Need advice on tenant squatting in my home

landlordinafix

Id like to hear if anyones got some ideas:

I am a landlord and I am owed 4 months rent. Ive already been to adjudication with the PRTB who were a waste of time - they told me I should leave the tenant there and hope he leaves at the end of his lease. I was informed that they do not have the resources to chase the rent owed.
The lease is up very soon and the tenant will do either 2 things. Stay beyond the agreed lease term or disappear owing me thousands..

How do I get the money owed to me? Also if he stays after the lease expires does he still have the right to continue living there?

kmick

I dont think you have any hope of getting your back rent no matter which way it goes. It is also foolish to assume he will leave at the end of his/her lease. Why would s/he? If it were me I would shadow the place until they leave and change the locks. However that would be highly illegal and I would not suggest that to you.

The_Conductor

I take it you have served proper eviction notice on the tenant at this point in time (regardless of whether their lease is up or not)? If not- do so immediately- following the directions in the 2004 Residential Tenancies Act- to the letter of the law.

S.

hobochris

kmick wrote: »

I dont think you have any hope of getting your back rent no matter which way it goes. It is also foolish to assume he will leave at the end of his/her lease. Why would s/he? If it were me I would shadow the place until they leave and change the locks. However that would be highly illegal and I would not suggest that to you.

I assume it is legal providing eviction notice has been served.

landlordinafix

Thats my problem - how do I get rid of this tenant and at the same time not break the law by illegally evicting them by changing the locks?

I am considering moving in to the house on the day the lease expires stating that I am not evicting them and that they are wecome to stay. Then make life difficult by playing loud music etc. - does this constitute an eviction or harrassment? How will the PRTB view this? If they stay longer than the 6 month lease they have a lot of extra rights as tenants and I cant let that happen..

The PRTB are all about protecting the tenant it seems to me.

landlordinafix

If I serve a valid eviction notice he will ignore it - he did the last time. then you have to wait 3 or 4 months for an adjudication. even if the PRTB found in my favour he can appeal it dragging it on for another few months. He can also appeal the appeal (if you understand) and it would be referred to a tribunal. He could buy himself another year or rent free accomodation if I go through the PRTB!!

The_Conductor

landlordinafix wrote: »

If I serve a valid eviction notice he will ignore it - he did the last time. then you have to wait 3 or 4 months for an adjudication. even if the PRTB found in my favour he can appeal it dragging it on for another few months. He can also appeal the appeal (if you understand) and it would be referred to a tribunal. He could buy himself another year or rent free accomodation if I go through the PRTB!!

Unfortunately legally this is what you have to do. If you've already served legal eviction notice- immediately commence adjudication- you need to do this. My sister had freeloaders in her apartment for almost 9 months without paying...... You are correct that the law is there to protect the tenant, not the landlord- the pendelum has really swung way too far the other way. There should be equal cognisance given to both tenants and landlords- unfortunately this is not the case.......

landlordinafix

But will adjudication ensure I get what is owed to me? I doubt it very much. What about debt collection agencies, Im wondering if thats the answer...

The_Conductor

landlordinafix wrote: »

But will adjudication ensure I get what is owed to me? I doubt it very much. What about debt collection agencies, Im wondering if thats the answer...

No it won't ensure you get the money that is rightfully yours. It will however ensure that you have followed the letter of the law- and your tenant will not be able to claim unlawful eviction (there have been a few cases where tenants who haven't paid rent in months or even in one case over 2 years- where the tenant has actually been awarded considerable sums of money (there are even 2 cases discussed in this forum)).

Follow the procedure- or risk having an award made against you- despite the tenant not having paid rent and being antisocial in the extreme.......

MCMT

landlordinafix wrote: »

But will adjudication ensure I get what is owed to me? I doubt it very much. What about debt collection agencies, Im wondering if thats the answer...

You need to do as others have suggested here and follow the letter of the law.

Either deliver in person or send by registered post a proper notice of eviction as laid out by the Residential Tenancies Act 04.

Don't attempt anything illegal - if the PRTB even catch a whiff of this you'll likely be the one paying.

In the meantime you might consider having a solicitor send a letter on your behalf. It is clear that you tenant is not afraid of you, but they may not like the idea of being hounded by a solicitor. It could very well be worth the money.

As for recouping your costs, I wouldn't bank on it. The best you can do is follow the law, put everything in writing, gather as much evidence as you can and prepare to present it all to the PRTB.

It's not fair but your main focus right now should be to ensure that they don't attempt a long term squat. Otherwise you'll be making no money off the place.

Also: try irishlandlord.ie for more advice.

Best of luck.

antoinolachtnai

You need to get a solicitor, and quickly. You may need to appeal the tribunal finding.

the_syco

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if he was to move a family member back into the house, the landlord could give the tenant 30 days notice, and then move the family member in?

Also, would it be any point talking to the local social welfare office, in case the tenant is claiming some sort of money for the rent, and get it stopped, as you are no longer recieving it?

rcdk1

hmmm.... just deleted 3 paragraphs of text... don't want to get done for incitement!

Victor

landlordinafix wrote: »

Need advice on tenant squatting in my home

If its your home, that is you are living there, this person is not a tenant, but a lodger. You merely have to give them reasonable notice. The PRTB won't get involved.

If you don't live there, it is not your home.

Ima lurker

In the same position as OP, tenants rent arrears in thousands, notice given according to PRTB etc, tenants driving new car, on rent allowance! Is there any option to legally seize their car in lieu of rent? Great to see a post from someone in similar situation and reading with interest the replies

bSlick

Tell the ESB to cut the supply of electricity to YOUR house and that they are not to enable it without your permission.

empirix

bSlick wrote: »

Tell the ESB to cut the supply of electricity to YOUR house and that they are not to enable it without your permission.

good call and the gas and then go round and give your tenant a few slaps!

bSlick

Can't see what's wrong with the idea. There may be a law that you can't just turf someone out on the street but there is no law that you have to provide them with electricity (or gas). And even if there was I doubt someone who owes thousands in rent arrears wants to be standing in a courthouse.

Palmy

If the tenant is on rent allowance contact your nearest office and explan that your tenat is recieving rent allowance for your property,but you have not recieved any rent.

the_syco

bSlick wrote: »

And even if there was I doubt someone who owes thousands in rent arrears wants to be standing in a courthouse.

Unless they're the ones who brought you there, claiming thousands of euro for the inconvience.

ztoical

bSlick wrote: »

there is no law that you have to provide them with electricity (or gas).

If they fall and break a bone due to not having lights then your ass is getting sued.

Millie

Jesus the country is gone to the dogs.
It appears to me that the more honest and law abiding you are the least protection is given to you.

bSlick

the_syco wrote: »

Unless they're the ones who brought you there, claiming thousands of euro for the inconvience.

There's no way someone squatting in your house is gonna want to take you to court over cutting the electricity. The first thing that will be asked in court is "why was the electricity cut" - "because the tenants owe me thousands of pounds in rent and plan to continue breaking the lease by not paying any rent in future. I have no problem re-enabling the electricity if they pay me what they legally owe me." There is no way a squatter will put themselves in that situation.

They'll be gone in a few days if you cut the electricity.

If they fall and break a bone due to not having lights then your ass is getting sued.

There is no legal obligation to provide electricity. The only legal obligation is that you don't throw them out on the street.

The_Conductor

bSlick wrote: »

There is no legal obligation to provide electricity. The only legal obligation is that you don't throw them out on the street.

There is a legal obligation that all rental property be of a habitable standard (totally aside from whether the tenant has paid their rent or not). Cut off the electricity- and it is no longer habitable- and the tenant can lodge a complaint with the council- who can fine the owner. Its harsh- incredibly harsh. Its also incredible that landlords have so few rights. Landlords are being milked by a few tenants who are totally abusing the situation.

20goto10

landlordinafix wrote: »

Id like to hear if anyones got some ideas:

I am a landlord and I am owed 4 months rent. Ive already been to adjudication with the PRTB who were a waste of time - they told me I should leave the tenant there and hope he leaves at the end of his lease. I was informed that they do not have the resources to chase the rent owed.
The lease is up very soon and the tenant will do either 2 things. Stay beyond the agreed lease term or disappear owing me thousands..

How do I get the money owed to me? Also if he stays after the lease expires does he still have the right to continue living there?

Change the locks. I mean whats he going to do about it? The fcuker has been squatting in your house for 4 months.

bSlick

smccarrick wrote: »

There is a legal obligation that all rental property be of a habitable standard (totally aside from whether the tenant has paid their rent or not). Cut off the electricity- and it is no longer habitable- and the tenant can lodge a complaint with the council- who can fine the owner. Its harsh- incredibly harsh. Its also incredible that landlords have so few rights. Landlords are being milked by a few tenants who are totally abusing the situation.

Ok fair enough if thats the case, I suppose electricity does constitute habitable. But I still don't see a tenant who has been acting illegally in breaking a lease and who owes thousands in rent, wanting to bring official attention unto themselves. Even if by some small chance they did plan to do that, they would still find themselves living in a house without any electricity while the issue gets sorted, which they know could take weeks/months. No member of a modern society could put up with no electricity for more than a few days.

By far the most likely course of action is that they will just move out and try and find some place to live rent free without the hassle.

D3PO

bSlick wrote: »

There is no legal obligation to provide electricity. The only legal obligation is that you don't throw them out on the street.

not exactly true. Cutting off utitilities falls under an illegal eviction. So bording up windows, cutting off utilities, threatening or harrasing behaviour will have you done for an illegal eviction

theres legal precedent to this. So hilst there is no law saying specifically you must provide utitlies there are legal precednts that say if you cut them off you are processing an illegal eviction

D3PO

20goto10 wrote: »

Change the locks. I mean whats he going to do about it? The fcuker has been squatting in your house for 4 months.

all he has to do is go to his solicitor and voila due course will take palce and he will owe probably in excess of 20k to the squatter for illegally evicting him.

so thats what hes gonna do. Now think to yourself is it worth it ?

loyatemu

D3PO wrote: »

all he has to do is go to his solicitor and voila due course will take palce and he will owe probably in excess of 20k to the squatter for illegally evicting him.

so thats what hes gonna do. Now think to yourself is it worth it ?

and what if the tenant owes the landlord 20k in unpaid rent? call it evens? pay the tenant the 20K then send the Monk to collect the unpaid rent?

20goto10

D3PO wrote: »

all he has to do is go to his solicitor and voila due course will take palce and he will owe probably in excess of 20k to the squatter for illegally evicting him.

so thats what hes gonna do. Now think to yourself is it worth it ?

Yes it is worth it. There is somebody squatting in his house. Its well worth it. There's lots of ways around the legalities of it if you're really worried about it. Do you really think the type of person who squats is the type of person to go running to a solicitor when the locks are changed? If you're worried about it I would write a letter, registered post, stating that you are moving back into the house and give him the proper notice. Turn up at the door with your suitcase and let yourself in. If he's there tell him to get the fcuk out and if he doesn't then call the guards. In the meantime, change the locks and don't give him a key. Can anyone make you give him a key? I don't think so.

I've never heard such nonsense in my life. Someone can squat in your house and there's nothing you can do about it. Utter nonsense. Kick the fcuker out, ignore any solicitors letters, end of story.

20goto10

I would also advise you to bring a few friends to "help you move in". you know, the type that are good at lifting heavy furniture.