New Tier listing for SF IV

Azza

Eventhubs have posted an updated tier list.
http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/oct/17/street-fighter-4-tiers-character-rankings/

Site seems to be down at the moment. But the list is as follows.

S Tier
Sagat

A Tier
Balrog
Rufus
Ryu
Blanka
Zangief

B Tier
Akuma
Seth
Chun Li

C Tier
M Bison
C. Viper

D Tier
E Honda
Gouken
Ken
Rose

E Tier
Abel
Dahlsim
Fei Long
Guile
Cammy

F Tier
Sakura
Gen
El Fuerte

**** Tier
Vega

Really **** Tier
Dan

Should be noted that Balrog, Rufus and Ryu are rated even (i.e joint second) but they are listed in alphabetical order.

Personally think that Akuma should be up there with guys listed in second. Also think Sakura is too high and Gen is too low.

So what you guys think?

Zapp Brannigan

Akuma is S tier. He's brilliant, best character in the game. But he's not as easy to use as Sagat.

Blanka is not A tier, once you figure out his tricks he hasn't got much in the way of game-winners (I should know I main him!). I reckon its the 50/50 (but not really) cross-up ultra that's putting him up there.

Abel is definitely not E tier, Upper B for me. Good resets and a nice damage output.

Those are the characters I play so that's all I can really speak for.

Azza

Blanka has a cross up ultra?

Orim

Azza wrote: »

Blanka has a cross up ultra?

Hop to Ultra off a throw will cross-up. However it's really obvious. It does get you safe damage which is not to be scoffed.

I'm not sure of any other cross-up ultra situations.

Zapp Brannigan

Yeah, after a neutral throw. You can do the ultra, and depending on how long you held forward, while inputting the motion, Blanka will either hit you in the front or behind. It's ambiguous because Blanka lands on the opponent just as they are waking up. Although good players will spot this.

Chari and Fax use it a lot. In fact, it's the sole reason that Fax beat Mago's team singlehandedly at Gods Garden.

Owwmykneecap

Lol at that list. where is it coming from?
Japs don't use the console characters enough to know and the Americans arent skilled enough to produce a real list .

Kirby

Azza wrote: »

Eventhubs have posted an updated tier list.
http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/oct/17/street-fighter-4-tiers-character-rankings/

Site seems to be down at the moment. But the list is as follows.

D Tier
E Honda
Gouken
Ken
Rose


E Tier
Abel
Dahlsim
Fei Long
Guile
Cammy

List is WAY off. There is no way in hell that Honda , Ken, Gouken and Rose should be above Abel and Sim in their current format. Those four just don't win matches at tourneys. Abel and Sim do.

I have a feeling alot of the matchup scores used for this list are all theoryFighter. And you can't base a comprehensive list off theory. Only real world results. And those four, as I said, don't get enough medium or high level play. You could make an arguement for Honda, but people who main him are always on about his serious deficiencies.

Azza

A list compiled of all the major tournament results up till about 1 month ago show Honda having more success than Dhalsim or Abel who really don't win alot of tournaments. As for people whiny about deficiencies you get that with every character.....broken Yoga Blast anyone?



Sim doesn't have any really horrible match ups, just he doesn't dominate anyone.

Abel has his own issues, like crap air defense and difficult getting around characters that can zone well to get in to do his high damage.

As for Gouken and Rose, Rose is solid easy to play character, while Alex Valle used Gouken a lot on his way to winning the recent Cicada Street Fighter 4 tournament. I reckon both characters are solid mid tier characters. I also think Gen is up there with em.

Its true the Japanese don't play console characters so we are left to rely on the Americans to compile a list for them.

bush

Joke list surely?

Liamario

I don't understand why Ken is rated lower than Ryu when they are almost identical. The only thing I get from the list is that whoever put it together is an elitist wanker and is taking the fun out of the game. It's like when you play shooters online and the team is getting owned and start making excuses. Noob tube, shot me from behind, he used bullets.... People making rules for games when they should just play the ****ing thing.
I appreciate that some characters are easier to use than others, but there really is no way to get around this. The characters have to play differently.

Azza

I assume Ken is rated lower than Ryu because he has less viable ultra set ups. His fireball game isn't as good either, and I think his tatsu is unsafe on block.

As for being made by an elitist wanker, I say more than one person made the list. There is such a thing called balance as well.

Liamario

I do appreciate that they want as much balance as possible, but this would be an impossible task when you consider the variety of moves (both how they are pulled off and their use), character speeds, reach and other variables. I feel this analysis is a bit over the top. It's interesting in terms of tournament play, but for the vast majority of street fighter players, I seriously doubt they would take much notice of these facts and figures (and opinions)

Retr0gamer

Liamario wrote: »

I don't understand why Ken is rated lower than Ryu when they are almost identical.

It's because Ryus Ultra has so many set ups while Kens only has a few and all over them are from close range. Also I feel ryu has a lot more tricks up his sleave than ken and doesn't leave himself as open. Also slightly better zoning game with the more powerful fireballs.

Retr0gamer

Liamario wrote: »

I do appreciate that they want as much balance as possible, but this would be an impossible task when you consider the variety of moves (both how they are pulled off and their use), character speeds, reach and other variables. I feel this analysis is a bit over the top. It's interesting in terms of tournament play, but for the vast majority of street fighter players, I seriously doubt they would take much notice of these facts and figures (and opinions)

It also leads to scumbags like Terry maining Sagat

Orim

Blanka and Gief are too high. Both should be mid-tier.
Akuma up to third.
I'd knock Rufus down a bit but keep him high tier.


I think Gouken is, with Honda, the most underated char in this game. I wouldn't put him higher in the tier list but I think some-one will take him to a tourney and put him on the map as Yeb as done with Gen.

Liamario

I would consider myself a decent player- winning a lot more than losing. I would use special moves, but I'm more than confident to have a fight with just the basic punches and kicks. I like to draw out moves from my opponents that wiIl leave them exposed. I suppose the more technical you become, the more this analysis will be relevant.

Liamario

HMUYA wrote: »

Blanka and Gief are too high. Both should be mid-tier.
Akuma up to third.
I'd knock Rufus down a bit but keep him high tier.


I think Gouken is, with Honda, the most underated char in this game. I wouldn't put him higher in the tier list but I think some-one will take him to a tourney and put him on the map as Yeb as done with Gen.

I would defintely put Gouken up there with the top. Seriously underrated. I think I might spend some time with him.... intimately ;)

Ken B

Vega(claw)is worse than Dan........

Orim

Ken B wrote: »

Vega(claw)is worse than Dan........

No way dood Claw is awesome. Don't you know he can jump off the wall from like the middle of the screen!

Azza

Vega(claw)is worse than Dan........

Your being unfair to Dan even comparing them, Vega is worse than Sean!

Blanka seems too high, solid B tier for me.

Gief is fine he's deffo top tier with Akuma and Ryu.
Rog and Rufus right behind em.

Gouken is a character evey one loves to say is underrated but I think he is just solid middle of the road. Honda is the real deal in terms of underrated characters.

A-Trak

Azza wrote: »

Honda is the real deal in terms of underrated characters.

With a decent & consistent ultra setup, Honda would instantly jump a tied or two.

Orim

A-Trak wrote: »

With a decent & consistent ultra setup, Honda would instantly jump a tied or two.

That's the thing for every character. The top characters are those that can get their ultra off pretty much every round. Ken is the same, if he had a decent way to link into ultra then he would jump up that list.

Ry

Am I less of a man now for liking Sagat? :rolleyes:

Ry

Azza

Yes, yes you are.

Retr0gamer

Your not a man, your a cnut.

bush

Azza wrote: »

Blanka has a cross up ultra?

I did it on you the last time we played and you blocked it the right way so i presumed you knew about it.

Azza

Must of not crossed me up or must of been an accident if I blocked right.

I see they changed the Bison Vs Blanka match up to 5:5 rather than 6:4. Seems about fair, they only arcade match ups for sure that I think Bison has the advantage is El Fuerte and C.Viper. Think its even enough with Abel which is his other listed advantage match up. I don't quite fully understand why Chun-Li is 6:4 over Bison, seems very even to me.

Placebo

Retr0gamer wrote: »

It also leads to scumbags like Terry maining Sagat

pure scum

animaX

Retr0gamer wrote: »

It also leads to scumbags like Terry maining Sagat

You know lads, sometimes I get the feeling you dont like me much

What, is it my hair?

FoamyMushroom

I'd replace Blanka with Abel in all fairness

Seth is in B with Akuma and Chun? Damn Last time I checked tiers Seth was kinda low..

Dreddybajs

FoamyMushroom wrote: »

I'd replace Blanka with Abel in all fairness

Seth is in B with Akuma and Chun? Damn Last time I checked tiers Seth was kinda low..

There's so much wrong with this post I don't know where to start... :pac:

FoamyMushroom

Hush

Cunny-Funt

Liamario wrote: »

I don't understand why Ken is rated lower than Ryu when they are almost identical.

They're far from identical, Ken is much worse in this game compared to his old 3s self. & he's much worse than ryu in this. Ryu was mid tier in 3s, the roles have reversed. But imo 3s ryu was still better than SFIV ken. He's just so slow, tatsu leaves him open , his target combo is useless/pointless in this game. Overheads have been nerfed, they removed his 3s 'crazy legs' but the forward medium kick is nice. Where the feck is his knee bash etc etc etc. Ryu isnt just rated better then ken in this game due to his ultra set ups, ryu is just better over all.

animaX wrote: »

You know lads, sometimes I get the feeling you dont like me much

What, is it my hair?

rofl:pac:

Azza

Ken has a lot of weakness compared to Ryu.

His fireball game is slower and not as effective.
His light and medium punch shoryuken is slower than Ryu's.
While his shoryuken hit multi pal times you won't score all the hits if you shoryuken an opponent jumping in. Only his ex.shoryuken does better damage than Ryu's.
Less ultra set ups and his shoryuken fadc ultra requires stricter timing than Ryu's one.
His Tatsu's are generally unsafe even when they hit, even his ex version which doesn't knock down.
Target combo can be ducked and leaves him exposed on block.

On the bright side is he still has lots of very damage combos and his kara throw is good.

Solid mid tier character.

Liamario

I have to say Azza that with my style of play (keeping it to the basics) it really doesn't make any difference if I was to choose ryu or ken. Thats not to say I don't know how to play, just that I am just as likely to win with Ken as I am with Ryu

Azza

Thats fine Liamario if your just keeping it to the basics, Ken and Ryu fundamentally play the same anyway. Throw a fireball and then dragon punch the opponent as he jumps in on you.

Not saying you don't know how to play the game, just I don't think you grasp what the subtle difference's are and how they can make a big difference to characters than on paper seem extremely similar. There is a vast amount of depth to Street Fighter and knowing these difference is as important as knowing how to perform a dragon punch.

I fear Ryu much more than Ken and that comes from actual experience not just reading up on theory.

Liamario

Perhaps Azza my fellow westmeathian we should have duel at some point. My PSN ID and Live Gamertag is Liamario. I fear that you have it on the 360 though.
Getting back to what you are saying though. I understand that each character has a different moveset and different combos, but for the vast majority of players this makes little difference.

Owwmykneecap

Ken is the Urien of SFIV

Placebo

not at all, kens handicapped in SFIV, urien was making his way up to top tier, some amazing games of urien. Aegis reflector was genius

K.O.Kiki

Aegis Reflector was broke in a way Dhalsim's Ultra WISHES it was!

Also, Ken < Ryu. I would seriously advise a switch to Ryu, or Akuma.

bush

I say if you like ken stick with him. A really good ken can be hard to fight cos nobody is used to fighting one.
Ryu is so overused it makes the majority of them piss easy to beat cos you know everything he can do. Using low tier characters has its advantages especially as low tier isnt even that bad in this game.

Placebo

everythings broken

Azza

I have SF IV on PS3 Liamario, sent you a friends invite. Hope to play you soon.

Owwmykneecap

Placebo wrote: »

not at all, kens handicapped in SFIV, urien was making his way up to top tier, some amazing games of urien. Aegis reflector was genius

You've missed the point.
Ken plays a lot better online than he does in real life, just like Urien in 3rd strike.

I can't think of anyone else who benefits from small bits of lag as well.

Cunny-Funt

Liamario wrote: »

Perhaps Azza my fellow westmeathian we should have duel at some point. My PSN ID and Live Gamertag is Liamario. I fear that you have it on the 360 though.
Getting back to what you are saying though. I understand that each character has a different moveset and different combos, but for the vast majority of players this makes little difference.

As he already answered he's on the PS3 alright but here you got it on the PC too do you? I have it on both ps3 and pc but I'm generally not arsed wipping out the ps3 anymore.

Don't think this the wrong way, I'm not saying I know what skill level you are or whatever. But I remember the original massive SF4 thread we had going before we got our own section. There was this poster on there who kept insisting he was extremely good at the game (not saying you are) he kept saying things like "All you people saying seth is hard are crazy, he's easy I beat him all the time etc etc" and we'd be all, "do you play online" and he was like "not that often cause its too easy online" and all that ****.

I added him and played the guy one night, now I'm not a fantastic player but I have online experience and I generally just play for fun. I beat him 20 - 0 and I was just messin around I wasnt trying to destroy the guy, he was just a basic flow chart ken. I used my weakest characters. Anyway the guy totally flipped out, and from what I gather never played the game again or posted on here about it. Which sucks as I was just trying to give the guy some ggs, he took offense that I played characters like sakura and dan, I did that to try and give the guy a GG , I didnt wanna pwn the guy, last thing I wanna do is turn people off the game

Theres legions and legions of really bad players online in this game that can give a false sense of how good you are as a player. Also playing bad players hurts your game. Azza is the best bison I've played so far. Before the other day I thought I had gief down, turned out I was just playing **** giefs all this time, dreddys gief had me for breakfast and shat me back out again.

All I'm saying if your insisting Ken is not as bad as people are saying it just comes off like you haven't enough experience to know the differences. If you totally wipe Azza out with your ken, nice work, I look forward to seeing your ken. Just don't ragequit street fighter if Azza beats you like that guy I fought though hehe

(I mean all this in a lighthearted way, not trying to piss you off or judge you )

Liamario

I can assure you Mr Funt I am under no illusions as to my slightly above average abilities. I too play for fun and I am certainly not in the business of trash talking even if I do win. I am pretty good at COD4 though
I don't have a particular character and have no doubt that Azza or any one of you gentlemen (or ladies) will wipe the floor with me.

FoamyMushroom

So who officially does these tier lists?