and calling everyone your "pal" you explain to us upset mere mortals how exactly it is considered normal legal procedure to keep files under wrap when there is an invetigation going on?

Apologies moderator..did not mean to offend.

I suppose the point I was trying to make is that I think the whole "files under wraps" issue is a ploy by Anglo to tie up the investigation into legal cul-de-sacs.

I am pleased that Appleby appears not to have bought this and is pressing ahead with the probe in tandem with the Gardai.

The legals in this a re complex and care has to be taken.....uh ...OK ?

hallelujajordan

dresden8 wrote: »

The Director of corporate enforcement is carrying out an investigation into the bank that is bringing down this country. The bank tells him to feck off, he can't see all the files, and he agrees?

You don't see a problem there?

No wonder this country is fncked.

That's not quite how i understood it . . He has agreed to park it for now so that they can challenge the legal privilege of the files in court. It would be far worse if subsequent cases got turfed on a technicality because the bank had not been given that opportunity.

Some of the conspiracy theories going around here are just ludicrous. The wheels of justice move slowly in this country but they will move.

Liam Byrne wrote:

At this stage it's beyond a joke; and the ONLY explanation that I can come up with is that FF are DELIBERATELY bolloxing everything they can up in order to be kicked out so that they don't have to work to clean up their mess.

Thats just beyond stupid . . If FF wanted out of government they would have called a GE long ago. . You might not agree with Lenihan's tactics but there are plenty of economists who do . . . I personally have no doubt that he is doing what he believes is the right thing to sort out the economic situation.

Fulton Crown

hallelujajordan wrote: »

That's not quite how i understood it . . He has agreed to park it for now so that they can challenge the legal privilege of the files in court. It would be far worse if subsequent cases got turfed on a technicality because the bank had not been given that opportunity.

Some of the conspiracy theories going around here are just ludicrous. The wheels of justice move slowly in this country but they will move.



Thats just beyond stupid . . If FF wanted out of government they would have called a GE long ago. . You might not agree with Lenihan's tactics but there are plenty of economists who do . . . I personally have no doubt that he is doing what he believes is the right thing to sort out the economic situation.

Good post Hal...'zactly what I was trying to say..I really get pissed by these conspiracy theorists...Jezuz Lenihan could make far more moolah at the bar and not have to take half the sh1t.

Liam Byrne

hallelujajordan wrote: »

I personally have no doubt that he is doing what he believes is the right thing to sort out the economic situation.

And I know of people in America who believe they've been abducted by aliens.....so what's your point ?

I know people who have convinced themselves that their partner is cheating, and they've believed it, but they've been wrong; the guys who flew planes into the Twin Towers believed what they were doing - does that make them right ?

And since when does "doing what you believe is right" involve NOT READING ****ING REPORTS ABOUT DODGY BANKS before you invest billions in the same banks ?

Because if that's what's "RIGHT", then Lenihan is 100% right. :rolleyes:

GSF

Fulton Crown wrote: »

Steady on boys...steady on there..this is complicated stuff..remember the old saying "the wheels of justice grind slow but exceedingly small" or something to that effect.

We are only at the early stages of this now..there is a long way to go.

All the signals are that these tossers will have to pay up..even the sh1t stupid politicos know the public won't stand for anything else.

Gormeley came out fairly strong on the subject today...big dependance on the media to keep the heat on people like Greystones man, Mayo Man, Ailesbury Road Man , Naas man and the various other "Tent" men.
If nothin happend or nobody is in the chokey this time twelve months ..we'll know that the nod and wink boys have stuffed us once again.

The Naas mans Audi deal is small beer but will be a good barometer of what is to come.

John Q Taxpayer and his childrens children will be paying for these tossers for years to come.

Given a choice between believing with my own eyes and believing in politicians words, I know which one I would trust and it isn't Gormless's words. :mad:

hallelujajordan

Liam Byrne wrote: »

And I know of people in America who believe they've been abducted by aliens.....so what's your point ?

I know people who have convinced themselves that their partner is cheating, and they've believed it, but they've been wrong; the guys who flew planes into the Twin Towers believed what they were doing - does that make them right ?

And since when does "doing what you believe is right" involve NOT READING ****ING REPORTS ABOUT DODGY BANKS before you invest billions in the same banks ?

Because if that's what's "RIGHT", then Lenihan is 100% right. :rolleyes:

The point is that you accuse him and FF of something entirely different. You accuse both Lenihan and FF of being involved in some sort of self-interested conspiracy which is just a nonsense. You can question the sense of his actions and you can accuse him of not being capable . . (personally I think he is one of the most capable politicians in Dail Eireann) . . but I think it is wrong to question the integrity of his actions.

As has been noted already, the man could be making a fortune, working less at the Bar..

maxwell smart

I'm warming to Lenihan. He "appears" to be trying to take some hard decisions but looks like he's running into some objections from the Cowen/Coughlan supporters.
I also think he tried to face down the civil service, but most of the cabinet bottled it.
In my opinion he's the only minister coming out of this with anything approaching respect.

dresden8

hallelujajordan wrote: »

You accuse both Lenihan and FF of being involved in some sort of self-interested conspiracy which is just a nonsense.

No, seriously, where have you been for the last ten years?

AlekSmart

A Fulton Crown,me oul segotia...will ye gerrowa dah gardin...Bud....:P

How so my learned friend ?

Ensure their survival ?? Now thats interesting..can you fill me in on how their survival is ensured ?

Just to ensure you don`t get TOO elevated an impression of me...I left school at 15 havin just managed to secure an Intermediate Certificate so most of my "learning" came from the period 1963 to 1973.

My views on the Zoe/ACC case is purely that of an uneducated cynic and I do not for a moment expect somebody as well informed as your good self to defer to my opinion at all.

The ongoing tableau in the High/Supreme Courts has already diluted the strength of any subsequent Judgements from those benches IN THE EYES OF THE "ORDINARY" PUNTER.

What perhaps caught most Ordinary Mortals attention was the surprising lack of Legalese in the original Kelly judgement and the subsequent Clark finding supported by the 1st Supreme`s.

However,perhaps the unadorned clarity of those judgements coupled with the manner in which the Judges took the utmost pains to keep them simple was wasted on the likes of Mr Cush or Mr Shipsey,used,as they are to reams of deeply intricate arcane phraseology most of which can be as ambigious as one requires.

I was VERY taken with the Open Court admonishment from Judge Clarkes bench regarding the background and content of the "figures" as presented to the court by Mr Shipsey.

In other times I would have thought such a stinging rebuke from a High Court Judge would have reveberated like the peal of Big Ben,however in the addled times we now find ourselves,it seems that the Judges words only served to spur Mr Shipsey and his team onto greater flights of fancy.....all the more articulate when one considers the Zoe legal tab may well end up being covered by the Public Purse anyway.

To read of the Zoe team referring to themselves as being totally focused on the Greater Public Interest simply made me want to reach for my Pistol,or perhaps a sickbag.

Put simply,If the ACC had succeeded in their initial application then the entire Zoe house of cards would have fallen and with it prospect of a never ending stream of frivolous oul nonsense masquerading as "supporting evidence".

Therefore I`m suggesting that the ongoing pantomine is largely intended to keep this Zoe crock on the road rather than in the crusher where it belongs.

Even the rapier like thrust of Judge Clarke`s (I think) point regarding the Zoe peoples projected sales appears to have been disregarded.

The Zoe`s are confident of selling 300+ units before Dec 31 2009.....at least that constitutes a significant part of the survival plan.....pity the dour oul Judge had to enquire as to how this would be achieved as the group had only managed to flog 30+ units in the more favourable environment prevailing to Dec 2008.....:rolleyes:

Ah wudja givvus a break Judge...are you not familiar with the principles of NAMA..? The Medium Term....Long Term.....any term EXCEPT the present ....

The more I look at this the more scared I become...why is it the more Protestant societies are dealing with the entire recession thing whilst the Catholic leaning countries,Ourselves,Spain,Italy,for example appear to require some more statues to move and leave brown envelopes at our doors ?

In the meantime I`m forced to put my trust in "capable politicians" like Minister Lenihan whilst wondering what form an "incapable" Irish Polititian would take !! :eek:

amacca

AlekSmart wrote: »

To read of the Zoe team referring to themselves as being totally focused on the Greater Public Interest simply made me want to reach for my Pistol,or perhaps a sickbag.

Pistol, definitely pistol. and then bodybag.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Why in the name of **** are they being protected? Why are they not getting the full whack? They are allowed for somethings to be kept secret? I wonder if I could keep some incriminating evidence secret if I conducted an armed robbery at my local branch. Same thing if you ask me. Bankers were once respected members of society, now they are nothing more than the base scum on the ground...

Liam Byrne

hallelujajordan wrote: »

personally I think he is one of the most capable politicians in Dail Eireann)

See the part of my previous post that you chose to ignore; do you seriously think that being "capable" includes investing fortunes of OUR MONEY in a bank without reading the ****ing report that showed the amount of dodgy and illegal activities that were going on ?

hallelujajordan wrote: »

. . but I think it is wrong to question the integrity of his actions.

And I think it's wrong to screw people working hard and barely making ends meet while paying fortunes in golden handshakes and pensions to the bankers and FAS leaders and Ceann Comhairle and everyone else who milked and screwed us and ran us into the ground and ensuring that investors in banks get their money back and call the shots while the rest of us get shafted (including the same banks that - without OUR money - would be worth ZERO increasing their rates so that the people who are already paying to bail them out end up paying even more)

And yet you support the activities that I think are wrong, and then claim that Lenihan has "integrity" ?

You can think whatever you like is "wrong", but if you answer the above questions and still claim that Lenihan has "integrity", then you're not going to be in a position to change my mind on what's "right and wrong".

Fulton Crown

Just to ensure you don`t get TOO elevated an impression of me...I left school at 15 havin just managed to secure an Intermediate Certificate so most of my "learning" came from the period 1963 to 1973.

Thank you for sharing that

My views on the Zoe/ACC case is purely that of an uneducated cynic and I do not for a moment expect somebody as well informed as your good self to defer to my opinion at all.

Nice line in sarcasm Bud

Put simply,If the ACC had succeeded in their initial application then the entire Zoe house of cards would have fallen and with it prospect of a never ending stream of frivolous oul nonsense masquerading as "supporting evidence".

So glad you put it "simply"

Therefore I`m suggesting that the ongoing pantomine is largely intended to keep this Zoe crock on the road rather than in the crusher where it belongs

.

Is everybody colluding then Judges and all ?

The Zoe`s are confident of selling 300+ units before Dec 31 2009.....at least that constitutes a significant part of the survival plan.....pity the dour oul Judge had to enquire as to how this would be achieved as the group had only managed to flog 30+ units in the more favourable environment prevailing to Dec 2008.....:rolleyes

:

Good point Buddy..

The more I look at this the more scared I become...why is it the more Protestant societies are dealing with the entire recession thing whilst the Catholic leaning countries,Ourselves,Spain,Italy,for example appear to require some more statues to move and leave brown envelopes at our doors ?

Gone right over my head this one

Now! I ask again how does it ENSURE the survival of ZOE ?

asdasd

The bank didn't tell him to feck orf..thay had a discussion and there are complicated legals around some of the files which are not vital to the investigation but could hold it up unduly.

Right then lets call in the shareholders, us, and ask us, or our board whether we want to release our files to ourselves.

I'd say we will.

asdasd

if by the way that is not the legal situation at the moment - the board of Anglo does not seem to be controlled by the Irish taxpayer, I say we fix that toute suite by removing from the board people we dont like. Keep Dukes. I rate Dukes for past services to the State. Then the board will do what we want.