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The Government Could Not Have Continued In Office If There Had Been A "No" Vote

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    #32
    kippy
    Registered Users Posts: 18,601 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    jank wrote: »
    Dresden8 has a point. The government doesn't give 2 hoots about the people. IF it did it would offer itself up in an election before NAMA. The fact remains that this was the ONLY time the public could have folded the government with an election until 2012.

    Anyway continue on about the budget and NAMA.....
    I have lost a lot of my faith in the Irish people over the last few months on how meek we are and continuiously take it up the ass from people who "know better" about NAMA, Lisbon, Unions, Expenses etc.

    I am submitting my final residency forms this week. I am not sure if I ever want to go back, that is how much the government and the public reaction has made me turn against my home country.:(
    I dont understand why a no result today would have removed the government from office. It didnt last time.........

    I am glad the people of Ireland didnt get as confused as some people about what the vote was about.

    There's a fairly high chance that the greens grass roots members will take down the government over NAMA, if all out public strikes dont first.

    So we all "take it up the ass"..... I think you'll find that given the proper conditions the government will be dumped, this just wasnt the method by which to do it.

    Good luck in N.Z, a country that has no problems what so ever.
    You speak of people being meek and taking it up the ass, you do worse and feck off when the going gets slightly tough. Fair play to you, I wish you well, I hear the winter sports are good out there.


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    #33
    PaulieD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 932 ✭✭✭PaulieD


    Mario007 wrote: »
    dude i know you're bitter, but no one is stating that this was a win for the government. not even cowen...so i dunno why you are getting worked up over it. lisbon is an european issue...NAMA is a national issue, as is the budget etc...

    This is what will happen. Cowen and Co will claim the result of Lisbon gives him and his party a mandate "to implement the tough decisions."

    -Nama will pass.
    -Unemployment will reach 550,000 by mid spring.
    -Fianna Fail and the Greens will stay in power until the summer of 2012.
    -The budget will crucify the average worker, there will be devestating cuts across the board.
    -Yes for recovery and all that malarkey will be conveniently forgotten about.
    -Multinationals will pull out and relocate to Eastern Europe and Asia.

    There has only been one winner in Ireland today, Fianna Fail. I hope Fine Gael and Labour enjoy their next three years in opposition.


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    #34
    Fuhrer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭Fuhrer


    PaulieD wrote: »
    This is what will happen. Cowen and Co will claim the result of Lisbon gives him and his party a mandate "to implement the tough decisions."

    -Nama will be passed.
    -Unemployment will reach 550,000 by mid spring.
    -Fianna Fail and the Greens will stay in power until the summer of 2012.
    -The budget will crucify the average worker, there will be devestating cuts across the board.
    -Yes for recovery and all that malarkey will be conveniently forgotten about.


    Any chance, did that crystal ball you have show any results of football matches coming up?

    Might have a flutter


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    #35
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    PaulieD wrote: »
    I hope Fine Gael and Labour enjoy their next three years in opposition.

    The problem is, I think they will.


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    #36
    Mario007
    Registered Users Posts: 877 ✭✭✭Mario007


    dresden8 wrote: »
    Not the only one.

    ok sorry i forgot to include Green in it.

    if you were refering to the yes side, then yes they also did mix it up by joining Lisbon with Europe, but as you see no is still winning


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    #37
    PaulieD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 932 ✭✭✭PaulieD


    dresden8 wrote: »
    That was Cowen's first failure. This would have been the last of a long line of failures.

    Sometimes you need somebody to point out the obvious. The backbenchers would have forced Cowen out if he failed once more, with Lisbon part deux. Alas, it wasnt to be. We are stuck with them until 2012.


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    #38
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    Mario007 wrote: »
    ok sorry i forgot to include Green in it.

    if you were refering to the yes side, then yes they also did mix it up by joining Lisbon with Europe, but as you see no is still winning

    I don't understand.


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    #39
    CCCP^
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,749 ✭✭✭CCCP^


    PaulieD wrote: »
    This is what will happen. Cowen and Co will claim the result of Lisbon gives him and his party a mandate "to implement the tough decisions."

    -Nama will pass.
    -Unemployment will reach 550,000 by mid spring.
    -Fianna Fail and the Greens will stay in power until the summer of 2012.
    -The budget will crucify the average worker, there will be devestating cuts across the board.
    -Yes for recovery and all that malarkey will be conveniently forgotten about.
    -Multinationals will pull out and relocate to Eastern Europe and Asia.

    There has only been one winner in Ireland today, Fianna Fail. I hope Fine Gael and Labour enjoy their next three years in opposition.

    Jesus, screw that, I thought 1984 was bleak but thats terrible. **** this.


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    #40
    meglome
    Registered Users Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    Some of you people are hi-larious. We the people of Ireland voted in a shíte government, repeatedly. Now we're all living with the decision. If you don't like representative democracy then I suggest you vote in a bunch of fascists, it worked well in Germany I heard.

    Did the Yes people whine this much the last time?


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    #41
    PaulieD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 932 ✭✭✭PaulieD


    Fuhrer wrote: »
    Any chance, did that crystal ball you have show any results of football matches coming up?

    Might have a flutter

    I will happily put my money where my mouth is. What odds will you give me?


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    #42
    Mario007
    Registered Users Posts: 877 ✭✭✭Mario007


    PaulieD wrote: »
    This is what will happen. Cowen and Co will claim the result of Lisbon gives him and his party a mandate "to implement the tough decisions."

    -Nama will pass.
    -Unemployment will reach 550,000 by mid spring.
    -Fianna Fail and the Greens will stay in power until the summer of 2012.
    -The budget will crucify the average worker, there will be devestating cuts across the board.
    -Yes for recovery and all that malarkey will be conveniently forgotten about.
    -Multinationals will pull out and relocate to Eastern Europe and Asia.

    There has only been one winner in Ireland today, Fianna Fail. I hope Fine Gael and Labour enjoy their next three years in opposition.

    yet again the only one who said that this gives cowen a mandate is ganley...cowen himself first thanked the opposition parties and didn't thus take it as a sign of endorsement.


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    #43
    PaulieD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 932 ✭✭✭PaulieD


    CCCP^ wrote: »
    Jesus, screw that, I thought 1984 was bleak but thats terrible. **** this.

    I can see it easily happening. It is staring us in the face. Let us not kid ourselves.


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    #44
    meglome
    Registered Users Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    PaulieD wrote: »
    Sometimes you need somebody to point out the obvious. The backbenchers would have forced Cowen out if he failed once more, with Lisbon part deux. Alas, it wasnt to be. We are stuck with them until 2012.

    sigh...

    And he would be replaced in normal circumstances by his second in command, Mary Coughlan. There are indeed worse things than Brian Cowan,


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    #45
    PaulieD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 932 ✭✭✭PaulieD


    Mario007 wrote: »
    yet again the only one who said that this gives cowen a mandate is ganley...cowen himself first thanked the opposition parties and didn't thus take it as a sign of endorsement.

    Ganley was playing the game, Mario. If you believed him, you would swallow a brick.;)


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    #46
    PaulieD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 932 ✭✭✭PaulieD


    meglome wrote: »
    sigh...

    And he would be replaced in normal circumstances by his second in command, Mary Coughlan. There are indeed worse things than Brian Cowan,

    If Cowen was pushed Fianna Fail would had to have an election. Not even Fianna Fail would push three taoiseachs on us since the last election.


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    #47
    Mario007
    Registered Users Posts: 877 ✭✭✭Mario007


    dresden8 wrote: »
    I don't understand.

    i meant to say that no included everything into this referendum from lisbon to NATO through NAMA whereas yes only had Europe and Lisbon included


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    #48
    Kama
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,027 ✭✭✭Kama


    Green Party talks on a new Programme for Government will continue in Leinster House today as results come in from the Lisbon referendum.
    Party sources accepted yesterday that a second 'No' outcome would make them academic.

    Independent


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    #49
    Mario007
    Registered Users Posts: 877 ✭✭✭Mario007


    PaulieD wrote: »
    Ganley was playing the game, Mario. If you believed him, you would swallow a brick.;)

    no i dont believe him, thats why i said it. it's obvious that the admiration from ganley to cowen was supposed to make people say 'damn now cowen will stay in power forever, i could have voted him out' even though thats not true.


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    #50
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    PaulieD wrote: »
    If Cowen was pushed Fianna Fail would had to have an election. Not even Fianna Fail would push three taoiseachs on us since the last election.

    According to my source "a change of government would have been inevitable." "extraordinarily difficult to stay in power."

    Direct quotes.


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    #51
    CCCP^
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,749 ✭✭✭CCCP^


    PaulieD wrote: »
    I can see it easily happening. It is staring us in the face. Let us not kid ourselves.

    We will have to fight this tooth and nail, no two ways about it. There is no way I want to face the future previous described, I'd rather leave this country (and I love this country) than face the indignity and embarressment.


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    #52
    PaulieD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 932 ✭✭✭PaulieD


    Mario007 wrote: »
    no i dont believe him, thats why i said it. it's obvious that the admiration from ganley to cowen was supposed to make people say 'damn now cowen will stay in power forever, i could have voted him out' even though thats not true.

    It is true, Mario. Wille O'Dea admitted as much when he was interviewed on RTE after the result was announced. We missed our chance and we will regret it. We had an open goal, a chance to rid ourselves of Fianna Fail and we blew it. Instead, the Yes side believed that the EU will save us. Watching the Irish vote in referendums is like watching Homer J Simpson play with a Rubex cube.


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    #53
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    dresden8 wrote: »
    According to my source "a change of government would have been inevitable." "extraordinarily difficult to stay in power."
    Direct quotes.

    O I see what you did there, you used "" and that makes it so much more believable.:rolleyes:
    CCCP^ wrote: »
    We will have to fight this tooth and nail, no two ways about it. There is no way I want to face the future previous described, I'd rather leave this country (and I love this country) than face the indignity and embarressment.

    So leave. The real Irish patriots will stay behind and fight the good fight. Funny I was accused of being a traitor earlier, but I haven't seen any yes supporters threatening to jump ship..


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    #54
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    PaulieD wrote: »
    Watching the Irish vote in referendums is like watching Homer J Simpson play with a Rubex cube.

    So much for your love of democracy. Nice one.


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    #55
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    prinz wrote: »
    O I see what you did there, you used "" and that makes it so much more believable.:rolleyes:


    How could you doubt me so? Gods honest truth


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    #56
    namloc1980
    Registered Users Posts: 18,292 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    PaulieD wrote: »
    It is true, Mario. Wille O'Dea admitted as much when he was interviewed on RTE after the result was announced. We missed our chance and we will regret it. We had an open goal, a chance to rid ourselves of Fianna Fail and we blew it. Instead, the Yes side believed that the EU will save us. Watching the Irish vote in referendums is like watching Homer J Simpson play with a Rubex cube.

    I must have missed the part where this was a referendum on the Governemnt....silly me :rolleyes:


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    #57
    jank
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭jank


    prinz wrote: »
    No, it really wasn't. Goodbye ;)

    Eh whatever. If you cant respond in a manner that doesnt goad people than thats too bad.


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    #58
    jank
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭jank


    Fuhrer wrote: »
    How?

    This wasnt a general election, no outcome of this referndum would have any effect on the government being folded or not.

    Oh yes it was. Ask or listen to any politcol commentator from any newspaper and they would have said the same. In fact I have heard 3 different commentators say this. Cowen would have resigned and an election would follow suit.


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    #59
    dresden8
    Registered Users Posts: 3,290 ✭✭✭dresden8


    namloc1980 wrote: »
    I must have missed the part where this was a referendum on the Governemnt....silly me :rolleyes:

    I think you'll find that at least one FFer disagrees with your sarcasm.


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    #60
    CCCP^
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,749 ✭✭✭CCCP^


    prinz wrote: »
    O I see what you did there, you used "" and that makes it so much more believable.:rolleyes:



    So leave. The real Irish patriots will stay behind and fight the good fight. Funny I was accused of being a traitor earlier, but I haven't seen any yes supporters threatening to jump ship..

    No you clown. I am calling on people to fight this tooth and nail. Lisbon is over, drop your rhetorical posturing now, from this point on there is no Yes and No sides, just an economically devastated country on the brink.


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    #61
    Mario007
    Registered Users Posts: 877 ✭✭✭Mario007


    PaulieD wrote: »
    It is true, Mario. Wille O'Dea admitted as much when he was interviewed on RTE after the result was announced. We missed our chance and we will regret it. We had an open goal, a chance to rid ourselves of Fianna Fail and we blew it. Instead, the Yes side believed that the EU will save us. Watching the Irish vote in referendums is like watching Homer J Simpson play with a Rubex cube.

    as much as i love seeing willi o'dea debate i missed him today so i won't argue with you on that point.
    still would you rather hold the whole of europe in ransom just to change our government, when the EU can actually help us and monitor that our politicians wouldn't do anything too stupid...

    and look at it pragmatically, even if it would cause the GE which i'm not saying it would, FG and Labour would get into power, FF in opposition. to get us out of the mess FG and Labour would have to either make savage cuts or will be fighting over whether we should cut or just increase taxes and borrowing which would either lead us stagnating or with another GE on our hands. if they did indeed make savage cuts, people would hate them, FF would criticize them, gain support and we're back to where we started from.


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