2012 return of the hidden planet?

King Mob

Captain Furball wrote: »

I am following my gut,it usually serves me pretty well.
Are you questioning my gut?

Yes I am questioning your gut because there is nothing to support your gut feeling.
And gut feeling can be wrong.

The idea that the Indians are covering up something on the moon is a pretty extraordinary claim.

You're going to need a bit more evidence than "I really really believe it" before you convince anyone.

But it's clear that you don't actually want to discuss your claim anymore or actually answer any of my questions.

ardinn

BEST THREAD EVER - I CANNOT STOP LAUGHING!

Captain Furball

Only time will tell if i'm correct.

me_right_one

I dunno. I've been freaked out lately, I keep dreamimg about aliens coming, or getting ready to come. I think something big will be revealed about space soon

Esel

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Well its was a 50/50 guess if theres water on the moon, its either yes or no. And when will these other results be made public? It wouldnt be after the results from the LCROSS mission are known would it?

Based on this, I'm going to go out on a limb and state that there is no Planet X (or whatever) in our solar system. If I'm wrong, sue me. (I'm stockpiling those aluminium Chinese takeaway trays just in case.) :pac:

Mahatma coat

Edit : Added by bonkey:

Before anyone responds to this post, read what I've written in the post immediately following.

Its very simple...respond to this post, and you will receive at least the same treatment that MC did for it.

The same will apply for anyone thanking this post.

King Mob wrote: »

So I can take it you have no interest in actually discussing your claim?

on a point of Order,

Many posters here wish to discuss their theories


JUST NOT WITH YOU.

a lot of us were interested in this discussion, and are genuinley interested infigurin out what this 2012 stuff is about, a know what might Planet X be, could the poles shift what would happen if this predicted solar alignment happens, interestin stuff to lot of people here.

but instead we have to deal with your Sh1te,

GET OVER YOURSELF


you are not contributing to the Forum

YOU ARE A TROLL.

there I've said it

bonkey

Mahatma coat wrote: »

there I've said it

And I've banned you for a month for it.

Anyone else who feels the need to respond to your post or my moderation will join you.
Anyone who feels that thanking you for your post is an appropriate response will join you.

espinolman

<edited by bonkey - banned, as warned>

MeatProduct

King Mob wrote: »

Really? When was the last time we had instantaneous world wide communication?
Or nuclear weapons?

King Mob, I appreciate your extensive reply. I'm going to deal with the maths as that is core to everythin else I have written.

The raduis of a hydrogen Atom is
R = r0A^1 / 3
where:

A = Atomic mass number [number of protons (Z) plus number of neutrons (N)] = 1 + 0 = 1 (in a hydrogen atom)

r0 = 1.25 x 10^-15 meters

R = (1.25 x 10^-15) (1)^1/3 = 4.16666667 × 10^-16 m

The planck length times phi = 1.616252×10^−35 x 1.61803399 =

2.61515067240548 x 10^-35m

Now my maths ain't great but 2.61515067240548 x 10^-35m don't equal 4.16666667 × 10^-16 m.
They're a couple of orders of magnitude off.

I could have been clearer and it is very understandable that your calculations are way off because they are way wrong. My fault, not yours.

Planck Length (1.616252 x 10^-35 meter) x Golden Ratio (1.618033989) ^ 116 power = .282537 Angstrom -The First Radii of Hydrogen (below)

Planck Length (1.616252 x 10^-35 meter) x Golden Ratio (1.618033989) ^ 117 power = .457154 Angstrom -The Second Radii of Hydrogen

Planck Length (1.616252 x 10^-35 meter) x Golden Ratio (1.618033989) ^ 118 power = .739691 Angstrom -The Third Radii of Hydrogen

Hydrogen radii measurements (Dr. Rajalakshmi Heyrovska , Academy of Sciences of the Czech Republic, Czech Republic) .28 Angstrom, .46 Angstrom, .74 Angstrom. (1 Angstrom = 10 ^-10 meter)

Which planetary periods?
Are you talking about their orbits?

The orbital period of the Earth and Venus years can be expressed as whole number multiples of plank time multiplied by Phi (as with Hydrogen). This means that fractality in time is a regulator of our solar system.

Not really because the golden ratio is a perfect example of selection bias. You may hear of the all the things that fall close to the golden ratio but never about the things that don't.

Well I believe we are in a time where we can now measure these things. I've been studying sacred geometry for almost 10 years now and there is always new information coming out. From proofs that the golden spiral causes gravity to it's application to stock market behavior.

Given that it is at the root of the very building blocks of creation, to say that there are many things that do not stem from it becomes a mute point.

That's a bit of a leap there.
How does phi mean the universe is fractal?

I think I've shown that already. Forgive me if I have made too many assumptions, I can fill in the blanks if you like.

In fact Pi occurs much more often and is a much more important concept than phi is.

Fair enough but that's more a belief than fact, how you can state that as fact I would be interested to know. Pi is certainly an important ratio but is utterly insignificant in importance when compared to phi.

But one number does not a fractal make.

Well actually yes, it does. Perhaps you don't fully understand phi. Phi is only perfectly implosive means of information compression in the physical universe, hence its extensive usage.

But the Mayans never saw the Europeans coming, or made any prediction for anything in fact.
Can you provide a single example of anything any ancient culture accurately predicted?

I am talking in terms of cycles, like in the stock market. It does not predict specifics but trends.

I think, like the actual researchers in Mayan history and the surviving Mayans themselves, that the calendar does not predict the end of the world.

I agree.

The whole 2012 world ending thing is a modern invention.

Pretty much.

The Mayans (or any other ancient civilization) never said anything about a planet X destroying us.

I have read some research that Planet X is actually Venus, was quite riviting at the time but do not recall where I read it.

Hence, it is all nonsense.

That's a bit excessive. It's obvious that you disagree but I don't think there is a need to call it nonsense.

Given that you have an inquiring and scientific mind I think you see the importance of the above equation for hydrogen. It's truely revoloutionary for science.

Nick

Edit: Typeo

MeatProduct

baza1976 wrote: »

Can somone send me a link to translate the above...... pain in head have i

Hi Baza,

Can you tell me which bits you are having difficulty with?

Basically, there is an underlying pattern to the universe. A certain number (ratio) keeps appearing. From the very large to the very small. I have a webiste that explains some of this with pictures and the like but it is perhaps not appropriate for me to post it here.

Just let me know if there is anything you would like clarification on. In terms of pure maths it vindicates prediction of time cycles which can give us more understanding as to how the implications for 2012 were arrived at.

Nick

baza1976

MeatProduct wrote: »

Hi Baza,

Can you tell me which bits you are having difficulty with?

Basically, there is an underlying pattern to the universe. A certain number (ratio) keeps appearing. From the very large to the very small. I have a webiste that explains some of this with pictures and the like but it is perhaps not appropriate for me to post it here.

Just let me know if there is anything you would like clarification on. In terms of pure maths it vindicates prediction of time cycles which can give us more understanding as to how the implications for 2012 were arrived at.

Nick

Hi Nick
your previous post cleared everything up for me. I don'tknow what I was thinking earlier. thanks for taking the time out explain in even more detail.

Regards

B

MeatProduct

PirateShampoo wrote: »

They ran out of space on their brick wall.

One of the benefits of a cyclical calendar is that it takes up less space than a linear calendar. What you said would be more relevant to our own calendar.

Nick

King Mob

MeatProduct wrote: »

I could have been clearer and it is very understandable that your calculations are way off because they are way wrong. My fault, not yours.

Planck Length (1.616252 x 10^-35 meter) x Golden Ratio (1.618033989) ^ 116 power = .282537 Angstrom -The First Radii of Hydrogen (below)

Planck Length (1.616252 x 10^-35 meter) x Golden Ratio (1.618033989) ^ 117 power = .457154 Angstrom -The Second Radii of Hydrogen

Planck Length (1.616252 x 10^-35 meter) x Golden Ratio (1.618033989) ^ 118 power = .739691 Angstrom -The Third Radii of Hydrogen

Unfortunately you need to be clearer still.
What are these radii you are talking about?
Radius of the nucleus?
Radius of the orbit of the electron?
Length of a hydrogen bond?
Cause none of those correspond with those numbers you gave.

A google search shows that the only reference to these numbers is this same copy pasted article.
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/hearttuner/message/257

And why to the power of 116 and up? seems a bit arbitrary.

MeatProduct wrote: »

Hydrogen radii measurements (Dr. Rajalakshmi Heyrovska , Academy of Sciences of the Czech Republic, Czech Republic) .28 Angstrom, .46 Angstrom, .74 Angstrom. (1 Angstrom = 10 ^-10 meter)

Again the only mention of this person is the copy pasted article you took it from.
Even a search of Academy of Sciences of the Czech Republic website gives no results.

MeatProduct wrote: »

The orbital period of the Earth and Venus years can be expressed as whole number multiples of plank time multiplied by Phi (as with Hydrogen). This means that fractality in time is a regulator of our solar system.

And can you show the math to this?

You realise with enough mathematical gymnastics you can make any number appear to be related to any other number you want?
This is even easier with huge numbers like a year expressed in Planck time.
5.850227064 x 10^50 planck times.

MeatProduct wrote: »

Well I believe we are in a time where we can now measure these things. I've been studying sacred geometry for almost 10 years now and there is always new information coming out. From proofs that the golden spiral causes gravity to it's application to stock market behavior.

And you really should familiarise yourself with the concept of selection bias.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias

Also the law of fives:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discordianism#Law_of_Fives

"I find the Law of Fives to be more and more manifest the harder I look."

MeatProduct wrote: »

Given that it is at the root of the very building blocks of creation, to say that there are many things that do not stem from it becomes a mute point.

Well for one it's not at the root of the building blocks of creation, so that's not a given.
The one thing you site more that phi is planck lenght this seems more important to the universe than some fairly arbitrary ratio.

MeatProduct wrote: »

I think I've shown that already. Forgive me if I have made too many assumptions, I can fill in the blanks if you like.

Not really. you just showed that you can do a bit of mathematical gymnastics and find any number you want.
The planck length is way more important and prevalent but that doesn't make the universe fractal.

MeatProduct wrote: »

Fair enough but that's more a belief than fact, how you can state that as fact I would be interested to know. Pi is certainly an important ratio but is utterly insignificant in importance when compared to phi.

Well given that all the stuff you listed as expressible by phi is related to pi. You don't even have to bother with the gymnastics.
Hydrogen radii, orbits etc.

That and the fact it's in a lot of the important physics equations.
Particularly:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmological_constant

MeatProduct wrote: »

Well actually yes, it does. Perhaps you don't fully understand phi. Phi is only perfectly implosive means of information compression in the physical universe, hence its extensive usage..

No for a fractal you need an proper equation not just a single number or ratio.

Phi no more expresses a fractal than does the number 42.

MeatProduct wrote: »

I am talking in terms of cycles, like in the stock market. It does not predict specifics but trends.

Yet you're claiming they predicted a specific date and time for something?

Can you provide an example of someone using phi to predict something?

MeatProduct wrote: »

I agree.

Pretty much.

I should have been clearer, the Mayans didn't predict anything at all for that date.
Except maybe a big ass festival.

2012 is not even the end of their calender.

MeatProduct wrote: »

I have read some research that Planet X is actually Venus, was quite riviting at the time but do not recall where I read it.

I think you're thinking of the planet Nibiru that some people think is planet x and was nicked from Babylonian mythology.
That was actually either Jupiter or Mercury.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nibiru_%28mythology%29#Nibiru_identified_as_a_planet

MeatProduct wrote: »

That's a bit excessive. It's obvious that you disagree but I don't think there is a need to call it nonsense.

Well considering that no one ever predicted anything for that date at all, I would call it nonsense.

MeatProduct wrote: »

Given that you have an inquiring and scientific mind I think you see the importance of the above equation for hydrogen. It's truely revoloutionary for science.

Again for something so revolutionary there seems to be very little information to back it up.

bonkey

So slashdot have an article linking to a dutch science-mag article (google-translated here where there is some comments that apparently the interpretation of the Mayan calendar which leads to a 2012 date is wrong....the observations of Venus don't match up. To match those up, we need to add something like 208 years....(AD 2220).

I predict (!) that someone will claim that the Mayans knew about Planet X, and that its effect will cause Venus' orbit to change, and that 2012 is indeed the End of Days etc. etc. etc.

I also predict (!!) that this inaccuracy will be used post hoc to explain why the world didn't end in 2012, allowing the story to continue through the end of our lifetimes and onwards to the 23rd century.

King Mob

bonkey wrote: »

So slashdot have an article linking to a dutch science-mag article (google-translated here where there is some comments that apparently the interpretation of the Mayan calendar which leads to a 2012 date is wrong....the observations of Venus don't match up. To match those up, we need to add something like 208 years....(AD 2220).

I predict (!) that someone will claim that the Mayans knew about Planet X, and that its effect will cause Venus' orbit to change, and that 2012 is indeed the End of Days etc. etc. etc.

I also predict (!!) that this inaccuracy will be used post hoc to explain why the world didn't end in 2012, allowing the story to continue through the end of our lifetimes and onwards to the 23rd century.

I dunno 2220 is a bit to far off for anyone to cash in on it.

I think the next "end of the world" will be 2060.
Apparently this is when Issac Newton predicted it.
Plus it's fairly close, but far enough away so people can make a tidy profit out of the hysteria.

PirateShampoo

Well he didnt predict it really did he.

"This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fanciful men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, and by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail."

King Mob

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Well he didnt predict it really did he.

"This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fanciful men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, and by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail."

And neither did the Mayans.

But little facts like that don't exactly stop people making the claims though.

Undergod

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Well its was a 50/50 guess if theres water on the moon, its either yes or no.

The horse either will or will not win the race, but the bookies will still give it odds of 5 to 1. That a question can only have two answers doesn't mean both answers are equally likely.

Ken_Is_Here

I'm not sure how the '2012' theory got tacked on to the 'Nibiru' theory. I personally see them as two seperate schools of thought.

Heres the way i see it:

To some areas of the middle east in pre-new testament days the constellation Orion was known as Nephila and those descendant from Orion were called the Nephilum. Orion in Greek mythology was a giant hunter.
'Descendant from Orion' is ambiguous enough to either mean directly related to the 'character' Orion or to have come from the constellation Orion.

In some origonal old Terstament versions the Nephilim are mentioned as giants and the product of Angel/human breeding. 'Angels' are, of course, described as heavenly beings often descending from the skies in thier chariots or causing great destruction with various weapons. These 'sons of God' are never seen to have wings or halos.

The Christian Old Testament is taken from the Hebrew texts. In the book of Genesis the Hebrew word 'Elohim' is translated as God yet the word Elohim is a plural word and should be translated as GOds.

If this were the case then the whole belief system of God and the angels, the way they are seen in catholisim, would be drawn into question.

I havent seen any reference of Nibiru to state that it is anything but Jupiter when its in a certain positon in the sky.
As for the 2012 theory, There is nothing to say that the end of this Long COunt is the end of ~ALL~ long counts. Have there not been a few already? And what does the end of the world mean exactly. Are the 2012 theorists sudgesting that Earth will be destroyed, Human life will be destroyed or some other method of meeting an End?

The Nephilim thing is the only theory i see worth looking into in that big sticky conspiracy ball that is the 2012 planet X event.

King Mob

Ken_Is_Here wrote: »

As for the 2012 theory, There is nothing to say that the end of this Long COunt is the end of ~ALL~ long counts. Have there not been a few already?

On December 21st 2012 the Long Count calender goes from 12.19.19.17.19 to 13.0.0.0.0.
So in that way it's like the year 2000 and the silliness surrounding it.

However according to Mayan legend, the previous creation (we're the fouth) ended on a long count of 12.19.19.17.19. This supposedly indicates that our world will end at that time too.
But also according to Mayan legend the Fourth World was the successful creation thanks to the presence of mankind.
The Gods had no intention of destroying this world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Count#2012_and_the_Long_Count

Ken_Is_Here wrote: »

And what does the end of the world mean exactly. Are the 2012 theorists sudgesting that Earth will be destroyed, Human life will be destroyed or some other method of meeting an End?

Well, the belief runs from out and out world is destroyed to the end of the world will start then to some kind of new spiritual age.
There is no single prediction.
And the Mayans themselves never predicted anything for that day.

NewFrockTuesday

The raduis of a hydrogen Atom is
R = r0A^1 / 3
where:

A = Atomic mass number [number of protons (Z) plus number of neutrons (N)] = 1 + 0 = 1 (in a hydrogen atom)

r0 = 1.25 x 10^-15 meters

R = (1.25 x 10^-15) (1)^1/3 = 4.16666667 × 10^-16 m

The planck length times phi = 1.616252×10^−35 x 1.61803399 =

2.61515067240548 x 10^-35m

Now my maths ain't great but

2.61515067240548 x 10^-35m don't equal 4.16666667 × 10^-16 m.
They're a couple of orders of magnitude off.

LOL

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

On December 21st 2012 the Long Count calender goes from 12.19.19.17.19 to 13.0.0.0.0.
So in that way it's like the year 2000 and the silliness surrounding it.

However according to Mayan legend, the previous creation (we're the fouth) ended on a long count of 12.19.19.17.19. This supposedly indicates that our world will end at that time too.
But also according to Mayan legend the Fourth World was the successful creation thanks to the presence of mankind.
The Gods had no intention of destroying this world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Count#2012_and_the_Long_Count


Well, the belief runs from out and out world is destroyed to the end of the world will start then to some kind of new spiritual age.
There is no single prediction.
And the Mayans themselves never predicted anything for that day.

Mayans never said it was the end of the world.


Even the Vatican knows this. Since the Vaticans has you know it burnt most of the manuscript on this. I will use common sense and say this.


The vatican never burnt anything they found valuble. They have circled the globe a bagillion times taking everything from all the ancient civilzations all kept in their hands. It's why the Vatican are the most powerful organistion in the world today. If you really want to know what the Mayas predicted you should ask nicely from the pope!.

Doubt he will give it to you though!

But haaaaaaaaving said all that. TPTB are the ones who create the mass hysteria over 2012.


Anyone who actually dicerns and does some research will know what 2012 really means. It's the end of the calander or the end of the time as we know it. Our planet is changing and the powers of be can't control it anymore. It's why they are panicking. They know what it means. I know what it means.


The question is do you?

Black Uhlan

mysterious wrote: »

The question is do you?

no,but i'd love to find out...

mysterious

Black Uhlan wrote: »

no,but i'd love to find out...

Well you might not be sursprised tbh.

It's really about you! Thats what 2012 is about. The only thing I can say is. You all will have to figure it out. All that is happening now is creating the outcome of 2012. 2012 is not some year that we are waiting to pass and thats it.

It's a mass awakening time, where humanity is taking leaps that were never took in history. The ancients knew this timeframe. Because they too have gone through this experience of where our solar system goes through great changes on every level. Awareness is the key to this whole transition.

Whether people realise it or not now, each day is coming closer and closer to where you are creating your own reality as you wish for it to be. TPtb for the first time in 2,000 years are reacting like never before. It's entertaining to see them lose power and look to desparation for reaction. The secrets they hide and cannot any longer.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

Well pretty much all of it is nonsense.

But if I had to pick one I'd go with the fact that no ancient civilisation predicted anything for that date.

You know for a fact?

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

You know for a fact?

Yes I do.
No ancient civilisation predicted anything for 21/12/2012.
Not the end of the world, not a great spiritual thing, not a alien invasion.

But if you have some solid evidence to the contrary, post it.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

Yes I do.
No ancient civilisation predicted anything for 21/12/2012.
Not the end of the world, not a great spiritual thing, not a alien invasion.

But if you have some solid evidence to the contrary, post it.

No no King mob

You made the claim, the statement and the fact. So your just saying from your own mouth this is "fact" lol?

Oh ok.

If this fact you need to back that up. You seem so sure of yourself. I didnt say it was the end of the world. Haven't we cleared that up in my previous post.

Thanks in advanced.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

No no King mob

You made the claim, the statement and the fact. So your just saying from your own mouth this is "fact" lol?

Oh ok.

If this fact you need to back that up. You seem so sure of yourself. I didnt say it was the end of the world. Haven't we cleared that up in my previous post.

Thanks in advanced.

Ok how about the fact that the date 21/12/2012 only crops up in the Mayan calendar.
But that date was not the end of the calendar nor was there any other prediction for that date.

How about the fact that the only mention of this date as the end of the world only ever appeared in the 20th century?

Or how about the fact that no surviving Mayans or experts on Maya history attach any prediction to that date?

Or how about the fact that no other civilisation ever predicted anything for that date?

If you can show that one did, please go ahead.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

Ok how about the fact that the date 21/12/2012 only crops up in the Mayan calendar.
But that date was not the end of the calendar nor was there any other prediction for that date.

How about the fact that the only mention of this date as the end of the world only ever appeared in the 20th century?

Or how about the fact that no surviving Mayans or experts on Maya history attach any prediction to that date?

Or how about the fact that no other civilisation ever predicted anything for that date?

If you can show that one did, please go ahead.

Your dodging my question.

I will address those you have when you just my answer my only simple question.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Your dodging my question.

I will address those you have when you just my answer my only simple question.

What question?

I've explained why I don't believe any other civilisations never predicted anything for that date.