Type of Bull for Autumn part time Suckling?

locky76

i've an autumn calving herd which i started 4 years ago with an angus bull and a variety of cows (charolais, simmental, whitehead, angus, limousine). my poor angus bull's legs are getting to him so i'm giving him the heave ho after this season. i'm thinking of buying a 10/11 month old purebred bull this autumn but i'm unsure of which breed to go for.
i've only seen 4 cows calving in the four years so easy calving is a priority but i'd like to get a beefier, more coloured off spring from my herd so i'm looking at the following:
Saler: Easy calving, good growth levels, bit of colour
Simmental: Fine big cattle, good colour
Angus: Easy calving
Any advice on which breed to go for much appreciated

leg wax

locky76 wrote: »

i've an autumn calving herd which i started 4 years ago with an angus bull and a variety of cows (charolais, simmental, whitehead, angus, limousine). my poor angus bull's legs are getting to him so i'm giving him the heave ho after this season. i'm thinking of buying a 10/11 month old purebred bull this autumn but i'm unsure of which breed to go for.
i've only seen 4 cows calving in the four years so easy calving is a priority but i'd like to get a beefier, more coloured off spring from my herd so i'm looking at the following:
Saler: Easy calving, good growth levels, bit of colour
Simmental: Fine big cattle, good colour
Angus: Easy calving
Any advice on which breed to go for much appreciated

stick with the angus if its not broken dont fix it and all that?

reilig

We run a limousin with 14 cows of similar breed to yours on an outfarm. They all calve between September and November, and all calve outside. In the last 2 years I can honestly say that I have not seen one of them calving nor have I lost a calf. But as I said in a previous post, this would be somewhat down to precalving grass management. It is especially evident this year in the weinling sales that there is a major difference in price between Continental bred weinlings and Angus. Limousin and Chaorlais are at least €100 per head dearer than Angus in my local marts anyway.

locky76

Cheers for that Reilig.
I'm reluctant to get a limousine as their reputation preceeds them.
I fancy the look of the saler and they're meant to be a bit more docile than the limousine. My neighbours saler bull broke in and fathered 3 calves which are head and shoulders above their angus siblings.

reilig wrote: »

We run a limousin with 14 cows of similar breed to yours on an outfarm. They all calve between September and November, and all calve outside. In the last 2 years I can honestly say that I have not seen one of them calving nor have I lost a calf. But as I said in a previous post, this would be somewhat down to precalving grass management. It is especially evident this year in the weinling sales that there is a major difference in price between Continental bred weinlings and Angus. Limousin and Chaorlais are at least €100 per head dearer than Angus in my local marts anyway.

vanderbadger

i know of a few people who bought saler cows and are sorry, very wild animals, very agressive when calving,dont know about their bulls but would be inclined to stay away from them, you are being a bit hard on the limousin, they have a bad rep and when they are mad they are desperate but its just a case of buying a bull with a good docility score

reilig

vanderbadger wrote: »

i know of a few people who bought saler cows and are sorry, very wild animals, very agressive when calving,dont know about their bulls but would be inclined to stay away from them, you are being a bit hard on the limousin, they have a bad rep and when they are mad they are desperate but its just a case of buying a bull with a good docility score

I agree with Vanderbadger. I have seen many saler cows that are just giddy in comparison to the Limousin. In reality, with a limousin, you get an animal that reacts the way that he was treated. Many Limousin Bulls (and other breeds too) are halter trained for shows and sales and some people don't do this halter training right or in time and end up abusing the bull - which he will remember. I'd prefer to buy a bull with little or no handling. I won't handle him either when I buy him. Have had a good few limousin bulls over the years and never had a problem. The current bull I can go into the field where he is with cows and walk him on his own away from cows towards the gate and bring him on the lane to fields where there are other cows that may be in heat. He's used of being moved.

As for limousin weinlings being wild, I don't have this issue. All are creep fed and used of people moving through the field with them. I have seen wild limousins where the farmer never walked through the cattle to look at them - just looked at them from the gate. Did he expect them to be friendly when he put them into the yard and saw humans for the first time??????

pakalasa

I bred 2 limousin heifers to RIO, the Saler bull in NCBC last year.
Both these heifers, homebred, were sired by the limousin MBU (malibu) out of beefy red limousin cows I had.
The quality of both calves were very bad. RIO is very easy calving, so that's why I used him. I won't be using him again though. I'll stick with an easy calving limousin in future.;)

and "locky76" if you do go with a limousin bull, get one with a high (>120) Docility Index. You should have no problems then.

Bitten & Hisses

Reilig and Pakalasa are bang on about Limousins' temperament. It is a combination of their breeding and the way they are handled. I have pedigree Limousin cows that I can take any stranger into the field and they will stand there and let you put your hand on them.
There is a Limousin Premier sale in Roscrea on October 26th, the Bank Holiday Monday. You'll find a bull there to suit your needs and budget. Select a bull with docility above 120 and he'll be like a lamb.

ravima

what about Blondes?

easy calvers and good prices in marts.

irish_bob

vanderbadger wrote: »

i know of a few people who bought saler cows and are sorry, very wild animals, very agressive when calving,dont know about their bulls but would be inclined to stay away from them, you are being a bit hard on the limousin, they have a bad rep and when they are mad they are desperate but its just a case of buying a bull with a good docility score

its widely known how incredibly wild saler cattle are , as many have often commented , they make limousins look like lambs , apart from the fact that the dams can calve elephants , they are nothing special as a breed either although they are incredibly easy calving , easier than angus even

locky76

cheers for all the advice.
i'm being turned towards a limousine bull i think.
i might spin up to the sale in roscrea on october 26th.
what would i pay for a 10 to 11 month old bull?

Bitten & Hisses

The minimum price a bull will sell for at the sale in Roscrea is (I think) €1700, i.e. the auctioneer won't put them on the market at less than that - Society rules. The way prices are gone at the moment, you should pick up a decent bull for €2000 to €2500, but the maximum on the day would be far higher than that. The catalogue will be online in advance and study it before you go up, draw up a shortlist and take it from there. Bear in mind that the Roscrea Premier Sale is generally where the better quality Limousins in the country go to market.

wiggy123

a good angus bull can be good for your system!

in saying that a charolais cannot be beaten for quality weanlings as can be seen in the sales rings around teh country @mo..
i'd say they will always make more than the limousins,maybe not in the heifers--but bull wise..yes!

See as they say--its the suckler cow,that makes a good calf,i'd say 60/40 so..
so if you have good (graded)cows! should hav gd weanlings out of most bulls...

also i do find--any breed of bull,or type-may not suit all your cows..

Bitten & Hisses

Roscrea catalogue is now online:

http://irishlimousin.com/09/downloads/Roscrea2009.pdf

BalthazarB

What time is the sale tomorrow?