Republic of Ireland vs. Italy - 10/10/09 **KO 8:00 PM** [mod warning post #160]

orourkeda

noodler wrote: »

Poor examples.

Italy having 10 men for the whole game? Being awarded a penalty against Gerogia for nothing?

Letting Cyprus and Bulgaria walk all over us at home and still not losing?

Playing in Mainz?

Comeback with better comparisons.

They were demonstrations of the luck that the Irish National team have enjoyed on the way to qualification for Major International Tournaments.

Gary McKay scores in Bulgaria against the run of Play against Bulgaria away with little time left. Lucky

Denmark versus Spain a goal either way knocks us out of USA 94. Ireland having just drawn in Belfast. Lucky

The Holland game for WC 2002. A game we should have lost by at least 3 goals. One of the worst refereeing decisions i've ever seen at Lansdowne and we fluked a 1-0 win with 10 men against a team that murdered us.

noodler

CHD wrote: »

HE DOES NOT FIT INTO TRAP'S PLANS. MOVE ON!! WE GET IT, YOU WANT A.REID IN THE SQUAD!

Never ever move on if you think it is wrong.

Awful advice there.

Also, some people question whether or not he should be there, so theres always going to be room for discussion.

IRISHSPORTSGUY

bayviewclose wrote: »

Duff if he is fully fit will always get into starting eleven. Lawrence to be fair showed great graft but graft alone can only get you so far.

Lawrence's set pieces look more threatening IMO. We have a bit of an embarrassment of riches on the wings.

Spiritoftheseventies

noodler wrote: »

Never ever move on if you think it is wrong.

Awful advice there.

Also, some people question whether or not he should be there, so theres always going to be room for discussion.

Yes never settle for second best. People who say Reid wont contribute anything notable to this team are clearly not paying attention.

noodler

orourkeda wrote: »

They were demonstrations of the luck that the Irish National team have enjoyed on the way to qualification for Major International Tournaments.

Gary McKay scores in Bulgaria against the run of Play against Bulgaria away with little time left. Lucky

Denmark versus Spain a goal either way knocks us out of USA 94. Ireland having just drawn in Belfast. Lucky

The Holland game for WC 2002. A game we should have lost by at least 3 goals. One of the worst refereeing decisions i've ever seen at Lansdowne and we fluked a 1-0 win with 10 men against a team that murdered us.

No my friend. My god, where to start?

Favorable results in games we didn't play in are not the definition of lucky.

There just awful examples to compare to the ref incorrectly sending off an Italian 9 minutes into the Bari game or that joke peno decision against Gerogia.

The Muppet

Mc Geady was good tonight though his final ball could have been better at time.

ntlbell

Archimedes wrote: »

Agreed. Lawrence and Duff on the wings. McGeady is perfect for an impact sub.

what sort of impact?

take on two players and fall over the ball?

get to the by line and produce nothing?

never make the right decision?

be awful going back?

never provide a telling pass?

what impact are you referring to?

do tell

ntlbell

el dude wrote: »

Simply not true. Fair enough, you can write off a bad defeat or a poor performance when it's a friendly game, but the confidence a good win or performance can bring, be it a friendly or otherwise shouldn't be underestimated.

Complete nonsense.

So you get 7/8 players playing in a team in a formation they never played before, with preperation they've never had before or will have in the future against a team of 7/8 players who have never played before, never played in the formation/prepapred like that before in SOMETIMES grounds they've both never played before or ever will play in, an atmoshpehere they've never played before with nothing at stake...

then you take the _real_ 11 players who go on to the pitch for a competitive match and they're suppose to take confidence from this?

if they take confidence from above then you probably have FAR bigger problems

Peyton Manning

ntlbell wrote: »

what sort of impact?

take on two players and fall over the ball?

get to the by line and produce nothing?

never make the right decision?

be awful going back?

never provide a telling pass?

what impact are you referring to?

do tell

Im referring to his constant ability to get past defenders, and if he comes on at the end when these defenders are getting tired, then he can force them into fouling him and winning frees/penalties, he can force them to double up on him leaving room for someone else on the team to find space, he can get crosses into the box that tired defenders wont deal with as well as they would when they are fresh and sharp in the first half. But hey, let not get in the way of your sensationalism.

Spiritoftheseventies

Yes anyone who wants to register their support for A Reid tomorrow last day for voting on this thread is tomorrow. Its clearcut at this stage but every vote counts!

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055700931&page=16

IRISHSPORTSGUY

ntlbell wrote: »

what sort of impact?

take on two players and fall over the ball?

get to the by line and produce nothing?

never make the right decision?

be awful going back?

never provide a telling pass?

what impact are you referring to?

do tell

He put in a couple of decent crosses, he was a lot more miss than hit with them. He took pressure off the team at times by running at the opposition, getting into threatening territory and hence easing the pressure. Think I might have Duff in the team over him but he doesn't have the pace to do that. He also drew a few fouls which took the pressure off wave after wave of Italian pressure.

grenache

orourkeda wrote: »

Denmark versus Spain a goal either way knocks us out of USA 94. Ireland having just drawn in Belfast. Lucky

Only a goal for Denmark would have prevented us from qualifying. Spain won the group anyway so had they scored we still would have qualified. My memories of that game was total madness from Zubizaretta when he came charging out of his goal with a two footed attack on Brian Laudrup.

NaiveMelodies

IRISHSPORTSGUY wrote: »

Andrea Pirlo is truely world class. Not going to happen but if we brought Reid into the team for Andrews I'd be a lot more optimistic about the play-offs.

I agree. If we brought a fully fit STEPHEN Reid in for Andrews I'd be even more optmistic.

Look lads, Andy Reid would be an excellent option on the bench but this system, with the midfield 4 working there aboslute bollix off tracking men and leaving as few gaps as possible for the oposition to work with, worked tonight. I dont think, even if Reid was in the squad, Trap would have confidence in him to the job of Whelan or Andrews for the main reason that he has never seen Reid do it before, nor have any of us.

Whatever about luck in other matches, tonight i thought was an excellent performance from an average bunch of players versus an excelent side. Traps subs were spot on and his decision to play lawrence was a brilliant one.

The atmosphere was awesome and I think this may have contributed to our recklessness at the end but hell am I ALOT more confident than i was last week of getting through the playoffs.


I was really intrigued by the row between Given and Trap over St.Ledger. Was Trap thinking about the point, ensuring we were in the top 8 runners-up, or was he thinking about his own record?

Nalz

bUILDERtHEbOB wrote: »

What the hell is going on?

We've just got to the play offs, and gotten a good result against a much better team, and still, still everyone still wants to have a go at the players and the manager.

We're not Brazil, we're not Spain, we are never going to play possession football in the oppositions half, even if we had Andy Reid and Ireland in there, I do wish everyone would get over it.

Also, Peter Collins, ugh.

Great Post. Was at this tonight, McGeady I thought did well. Ye I know he can be frustrating at times and no end product etc, but having looked at this live I noticed there wasnt much to lay it off to. Not an awful lot of moment imo. Lawerence did well, covered well in the second half. I cant fault many of them to be honest. Unlucky not to get the win, but a draw was a fair result.

matrim

IRISHSPORTSGUY wrote: »

He put in a couple of decent crosses, he was a lot more miss than hit with them. He took pressure off the team at times by running at the opposition, getting into threatening territory and hence easing the pressure. Think I might have Duff in the team over him but he doesn't have the pace to do that. He also drew a few fouls which took the pressure off wave after wave of Italian pressure.

I remember 1 half decent cross from him. The rest were pretty awful.

He got into alot of good positions and went past the defender well but his final pass was pretty awful or non existent.

There were alot of opportunities were he was in a great position to pass or cross and he either tried to go past the man again and lost it or played a crap pass \ cross.

I like him as a player but he needs to work on his crossing alot

artanevilla

I thought the only negative tonight was conceding so late on but otherwise positives all the way. The players are starting to get used to Trap's system, great to see him actually run on to the pitch! Our worst player I thought tonight was Shay Given which is saying something. I think of all the managers out there if someone can get us through a two leg tie with anyone is Trap. OH TRAPPATONI, HE USED TO BE ITALIAN BUT HE'S IRISH NOW!

thebman

bayviewclose wrote: »

Yes never settle for second best. People who say Reid wont contribute anything notable to this team are clearly not paying attention.

Trapp obviously feels he doesn't fit the dynamic of the team overall and would disrupt the game he wants the team to play.

I think he'll get a shot in the next match to shut media and fans up and to give him his shot, maybe judging from the reaction in the interview, he just wants it to go away ,,, (I needed more commas).

LuckyLloyd

The sad part is that this constant sniping over Reid from the media is going to piss him off to such an extent that he walks at the conclusion of this campaign. But yay, Reid will surely be selected by whatever second rate management team we bring in to replace him. :rolleyes:

Spiritoftheseventies

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

The sad part is that this constant sniping over Reid from the media is going to piss him off to such an extent that he walks at the conclusion of this campaign. But yay, Reid will surely be selected by whatever second rate management team we bring in to replace him. :rolleyes:

Media have every right to bring up the subject of Reid. They are not sheep. Lets see how well this team does in the play offs without Andy and maybe the World Cup.
I have my doubts but lets see.

ctrl-alt-delete

only1stevo wrote: »

I agree. If we brought a fully fit STEPHEN Reid in for Andrews I'd be even more optmistic.

No such thing as a fully fit Stephen Reid.

pipeliner

was at the game last night and watching pirlo strutting around was worth the admission price alone.

I dont get to many soccer matches and that was the first time i got to see a class act like that live. One little turn and he had all the space in the world. Right enough geeking out, ill let u get back to claiming andy reid is better than he actually is

Spiritoftheseventies

pipeliner wrote: »

was at the game last night and watching pirlo strutting around was worth the admission price alone.

I dont get to many soccer matches and that was the first time i got to see a class act like that live. One little turn and he had all the space in the world. Right enough geeking out, ill let u get back to claiming andy reid is better than he actually is

No need to. Evidence is there for all to see. Reid as Dunphy said ran the show against Man United.
Thats a good enough yard stick for me!

Xavi6

Gotta love the green tinted glasses -

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/1011/breaking4.htm

It was also, one feels, a night when Trapattoni’s Ireland came of age, when those unheralded players he put his faith in throughout an unbeaten campaign so far - not least goalscorers Glenn Whelan and Seán St Ledger - repaid the Italian’s faith.

'Came of age'? If they had of done that then they would have been able to close out a game with three minutes to go and St. Ledger wouldn't have given Gilardino 5 yards of space in the box to score.

And as for this -

The performance is sure to instil belief in the side, fans and media, that a result against another marquee name in world football over two legs is very achievable. .

Yes, I'm sure those marquee names would be shitting themselves if they drew us in the playoffs :rolleyes:

blinding

shamblertine wrote: »

Tonights game had no relevance, Italy would of beaten cyprus at home anyway. 1st place in the group was lost when we drew with montenegro, which was a most win game. I remember saying this exact same thing on here right after the montenegro game and was laughed out of the place, everyone was so happy we got a draw. Its lonely being right all the time.

You are right with pretty much all you say above.

Normally though its people who think they are right all the time that are lonely:D

killwill

ntlbell wrote: »

this is a really easy thing to understand.

you pointed out everything that makes friendlies relevant.

the one thing you didn't point out was the result of the game.

if you played football at any level you will understand why the result of friendlies have absolutely _no_ baring/relevance on anything really.

pace of the game, opposition's preparation to the game, their concentration levels their tactics, their team, subs made there is so much out of your own control.

then as a team you probably have never played together before and everything about the game will be nothing like to a game that actually means something

so there for the result of them games are irrelevant. of course it's nice to win they _might_ add to the confidence or an "oar" around the team but at the end of the day it means nothing

I have played soccer, not at any amazing level but did play , I stopped playing to play national league bball. Results are only irrelevant because it has no bearing on table positions for WC or EC. In any sport you play to win. If you are not winning it does hit your confidence, noone can deny that. That makes the result pretty significant.

Bounty Hunter

odds are we will have gone through this entire qualifying campaign unbeaten and although we perhaps have not won enough games for many I think almost everyone would be happy with what we have now achieved in this campaign going back to when the draw was made for this group. The seeded playoffs will be tough but make no mistakes the big teams would like to avoid us also as we are so hard to beat (it seems)... The new greece maybe? though with less 1-0s

Kev_ps3

A 2-2 draw with our poor squad is a great result. Its just such a pity we couldnt close the match out:(

Aidric

shamblertine wrote: »

Tonights game had no relevance, Italy would of beaten cyprus at home anyway.

You are right. However, it would have done wonders for the teams confidence to have held out for a win against a team of Italy's stature. As it is there are still going to be doubts in the players head's, doubts we can ill afford against the top teams.

pipeliner

was at the game last night and watching pirlo strutting around was worth the admission price alone.

I dont get to many soccer matches and that was the first time i got to see a class act like that live. One little turn and he had all the space in the world. Right enough geeking out, ill let u get back to claiming andy reid is better than he actually is

MagicMarker

pipeliner wrote: »

was at the game last night and watching pirlo strutting around was worth the admission price alone.

I dont get to many soccer matches and that was the first time i got to see a class act like that live. One little turn and he had all the space in the world. Right enough geeking out, ill let u get back to claiming andy reid is better than he actually is

You realise you posted this exact post almost 2 hours ago?

Bounty Hunter

pipeliner wrote: »

was at the game last night and watching pirlo strutting around was worth the admission price alone.

I dont get to many soccer matches and that was the first time i got to see a class act like that live. One little turn and he had all the space in the world. Right enough geeking out, ill let u get back to claiming andy reid is better than he actually is

um didnt you type that exact thing an hour and a half ago

Aidric wrote:

You are right. However, it would have done wonders for the teams confidence to have held out for a win against a team of Italy's stature. As it is there are still going to be doubts in the players head's, doubts we can ill afford against the top teams.

Why exactely will there be doubts again? we have just come through our group unbeaten (once Montenegro dont surprise us) including two games against Italy. This team should already have confidence and belief in themselves especially with one of the most succesfull managers ever backing them up.

LuckyLloyd

bayviewclose wrote: »

Media have every right to bring up the subject of Reid. They are not sheep. Lets see how well this team does in the play offs without Andy and maybe the World Cup.
I have my doubts but lets see.

LOL

Ah yeah, your argument will be "proven" if we fail to advance from the playoffs as significant underdogs. Wow.

Aidric

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Why exactely will there be doubts again?

Doubts about holding on to a lead.

Unearthly

Wonder does Andy Reid know that over in Ireland he is seen as a football god who is the key to winning the world cup by many people.

Nalz

By the way we need some new songs regardless of whether we qualify or not. "Stand up for the boys in green" me hole!

Krusader

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Why exactely will there be doubts again? we have just come through our group unbeaten (once Montenegro dont surprise us) including two games against Italy. This team should already have confidence and belief in themselves especially with one of the most succesfull managers ever backing them up.

There should be plenty of belief in the team
We started as 3rd seeds and have made the play-offs,
Everybody would of took this at the start of the campaign
Its just a pity last night was a draw, it would of given the
Montenegro game some purpose and hype.

BTW is Glenn Whelan out for Wednesday?

LuckyLloyd

Was extremely proud of the effort last night. Yet again this team toiled away, produced more than the sum of their parts and found a way to get a goal in the dying minutes. To concede an equalizer was sloppy, and extremely frustrating. But on the whole I had no complaints as a fan.

O' Shea was magnificent, and it was a shame that his great performance was marred somewhat at the clinch. McGeady is a very annoying player no doubt, but he definitely makes up for the times he wastes possession by the times he makes stuff happen from nothing. He is far from the finished article (and will probably never round the edges in his game) but he is certainly game. Lawrence did well enough, Doyle and Keane worked tirelessly all night, Given and the rest of the back four held their own. Whelan and Andrews were again second best, but they made more of a fist of it than during previous games. Whelan's goal was obviously magnificent, and their opposite numbers were obviously very good.

Here's the thing:

When the groups were drawn, we were legitimately placed as third favourites in the group, and we would have snapped the hand of anyone offering us a playoff place in lieu of actually playing the group out. There should be an air of celebration around the place over the coming days. We have an extremely limited crop of players, and when the biggest selection bugbear is Andy Reid people should be acutely aware that this is probably the worst Irish team since the late seventies.

The silver lining from last night is that it readjusts the psychological focus of the players starting from today. If we had of held on last night, there would have been a certain level of expectation most likely dashed on Wednesday, and a sense of letdown before the playoffs began. As it is, everyone knows they will have to play over two legs, and play a team better than us. It will take a mammoth effort, and a dollop of luck, but I would expect this team to bring whoever it is down to the last 20 minutes with the tie in the balance.

Good enough for me.

That_Guy

As disappointed as I was to not have actually won the match last night, the lads deserve all the praise they deserve for last nights performance.

As dodgy as some of our performances have been throughout this campaign, twice we have shown the world champions what we are truly made of.

We took the lead twice and created a lot of chances and defended relatively well bar the end.

To play the world champions off the pitch for a lot of the game is a positive sign that this Irish team can achieve great things in the near future.

Spiritoftheseventies

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Was extremely proud of the effort last night. Yet again this team toiled away, produced more than the sum of their parts and found a way to get a goal in the dying minutes. To concede an equalizer was sloppy, and extremely frustrating. But on the whole I had no complaints as a fan.

O' Shea was magnificent, and it was a shame that his great performance was marred somewhat at the clinch. McGeady is a very annoying player no doubt, but he definitely makes up for the times he wastes possession by the times he makes stuff happen from nothing. He is far from the finished article (and will probably never round the edges in his game) but he is certainly game. Lawrence did well enough, Doyle and Keane worked tirelessly all night, Given and the rest of the back four held their own. Whelan and Andrews were again second best, but they made more of a fist of it than during previous games. Whelan's goal was obviously magnificent, and their opposite numbers were obviously very good.

Here's the thing:

When the groups were drawn, we were legitimately placed as third favourites in the group, and we would have snapped the hand of anyone offering us a playoff place in lieu of actually playing the group out. There should be an air of celebration around the place over the coming days. We have an extremely limited crop of players, and when the biggest selection bugbear is Andy Reid people should be acutely aware that this is probably the worst Irish team since the late seventies.

The silver lining from last night is that it readjusts the psychological focus of the players starting from today. If we had of held on last night, there would have been a certain level of expectation most likely dashed on Wednesday, and a sense of letdown before the playoffs began. As it is, everyone knows they will have to play over two legs, and play a team better than us. It will take a mammoth effort, and a dollop of luck, but I would expect this team to bring whoever it is down to the last 20 minutes with the tie in the balance.

Good enough for me.

I am aghast at some peoples logic. Regardless of whether it is worst team of seventies, we have a much better chance of winning play offs with Andy Reid in it.
Put simply it is not enough to keep pumping one ball after another into the box when nine times out of ten they dont find the target.
Reids experience and composure on the ball combined with a killer pass is crucial for us. I dont think it matters if we are in contention with twenty minutes to go. Wont make a difference if we dont win.
Hard decisions have to be made now. Giles Dunphy and Sounness all agree Reid should be in that team.
Thats good enough for me.

Daysha

Interesting Italian take on the match, via Gazetto dello Sport.

DUBLIN (Ireland), 10 October 2009 - Mission accomplished. Italy drew 2-2 in Ireland thanks to a goal from Gilardino in the final minute and earned the ticket to South Africa, where they will have to defend their title in the 2010 World Cup. Perhaps now, it's not important if they suffered in Dublin against a very brave Irish side that flew off the blocks with the support of 80,000 fans at Croke Park. As a result, all is now reset to zero. A few friendly matches—a luxury, perhaps—will give them more confidence. Lippi will have time to give the team a few touches, maybe bring in some new additions to the group; and of course, the psychological and physical form of the Azzurri will be very important when they get to South Africa.

HARDSHIPS However, today's match in Dublin was neither a display of the good game shown against Bulgaria nor a display proper of a great squad. The first time was dull, saved by Camoranesi's goal in response to Whelan's opener. The second half was more engaged, even if it wasn't still convincing. Only Gilardino's goal in the final minute prevented the Azzurri from having to put all their hope in the match against a lifesaving Cyprus after St. Ledger had scored the second goal for the Irish. Trapattoni can feel relieved even after the shock of the final minute because although Italy finished first in Group 8, Ireland are now second and go to the playoff thanks to Bulgaria's loss to Cyprus. Trap repeated the draw of the first leg match (1-1 in Bari) and took two points from the Azzurri with a squad that is inferior in quality.

IRELAND, SUPER START Trap's Green lads flew off the starting blocks. Boosted by the incandescent ambience at Croke Park and encouraged by the doubts of a shy Italian side that looked more like a debutante than the reigning world champions. Ireland dominated the first 20 minutes, with a high, physical and football-wise wicked team. They played the wings, with McGeady loose on the left, and relied in midfield on Whelan, who found ball after ball like a very energetic ball boy. The goal was unavoidable and a spontaneous consequence of the game displayed. It was favoured by a "snooze" from the Azzurro defence that hadn't let in a goal for the last three matches. The hosts' opener came from a free-kick, a corner of sorts sent in from the right, deflected out of the area for Whelan who unperturbed, had the time to aim and then put a crossed right-kick past Buffon, whose view was blocked in the centre of the area.

ITALY'S EQUALISER The next 5 minutes belonged to the Azzurri, who got angry, stopped letting the hosts take control and reacted. 25 minutes into the game, the Azzurri made their way to the net, with a brilliant volley from Grosso that was too centred to surprise Given. It was a wake-up call. One minute later Camoranesi scored the equaliser with a header to finish in Pirlo's corner-kick. It was 1-1. Ireland did not lose faith and continued to push. Italy suffered and fell victim of mysterious fears. However, apart from many scuffles, they did not give up much. The Irish dominated the match, attacked generously and the flurries imagined the night before came true; however, the Irish did not manage well in the area and Chiellini often put his athletic superpowers to work, standing out indeed because his opponents were putting in some muscle work. It was 1-1 at the half.

AN ILLUSION 1-2 Italy took the lead soon after the start of the second half. Chiellini's header made its way to the net but the goal was cancelled due to Iaquinta's offside (in front of Given). This gave the Italians wings and it was about time. They took advantage of the inevitable tiredness of their opponents and began to enjoy Iaquinta's dynamism, galloping into open spaces and sending the ball deep for his team-mates. The match was now even; Ireland had nothing to lose and insisted, pushing hard, but the Italians were more determined now.

BLOW AND RESPONSE The excitement came in the final minutes. St. Ledger scored from a header with just a handful of minutes left in the match. The stadium became a party and seemed to collapse over the Azzurri who instead showed pride and character... one more time. A little bit of good luck didn't hurt either. In the final minute, Gilardino—who had come onto the pitch for Di Natale—hit it in, giving Italy a draw and a ticket to South Africa.

IRISHSPORTSGUY

Thought Whelan did well in the first 20, actually closing down the Italians and getting in tackles. However he faded. I was tearing my hair out at times as the Italians were just walking and passing whilst stood off them yards away. A lot better than Andrews though. Can't say I noticed Rowlands much when he came on.

Does anyone else think with the 'system' we might be better off dropping Doyle for Best? Doyle is the better player but I think Best would suit our style more.

LuckyLloyd

bayviewclose wrote: »

I am aghast at some peoples logic. Regardless of whether it is worst team of seventies, we have a much better chance of winning play offs with Andy Reid in it.
Put simply it is not enough to keep pumping one ball after another into the box when nine times out of ten they dont find the target.
Reids experience and composure on the ball combined with a killer pass is crucial for us. I dont think it matters if we are in contention with twenty minutes to go. Wont make a difference if we dont win.
Hard decisions have to be made now. Giles Dunphy and Sounness all agree Reid should be in that team.
Thats good enough for me.

LOL

There is a minority who disagree with all of the above (and the minority crucially includes the coach). As I have said all along, the key thing for this Irish team is their sense of togetherness and their ability to play to a specific system. At this stage, Reid coming in to start would only upset the apple cart psychologically (as a player coming in from out of the squad would irritate players in any team at any level). Reid is simply not good enough talent wise to override any regression in the above areas. He would amount to a slight upgrade in terms of offensive capability (a slight downgrade in defensive bite fwiw), but a probable downgrade in terms of team work and togetherness. So I don't want him in right now.

Ireland will most likely lose their playoff. But I genuinely believe that we are best served by the players in the current squad. They have earned their way here, they are unbeaten in 9 competitive games. Leave them as they are and get behind them and their coach.

Bandit12

Amazing performance from the lads last night. When you consider most of our players are championship material it is unbelievable what trap has done with them. If ever a manager deserved the new contract it's this guy. Fair play.:)

LuckyLloyd

Daysha wrote: »

Interesting Italian take on the match, via Gazetto dello Sport.

They seem complimentary enough with respect to our performance. I wouldn't agree with them that we "Irish dominated the match", but it is interesting to see that different perspective on things.

LuckyLloyd

IRISHSPORTSGUY wrote: »

Does anyone else think with the 'system' we might be better off dropping Doyle for Best? Doyle is the better player but I think Best would suit our style more.

I would tend to stick with Doyle tbh. I think he does a lot of good work during the first 50 minutes or so of games. Remember that it is always harder out there against fresh defenders. I think himself and Keane have a good understanding, and utilizing the more physical Best / Folan as a change-up during second halves is the most effective overall method of managing the resources available.

Spiritoftheseventies

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

LOL

There is a minority who disagree with all of the above (and the minority crucially includes the coach). As I have said all along, the key thing for this Irish team is their sense of togetherness and their ability to play to a specific system. At this stage, Reid coming in to start would only upset the apple cart psychologically (as a player coming in from out of the squad would irritate players in any team at any level). Reid is simply not good enough talent wise to override any regression in the above areas. He would amount to a slight upgrade in terms of offensive capability (a slight downgrade in defensive bite fwiw), but a probable downgrade in terms of team work and togetherness. So I don't want him in right now.

Ireland will most likely lose their playoff. But I genuinely believe that we are best served by the players in the current squad. They have earned their way here, they are unbeaten in 9 competitive games. Leave them as they are and get behind them and their coach.

Re This argument pf playing players on basis of a system. Thats all fine if its working. But Traps huff and puff game will only take us so far.
The better teams can cope with McGeady and Hunt and Lawrence who in fairness are never lacking in effort.
But if that route is closed down, Reid can unlock defenses better. And there is also Fahey to considered as he has played a similar role for Pats and Birmingham.

Krusader

Yeah defo stick with Doyle, he's a work horse up front and I would say more likely to score you a goal then Best/Folan at international level

Spiritoftheseventies

Crosáidí wrote: »

Yeah defo stick with Doyle, he's a work horse up front and I would say more likely to score you a goal then Best/Folan at international level

Doyle Keane are regular strike force. Absolutely no need to change that. Folan gives us a bit if you are playing the long ball route but Doyle gives us a lot more.

Villain

Andy Reid can't play in the middle of the park in a Trap team, he wouldn't suit the style, the only place I could have seen Reid playing was on the wing and Lawerence was one of best players last night and I'm not sure Reid would haven't offered much more going forward and he certianly wouldn't haven't offered as much in defending.

Talking about a player that the Manager doesn't include in the squad after such a good performance imo is a bit of a waste, I certainly want Reid in the Squad and think he would be a great option for the playoff if we need someone to come on a create something buy you can't fault Trap so far.

Krusader

bayviewclose wrote: »

Doyle Keane are regular strike force. Absolutely no need to change that. Folan gives us a bit if you are playing the long ball route but Doyle gives us a lot more.

thats what i just said