Anyone set up a DVB-S/S2 Tuner Card in their HTPC?

meob

Nelbert wrote: »

I want full feature watch one channel record at least 1 other Sky in media center with HD! Is that too much to ask?)

it will never happen.

royalties / encryption / file protection / file sharing... to name a few.

the dvblink is far from a sky payer by the way! it is full hd sky with a epg that is a million times better than the sky epg, yes restricted to 1 tuner - just use the other to record movies... its very impressive in action....

eddiem74

meob, so in terms of reliability whats the solution like? How often do recordings fail or other issues surface?

Nelbert

it will never happen.

royalties / encryption / file protection / file sharing... to name a few.

It will never happen is a very blanket statement which I hope turns out to be wrong (preferably some time soon!)
It has happened in the States and they have recently removed the mandatory drm that had been attached to the files that are recorded with CableCard tuners with a Windows update and a firmware update for the tuners.

Honestly I'd be happy even if you could only watch the content on a Windows 7 computer which is part of the same Homegroup. In fact I'd just be happy if I could do it on one pc.

All it takes it Microsoft wanting people to use their product they way it is being used by people in the states with CableCard tuners. A precendent has been set with this type of thing in the states and I think if MS went to the EU version of Comreg(???) and made their case like they did in the states then it would happen.

I would be more than happy to pay for Sky for sports and maybe movies too if they provide what by comparision to the states is now basic and standard integration into Windows Media Center.

I wasn't comparing DVBLink to sky player by the way. DVBLink does a lot of what I'd like just not as well or as simplified as I think we would all like i.e. still need a sky box! SkyPlayer is nothing close to what most Media Center fans/enthusiasts want from Sky which is a legitimate way of subscribing through a DVB-S2 tuner PC Card solution like CableCard does in the states.

meob

eddiem74 wrote: »

meob, so in terms of reliability whats the solution like? How often do recordings fail or other issues surface?

good question!

in fairness, i was having major problems getting it going, covered in my blog, but the latest beta for dvblink is ROCK solid. 100% channel changing - 100% recording schedule. the dreaded "no tv signal...." is no more

the channel changing sucess is due to the dusky box

http://www.dusky-control.com/serial.shtml

no ir buds for my channel changing thanks!

setup was VERY flakey until recently, this is not the dvblink but the hdpvr is very sensitive to usb, so once i had isolated its own controller, all my issues were solved.

the latest driver for hdpvr is 1.5.6 - no official w7 driver but it does work, we are hoping hauppauge will bring a new driver..

hdpvr gets a little hot, so no harm is rising it up to allow air to pass underneath and i cover its ir sensor with tape to prevent any unwanted signals...

clean build htpc with NO other crap on it, using a decent graphic card piped to 52"

looks mint.

eddiem74

meob wrote: »

good question!

in fairness, i was having major problems getting it going, covered in my blog, but the latest beta for dvblink is ROCK solid. 100% channel changing - 100% recording schedule. the dreaded "no tv signal...." is no more

the channel changing sucess is due to the dusky box

http://www.dusky-control.com/serial.shtml

no ir buds for my channel changing thanks!

setup was VERY flakey until recently, this is not the dvblink but the hdpvr is very sensitive to usb, so once i had isolated its own controller, all my issues were solved.

the latest driver for hdpvr is 1.5.6 - no official w7 driver but it does work, we are hoping hauppauge will bring a new driver..

hdpvr gets a little hot, so no harm is rising it up to allow air to pass underneath and i cover its ir sensor with tape to prevent any unwanted signals...

clean build htpc with NO other crap on it, using a decent graphic card piped to 52"

looks mint.

Sounds interesting for sure. I've always been keen to use media center for the lot, but was concerned with reliability, and failed recordings, and given it would need to be family friendly. We use it for Music, Pictures, and Movies at present, but I've shyed away from the TV side.

If fact I have an MCE150 & Dual DVB-T/DVB-S card installed but have never gotten around to setting anything up for regular use.

This approach with the HD PVR is not cheap either, although the bundling of the Arcsoft software offsets that a bit, I was actually considering buying that instead of reinstalling PowerDVD.

Some food for thought.........

meob

i agree fully, there is cost, but i am happy with it.

it has also passed the wife test which was a MAJOR milestone.

so i have all the pics / video / cartoons for kids / movies ect all accessible to family when i am not there.

not to mention the media extender capability.....

eddiem74

meob wrote: »

i agree fully, there is cost, but i am happy with it.

it has also passed the wife test which was a MAJOR milestone.

so i have all the pics / video / cartoons for kids / movies ect all accessible to family when i am not there.

not to mention the media extender capability.....

And the Arcsoft TMT software that comes with it, is it the version that integrates into Media Center for Bluray playback, etc ?

PyeContinental

Yes I have a Hauppage HVR 4000 use it with Windows 7 Media Center.
It seems to be the same as a NOVA-HD-S2 with the addition of a DVB-T/T2 tuner, analog UHF and FM radio tuner.
They were roughly the same price when I was buying (about 105 euro on elara.ie, although they seem to have risen in price since) so I didn't see any reason to go for the Nova-S2 instead of the HVR4000
The only disadvantage I can think of is that with all the connections on the card it may be a little difficult to fit it, as the FM connector is so high on the card, it prevented me from lining it up over the PCI slot without disassembling the case a little first. Otherwise I think I would have had to remove the motherboard to fit it.

You're making the same assumption as I did regarding HD and S2 before I had a chance to experiment with my system. HD doesn't have to be S2 and in fact, BBC HD is broadcast on normal DVB-S, so any DVB-S card will receive BBC HD. Personally I haven't bothered with ITV HD, although if it started broadcasting more regularly I might make the effort to play around with the necessary registry settings to get it working in Media Center.
So, as Cork45 said, you could save some money and buy something cheaper if you only need a DVB-S card. You will need a fairly decent graphics card to show High Def stuff properly though (so that the picture displays smoothly without tearing or stuttering). I found that an Nvidia 9600GT worked pretty much fine, although I'm now using a 9800GT which has a useful HDMI port for connection to a tv.

As for the Hauppauge HVR4000 card, I use it for Freesat with an elliptical (Sky minidish) type dish which I put up myself, and found it surprisingly easy to do so.
I've had no issues with it, and found the installation procedure and tuning setup under Windows 7 very straightforward (with XP Media Center, DVB-s tuning wasn't straightforward and needed registry patches).
You can only use one tuner on the card at a time, so for example, you can't record a DVB-T channel while watching DVB-S or vice-versa, but you can have satellite and terrestrial channels all in the one EPG and you don't have to care or know which tuner is being used when selecting between the channels.
Oh, it works with the Irish MPEG4 DTT channels as well.

The only issue I can think of to mention is that there was an optional update which I installed on windows 7 which seemed to stop the card working when I applied, so rolled it back and it worked again. I haven't investigated any further on that.

meob

eddiem74 wrote: »

And the Arcsoft TMT software that comes with it, is it the version that integrates into Media Center for Bluray playback, etc ?

yes

meob

eddiem74 wrote: »

meob, so in terms of reliability whats the solution like? How often do recordings fail or other issues surface?

actually, there is one other issue i forgot to mention....

PIN entry on movie channels

this is a requirement on most (not all) movie channels pre-watershed and CANNOT be disabled, - lord i have tried.

so with the current setup, i need a way to enter the pin when i change to a movie channel (this is why I am using the other tuner in sky hd to archive movies at moment....)

this can be possible tho.

I am working on a script, which will hook into dvblink, so IF channel = movie channel - enter pin

thats the idea, needs testing & more work....

this is the bit that needs work....

:: Create a list of channels with the ; seperator (start and end with it as well)
set PIN_CHANNELS=;123;111;109;602;555;

:: Check if %SHORT_CHANNEL_NUMBER% is include in the list
echo %PIN_CHANNELS% | find /c ";%SHORT_CHANNEL_NUMBER%;" > result.txt
for /f %%i in (result.txt) do set IS_PIN_CHANNEL=%%i
del result.txt
if "%IS_PIN_CHANNEL%"=="1" goto :SEND_PIN
if "%IS_PIN_CHANNEL%"=="0" goto :END


::SEND_PIN script wait for 3 secs
:SEND_PIN
      ping -n 3 127.0.0.1>nul
      sky-control.exe 0 12 9
      sky-control.exe 0 12 1
      sky-control.exe 0 12 9
      sky-control.exe 0 12 4

meob

the sky-control.exe is dead handy as well as then you can script and macro you might need on the sky remote, ie go to UTV on other channels. pop that inti a batch script & possible use event ghost to assign ti to a button the remote / media center ect...

eddiem74

meob wrote: »

the sky-control.exe is dead handy as well as then you can script and macro you might need on the sky remote, ie go to UTV on other channels. pop that inti a batch script & possible use event ghost to assign ti to a button the remote / media center ect...

So for the ITV's, and all BBC's do you also integrate them into your EPG too ? Do you use your S2 card to pick these up via freesat or ?

To be honest I am all on for a bit of tweaking, but this feels like its getting into the serious bracket, along with the expense !!

meob

its not for the faint hearted, i'll admit that!

to get the freesat channels into the epg & working right, better off with a DVB-S tuner.

the scripting is just a workaround for me at the moment so my wife can watch utv on telly while keeping W7MC on, i have not tied utv into the epg, I am jst going to use my dvb-s for that

at the moment my dvb-s is in a 2nd htpc for testing.... plan is to have dvblink & dvb-s in same box in next few weeks.

then i'll have full access for freesat & Sky HD in EPG

there is no real need to get deep into the scripting, but i enjoy tinkering with the stuff,

the PIN on movie channels is a balls tho - if i want to record a movie via W7MC, i usually schedule it at night to avoid the pin prompt....

no way around it unfortunately, thanks sky!

subway

im using dvb-s card for freesat. works fine in 7mc

<Snip>


Mod comment: discussion of this sort is unwelcome.

Ritz.

meob

subway wrote: »

im using dvb-s card for freesat. works fine in 7mc

Snipped - see above. Ritz.

mcgovern

Just installed my Win Nova HD S2 card in my PC and hooked it up. Getting stations alright, but the bundled software is a bit crap.
Anyone know where I can get the patch to get it working through Windows Media Centre (Vista)? Or a better EPG (rather than now and next if I'm lucky).

Edit: Found the file somewhere, but still only now and next in the Media Centre EPG

PyeContinental

Do you only have now and next on all channels in the guide?
What happens when you choose to download the latest guide listings?

I'd have a look for Vista Media Center TV Pack 2008 anyway, or if at all possible go to Windows 7 to avoid the hassle of messing about with satellite card patches and "OEM only" packs which should be essential updates.

meob

mcgovern wrote: »

Just installed my Win Nova HD S2 card in my PC and hooked it up. Getting stations alright, but the bundled software is a bit crap.
Anyone know where I can get the patch to get it working through Windows Media Centre (Vista)? Or a better EPG (rather than now and next if I'm lucky).

Edit: Found the file somewhere, but still only now and next in the Media Centre EPG

http://dvblogic.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=2329

mcgovern

Thanks meob and PyreContinental, I thought I had installed TV Pack 2008 already, but the fact that it didn't recognise the tuner until I ran the patch, makes me believe I might not have.
I'll try install it again and let you know.

But yeah, at most it's now and next, a lot of the time there will be no listings at all for most stations, including the major ones like BBC etc.

meob

mcgovern wrote: »

Thanks meob and PyreContinental, I thought I had installed TV Pack 2008 already, but the fact that it didn't recognise the tuner until I ran the patch, makes me believe I might not have.
I'll try install it again and let you know.

But yeah, at most it's now and next, a lot of the time there will be no listings at all for most stations, including the major ones like BBC etc.

if your missing channel listings, try this

http://mediacenterhd.blogspot.com/2009/10/customise-w7mc-epg.html

mcgovern

meob wrote: »

if your missing channel listings, try this

http://mediacenterhd.blogspot.com/2009/10/customise-w7mc-epg.html

Is that valid in Vista Media Centre too?

meob

mcgovern wrote: »

Is that valid in Vista Media Centre too?

i cant confirm that, but i would say yes.

it was originally designed for vista afiak, so as long as you have the tv pack, you should be ok.

i would just upgrade to W7 ;-)

riccol1966

Just a question on getting 2 HD channels into media center. So when I pay for SKY HD I get SKY+, so there are 2 channels going into the SKY HD box.

I assume there is no way to "access" the 2nd satellite feed because there is only one component out on the thomson box, is that right ?

So if money was no object, could I get a separate SKY HD box, (with paired subscription or something?), and then feed both into 2 separate Hauppauge HDPVRs, or can a single HDPVR this handle 2 separate feeds and then route into 2 separate MCE freesat S2 cards?

Is that possible?

What's maddening about all this stuff is that money IS an object, and a real sticky one, and the fact that there's a harddrive in the Sky HD box that I dont want to use and another hard drive in the HDPVR that I dont want to use, and end up paying for both. Aargh, all I want is the 2 HD signals, nothing else.... As far as I know MCE then takes over and allows you to watch a channel and record another. Which is where I suppose this alternate route of a dreambox and CI module etc etc takes over, and my eyes begin to glaze over... has anyone get 2 HD feeds working from one SKY HD subscription ?

meob

if you want 2 hd feeds, i woudl investigate the solution subway (dreambox & 2*DVB-S) detailed above,
from what I can tell this does work, but seems to still be at a experimental stage, you'll need some more kit as well best part of 400 to 500 euro worth.

there is NO hard drive in the HDPVR - the video is ripped to your pc hard drive or NAS.

i am looking into the dreambox setup, but it does look daunting.

I just setup the DVBlink setup and it works, so don't want to tinker for a while!

keep in mind the 2nd tuner in the sky box can be used to record as well (to internal sky box hd)

I use this to archive HD movies then rip to pc when I have spare time with HD PVR & Total Media Extreme - so at least its not gone to waste....

riccol1966

meob wrote: »

if you want 2 hd feeds, i woudl investigate the solution subway (dreambox & 2*DVB-S) detailed above,
from what I can tell this does work, but seems to still be at a experimental stage, you'll need some more kit as well best part of 400 to 500 euro worth.

there is NO hard drive in the HDPVR - the video is ripped to your pc hard drive or NAS.

i am looking into the dreambox setup, but it does look daunting.

I just setup the DVBlink setup and it works, so don't want to tinker for a while!

keep in mind the 2nd tuner in the sky box can be used to record as well (to internal sky box hd)

I use this to archive HD movies then rip to pc when I have spare time with HD PVR & Total Media Extreme - so at least its not gone to waste....

ok thanks for that, I know what you mean about tinkering, that drives the wife mad and I must keep 7MC stable, otherwise she blows!

Apogee

An alternative to using a dreambox to read the card is a Phoenix Smartmouse. This still works fine for the FTV channels (e.g. C4HD, Fiver etc) with the blue Sky cards. However, I don't know if it will work with the newer white Sky cards.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=57278176

tech-e

hi lads, looking for some help -
ok so, currently putting together a htpc based around antec mirco fusion remote 350case.
currently sky + std subscription x1 , 2nd sky box with uk freesat card , 3rd sky box for fta no card.i want to be able to view and record from freesat i.e itv,c5 ,five us etc.
quite happy to connect freesat box to htpc but which tv card and which os ?
currently running xp pro and vista ultimate . have 2nd sky dish and lnb which i could use too.
any thoughts? dvb s or s2 ,note hd is not a necessity but would be a bonus all be it for two channels

PyeContinental

Hi, long story short, don't bother with connecting any external satellite box to your HTPC. Get any DVB-S card for your HTPC and connect a feed from your LNB directly to it. You don't need DVB-S2 cards for HD. They two aren't synonymous. The only HD channels on freesat at the moment are BBCHD, LuxeTVHD and (with a bit of messing around) ITVHD, for the little it shows at the moment.

Personally, I use Hauppauge HVR4000 cards. There are cheaper models that are DVB-S only though. Hauppauge are known for making good hardware but atrocious software. This is fine though, if you only install the drivers and use Media Center instead. Pinnacle are supposed to be good too, and BlackGold cards (if available) have a good reputation although I've read reports of some driver issues on those.

tech-e

thanks for that pye... i thought that the HVR4000 might be a possibility , but didn't realise that i could bypass the digibox completely.i take it then that this card will allow viewing of all freesat channels inc. five us ,fiver etc?
will this let me record one channel while watching another (seperate transponder signals)?
what do you reckon on using xp with a htpc(have a spare copy) or am i better with W7?
thanks again

PyeContinental

tech-e wrote: »

thanks for that pye... i thought that the HVR4000 might be a possibility , but didn't realise that i could bypass the digibox

Yes, much better doing it that way, otherwise you're decoding with the digibox, outputting via scart and inputting to card on analog composite or s-video and then re-encoding to mpeg2, which even at highest quality setting, decreases quality because of the conversion and reencoding (and creates larger file sizes than if connecting signal from sat dish directly to F connector on sat tuner card. (that's sort of the long story!)

i take it then that this card will allow viewing of all freesat channels

Yes. Although you will need to tune some channels manually like Men & Motors, some of the Zone (CBS) channels and Newstalk radio for example. See this thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055740017

inc. five us ,fiver etc?

They're not on Freesat (for the moment at least), just Five is.
I have a thread in Terrestrial forum at the moment as it happens about what I'm doing to improve my DTT reception from Wales to get these channels reliably by the way.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055735994

will this let me record one channel while watching another (seperate transponder signals)?

No, at least not that I'm aware of. There may be third party software that allows this, or who knows - perhaps a patch or update for WMC (W7) in future. Only one of the tuners on the HVR4000 can be used at one time. You can of course add another one to your system though, of course that means spending more.

what do you reckon on using xp with a htpc(have a spare copy) or am i better with W7?

Personally I preferred the look of the interface of XP MCE, although W7 does bring some nice new features like proper media content downloading like album art and film and DVD covers, with movie review and cast and crew information and lookup and "record in future" options even if a film is not in the schedule.

The HVR 4000 sat card will work in XP MCE, but only with a patch from Hauppauge's website. It does this by fooling XP MCE into seeing the DVB-S tuner as being a DVB-T tuner, and "translating" the tuning information. There would need to be a similar patch for other DVB-S cards to work in XP MCE. Win 7 is the first Windows OS to provide native support for DVB-S. Even vista doesn't without the 2008 TV-pack, which is officially for OEM builders only.
Basically, Win7 is a lot less hassle and works much more "out of the box".

thanks again

Glad to be of help. Did a lot of experimenting myself, and happy to see others avoid the same mistakes and timewasting I did!