'statues' in town

merlante

I knew I'd get this whole 'how dare you slam the working class, I'm working class' thing. And 'you don't need a degree to be this, that or the other thing, etc.'

I don't think you need a degree to be smart or successful or to be able to enjoy cultural exhibits or whatever. BUT, the fact remains that the less well educated your population, the lower the prospects of your society, the lower the sense of civic responsibility and the more begrudgers you have shooting people down who are trying to set up a business or start up a creative group. (It is common in Waterford to sneer at people who try to change things or do something new.)

I know we're wandering off topic, so I'll just say this. Waterford badly needs more people who are educated in areas like politics, philosophy, economics, the social sciences, and so on, so that we can organise ourselves better, both internally in our own society and externally when Waterford members go to the Dail to make cogent arguments on our behalf. That's what people say when they call Waterford a factory town, and Galway is referred to as a university city. What is the difference? Not just tax breaks and government intervention. Where is our Michael D Higgins? What we really need is a university but all people care about is the door charge in Harvey's.

And it's not just about having a degree. Lots of stupid people have degrees and lots of people have technical degrees, which don't touch on societal issues. Incidentally, working class/middle class is basically a choice in Irish society. Most people come from very modest backgrounds and what they have they built up in the past 20 years. There is plenty of mobility in our society where people can do more or less what they want in college, and as a career, while there is also plenty of scope to have a laugh in school and get a bog standard job, or live on the dole as well.

Okay, I'm done now, back on topic.

Those statue guys annoy me in general anyway, whether they're good or not. They were interesting when I first saw them in Dublin 10-15 years ago. But I wouldn't be bothered starting a thread to have a go at them, and I do think that it says something about us that these sorts of threads appear on the Waterford board.

anplaya

merlante wrote: »

I knew I'd get this whole 'how dare you slam the working class, I'm working class' thing. And 'you don't need a degree to be this, that or the other thing, etc.'

I don't think you need a degree to be smart or successful or to be able to enjoy cultural exhibits or whatever. BUT, the fact remains that the less well educated your population, the lower the prospects of your society, the lower the sense of civic responsibility and the more begrudgers you have shooting people down who are trying to set up a business or start up a creative group. (It is common in Waterford to sneer at people who try to change things or do something new.)

I know we're wandering off topic, so I'll just say this. Waterford badly needs more people who are educated in areas like politics, philosophy, economics, the social sciences, and so on, so that we can organise ourselves better, both internally in our own society and externally when Waterford members go to the Dail to make cogent arguments on our behalf. That's what people say when they call Waterford a factory town, and Galway is referred to as a university city. What is the difference? Not just tax breaks and government intervention. Where is our Michael D Higgins? What we really need is a university but all people care about is the door charge in Harvey's.

And it's not just about having a degree. Lots of stupid people have degrees and lots of people have technical degrees, which don't touch on societal issues. Incidentally, working class/middle class is basically a choice in Irish society. Most people come from very modest backgrounds and what they have they built up in the past 20 years. There is plenty of mobility in our society where people can do more or less what they want in college, and as a career, while there is also plenty of scope to have a laugh in school and get a bog standard job, or live on the dole as well.

Okay, I'm done now, back on topic.

Those statue guys annoy me in general anyway, whether they're good or not. They were interesting when I first saw them in Dublin 10-15 years ago. But I wouldn't be bothered starting a thread to have a go at them, and I do think that it says something about us that these sorts of threads appear on the Waterford board.

lol if ya really didnt care you wouldnt be bringing up things such as working class,backgrounds,education and culture.

all i posted was did any1 else see them?looks weird.what do ye think.

yet all ya did was go on a rant.typical waterford begrudgery etc.cant sort things out for themselves without arguing.so you sound like a typical waterforder there.ya wouldnt start a thread about that as ya said,but yet ya hijack it.hmm.

well butty

anplaya wrote: »

lol if ya really didnt care you wouldnt be bringing up things such as working class,backgrounds,education and culture.

all i posted was did any1 else see them?looks weird.what do ye think.

yet all ya did was go on a rant.typical waterford begrudgery etc.cant sort things out for themselves without arguing.so you sound like a typical waterforder there.ya wouldnt start a thread about that as ya said,but yet ya hijack it.hmm.[/quote]

I think Merlante should start a new thread about a very relevant topic!

Asmodean

I don't know if Working class etc has anything to do with it really. Plenty of Cities/Large towns have large working class areas and can still have bucketloads of culture. I think the problem with Waterford is that the higher-class people who have the capacity to move things along for all of us (working class included) just don't give a damn.
There's not enough new initiatives being proposed for Waterford too. You culd argue that the recession is making this very difficult at the moment but even with the boom I can't think of one decent piece of infrastructure that was developed in the city, with the exception of the Plaza maybe and John roberts Sq.

anplaya

well butty wrote: »

anplaya wrote: »

lol if ya really didnt care you wouldnt be bringing up things such as working class,backgrounds,education and culture.

all i posted was did any1 else see them?looks weird.what do ye think.

yet all ya did was go on a rant.typical waterford begrudgery etc.cant sort things out for themselves without arguing.so you sound like a typical waterforder there.ya wouldnt start a thread about that as ya said,but yet ya hijack it.hmm.[/quote]

I think Merlante should start a new thread about a very relevant topic!

ye maybe he/she should.

anplaya

Asmodean wrote: »

I don't know if Working class etc has anything to do with it really. Plenty of Cities/Large towns have large working class areas and can still have bucketloads of culture. I think the problem with Waterford is that the higher-class people who have the capacity to move things along for all of us (working class included) just don't give a damn.
There's not enough new initiatives being proposed for Waterford too. You culd argue that the recession is making this very difficult at the moment but even with the boom I can't think of one decent piece of infrastructure that was developed in the city, with the exception of the Plaza maybe and John roberts Sq.

probably too busy lining their own pockets.

merlante

anplaya wrote: »

lol if ya really didnt care you wouldnt be bringing up things such as working class,backgrounds,education and culture.

all i posted was did any1 else see them?looks weird.what do ye think.

yet all ya did was go on a rant.typical waterford begrudgery etc.cant sort things out for themselves without arguing.so you sound like a typical waterforder there.ya wouldnt start a thread about that as ya said,but yet ya hijack it.hmm.

I was responding to the following comment: "Waterford is too much of a working class town for anything like this to be appreciated imo , no matter how much we talk about culture and such people like this will always be thought of as odd"

So I didn't bring these things up, just agreed with a lot of the sentiment. Why don't you read the posts rather than whining about people ranting.

gscully

merlante wrote: »

What we really need is a university but all people care about is the door charge in Harvey's.

Hey, I started that thread out of genuine concern!

merlante wrote: »

Those statue guys annoy me in general anyway, whether they're good or not. They were interesting when I first saw them in Dublin 10-15 years ago. But I wouldn't be bothered starting a thread to have a go at them, and I do think that it says something about us that these sorts of threads appear on the Waterford board.

It says nothing. It's a open forum and anyone can post what they want as long as it's relevant and within the rules. The topic may not interest you, but may raise enough interest in others to make them go into town out of morbid curiosity. Isn't that what you want, people in town? These performers may be sub-standard or whatever, but they are new to Waterford and the OP was within his rights to start a thread asking for opinions. That says nothing about his character, so don't judge a book by its cover. If this forum turned into something where the only threads were about class and society in Waterford, or the need for a university and involved multi-quoted pages of debate, I would stop visiting the site. Let's just enjoy the weird and wonderful concoction of posts for what they are and not cast aspersions on those who make them.

anplaya

merlante wrote: »

I was responding to the following comment: "Waterford is too much of a working class town for anything like this to be appreciated imo , no matter how much we talk about culture and such people like this will always be thought of as odd"

So I didn't bring these things up, just agreed with a lot of the sentiment. Why don't you read the posts rather than whining about people ranting.

why dont ya start a different topic on this rather than whining about it in a thread that was started on something totally different?

merlante

gscully wrote: »

It says nothing. It's a open forum and anyone can post what they want as long as it's relevant and within the rules. The topic may not interest you, but may raise enough interest in others to make them go into town out of morbid curiosity. Isn't that what you want, people in town? These performers may be sub-standard or whatever, but they are new to Waterford and the OP was within his rights to start a thread asking for opinions. That says nothing about his character, so don't judge a book by its cover. If this forum turned into something where the only threads were about class and society in Waterford, or the need for a university and involved multi-quoted pages of debate, I would stop visiting the site. Let's just enjoy the weird and wonderful concoction of posts for what they are and not cast aspersions on those who make them.

I wasn't making any comments about anybody's character, I just agreed with another poster that we in Waterford tend to have a strange attitude to things such as these statue guys, that quite often doesn't say very good things about us. They were general comments and not targeted at anyone in particular. Fair point about not everything needing to be about high class and culture on here, I fully agree. I ran off topic, and am quite happy to let things to go back on topic again!